Attawapiskat 2
December 6, 2011 - 12:35pm
Continued from here.
Headline on CBC Newsworld just now:
NDP MP: Government trying to provoke confrontation in Attawapiskat
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Chissassibi and Wemindji First Nations on the James Bay coast of Quebec have also declared states of emergency, as they have been without power for more than 24 hours, and it is cold up there. Quebec Hydro is working on the problem, but Band members told CBC they believe the transmission lines have been burnt out.
Atleo: First Nations people have reason to feel “angry and betrayed”
It seems to me that after reading everything in sight, that the government is determined to treat a humanitarian crisis more like a financial crisis - which it is, because First Nations are horrifically underfunded - but for goodness sakes, deal with the humanitarian crisis first!!!
This is excellent, now on Rabble.ca:
Attawapiskat and colonialism: Seeing the forest and the trees
It's worth remembering that then Minister of Indian Affairs Jean Chrétien proposed way back in the 1969 White Paper to abolish the Indian Act. The appropriately named White Paper was criticized and rejected by Harold Cardinal's Red Paper and The Unjust Society because doing so would strip FN, Métis and Inuit of any special distinction in the eyes of the Crown.
—Harold Cardinal, The Unjust Society
Grand Chief Stan Louttit on CBC P&P just now: "If the government doesn't sit down with us to help deal with the problems we face, we are considering civil obedience" - debate just starting.
Attawapiskat leader threatens civil disobedience
excerpt:
A regional chief who represents Attawapiskat says that a number of his counterparts in other First Nations are prepared to engage in civil disobedience over Ottawa's handling of a housing crisis in the northern Ontario community.
"There's people who are ready to stand up and be counted... to stand up and do civil disobedience so that we are heard," Stan Louttit told Evan Solomon on CBC-TV's Power & Politics.
"If the minister does not want to work with us, you may see that sooner than later," said Louttit, who presides over the Mushkegowuk Council, which represents Attawapiskat and six other First Nations.
And: they've called for the UN to investigate.This could get interesting:
Chiefs rally around Attawapiskat as call issued for oil pipeline blockade in three provincesI wonder if tar sands and pipelines investors will now pull out because of potential conflicts with First Nations.
AFN Draft Resolution on Attawapiskat - .pdf format
Send army to Attawapiskat, NDP urges
Son of a gun. I thought Harper would send in the military to enforce third party rule; but Turmel instead wants the Army to help out the community. Good move.
On CBC: Duncan offers evacuation plan to Attawapiskat residents
ETA: Rickford will discuss the offer on P&P in one minute.
Bloddy hell. The government is saying their emergency plan is contingent on Chief and Council working with their third party manager!
Send army to Attawapiskat, NDP urges
Son of a gun. I thought Harper would send in the military to enforce third party rule; but Turmel instead wants the Army to help out the community. Good move.
It wouldn't be the first time the CF was used to assist a northern native community. Does anyone here remember Kashechewan? I flew one of the missions to bring in a water purification unit back in late 2005.
Yup. I lived in a community just below James Bay, and a lot of my friends were from Kash, Wemindji, Moosonee, and Moose Factory Island, and I've been kept abreast of things happening up north. I visited Moose Factory and Moosonee.
Send army to Attawapiskat, NDP urges
Son of a gun. I thought Harper would send in the military to enforce third party rule; but Turmel instead wants the Army to help out the community. Good move.
Good move?
This is Turmel, fresh from welcoming home the Libya heroes?
Has it occurred to Turmel that an invitation to send in the military ought to come from the First Nations and their representatives - or not at all?
This is the same Turmel who invited Harper to come and see for himself - and when he wouldn't, she wants the army? To do, precisely, what??
I guess all the competent advisors are hired out to the leadership campaigns.
Is it possible to politely ask Turmel to leave the leadership now and hand it over to, like, anyone else?
Has it occurred to Turmel that an invitation to send in the military ought to come from the First Nations and their representatives - or not at all?
I really hoped that such an appeal by the communities had been made... but it seems that is not the case.
In a letter to Prime Minister Stephen Harper, she said that people in Attawapiskat have asked her to seek the army's help, and that a lack of warm and hygienic housing is dire, given the imminent arrival of winter.
Did Turmel check with the Band leadership about this? Apparently not.
I was exasperated to see this headline this morning. Call in the army to save a First Nations settlement? Doesn't this ring any wanting bells? It appears that the NDP is using the currency this event has garnered in the Canadian mainstream media for electoral advantage, rather than for the advantage of the Attawapiskat people. They have completely abandoned any anti-colonialist lens in favour for a "solution" palatable to middle class Canada. I fail to see how this is substantively different from Stephen Harper's solution.
Even if "the people" of Attawapiskat called Turmel and asked her to bring in the army, as Unionist says, it is not Nycole Turmel who should be making this plea.
I suppose it's too much to ask Canada's left-wing party to use this disaster as an example of how Canada is a colonialist and as such deeply criminal country and that it's relationship with First Nations people across Turtle Island is in crisis. If we (as the settlers of this land) don't want miserable catastrophes like this to happen, we need to radically renegotiate our relationship with the First Nations of Canada, one that recognizes their right to land and title, that offers true self-determination, and that recognizes Canada's culpability in and takes responsibility for both destroying the means of production and creating a new means of dependancy for remote Aboriginal settlements.
No. Instead: call in Her Majesty's Armed Forces. Well played, Nycole.
Don't get me wrong. The instant Attawapiskat calls for CF assistance, Canada's response should be: "Ready, aye, ready!" During our ice storm of January 1998, the forces did a decent job clearing fallen trees, visiting remote residences to offer assistance, etc.
But Turmel, or whoever is "advising" her, really should be asked to shut up. It's disgraceful.
Unionist. I am sorry but I just don't get what the issue is here. Look, it is obvious that this needs to be done in coordination with the commuities and leaders of course, but the CF has expertise here that we could take advatanage of here. It is time to do someting and be proactive in whatever way as possible respectful of the desires of the community. I think Trumel has shown real leadership here, and paints a stark contrast between how we, the "Peace Party", and the Tories see the role of the military.
As an ex serviceman, I absolutely can't understand what the issue is. Help me out here, and I am not being sarcastic, I really don't understand why this is objectioable or questionable. And CDN_FORCES. I should have thought to do this sooner, Thank-you for your service!
Boom Boom, I think you are right. Good for Turmel.
Send army to Attawapiskat, NDP urges
Son of a gun. I thought Harper would send in the military to enforce third party rule; but Turmel instead wants the Army to help out the community. Good move.
It wouldn't be the first time the CF was used to assist a northern native community. Does anyone here remember Kashechewan? I flew one of the missions to bring in a water purification unit back in late 2005.
Nor would it be the first time the NDP called in CF 'to assist a northern native community' either. Here they are hard at work in Bison APCs at Gustafsen Lake in 1995
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQH9MAPdqws
The problem is the historical relationship between the Armed Forces or other agents of the state and Canada's First Nations. One, this is not an emergency in the sense of Manitoban floods or Indonesian Earthquakes: this is a protracted and legislated catastrophe enacted by the Canadian government on Aboriginal peoples. And Turmel's solution is to impose another government brain child on a people whose agency and self-determination have been systematically diminished over the past two and a half centuries. The way to really and truly solve Attawapiskat and similar situations across Canada (including the desperate situation of FN living right here in Vancouver's DTES) is to atone and acknowledge this historical fact.
I would hope that Canada's left-wing party lead that charge, in a way befitting Charlie Angus's tremendous work over the past few years. Instead, we have Turmel's ignorant and disgraceful entreaty to the army. I wonder what Angus thinks of Turmel's heartfelt plea?
I would hope that Canada's left-wing party lead that charge, in a way befitting Charlie Angus's tremendous work over the past few years. Instead, we have Turmel's ignorant and disgraceful entreaty to the army. I wonder what Angus thinks of Turmel's heartfelt plea?
I was actually wondering exactly the same thing. Unfortunately, he appears to support it, unless he's reporting it simply out of loyalty.
If her letter were co-signed - or released in the presence of Spence or Louttit or even Atleo - it would be so very different. But this is an appropriation of First Nation autonomy, every bit as bad (and, for the reasons Catchfire expounds, arguably far worse) than Harper's "3rd party management".
Maybe I'm wrong? Maybe Spence will appear tomorrow to say she asked Turmel to convey the request? Or maybe it's just a golden opportunity to show compassion and support for the troops all in one neat package.
Personally, I prefer to see the military used to respond to humanitarian crises than dropping bombs on brown people.
Well, I guess we will see how this plays out. It seems to me all Turmel was trying to do was get some help to people. This is a catastrophe of the first order. It would seem this should be the first part of the NDP response.
Inronically, this kind of came at a funny time. I guess I must have been on the same wave length as the leadership who obviously had been thinking about this as well; I am not saying anything other then that I was obviously thinking about the same things as the leadership.
My idea would be to provide short term assistance in the form of "repair" for lack of a better way to put that, with the idea of a large scale rebuilding initiative starting in the spring; of course doing so after offering assistance to the commuities with the undestanding it would be really "their call" over how this would paly out. But not only for Attawapiskat, but other aborigial commuities as well, using kind of a triage approach from "worst to best", again, so to speak. Of course along the way we need to think how to best get these communities involved, say in apprenticing of community members so that can learn trades, or get other training.
I think this was a great proposal. I just hope it gets the attention it deserves both here, and in the MSM. We built the Dew Line, CFS Alert, Cold Lake Alberta, etc. There is no question the CF is up to this. I know the folks who serve, this is something they would really embrace with gusto if asked and if done in a way where these communities were on equal footing and treated as partners and stakeholders, rather the people to whom we were dictating anything.
Sigh, double post. I am such a dope!
Sigh.
I didn't see this in the CBC article, but according to APTN:
The NDP has called on the government to send in the military to construct temporary shelters for residents in the community.
This appears to make a lot of sense, because the 15 modular homes will not arrive until the end of January. The only question is this: did Turmel go over the heads of the leadership, or not?
Unionist, I never know how to take you. Sigh!
Catchfire, I don't understand why this is a mistake. Maybe its because I am ex military and know what we can do to help if they want that help. All Turmel seems to be saying is lets get some help to these folks now. What is so bad about that?
The request has to come from the folks, Arthur. They're sovereign people.
At any rate, I'm pretty sure I heard Duncan's deputy on P&P say the Cons are sticking with their "plan" but it is contingent on the Band accepting third party management, and I'm sure they're not interested in sending the military because that would upset their "plan" (sending in 15 modular units, evacuation of anyone who wants to leave, setting up the hockey rink and healing lodge as temporary residences, and fixing up the decrepit homes).
And why doesn't Ottawa have civilian agencies to send to places like Attawapiskat in times like this? Why, after decades of neglect and abandonment of Canada's Northern people do they have nothing to respond with? Living in Canada's remote Northern regions is dangerous for a lot of people. Head injuries, for example, are a death sentence for many northerners. There is no civilian infrastructure and what there is is spaced so far apart that people have died of lack of medical attention. They can fly them by air ambulance if FNs and other northerners are lucky enough to get to an medivac base in time. Where days and hours and minutes are crucial to surviving everything from head injuries to hypothermia, Canada's northerners are living in third world conditions, thanks to too many decades of neglect by our so-called federal government pinching pennies to service debt payments to foreign and private sources which is totally unnecessary. $100 billion dollar infrastructure deficits are totally unnecessary in a rich country like Canada.
Ice Storm '98 and Canada's Military I was actually proud of the Canadian military then. My friend was in service then, and he was out there helping PUC guys fix telephone and hydro lines. 46 people died during the ice storm. It could have been worse. People in the Ottawa valley region and parts near have just never had to deal with severe winter weather. They were totally vulnerable. If the military is all we have to respond with, then we can't afford to do SFA as Steve the stooge is doing now from his grand seat in the halls of Harper Government powerlessness. Do something, Steve! Anything more than sweet fuck is in order, and step on it!
Where is Steve the vicious toady when needed? Why, he's down their kissing Uncle Sam's fat ass and ceding Canadians' privacy to the imperial master nation with "border security". Meanwhile there Canadians in Northern Ontario in desperate need. Thanks again, Steve, Thanks for doing nothing as per usual. Political Conservatives are well versed in doing and achieving nothing while in phony majority power...lessness. It's time Steve's physician recommended Viagra for him, or something. He's lost the will to even feign powerlessness in convincing fashion.
I'm likely wrong, but there's nothing yet to verify that Turmel wasn't acting upon request. I'll wait and see, as I agree that's the ONLY way it should have been mentioned by the NDP.
If her letter were co-signed - or released in the presence of Spence or Louttit or even Atleo - it would be so very different. But this is an appropriation of First Nation autonomy, every bit as bad (and, for the reasons Catchfire expounds, arguably far worse) than Harper's "3rd party management".
Maybe I'm wrong? Maybe Spence will appear tomorrow to say she asked Turmel to convey the request? Or maybe it's just a golden opportunity to show compassion and support for the troops all in one neat package.
what 'First Nation autonomy'? If there was such a thing this wouldn't be happening.
This armed forces suggestion is being talked about in two threads now.
I realize of course that the prospect is a non-starter, for a number of reasons.
On the other hand, from what I have read and heard one of the major problems is that houses there are build to southern standard, with airtight walls, and other design flaws that have a great potential to fuck up. I heard the same story 25 years ago about northern housing in this province.
One of the commentators on XCcheckup said that the average livespan of houses in FN communities (according to CMHC) is five to eight years.
Again, no one has invited the armed forces in, and I expect that if they were not wanted they would be turned away the same way the manager was. Since this suggestion of Turmel's is never going to happen, I'm just thinking about this scenario at a basic level, suspending the whole issues of sovreignty, militarism, and history.
And you know what? I don't think it would be such a bad idea to see a different approach to water, housing, sanitation and other infrastructure issues than what they have been getting forced on them from Ottawa since day one. I think a break with the stranglehold the feds have on everything in those communities, by seeing how the military approaches setting up a camp might be an instructive exercise.
(not that I think they have anything to teach, but I doubt they would do things by the book in Minister Duncan's office).
Of course I know we can't see the army as a positive or helpful force in this, but again, since it isn't going to happen, I figured there's no harm in thinking about the differences in approach and how it might play out.
If it existed, our corrupt stooges in Ottawa would send an appropriate civilian agency to help out in Attawapiskat. It doesn't.
This is what decades of federal neglect of Canada's North looks like. I have some choice words for the long-time stoogeaucracy that would get me suspended right now. The conditions in Canada's norther are a national disgrace. Our corrupt stooges should be ashamed but are not. They need cleaning out of Ottawa.
According to the G&M, the first nations want the military to help:
But first-nations leaders have been asking for more help and say the military, unlike Mr. Marion, would be most welcome.
Stan Louttit, the grand chief of the Mushkegowuk Council which encompasses seven first nations in Northern Ontario including Attawapiskat, said Wednesday that troops could provide emergency shelters and help transport housing materials to the reserve, which declared a state of emergency a month ago over its deplorable living conditions.
“Whenever there is a crisis in any part of Ontario, or Canada, or overseas, what do other countries do? What to neighbours do?” asked Mr. Louttit, who is attending a conference of chiefs from across Canada in Ottawa.
“Well they provide emergency help, right?” he said. “And the military come in with their disaster-relief equipment and expertise and help out. And what we’re saying is we’re in a crisis as well, right in the backyard of Canada. And why not? Why can’t they come in and provide some relief?”
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/government-offers-to-provid...
@ Summer
Thanks for the article.
Somehow I think if it were something that would produce positive results, Harper would not let it happen.
edit duplicate post
Our military has played an incredible role at times of other humanitarian crises in Canada. I am sure that you will agree that the conditions facing people in Attawapiskat are dire and likely to get worse as the winter sets in. Therefore I am asking you today to act immediately and target resources, including military resources as requested by the community, towards building adequate housing in Attawapiskat. You will have the full support of the New Democratic Party in this effort.
Fidel has good points in his posts. There should be a civillian relief agency ready to respond to emergencies in the far north. This is way overdue.
Duncan and his deputy seem to feel their response is sufficient - evacuation of those who want to leave; turning a hockey rink and healing lodge into short term shelters; $500,000 for immediate home repairs; 15 modular homes going up the ice highway at the end of January. I don't get why he thinks the military isn't needed. Maybe because the request came from the NDP?
Harper doesn't think the military is necessary because he wants the people of Attawapiskat off their traditional lands. If he evacuates them to, say, a region that doesn't have a big honkin' diamond mine beneath it ...
In the end, the solution has to come from the people of Attawapiskat. They and they alone know what is needed. Personally, I think changes to the Indian Act that are actually generated by the people affected by it are needed. Nearly all of the current amendments to the IA disenfranchise and rob FNs of their sovereignty.
Given the reality that Turmel was asked by the people themselves to request military assistance, and she noted that from the very start of her activism, I find this comment below extremely distressing. It is divisive, at best. It also undermines the Appiwapiskat people's movement to get help for themselves. Undercutting those who have been asked to help gives Harper more leverage.
Before comments such as these are made, maybe there should be a bit more investigation done by those who make such negative pronouncements, as they do more harm than good?
But Turmel, or whoever is "advising" her, really should be asked to shut up. It's disgraceful.
Given the reality that Turmel was asked by the people themselves to request military assistance,
I know what Turmel said:
What I don't know is why Theresa Spence would convey a request to the government through an opposition leader, rather than directly.
When Shawn Atleo was asked what he thought of Turmel's request to send in the military, here's what he said:
Shawn Atleo, the National Chief of the Assembly of First Nations, said he would agree with a military response but only if that is what Attawapiskat has requested.
“This is about first nations driving solutions forward and I think that is the real essence of the fundamentals of this discussion,” Mr. Atleo said in an interview Wednesday with the CBC. “I would really look to the chiefs, in this case in Attawapiskat and Grand Chief [Stan] Louttit for their leadership about what kinds of responses that they see are required.”
That's my view also. As I said before, if and when the First Nation requests military assistance, our answer should immediately be: "Ready, aye, ready!" That's exactly the kind of public service our military ought to be deployed for - upon invitation only.
So I hope you understand my criticism of Mme Turmel properly. If she wants to be an ally of the Indigenous people, she can do much good. But part of being an ally is not appropriating their voice.
I don't think Trumel is trying to approrpiate anyone's voice. All she is trying to do is get above the politics and get help to people who need it.
Could not agree with you more in respect to being an ally. My issue is when someone is being an ally, in the greater sense of the word, that they should not be undercut by those who have not done their homework.
Nothing in your response to me bolsters your post that I found so distressing. They have requested military assistance. That the media is trying to spin Turmel's actions as being her own when she was aksed to do so, should not IMV be taken up by those who state they are an ally. It does several negative things that hinder assistance and actually support Harper's government.
Atleo's response confirmed that Turmel was acting correctly given that she was asked to request military assistance. Media trying to spin it differently can be viewed as the reality that they are agents of the state. And that is not a side that allies should be on, IMV.
I have not seen any confirmation about who has asked Turmel to do anything--a very odd strategy at any rate, as Unionist has pointed out. And this fanfare about how FN leaders are "confirming" that Turmel did the right thing is also wrongheaded. In case the point has been missed, let me be clear: colonialism did this. And it will keep doing it, so long as NDP interim leaders think the best way to effect change in FN communities across Canada is to speak on their behalf.
It's pretty elementary, actually. And it's a disgrace that the NDP has not taken the opportunity to make it clear.
Fidel has good points in his posts. There should be a civillian relief agency ready to respond to emergencies in the far north. This is way overdue.
Well that would be the Red Cross, unless there is some need to recreate the wheel.
One of the items they are bringing up there is apparently portable generators and heaters. Clearly I am not on the ground up there, so I don't claim to the best solution, but wouldn't it make sense to send an electrician instead, and connect some temporary panels into the power lines like they would do at any construction site?
After all, what do generators run on but gasoline, which has to be shipped in? Again, it seems to be badly-planned, southern solutions that are as wasteful as they are ineffective.
And this distraction about the army? Sorry, but I just have to shake my head about it.
When they came to help with the Winnipeg Flood in 87 there were people east of town who thought it was part of a secret plot to blow up the floodway and save winnipeg by flooding everything east of there, even though anyone who looked at a topo map could see it was high ground.
Anyone standing close to the river was just glad to see sandbags getting moved, and dams put in place by real engineers, rather than volunteers.
So Turmel put her foot in her mouth. Seems to me it was through good intent. If people up there want military help, fine; and if they don't, also fine. Beyond that, I don't see why this is an issue.
(edit)
Actually, if this is what she said:
She called on the prime minister to “act immediately and target resources, including military resources as requested by the community, towards building adequate housing.”
then I really don't see what the problem is.
Boom Boom, you are right. I think eveyone should relax on this, and be proud that Trumel acted so visibly. Its nice to see some leadership.
Please excuse if my perceptions of what has transpired with Turmel is different from those detailing their own observations. There appears to be a glaring difference though, and will detail how I see it, maybe we can find a good point to concur? Not wanting to offend just distressed about how points of action are being portrayed.
On December 7th Turmel sent this letter to the federal government.
http://xfer.ndp.ca/2011/2011-12-07-attawapiskat/111207_turmel-attawapisk...
It says:
Dear Prime Minister Harper,
It has been almost a month since the Attawapiskat First Nation took the extraordinary step of asking the federal government to recognize a state of emergency in their community.
I have seen first-hand how hundreds of families are living in garden sheds and tents, with no running water or electricity. These families are worried about surviving the cold winter that has already come to Attawapiskat.
I have met with the residents of Attawapiskat, and they are asking that appropriate federal resources be dedicated to alleviating this crisis. There is no time to waste.
Last week, the federal government put the community under third-party management, and assumed full responsibility for solving the crisis. As of this week, however, there are still families living in completely inadequate conditions.
Moving supplies into this community to alleviate the housing crisis will require an extraordinary level of co-ordination. Given the extreme weather conditions and the fact that the winter road will not be ready for nearly two months, the community is seeking coordinated logistical help. For this reason, they have asked me to convey that they are asking for military support to help in the response.
Our military has played an incredible role at times of other humanitarian crises in Canada. I am sure that you will agree that the conditions facing people in Attawapiskat are dire and likely to get worse as the winter sets in. Therefore I am asking you today to act immediately and target resources, including military resources as requested by the community, towards building adequate housing in Attawapiskat. You will have the full support of the New Democratic Party in this effort.
-2-
Attawapiskat families require heated housing, clean drinking water, and urgent medical care. The situation is grave and if the community does not receive help, lives will be at risk.
This is a moment when we can come together as Parliamentarians to respond to a tragic situation.
Sincerely,
Nycole Turmel, M.P.
Leader of the Official Opposition
Leader of Canada's New Democrats
cc: Hon. John Duncan, Minister
Charlie Angus, M.P. Linda Duncan. M.P.
There is also a video of both her and Charlie Angus speaking with the community leaders.
http://www.ndp.ca/video/all/V6UXsLwzTRs
On that same day, in what appears to me to be a 3 pronged push at the government, Stan Louttit, (this is the Chief, that Atleo noted, also on the same day as Turmel's letter was sent, should be talking, in Unionist's post above) said Wednesday that troops could provide emergency shelters and help transport housing materials to the reserve, which declared a state of emergency a month ago over its deplorable living conditions.
as both Atleo's and Louttit's words note what transpired was a request from the Peoples themselves. It is quite apparent that Turmels' of the same day was part of their push.
It is also quite clear that when they declared a state of emergency a month ago what they expected to happen, which is what happens everywhere else in Canada when a state of emergency is declared, military support comes in to help with the circumstances.
For the life of me, I cannot see why pretty much everyone jumped on the Turmel bad band wagon over post #16 which based its premise on a report manufactured by the voice of the state, the CBC.
If you actually read the article linked at 16, and watch the video and read the letter, linked above, you will see how much spinning was going on by the CBC, and the government. Then of course the CBC started it all off wrong in the first linked article, in the first thread, where they stated no one from government, or opposition, has been addressing this, which is also false given that we all know Charlie Angus has been on it for a good long while now.
Should we not be pressuring the government, as opposed to trashing our own for absolutely doing nothing wrong?
etd to fix formatting and spelling
Duncan's deputy on P&P twice in the past week blamed Charlie Angus for misrepresenting the government's plan. And, so far, as far as I can tell, the government is rejecting all but their own plan - which as Evan Solomon pointed out yesterday, is contingent on acceptance of their third party manager - who has had control of federal funding to the band for a few days now. I haven't seen any updates today from anyone - not from Charlie Angus, Duncan, Chief Spence, Turmel, APTN, or for that matter, anyone from the federal government at all. As far as I know the community is transforming the hockey rink and healing lodge into emergency short term shelters, and anyone who wants to leave will be evacuated out, and $500,000 is being used to rebuild what housing can be repaired. Does anyone here have a very latest update?
In other news: Attawapiskat must pay Ottawa appointee $1,300 a day
Thanks quizzical - and welcome to babble!
Let me know when you find evidence of an actual prior request from the First Nation representatives to either the government - or to Nycole Turmel - to send in the military - and to have Turmel convey that request. If and when you do, I will agree with you.
These are not unfortunate souls looking for charity or a handout. They are the indigenous inhabitants of this land, they are sovereign, and we have a duty to give them that respect. It's not asking too much, is it, that we should listen carefully to them. If they want to appoint Nycole Turmel as their spokesperson, they know exactly how to do it. And they haven't done that.
If we don't get this much through our thick heads, then no marching in of troops and equipment is going to make any difference. On the contrary, the colonial status quo, which is responsible for this disaster and that facing (it is said) a hundred other communities, will become further entrenched.
I'm pretty sure Charlie Angus and Jack Layton were both up in Attawapiskat in the year before Layton died; both came back determined that something had to be done. Unless it was a different village altogether - I'm not 100% certain. Will look for a link today.
Good old CBC, count on em' to get it wrong unless its Bob Rae.
May 2008 – Hundreds of people are evacuated from the community after a state of emergency is declared. The threat stems from the possibility of ice jams in the Attawapiskat River and subsequent flooding.
June 2008 – De Beers Canada opens the Victor Mine.
October 16, 2008 – Newly re-elected NDP MP Charlie Angus expresses big goals for his riding, hoping to secure a new elementary school.
Read it on Global News: Global News | Putting Attawapiskat on the map
AFN live: http://download.isiglobal.ca/afn/2011-12-06_07_08/english.html
yes, welcome to babble, q.
Actually, I was so shocked and dismayed by the CBC headline that I immediately doubted that Turmel said such a thing. Sadly, further study did not disabuse me of that notion. We clearly have different definitions of what counts as negotiation and endorsement, especially when it comes to colonized nations. At any rate, it's quite clear that the NDP leader failed to take this opportunity to show Canadians the devastating fruits of two and a half centuries of colonization. Again: this is not an "act of God" disaster. This is deliberate and legislated, and our fault. Canada's fault. Not "Harper's fault," although he's doing his best. I don't see that level of desperately needed analysis in Turmel's "bring in the troops."
Thank you unionist and catchfire, for the welcome, though I was a member, back in 2002 or 2003 I think it was, under the moniker of Cherry, life happened and no time nor inclination to do other than read 'til I got so distressed over what I see as a misportrayal of Turmel's actions.
Having just moved off reserve a year ago, because of black mold hurting my chest, I feel deeply for those worse off even more than me and want to see allies being supported not hurt.
Um....are you calling Turmel a liar over what she stated quite clearly in her letter, or just what are you trying to deny?
Are you denying the concurrent request by the Grand Chief?
I see no evidence that she was not asked. And given the report on APTN that was most positive towards Turmel's actions, I have no reason to believe that she stepped into a colonialistic mindset.
May 2008 – Hundreds of people are evacuated from the community after a state of emergency is declared. The threat stems from the possibility of ice jams in the Attawapiskat River and subsequent flooding.
June 2008 – De Beers Canada opens the Victor Mine.
October 16, 2008 – Newly re-elected NDP MP Charlie Angus expresses big goals for his riding, hoping to secure a new elementary school.
Read it on Global News: Global News | Putting Attawapiskat on the map
Thanks. That link is an eye-opener.
I just watched a piece on CTV News now on this. So let me get this straight - they're paying some banker $300,000 to go in there and look at their books? And then the very next thing they say in the clip is that the Chief was getting paid the supposedly outrageous annual salary of...wait for it...not even 70 grand.
Up north. 69k. That's $189 per day. In a community where that salary would maybe go as far as, what, maybe $40,000 does down here due to everything having to be flown in? Harper is calling it "mismanagement" that they are getting paid modest salaries while the banker he's sending gets paid $1,300 per day. That's almost SEVEN TIMES as much as the Chief is getting paid.
Harper is complaining that some of the leaders have had expensive travel costs in and out of the community and calling that mismanagement? How long have the leaders there had to fly to various places trying to publicize the plight of their people, to meet with officials to try to get help? How much do his MPs spend on travel when they have to represent THEIR communities in Ottawa?
Harper and his gang of thugs - racist colonizers, every damn one.
ah consultants...
"One version of her resume highlights consulting work conducted between the Attawapiskat First Nation, De Beers Mining Company and the Department of Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development Canada. Her duties included 'Blockage issues, facilitation and relationship issues with De Beers, community issues, governance.."
El Qaddaffi's Son's Alleged Canadian Smuggler Had Attawapiskat On Her Resume
http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2011/12/07/gaddhafi-sons-alleg...
God. I just watched Rex Murphy. To hear his version you'd think there wasn't a racist person in the entire country.
And though he blamed it all on leaders stuck in old patterns, he never once mentioned Stephen Harper, prefering to single out Chief Theresa Spence.
I guess she's to blame for thwarting non-native Canadians' sincere and burning desire to have a good relationship with First Nations.
An excellent couple of articles about this:
Dog-whistle politics played by Harper to his racist base:
http://www.straightgoods.ca/2011/ViewArticle.cfm?Ref=973
Attawapiskat responds to Harper's whistles:
http://www.straightgoods.ca/2011/ViewArticle.cfm?Ref=972
I just watched a piece on CTV News now on this. So let me get this straight - they're paying some banker $300,000 to go in there and look at their books? And then the very next thing they say in the clip is that the Chief was getting paid the supposedly outrageous annual salary of...wait for it...not even 70 grand.
... Harper is calling it "mismanagement" that they are getting paid modest salaries while the banker he's sending gets paid $1,300 per day. That's almost SEVEN TIMES as much as the Chief is getting paid.
Not only that, but, as writer linked to above, it's the band who has to pay him. You know, with all the money they have.
http://www.thespec.com/news/canada/article/636786--attawapiskat-must-pay...
Chief Spence said today the Band will NOT be paying the third party manager. Meanwhile, National Chief Atleo says civil disobedience is a tool that First Nations have used in the past and could use again.
ETA: Duncan said 15 modular homes are going up at the end of January. Chief Spence says they need 22 homes right away. And what's a "modular home" anyway? Canada's outspoken master of home renovations, Mike Holmes, says "stop building crap on reserves".
Chief Spence said today the Band will NOT be paying the third party manager. Meanwhile, National Chief Atleo says civil disobedience is a tool that First Nations have used in the past and could use again.
ETA: Duncan said 15 modular homes are going up at the end of January. Chief Spence says they need 22 homes right away. And what's a "modular home" anyway? Canada's outspoken master of home renovations, Mike Holmes, says "stop building crap on reserves".
Interesting article, Boom Boom. But it brings up the question for me: if this is traditional territory for this nation, what building materials have they used traditionally, and what kinds of structures did they build traditionally? And why do they no longer have access to these? Anyone know?
"Traditionally," the James Bay Cree did not have permanent settlements like Attawapiskat. Permanent settlements were a product of inland fur traders, government agents, prospectors and missionaries--these changes, particularly to the James Bay Cree's mode of production and the gradual dispossession of the land by settlers, meant that the "traditional" means of living and habitation were no longer feasible or appropriate for the community's needs. This is the creeping treachery of colonialism.
We see it now with Duncan's humanitarian plea to evacuate residents until situations improve--knowing full well that without residents, there is no pressure to improve conditions, and FN dispossession of land, right and title continues apace.
We might as well ask why the Scots of the Niagara peninsula no longer build homes out of stacked cuts of peat moss.
Chief Spence said today they're not interested in evacuations, according to CBC.
..the minister's competance comes into question. judge for yourself.
..choose Duncan Questions from the right hand menu.
http://aptn.ca/pages/news/video/
usual pawns, usual shareholders.
It's so expensive to mine diamonds without cheap power. Shareholders doubtless see themselves as freezing in the dark, at the idea of having to truck in petro, yes, expensive. Aw ma, why.
The original (04) plea for Ont to provide them with electricity sank in spite of the De Beers dancing and mention of communities served on the way, like Attawapisak.
http://www.hydroone.com/RegulatoryAffairs/Documents/Archives/EB-2004-0545/EB-04-545_English_NOA-NOWH.pdf
I say, watch for it. Extension cords in the videos, kids with no socks on, huge hunks of wood outside, nod nod, wink wink, benevolence will be pretended and the mine will get its cheap power. Always the way.
The pipeline through Afghanistan, if and when now built, is not to save people from chewing stuff raw and freezing in the dark. It always was about industrial and investment opportunities. So important, so many people had to die, and so much tax money was wasted. Wasted, spent on pure evil.
I say, watch for it. Extension cords in the videos, kids with no socks on, huge hunks of wood outside, nod nod, wink wink,
?
I have no idea what this means.
In other news, the world sucks and so does your life. Have a razor blade.
Rob Russo on CBC this morning said Duncan has been handling this file very badly and looks ill - maybe he's sick? At any rate, at every press conference this past week, Duncan has been rattled by easy questions, so one has to wonder how long he will remain in this cabinet position.
Meanwhile, the Harper militarist regime is quite happy to spy on child protection specialists and activists if they speak up on behalf of aboriginal children like those in Attawapiskat ....
Harper regime should address needs of Attawapiskat rather than spy on child welfare advocate
jas, I understood what margot66 was saying just fine.
Infrastructure improvements are rarely made with the people in mind; the first priority is almost always industry.
Turmel just invited Harper to go to Attawapiskat again.
She didn't mention the military.
She also said we need more front-line cops.
Who is this person? Does she listen to herself?
Turmel knows Harper won't send the military for lack of a civilian agency to deal with emergencies in the North. She knows that Harper is a mere colonial administrator for U.S. empire and nothing more. Steve Harper is an embarrassment to all Canadians.
So, now she wants Harper to go there himself, accompanied by front-line cops? Harper is definitely an embarrassment, but he ain't alone.
So, now she wants Harper to go there himself, accompanied by front-line cops? Harper is definitely an embarrassment, but he ain't alone.
So, what is Harper doing about this situation besides nothing? Where is he hiding, Washington again?
Who else should Harper send to Attawapiskat? There is no colonial administrative department to handle emergencies anywhere in Northern Canada.
There is no civilian infrastructure in the North to handle much of anything except a few bush pilots running errands for mining companies and air ambulance duties on the side.
And that's because our corrupt stooges have neglected Northern communities for decades on end.
Steve needs to get his shit together and go to Attawapiskat and about a hundred other reserves across the North, and observe how people are actually living in third world "Canada."
I applaud the NDP for pointing out to Canadians the Harper colonial administration of Canada's routine violations of basic human rights in this country. If people could figure out what it is that the Harpers actually do in phony majority powerlessness, Canadian voters would surely replace them in 2015!
Did anyone else see CTV's QP this morning? It'll be shown again at 5 pm.
John Duncan was the first guest, Craig Oliver the host. Oliver asked Duncan how things are going, and Duncan seems to think he's doing a good job. He said the third party manager has now been in charge for a week, not just of the band finances, but also all health and safety related matters. He said Chief Spence now supports the third party manager, but Oliver interrupted and said he had spoken to the Chief just a moment ago by phone and she said that's a lie. Duncan tried not to appear flustered, then went on to say he has a letter from Chief Spence dated November 4th thanking him for his response to the Band's call of a state of emergency. Also said $500,000.00 has been given to the Band for immediate renovations, and 22, not 15, modular homes are on their way up at the end of January, as specifically requested by Chief Spence.
Duncan said he was Aboriginal Affairs critic in 1994 and has 18 years experience related to Aboriginal Affairs. That being the case, how has he manage to fumble this so badly??? He's known about the deplorable state of northern reserves for almost two decades at least. Oh, and QP showed that clip again of Harper standing up in the H of C and blaming Band mismanagement.
ETA: Duncan also said the third party manager will be paid by deducting his salary from the money the feds send to the Band.
I think that like dozens of other impoverished reserves are ignored by Ottawa, Attawapiskat, too, would have been ignored as usual by the feds had Charlie Angus not raised hell about the matter. The Harper's aren't liking all this attention on them. They will cough-up some money and put people on the issue now that they are being pushed and prodded into doing something. Whether it will be adequate for the reserve remains to be seen.
These Harpers require micromanaging and adult supervision in general. Apparently that's the opposition NDP's job until 2015.
Turmel just invited Harper to go to Attawapiskat again.
She didn't mention the military.
She also said we need more front-line cops.
Who is this person? Does she listen to herself?
You must have short term memory, Jack Layton and the NDP have been calling for an increase of front line cops for years. Mrs. Turmel is just playing the same game as Jack was.
http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/TopStories/20110407/layton-crime-platform-110407/
(bolding emphasis mine) Where did you see that, U?
(bolding emphasis mine) Where did you see that, U?
Ok. It was sarcasm. But only partly. Let's take it from the top:
1. When she visited Attawapiskat, her only concrete call was that "Mr. Harper should come here and see for himself".
2. When she got back, she wrote him a letter saying, "send in the army".
3. The only person who could vouch for First Nations having asked Turmel to say "send in the army" was... Turmel.
4. So, in her speech this afternoon, she dropped the army and went back to challenging Harper to go see for himself. Great political program, that.
5. Turmel's line on Harper's crime bill has been, "Instead of prisons, give us front-line cops!" This was after waffling on whether she supported Québec's condemnation of the treatment of youth, minimum sentences, let us opt out of this bullshit, etc. You see, we wouldn't want the NDP to be seen as "soft on crime", now would we? And she repeated this horrendous crap in her speech this afternoon as well.
6. So, to ridicule her idiocy further, I combined the two - bring Mr. Harper, and more front-line cops!
Not as funny when you have to deconstruct the joke, is it? I wish it were just a joke though.
Oh, okay. By the way, if I had to choose, I'd go for more front line cops on the street instead of Harper's megaprisons.
Oh, okay. By the way, if I had to choose, I'd go for more front line cops on the street instead of Harper's megaprisons.
Yeah, it's cost-effective - more front-line cops with guns and tasers, you'd need fewer prisons, mega or mini.
If you had to choose, would it be Stephen Harper or Jason Kenney? Would you double or triple the minimum sentences?
I think the least we can do as progressive folk is to try to frame the discussion for the way forward, instead of picking the colour of the cat.
Not to derail this thread any further, but front line cops don't have to be armed, do they?
ETA: I'd take Jason Kenney over Harper, because with Kenney as CPC leader, the NDP would be in government by now.
Not to derail this thread any further, but front line cops don't have to be armed, do they?
They do if you want to relieve overcrowding in prisons.
I think the least we can do as progressive folk is to try to frame the discussion for the way forward, instead of picking the colour of the cat.
Sounds good to me. Don't we already have a thread dedicated to criticizing the choices and phrasing of the interim leader of the opposition?
Frankly I don't see too much in the way of practical solutions to the situation in Attiwapiskat coming from Ottawa anyway, since Harper holds control of the ministry. so I am not sure why this is drifting toward the politics of the hill, rather than the community which is in crisis.
Not to derail this thread any further, but front line cops don't have to be armed, do they?
They do if you want to relieve overcrowding in prisons.
Who else can they possibly send to an emergency? The ill-equipped and underfunded Coast Guard? Boy Scouts?
The Harpers will probably not create any kind of temporary civilian agency to deal with third world conditions at Attawapiskat. Because that would be establishing some sort of civilian agency to deal with an actual problem.
They only create new government programs when it includes:
1. The Military
2. cow-towing to Uncle Sam on "border security", or,
3. expanding corporate welfare programs for profitable multinationals raiding Canada's resources
The Canadian Military was good enough to help out in the ice storm of '98.
The Canadian Military is good enough to do "reconstruction" in Afghanistan occupied by NATO gangsters for over a decade now.
Why can't the Canadian military help out in Attawapiskat? Do they have better things to do, like shooting Afghans and delivering detainees to Uncle Sam to be tortured to death?
Who else will volunteer to do what the feds have been totally and criminally negligent in not doing for decades at a time?
It will be interesting to see if anything comes from the blockade proposal mentioned upthread. Because of course, this issue is not just about Attawapiskat.
Here is a piece from a blockade which the community set up at the DeBeers mine two years ago:
http://www.thesudburystar.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?archive=true&e=1451082
I had completely forgotten about the DeBeers blockade. Thanks for that link.
the band isn't in a position to be, or seen to be, "turning down help", so there's preasure for sure to "welcome" the military. lets just say i'm sure it's not their first choice, to be in the current position of having to "choose" whether to have the military show up.
I think the least we can do as progressive folk is to try to frame the discussion for the way forward, instead of picking the colour of the cat.
no freakin kidding.
people always underestimate harper. he's loving this-
1) advance hate politics.
2) pry some folks off their land 'cause the world needs more diamonds.
3) advance nanny state politics.
4)advance disaster capitalism politics.
5) distract from border security bullshit, etc.
not saying the military shouldn't be part of the logistecs involved in bringing this to a "happy" resolution; but the optics and messaging of "sending in the military" as "the solution" , or even floating it publically at this stage in the game, given how the situation has been framed, is sick.
as in, "i think the cat should be camo".
Chief Spence made it abundantly clear on CBC (and in a public letter) that she NEVER accepted thrid party management. Duncan's deputy, however, says she has no choice in the matter - the third party hack is in place and has control over Band finances, and will be making decisions over health, safety, and housing matters for six months, and his salary will be deducted from the money that the Band receives from the feds.
Carole McNeil on CBC is talking to Chief Spence by phone, and Spence says Duncan is causing another crisis by taking the third party manager's salary from Band income - meaning there may be Band layoffs to pay the manager. She is considering getting a court injunction to block the thrid party manager.
It is amazing, since many jumped on her salary and made accusations of mismanagement.
This manager imposition is clearly so far beyond that, and so clearly punitive (since this is taking even more money away from the crisis), evidently Harper doesn't care - and in fact probably wants others to see that this is what they will get if they make trouble.
It may yet backfire, especially since we have people having to donate to the Red Cross to get the people what they need, and the feds are taking even more away.
@#96 It sounds like they'd actually have been better off without Harper and Duncan intervening, and better off without the third party's inflated salary on their books.
Why does it require third party management to allocate, what is it, between $25 and less than $32 dollars a day per person budgeting?
Who is able to house and feed themselves for $25 bucks a day in Northern Ontario? ffs They don't need an overpaid third party manager. What they need is a fucking magician!
These idiots need cleaning out of Ottawa.
Well, they don't want the third party manager - he's been imposed on them.
God help them.
No news yet on whether the Band went to court yet, still looking.
ETA: still pending
excerpt:
Attawapiskat Chief Theresa Spence says she will use the courts if necessary to resist the imposition of a third-party manager.
excerpt:
Marion is already controlling the purse strings and making a positive difference, Duncan said Monday, praising the consultant's work.
"The third-party manager is already getting results for the community," Duncan said. "He purchased 22 modular homes using federal funds. He is ensuring that services and social services are delivered."
NDP MP Charlie Angus begged to differ, saying Marion wasn't involved in an agreement between the community and the department to acquire the homes.
John Saunders, the Ontario director of disaster management for the Canadian Red Cross, said he's never spoken with Marion.
"Most of the items that we've purchase have been as a result of the donations from Canadians," Saunders said.
Duncan to meet with Attawapiskat chief in attempt to clear the air
Since it is readily apparent that Duncan is contradicted by the facts, and the Band is doing all the work, what the hell is the 'third party manager' doing to earn his $1300/day????
The Greatest Moral Challenge in Canadian Politics - by Gordon Gibson
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinion/opinions/opinion/the-greates...
"Why is it the terrible images seem never to change through the slideshow of Indian history? Click Attawapiskat, 1,800 souls in misery living in a place without roads, without work, without any meaning except substance abuse and welfare and rotten housing and little education and no hope. Click Kashechewan, same thing.."
and it is people like Gibson, his family and his class, that have made a good living out of this ongoing genocide and open veins of occupied indigenous Canada. He is with the Predator.
@ NDPP
Wow. The comments are even harder to read than his article. Interesting that he didn't once mention the treaties to which we are all bound.
Whatever he believes is going on, I don't think it is quite as simple as Harper laying down the law.
If he wants a better picture of where the power really lies, maybe Mr. Gibson should be pay a bit more attention to what is going on next door at the Supreme Court when the Manitoba Metis present their land claim today.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2011/12/12/pol-scoc-tuesday.html?cmp...
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/final-showdown-looms-in-man...
Some Attawapiskat Residents At Odds With Chief
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/12/12/attawapiskat-residents....
"The way the chief and council operate is totally opposite. They decide and then bring it to us after..."
sure sounds like Canadian democracy to me...
Long thread. Continue here.