Permaculture

This ties in nicely with the thread on prosleytizing for me. [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img] My family is devoted -- by varying degrees -- to this concept.

That it originated in Australia I guess goes some way to explaining its relative popularity here. I don't know how widespread it is elsewhere, but I'm quite sure that you'll be able to find some devotees not too far from where ever you are.

PERMACULTURE: A Designers' Manual is the absolute bible of the movement. It's been a few years since I've pored over its pages, but I recall it as being a friendly and inspiring read. The author, Bill Mollison, is largely credited with being the father of the philosophy, and is charmingly down-to-earth and practical. He also declines to wear shoes, of which I wholly approve. [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img]

There's also a great series that aired on television here, Global Gardener, which is hosted by the man himself, that gives a good overview of the philosophy and looks at some of the results of the practice in the tropics, arid regions, cool climates and urban areas.

On your comment about not having any land: permaculture can be utilised by anyone in any situation. It's not just a land-management system, but (dare I say it) a way of life that embraces reduced consumption, caring for ourselves and others and sharing resources. It sounds like it's in the same postcode as crystal-healing and dolphin spirit guides* but while it does have a large cross-over audience with those pasttimes it's actually very much grounded in practical reality. Having said that I should warn you that I've seen a good few individuals and organisations that claim to be permaculturalists but are doing it in a very half-assed way and giving the whole movement a bad reputation. If you're looking to make contact with or visit a permaculture set-up, you could do worse than finding them through an organisation such as Permaculture International or Crystal Waters. Both are Australian-based, but I'm sure would be able to refer you to organisations in your area. (I don't know a great deal about the first organisation, but I know that Crystal Waters has a very good reputation in this part of the world.)

I hope this helps a little. Feel free to PM me if you'd like any more information. Always happy to help spread the good word. [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]

*If this is your thing, that's fine by me. I just needed to make the distinction. [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img]

edited to add something of no interest to anyone but myself: I browsed the Crystal Waters site after I posted this. I was looking at the courses they offer and was pleasantly surprised to notice that one of the teachers is someone from my class at school who I haven't heard anything of since we all left. I had the biggest crush on him. [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]

[ 23 July 2005: Message edited by: Suzette ]

Suzette, is there a such thing as permaculture in the inner city? You were saying you could adopt the principles anywhere... [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img]

In any case, I just reserved the book you mentioend from the library. Not surprisingly, both copies are out.

quote:Originally posted by Michelle:
Suzette, is there a such thing as permaculture in the inner city? You were saying you could adopt the principles anywhere... [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img]

In any case, I just reserved the book you mentioend from the library. Not surprisingly, both copies are out.
Abso-freakin'-lutely!!
This is one local example, but it gets even smaller-scale than this. A small balcony. A window ledge. An attitude. Seriously, permaculture can be implemented in as simple a way as our own behaviour. Land in the permaculture philosophy is divided into zones which radiate out from the dwelling, the house itself being Zone 1, and so on. This was modified later to make ourselves Zone 0. So even by adopting permaculture principles such as sharing resources and reducing consumption we can adopt the practice into our lives. (I'm conscious of sounding preachy here, but I was kind of given permission, I suppose...) Enjoy the book, by the way. Love to hear what you make of it when you're done.

skdadl: I'd be very surprised if that particular door didn't slam shut some time ago -- I was far from being the only one with her eye on it. [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img]

Ha! Perfect, Michelle! A tiny, weedy, hopeless-case plot + permaculture manual = inspired and happy digging! I defy you to read the book and not plan a dozen wonderful things for your weeny square of dirt! It's a Zone 1 plot; perfect for herbs, as you say. And maybe some other things, too. You'd be surprised what you can get into a small area with some upright planters and so on. Maybe some water chestnuts (when outside water is liquid in your part of the world; so, what, three months of the year? [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img] ) in an old baby's bath...some sweet and lovely new potatoes in a stack of tyres filled with straw and compost...a worm farm... the possibilities are endless! Grow, grow, grow! [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]

Herbs = brilliant. Pots or that old tire are best for the few that can become pests (oregano, unfortunately, or the dreaded lemon balm).

Strawberry plants are also a good idea: small, and they spread, but controllably.

Oh yes, I see. Well, vermicomposting isn't necessary for me right now because we have a really fantastic green box program here, where you can put everything edible (and organic non-edibles) into the green bin. So I probably wouldn't bother with that. Besides, I tried vermicomposting once and my worms all died! I felt like a mass murderer.

Hey neeuqdrazil, how's the vermicomposting going, anyhow? (She's got my old bin. [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img] )

Apparently they'll be using it "for farms and parklands" according to this page:
http://www.city.toronto.on.ca/greenbin/background.htm

Yeah, I don't understand how people's bins can get so dirty. The other day I was walking down Dufferin Street on the way to taking my little one to day camp, and there was this one green bin that they lined with a large bag (as opposed to using small bags in the kitchen and sticking them in the bin). It was left by the garbage collectors because the bag inside it wasn't tied, it reeked to high heaven, and there were flies swarming all over it! Good lord.

I find that, being kitty-free now, I only have one grocery bag full of stuff for the bin, depending on how much I've been cooking that week. I find the kitchen bin so handy, and surprisingly, it's not so terrible when you open it on garbage day and tie it up, even if there's meat in it (my kid's here for the summer, so I've been buying meat lately, which I normally don't do). I am just loving this composting program. It makes up for the dismal recycling program.

What I'm finding to be a bit of a pain, though, is that now that I've been recycling and composting so much, I have only maybe a grocery bag full of garbage-garbage every two weeks. But they say they don't want people to put out kitchen catchers or grocery bags for garbage pick-up. I wonder if they make an exception if you only have one bag, as opposed to 10 grocery bags piled up? I used a large garbage bag last week, but felt guilty because it was only a quarter full. Seems like such a waste.

Yeah...the only problem I have with the green bin program is that they don't offer the program to people who live in apartment buildings. So the people who don't have a backyard to put in a composter are the ones who also can't use the city's composting service! Kind of a shame, really. But I think I've heard that they're going to try to study the problem of waste disposal in buildings, especially high rises, because the rate of recycling in highrises in Toronto is apparently dismal. People can get away with throwing all their garbage down the chutes so they do - and they have no incentive to make sure that they throw the proper stuff into the recycling dumpster, so they screw it up.

On the other hand, I lived in a 10 or 12 storey building in Kingston where they had a really great garbage room, with a decent recycling area that everyone respected and used properly. I think that, given the opportunity, people will do it right.

How do you become certified? (Also: welcome!)

[ 23 July 2005: Message edited by: Michelle ]

Greetings, well there is my site www.restoretheearth.ca

and
this one from British Columbia:

http://www3.telus.net/permaculture/

and this in Ontario:
http://www.everdale.org/

and in New Brunswick:

http://www.fallsbrookcentre.ca/

There are a number of good books about permaculture that are worth reading. The Designer's Manual is the textbook for the certified designer's course but a seriosu read and pricey.

Try Gaia's garden by Toby Hemenway or the earth User's guide to Permaculture by Rosemary Morrow, first. Permaculture One and Two or the Introduction to Permaculture are also informative.

The Beginner's Guide to Permaculture by Graham Burnnet is another great place to begin.

bob

I always liked the idea of keeping chickens (for eggs - don't think I could bear to make friends with them and then eat them for supper). Although I think I like the idea more than I'd enjoy the reality. But gee, whenever I hear about back-to-the-earth types who grow their own veggies and keep a couple of chickens about the place, I always think it sounds so nice. [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img]

[ 24 July 2005: Message edited by: Michelle ]

Click on his homepage from his profile. He's got a pretty informative site on the subject. Looks interesting!

Haha! That's really not what I meant! No, I was just pointing out that I enjoyed his web site.

But actually, you're right, one thing I didn't realize was the output-input part of it when I was reading those links yesterday. It didn't come clear to me until I read satana's description of the farm he visited.

I should find a book on the subject for my mom. It would make a good gift - sounds like the type of thing she'd like.

quote:Originally posted by satana:
and now I'm wondering why isn't this way of working not done everywhere?
I wonder that on a regular basis, too. Spreading the information you learn from the manual will be another step towards changing that. As Ghandi said, Be the change you wish to see in the world. [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img]

quote:I think I'll order "The Designer's Manual". Lots of sites I've seen recommend it but I've been hestitant as its seems like a heavy tome and I was wondering if I could find something lighter and handier (and less expensive).
You could try to find it in your local library, as Michelle did, rather than shell out your money before you've had time to check it out. It's not cheap, so maybe spending some time having a look first would be worthwhile.

quote:I didn't know permaculture could be applied without land. This Zone 0, Zone 1 stuff is covered in the manual?
If memory serves, this is all covered in the manual.

quote:Now I'm really interested in trying it myself.
Thanks heaps Suzette!

Great! Always a pleasure to be spreading the wonderful world of permaculture (and banging the Aussie drum. [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img] )

Edited to add: Thanks for posting the Canadian links, B. Ewing.

[ 24 July 2005: Message edited by: Suzette ]

Permaculture in a Nutshell, another excellent book.

For futher understanding of permaculture and the produce no waste practice, vist this site.

http://www.permaculture.biz/ethics_principles.htm

To become a certified permaculture designer, it is necessary first to take a course that is offered by a certified designer who has also been certified to teach.

The course runs approximately two weeks or some variation of that . There are at least two online courses offering designer certification and many others that offered on site teaching. For more info visit the Permaculutre Institute.

http://www.tagari.com/.

Mollison's The Permaculture Designer's Manual is the text.

I have recently applied for teacher certification.

One of the big criticisms of permaculture is the cost. The seminars, even the books, can be a real impediment to involvement. There is a movement afoot to democratize permaculture in order to make it more accessible to those who right now can't afford the high cost of entry. Because really, it is something anyone can do. There is a magazine. Permaculture Activist you might want to google. Oh, I can google just as easy as you: http://www.permacultureactivist.net/

Permaculture resource

When I moved into this place last July, I acquired a property lot around the house that was all grass save a fenced in garden. I'm planting trees this spring, along with creating four or five gardens to break up the grass monopoly here. I'm going to get the local contractor to haul a huge rock to put in the centre of the property, and I'll landscape around it. I have a small property, but it has potential. If everything grows according to plan, I'll have far more veggies than I need for myself, and will give some to friends and neighbours. And, I'll have about fifty sunflower plants just for the birds.

quote: What I really like about permaculture is the idea of making the system do much of the work, like a miniature ecosystem. It suits my inner laziness.

It is funny you should say that because a large part of permaculture is placing things close to where you need them. For example, many people place their compost heaps way, way in the back and then tend not to use them when it is bad weather. Permaculture says place the compost outside your backdoor. And place plants that need a lot of water closer tp your water source.

quote: Although it probably shouldn't smell too bad as long as you're not putting verboten stuff into it.
If your food is all vegetable, add grass clippings, saw dust, leaves, or even peat, and be sure to turn it regularly and it won't smell.

You can keep chickens for pets, you know. They will do all those good things for you. Plus, if you adjoin your chicken coop to a small greenhouse, they will help keep it warm. If you don't want the eggs give them to a neighbour who will appreciate them. We don't have chickens yet, but we are planning to have them.

Bumping this because I was looking at a neat web site that has great garden maps and examples of plant guilds.

Why, yes, I DO wish I had my own little house in the country. Why do you ask? [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img]