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John Horgan, Wrong Choice!

NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

!!!


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NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

The Premier is already wearing her hard hat. 

Unfortunately John just doesn't get it. It's about jobs and the economy.

You cannot be against jobs and expect to win. The NDP is the party of no.

The BC NDP will get crushed in May.

Too bad!

 


NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

Right now the NDP has one effective leader in Canada and that is Rachel Notley. What is not to understand about that!

 


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

NR please fuck off and die. 


KenS
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Joined: Aug 6 2001

... he said please.

good canadian.


Edzell
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Joined: Nov 4 2016

kropotkin1951 wrote:
NR please fuck off and die.

Really smart people know how to take their own advice Wink.


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

Edzell wrote:

kropotkin1951 wrote:
NR please fuck off and die.

Really smart people know how to take their own advice Wink.

Anyone with street smarts would know better than to get into the middle of a fight.


Ken Burch
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Joined: Feb 26 2005

You don't have to support the pipelines to be for "Jobs".  We are all for jobs.

And the pipelines are only going to create a handful of longterm jobs.

Beside which, coming out for the pipelines would have no effect on the BCNDP's electoral chances other than to knock the party into third place behind the BC Greens. 


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

Ken Burch wrote:

Beside which, coming out for the pipelines would have no effect on the BCNDP's electoral chances other than to knock the party into third place behind the BC Greens. 

If they support tar sands gunk being shipped through the Salish Sea in the quantities proposed every single coast seat they have will be in play and many will go Green. The idea that the only jobs imaginable are in digging up the lowest grade of oil on behalf of foreign owned companies to ship it through a pipeline built and owned by and American corporation to ship to China where they are the investing big time in renewable energy is absurd. 

 


NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

And unfortunately for the brain dead NDP, she is correct.

Christy Clark dons hard hat in quest for 5th Liberal mandate, hammers out jobs platformB.C. Premier Christy Clark in hard hat

Wearing a hard hat, B.C. Premier Christy Clark listens to a question at the Woodfibre LNG project site near Squamish, B.C., on Friday Nov. 4, 2016. Clark never seems to miss the chance to put on a hard hat and pose with workers for what has become the trademark photo opportunity of her government. (Darryl Dyck / THE CANADIAN PRESS)

 

 

VICTORIA -- British Columbia Premier Christy Clark never seems to miss the chance to put on a hard hat and pose with workers for what has become the trademark photo opportunity of her government.

She's donned hard hats in Nanaimo at a lumber yard, at a mine site in Princeton and at the Howe Sound location of a proposed liquefied natural gas plant.

British Columbians can expect more hard-hat appearances as Clark looks to secure her second term and a fifth straight Liberal mandate in next May's election.

RELATED STORIES

"Whenever I'm wearing a hard hat, I'm usually talking about all the things we can do to support job creation," Clark said in a year-end interview with The Canadian Press. "Why do I go to work sites? I want to make the point that jobs matter and government makes a difference in whether or not those jobs get created."

New Democrat Leader John Horgan is also familiar with a hard hat.

"I've said in the past, I've worn a hard hat to protect my head, not just get my picture taken," Horgan said in an interview as he placed the union-sticker covered hard hat on his head. He smiled as he joked that he'd never be mistaken for actor George Clooney.

john horgan ndp daycare

Clark said job creation will be her primary message in the coming months and the choice will become more clear for voters.

"When I was growing up and my dad would come home from his union meetings, it was obvious there were two parties," she said. "Now in B.C. there is one party that supports employers and supports workers because we support job creation, and there is another that doesn't support jobs. That's what will be at stake for us over the next six months."

Horgan said Clark's Liberals have underfunded public education, presided over an exodus of forestry jobs in rural communities and provided tax breaks to the wealthy.

"Sixteen years these people have been in power, and I've been maintaining Christy Clark cares about two things, and you are not one of them," Horgan said, suggesting Clark cares more about herself and her party.

The premier has warned her Liberal party supporters that they are in for a fight this spring.

But she's leading Canada's strongest economy and is betting that issue and jobs will hit home when voters go to the polls May 9.

"What I know is a job means stability," she told the annual gathering of the B.C. Road Builders Association earlier this month. "It means food on the table. It means you can own your own home."

B.C.'s economy is projected to grow three per cent this year, more than double the projected national average of 1.2 per cent. B.C.'s jobless rate at 5.6 per cent is the lowest in the country.

Christy Clark

Clark highlighted major projects and the jobs they created, pointing out each one has been opposed by the NDP. The Evergreen Line, South Fraser Perimeter Road, Port Mann Bridge, the Canada Line, Site C hydroelectric dam and Pacific NorthWest LNG are either complete, proposed or underway.

"And then there's Kinder Morgan, 15,000 new jobs, and they oppose that, too," she told the convention.

The $6.8 billion Trans Mountain expansion project from northern Alberta to Burnaby, B.C. would triple the oil pipeline's capacity from 300,000 to 890,000 barrels a day.

Horgan said British Columbians are struggling to make ends meet as hydro, insurance and medical costs increase.

"I've worked in mills. I've worked on a roof," he said. "I've worked in construction. I know what it's like to try and make ends meet, pay cheque to pay cheque."

Political scientist Hamish Telford, at University of the Fraser Valley, said Horgan must increase his public profile ahead of the campaign.

"If you went to downtown Vancouver, Victoria or any other town in the province and stopped people on the street and asked them to name the leader of the NDP, I suspect nine out of 10 people couldn't do it," he said.

Telford said the Liberals are vulnerable on education, transportation, housing and the unequal distribution of economic gains. Clark's Liberals failed to deliver on their big promise of thousands of LNG jobs, he said.

"We are five months away from the election and the NDP have to get him (Horgan) known and defined before the Liberals do it for them," Telford said.

 

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/christy-clark-dons-hard-hat-in-quest-for-...


Ken Burch
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Joined: Feb 26 2005

You don't have to back environmentally disastrous megaprojects to support "jobs".  Brown jobs are not the only kind that can be made.  Since you are now right wing, why do you still post here?


Centrist
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Joined: Apr 7 2004

Ken Burch wrote:

You don't have to back environmentally disastrous megaprojects to support "jobs".  Brown jobs are not the only kind that can be made.  Since you are now right wing, why do you still post here?

That's not politically analytical though. The unionized BC Building Trades (long-time allies of the BC NDP) supports mine development, LNG, nat gas pipelines, Kinder Morgan twinning, BC Hydro's Site C dam, etc. So does a majority of the USW membership - comprising, for example, a huge membership in Canada's largest metallurgical coal region in the Elk Valley within the East Kootenays.

Frankly, the BC NDP has written off almost the entirety of interior BC (aside from the 2 West Kootenay seats). Without winning these ridings in 2017, where all of the foregoing issues matter, the BC NDP will never form gov't.

Green energy, booming tourism industry, booming high-tech sector, booming film industry, etc. on the SW BC coast does not impact/matter to BC interior folk. Will say again, the BC NDP has basically written off interior BC ridings with their current positions. Do not need to be a rocket scientist to figure that out. The BC NDP could have scoped out more nuanced positions like the AB NDP, SK NDP, MB NDP, and ON NDP. But they haven't in terms of the MSM's eyes. And the MSM will always kill ya.

 

 


Kaspar Hauser
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Joined: Aug 15 2004
I think Centrist and NorthReport are right. The NDP needs to listen to every constituency if it wants those constituencies to vote Orange. If people feel that the NDP is ignoring their core interests--the need for middle class wages, for example--then they will abandon the NDP. The NDP needs--desperately needs-- to be seen as a working class party, rather than a party for urban intellectuals. You can only show contempt for workers' bread and butter issues for so long before you lose all credibility with them. Balancing environmental, social justice, and industrial interests is perilously difficult, but it needs to be done: you can't win if you forsake industry for the environment and social justice, and if you don't win you can't achieve any good whatsoever. There has been a terrible bifurcation that has happened in our political systems between conscienceless power and powerless conscience. By abandoning for the sake of social and environmental conscience the strategies needed to obtain and wield power, the NDP ensures that Liberals will fill the resulting vacuum by focusing solely on acquiring power untempered by conscience. The political landscape is ultimately a tragic landscape littered with unresolvable ethical double-binds. The desire to ignore those double-binds in pursuit of a completely clean conscience cedes the field to psychopaths.

Basement Dweller
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Joined: Nov 27 2006

Reading this thread, you might start to believe everyone in the Interior thought the same and had the same interests. I kind of doubt that.


Kaspar Hauser
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Joined: Aug 15 2004
They may not have the same interests, but I'll bet they largely share the same deep anxieties about things like plant closures and immiseration.

epaulo13
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Joined: Dec 13 2009

The BC NDP could have scoped out more nuanced positions

..i agree with this statement although it may not in the same way as the author. probably all of us by now understand that how we are living/working is unsustainable. so far the ndp has been unable to articulate the alternative. they began taking the positions around lng, site c and lng because they perceived, rightly so, that great numbers of the population were against this business as usual. 

..reducing the crisis we are facing as one of jobs is a manipulation that will guaranty business as usual. extraction causes enormous damage to water, air, earth and people. this not theory but a reality. extraction is empowered via trade deals that override democracy. it violates both land and human treaty rights. by challenging this indigenous folks they are threatened with state repression financial or/and violence.

..the clc has a campaign currently. it's the creation of 1 million jobs via the green economy. it is only limited by the lack of polititcal imagination. horgan raised the issue of expanding the cooperative sector. this is a way to proceed that is not business as usual. we are not short on alternatives it's the polical will and the remedy is pressure from below. and while the ndp may not be totally committed at this point in time to an alternative approach they are the most susceptible to change.

eta: the state of the bc economy, the lack of jobs is mostly due to the very same people who are falsely promising all these jobs..the libs.


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

Centrist wrote:

Ken Burch wrote:

You don't have to back environmentally disastrous megaprojects to support "jobs".  Brown jobs are not the only kind that can be made.  Since you are now right wing, why do you still post here?

That's not politically analytical though. The unionized BC Building Trades (long-time allies of the BC NDP) supports mine development, LNG, nat gas pipelines, Kinder Morgan twinning, BC Hydro's Site C dam, etc. So does a majority of the USW membership - comprising, for example, a huge membership in Canada's largest metallurgical coal region in the Elk Valley within the East Kootenays.

You are wrong in your analysis. During the Bennett years the Building trades supported the Socreds. It was not until MiniWac attacked the building trades and drove the percentage of industrial construction from 85% union to 5 to 15 % union that they became NDP activists. 

Federally Liberal Senator Ed Lawson was from the same period. The Teamster's are part of the Building trades Tri-pack [Operating Engineers, Teamsters, Labourers] who build the dams and other major government projects under the Bennett years with polyparty collective agreements that were signed prior to the beginning of construction 

Since we are discussing defamation on the board here is a little bit about the defamation suit that Lawson won when he was called corrupt.

Quote:

On March 9, 2012, the Court of Appeal dismissed the appeal of David Baines and others from a judgment finding Mr. Baines (a newspaper columnist) and the other appellants (members of the paper’s editorial staff, the paper’s publisher and its proprietor) liable for defaming the Hon. Edward M. Lawson, a former member of the Senate.

http://hakemiridgedale.com/2012/03/court-of-appeal-dismisses-baines-defa...

 


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

On Vancouver Island and the rest of the Coast we have lost pulp mills, paper mills, sawmills and we now ship raw logs primarily as a forest industry.  I feel for the people of FOrt McMurray but what about Gold River and Campbell River and Powell River to mention three mill towns in decline. Building pipelines will not do anything for the economy of our region except add another risk factor to the fishing and tourist industries that are the backbone of our local economy.. 


alan smithee
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Joined: Jan 7 2010

Not to be hypocritical but I used to call NR right wing. I can't prove that he is even though some of his posts are questionable. No need to tell him to fuck off.

But slagging the NDP isn't conducive to the conversation. There are hundreds of comment boards out there where that can be done. There's no place for it here.


epaulo13
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Joined: Dec 13 2009

delete dup


epaulo13
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Joined: Dec 13 2009

..we face multiple crisis in the lack of proper transit, afforable housing, proper medical and mental health care, education. all these are green jobs. yet what we are offered is some of the dirtiest ways of earning income that leave us with clean up costs and the brunt of the profits going out of the country to corporations. liberal policy such as run of river electricity and site c is destroying the family jewel bc hydro. we can do much better. 


quizzical
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Joined: Dec 8 2011

Kaspar Hauser wrote:
They may not have the same interests, but I'll bet they largely share the same deep anxieties about things like plant closures and immiseration.

why aren't the BCNDP explaining why raw logs are being exported and how or if they intend to stop it?

nothing being said to the issue around the collapse of the forest industry and how it can be rebuilt means why not vote BC Liberal.


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

alan smithee wrote:

Not to be hypocritical but I used to call NR right wing. I can't prove that he is even though some of his posts are questionable. No need to tell him to fuck off.

I live in BC. I am inundated in all the media with pro-BC Liberal propaganda.  The BC Liberals are one of if not the most corrupt government Canada has ever seen. Coming to babble and day after day having to put up with NR's regurgitation of MSM talking points is beyond the pale. He is only doing it to piss people off. He pissed me off and since I thought he did on purpose I told him to fuck off. I still mean it.


alan smithee
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Joined: Jan 7 2010

kropotkin1951 wrote:

alan smithee wrote:

Not to be hypocritical but I used to call NR right wing. I can't prove that he is even though some of his posts are questionable. No need to tell him to fuck off.

I live in BC. I am inundated in all the media with pro-BC Liberal propaganda.  The BC Liberals are one of if not the most corrupt government Canada has ever seen. Coming to babble and day after day having to put up with NR's regurgitation of MSM talking points is beyond the pale. He is only doing it to piss people off. He pissed me off and since I thought he did on purpose I told him to fuck off. I still mean it.

I understand. I felt the same way the months before the Canadian election. I see exactly why he pissed you off. I was just trying to have cooler heads prevailng.


NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

Usually when one levels personal attacks it is because their arguments don't stand up.

Politically the NDP are a lost cause, and they need to stop wasting people's time, energy, and money with their nonsense.  


Edzell
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Joined: Nov 4 2016

alan smithee wrote:
No need to tell him to fuck off....I understand. I felt the same way the months before the Canadian election. I see exactly why he pissed you off. I was just trying to have cooler heads prevailng

Congratulations on your equanimity, but good luck with that. "Fuck off" - Is that the worst any of the krackpots said? I believe "Fuck off and Die" is their usual  "euphemism" for "I disgree."


quizzical
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Joined: Dec 8 2011

Edzell wrote:
alan smithee wrote:
No need to tell him to fuck off....I understand. I felt the same way the months before the Canadian election. I see exactly why he pissed you off. I was just trying to have cooler heads prevailng

Congratulations on your equanimity, but good luck with that. "Fuck off" - Is that the worst any of the krackpots said? I believe "Fuck off and Die" is their usual  "euphemism" for "I disgree."

so let me get this straight.....you're negatively labelling people as krackpots? from a self-imposed belief in your position of sane superiority?

lolololol

 


alan smithee
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Joined: Jan 7 2010

Edzell wrote:

alan smithee wrote:
No need to tell him to fuck off....I understand. I felt the same way the months before the Canadian election. I see exactly why he pissed you off. I was just trying to have cooler heads prevailng

Congratulations on your equanimity, but good luck with that. "Fuck off" - Is that the worst any of the krackpots said? I believe "Fuck off and Die" is their usual  "euphemism" for "I disgree."

There's nothing more annoying than some Johnny Come Lately calling people here 'Krackpots'. You're inviting confrontation. Smugness is not a virtue that demands respect.


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

NorthReport wrote:

Usually when one levels personal attacks it is because their arguments don't stand up.

You do nothing but post propaganda from the MSM media. I don't comer here to argue with right wing talking points. If you have nothing to add to the debate of how we get from here to a better future except more Liberal BS why are you still here. I told you to fuck off because I believe you opened this thread and the countless others just like it to piss in our collective cornflakes. 

I actually agree that the BC NDP has major problems but the focus has to be how do we stop the BC Liberals from winning again. You are here to promote the party of thieves and charlatans fronted by Ms. Photo-op herself.

The BC NDP needs to run on jobs and the third party interests need to save their money for a relentless radio ad campaign this spring citing the corruption of this government.  I have a different view of what cost the NDP the last election. It was a combination of months of business group ads calling Dix's character into question and his stupid response in the debate to the question about the memo.  The NDP allowed a government that had its offices raided over BC Rail to run without them pointing to the oozing corruption while being under attack for backdating a memo.


NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

Just heard the leader of the "Party of NO" on the CBC confirm that the BC NDP will lose the next election. Even neophyte politicos know you can't expect to run against jobs and win. How stupid can you be! Political losers always like to blame others for their own failings. Now Christy Clark and Rachel Notley are united against the lunatic fringe represented by John Horgan. But don't worry NDPers, you will probably come ahead of the Greens, which your leadership, in its brillance, has obviously decided, are even a bigger threat than the Liberals. Go figure!!!


NorthReport
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Joined: Jul 6 2008

The BC NDP are definitely brain dead. The BC NDP lost the last election worrying about the Greens instead of keeping an eye on the main player, the Liberals, and now Horgan is just repeating Dix's stupidity word-for-word! 

Year / Liberals / NDP / Ind / Total

2005 / 46 / 33 / 0 / 79

2009 / 49 / 35 / 1 / 85

2013 / 49 / 34 / 2 / 85

You tell me what has the NDP learned about its election strategy, and what have they done about it over the years. People get tired of losers. My hunch is that the NDP will probably lose about 10 seats this time.


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