babble is rabble.ca's discussion board but it's much more than that: it's an online community for folks who just won't shut up. It's a place to tell each other — and the world — what's up with our work and campaigns.
Support rabble | Advertise with us | Contact our staff | About rabble | Log-in or Register for a new account | Corrections | Privacy policy | Newsfeeds | Mailing lists
rabble: Features | Columnists | In Cahoots | Blogs | Books | Photos | What's Up | Polls
babble: Forum Topics | Active Topics
The rpn: About the RPN | Become a podcaster
rabbleTV: Program Guide | Features | Indie Inside | Best of the net
Copyright © 2001-2013 the authors
Syndicate
Israel and its agencies spend enormous sums of money to try to cultivate allies, dupes, and/or spies within targeted communities throughout the world. They use lobbying, political donations, massive propaganda machines, and free trips and junkets as part of their arsenal. If they can wine and dine and transport a "guest", and get a pro-Israeli comment out of them at the end of the day, it's money well spent.
That's how Gerry Schwartz and Heather Reisman, for instance, managed to "turn" Buzz Hargrove into an Israel booster in 2006. All it took was a free trip and a brief ego massage. Likewise with countless members of parliament and others.
And, likewise, with Ovide Mercredi and Phil Fontaine. It's way too late in history for anyone to claim innocence in the face of the murderous, lawless, apartheid policies of the Israeli regime. But money... well, money is an amazing thing. A miracle drug.
Remaining silent in the face of the Israeli propaganda onslaught is not an option. White racist rule in South Africa was not brought down by silence. Neither will Israeli apartheid and occupation.
ETA: We also discussed David Harper's visit recently.
ETA squared: And I still appreciate the note of perspective which NDPP added to that discussion:
Seriously NDPP, wouldn't that depend on how far back in history and time you went? If you go past the founding of Islam and the Muslim conquest of the region by Arabs from Arabia you could say Jews were the indigenous people. Even farther down the road of history before the Roman occupation of the area you had the Israelites/Judeans. I believe they were Jews for the most part.
I support the Cree doing what ever they want to do... They are older than our peoples and perhaps thats why they can see deeper into history then we seem to be able too.
No, I think this is a strategy of the Zioinst CIJA to exploit Canadian colonization and a receptive local puppet administrator of that colonization, to attack the Palestinian Indigenous resistance movement with a wild and unfounded endorsement of the Zionist historical narrative, based solely on the enforced Christian brainwashing which was a component of Canada's 'education' system, designed to replace a Cree worldview with the white dominator god gobbledygook, as has already been pointed out here. It is a cruel and cyncial abuse by CIJA, Canada, Israel and this 'Canadian Cree Chief' who made the deal and took the money.
But to play devil's advocate for a moment. This country has a long, deep and affectionate history with the settler state of Israel. In fact Canada is Israel's 'best friend'. Why is it somehow so very much worse, for this delegation to visit than all the other academics, politicians, professionals who regularly take the trip?
"A serious question. Whose land do you live on?"
I write from land that used to be a lake, just west of what used to be the largest wetland of all the great lakes. The lake here was filled in for industrialized use, and the river hemmed in by concrete. As a result, there is a big flooding risk, which is costing millions upon millions of dollars to address, and inspiring much debate in what are now called the Port Lands.
I understand that the lakeshore and land north of it was, for a time, used as hunting grounds for the Huron confederacy. Before that, Iroquoian peoples lived here.
I read that, after a time, two communities settled on nearby rivers: near the mouth of the Rouge River and on the Humber near what is now Bloor Street. My river, the Don, lies between these.
"Toronto" began to appear on French maps in the area of Lake Simcoe. Growing up, I was told the word means "meeting place". In studying to answer a serious question, I read that it is derived from an Iroquois term meaning "where there are trees in water" and refers to "a weir (or pole and net system) for catching fish. The location of the most prominent weir in the area was in the fast-moving waters between lakes Couchiching and Simcoe." The same source tells me, "Through vague understandings of Ontario's 17th-century geography 'Toronto' gradually came to refer to a larger region that included the site of the present city. (The old and still-popular Victorian romanticism that claimed that 'Toronto' means 'meeting place' was based on research by an antiquarian without an adequate understanding of native languages.)"
Around the same time European-identified people made Toronto skitter south, the Mississaugas lived here.
A few years ago, Aboriginal agencies estimated that there were about 70,000 Aboriginal people living in the City of Toronto. This year, there is a great deal planned for commemorating the War of 1812. A few blocks from me, foundations for Upper Canada's parliament building lie beneath a gravel parking lot, asphalt and concrete.
I live in a culture of erasure.
I still have much to learn about the land I stand on, where fish swam just over 100 years ago. It is a serious question. And it relates to the concerns expressed in this thread.
It is a serious question, worthy of a great deal of reflection and much respect.
It's not "so very much worse". But it's very different. Many academics, politicians, and professionals who take such trips are "natural allies" of the Israeli Zionist regime. They represent and defend and benefit from the same oppressive policies, both there and here. The same cannot be said for First Nations - nor for workers or women or youth or other marginalized and oppressed people.
I live in unceded Coast Salish territory. The Coast Salich FN's are not asking me to leave and they are the only FN's that matter to me in that respect.
I was born in Acadia and my ancestors were accepted by the Mi'kmaq until the Boston elite used the British navy to ethnically cleanse Acadia of its French speaking mixed race community. [see http://www.danielnpaul.com/Col/1997/Mi%27kmaqAcadianRelationship-Respectful.html]
Quizzical thank you so much for your posts. You are a breathe of fresh air. I too was raised in the catholic church and because of the abuse I suffered lost my "faith." To me the most evil influence in early canadian history has always been the Jesuits. The catholic church heirarchy are a nasty vile gang of misogynists. That view of course never stopped me from loving and respecting my mother who was a devout catholic for over 90 years.
Writer nice to see you posting again. I have been having to make do with the rare Maysie sightings.
I don't think the question is whether FN and Native leaders can make bad decisions. I think anyone who has any exposure to the politics can see that no one is immune to that.
The question is one of protocol: Who is in a position to second-guess why Native leaders make those decisions, or what the right decision is? Perhaps if our federal government made a priority of simple matters like fresh water or housing, we wouldn't be facing embarrassing issues like this.
I live in probably one of the more structurally racist cities in this country (if you need to buy food, for one thing), divided by a river, with a swiftly-growing Native population, currently around 10 %, and with a FN-run university and two urban reserves sites, a First Nation just south of town, and an airport that you cannot pass through without being reminded that we are in Treaty 6, and that we are all treaty people.
Contrary to popular myth, the crime rate is about equal on both sides of the river.
You're right and that's why it's a 'devil's advocate' view, but in truth a standard Canucklhead education has produced lots of people who truly believe exactly what Ron Evans says. Perhaps as a counter, some progressive Jews could offer to fund the same young people to travel to Gaza?
These mealy-mouthed expressions of "disappointment" and calling FN leaders "fucking disgraces" has to stop. Such statements don't take account of history or colonialism and are deeply misguided. As Unionist and NDPP rightly point out, the "fucking disgrace" here is Israel and the massive amounts of money the spend on propaganda and hate, with no end of chutzpah on who they target for their self-interested campaign. Just because one aboriginal nation has taken up their offer for reasons we cannot know and with a sincereity we cannot gauge does not permit settlers to lay judgement upon them with such detached callousness. Get some fucking colonialist politics.
This thread is in the international politics forum because Israel's deceitful propganda campaign is the topic of discussion. It was not moved to give haters licence to hate on FNs.
Thanks Catchfire...I felt singled out..And just for the record,a little criticism does not make one an ignorant xenophobe.
And it is more than offensive to be labeled a First Nations hater...You don't know me,don't label me.
Anyhow,you won't see me using any 'hot button' words in this issue again.
In fact,I will refrain from commenting in this thread again.
alan smithee, I mean this to be constructive, and hope it can be received in this way. If you don't want to "be labeled a First Nations hater" you might do well to take more care to be respectful to First Nations people. Responding with "No need to be smug, Captain Obvious"; refusing to apologize for that aggressive, spiteful response: these things continue to affect perceptions of how you walk in the world. We know you only by the words you place here. And that sentence is not "a little criticism."
So much grief comes from defensiveness and fear. Sometimes a serious question really is a serious question. In some cultures, a central question. One that informs all discussion that follows.
@ CF
Absolutely.
However, the fact that this involved First Nations (like the situation some years back when South Africa did something similar) is very significant, in that it points to the hypocrisy of our nation and our society. It would not have quite the same sting in the case of some other representative.
I don't think any government or organization is immune from criticism for things which affect the general public. This has nothing to do with that.
But rather it is a smart, and a devious move on the part of the Israelis, because any criticism is going to ring pretty hollow. In that, it is no different than if it were any other constituency with grievances which we assume should think, act, or vote a certain way because we think it is the best thing for them.
(Which is a colonialist way of thinking.)
that's a good point 649 about criticism being subject to censor. there's gr8 potential for less criticism and for positive PR. if they are accepted as indigenous by portions of the world's indigenous then hey it creates a better foot hold dynamic. or they think it will.
i think it'll eventually create a soul deep knowing we are all indigenous to this planet and no one has ownership rights. 'cause we're all in this together.
Yes.
That is to say, it is equally presumptuous to assume that a group should act in a certain way, whether it concerns First Nations, Metis, immigrants, women, union members, farmers, Newfoundlanders or any other group.
I see this in part as a failing of the Palestine solidarity community in Canada to reach out to First Nations communities. I know I haven't done much because I'm not sure how to avoid the critiques in #42 and #43 above. There are some examples - a Palestinian flag at the Grassy Narrows blockade a few years back is one.
I'm not putting this together well, but it's something I think about a lot. I read a piece by Gilbert Achar that has stuck with me. In reference to the Kurds working with the Israelis, much of the same criticism was leveled. Achar wrote that when you're in a pit you'll grab hold of the lifeline tossed to you and worry about who is holding the other end when you get to the surface. Whatever the motives, I know that the Israelis share their skills and knowledge of language reclamation with some First Nations.
I agree, quizzical. We're all in this together.
Anyway, I have an idea brewing ... A little project maybe for babblers?
I think the ethnic component here is a red herring, at least the way it has played out in this thread. In my earlier post I had thought to qualify it along the lines that Unionist graciously did in the post following mine - by noting it was standard practice for the Israeli propaganda machine to target vulnerable minorities with free junkets and gift baskets in its effort to recruit supporters and that seems to be the case here. That is the only aspect in which the chief's cultural background is relevant.
Do I really need to mention the obvious, that there is nothing special about the chief's ignorance of Middle Eastern politics, that tens of millions of North Americans of every ethnic stripe hold the same uninformed views? That the main point is that as soon as he takes to the public stage, in an official capacity as a leader - of ANY group - and starts acting as a useful idiot of the Israeli state, he needs to be called on it. I think my use of the phrase 'whisper in his ear' indicated that in this case the thing could be handled with cultural sensitivity because of course, who knows by what innocent path he came to be holding the views he espoused.
The issue here is the perfidy of the Israeli state and I don't care to be associated however loosely with anti-FN 'haters' thank you very much. We don't conflate criticism of Israel with anti-semitism: likewise, criticism of an FN leader's public statements should not be confused with anti-FN sentiment.
If he got up on his soapbox and made inspired remarks about homosexuality and sin, or women's natural subservience to men, would we be so quick to reach for the kid gloves?
I love you quizzical. Like I love Maysie. Your voice is clear.
CIJA: 'Mission Accomplished'
http://www.cija.ca/community-2/mission-accomplished/
"A group of 30 members of the Norway House Cree Nation completed their leadership mission to Israel this week, in an event organized by the Jewish Federation of Winnipeg.."
mission accomplished indeed.
Aboriginal Leader Looking to Israel As Role Model
http://www.cija.ca/community-2/aboriginal-leader-looks-to-israel-as-role...
"...Evans said he is planning to take a group of potential young leaders from his community to Israel every year for the next nine years or more. 'We have already started our fundraising for our mission next spring, he said.
The Zionists are sure getting their money's worth of hasbara from this one..
I notice that this CIJA tour guide neglected to take them to see the areas of Gaza and Lebanon that were bombed by the Israelis using phosphorous munitions. Shelley is a very good shill for the immoral state of Israel.
I wish I had the money to send the same students back to Gaza and Lebanon to see the other side of the reality. Of course if they went as a group to meet people from Gaza they likely would not be admitted into Israel at all. They would be deported before they got into Gaza.
Zionist CIJA's latest outreach attempt;
Jewish and Aboriginal Communities Continue to Strengthen Relationship
http://www.cija.ca/judaism/jewish-and-aboriginal-communities-continue-to...
"Jewish Federation and CIJA will be helping community members to participate in the citywide Walk For Reconciliation on Sunday Sept 22, 2013. Stay tuned for more information on this event and on the relationshp between the Jewish and Aboriginal communities."
Chief of Canadian Cree Nation Returns to Israel for Second Annual Youth Leadership Trip
http://www.cija.ca/israel-advocacy/chief-of-canadian-cree-nation-returns...
"....As with last year's inaugural program, our aim is to develop the next generation of First Nations leaders by looking through the lens of Israel's inspiring story,' said Evans. 'Israel is first and foremost the land of the heritage of the Jewish people..."