Suicide
January 28, 2012 - 10:06pm
Under what circumstances would you consider ending your life.
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Syndicate
Probably if it became clear that I could no longer live with dignity...which, to me, might include being both paralyzed and incontinent with no hope of recovery from either.
Also, I'd have to at least put it under long-term consideration if I'd been given a diagnosis of Alzheimer's.
Perhaps a terminal ilness or even depression. What would it take for you to call it quits.
My last post shouold go before Ken's.
However, now that I'm thinking about it, what about mental considerations. Like depression, or hopelessness.
Suicide is somewhat acceptable for physical reasons but what about the above?
deleted
There's a lot of literature on the subject, beginning I guess with Émile Durkheim. I did a university course on the subject 40 years ago.
Wow. That's a serious question. I suppose for myself, if there comes a time when nobody would notice I was missing I'd probably have to consider it. Knowing the impact it has on others, I don't think I could hurt them that way unless I had their blessing and consent.
ETA. I shouldn't need the blessing and consent of any government however.
`` By recognising this innocence in ourselves and in one another, we can find freedom, strength and kindness in the very heart of despair. We shouldn't commit suicide, Camus reasoned, because suicide slanders this innocence; for the same reason, we shouldn't be cruel to others or abandon them to their suffering.``
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But that assumes death is a bad thing.
I shouldn't need the blessing and consent of any government however.
I agree, but I would go a step further: The government should not punish those who assist a suicide. Many people who may want to commit suicide are physically unable to do so.
stevebrown, not to assume anything but if this is some sort of "cry for help", please find somebody to talk with,
This is not a cry for help, whatever that is, so fuck you.
dude, that wasn't necessary. i was trying to be helpful. often when people start talking about suicide, it's because they're considering it. i was hoping that wasn't the case.
Stevebrown, if someone hears something from someone else that makes them think "hey, that sounds a bit dark, I wonder if I should be concerned" there is never, ever, anything wrong with asking. If Mr.Tea is incorrect in his concern then that's great. No reason to be offensive.
...if someone hears something from someone else that makes them think "hey, that sounds a bit dark, I wonder if I should be concerned" there is never, ever, anything wrong with asking.
Thanks for that reminder, oldgoat...to all of us.
Under what circumstances would you consider ending your life.
That was the question. Unfortunately Mr.Tea made it personal.
This is not a "cry for help".
A bit dark? How about every post in the "International" forum.
How about every single fuckin post in the anti-racsist forum?
A bit dark?
But not dark enough to assume someone is "crying out" for help?
I reserve the right to be offensive, if that offends anyone I apologize.
Look, steve, I apologize if you were offended. it's just that at 9 pm on a Saturday night, my typical mindset is to think that I'd like a beer or to watch a movie, not to initiate a discussion on suicide on an internet message board. I've had experiences in college where people were posting similar thoughts and lets just say it didn't end well, so I was a bit concerned. I was pretty certain that you were merely trying to engage in a philosophical discussion, but if that wasn't the case, I thought it was at least worth encouraging you to talk to someone.
For whatever it's worth, I suspect that steve's response to "Mr. Tea" might not have been quite that hostile if Mr. Tea's post hadn't had quite that much of an "If you're in trouble, I don't wanna hear about it" tone to it.
Tea, as one babbler to another, the way you responded to steve there was really not a cool choice if you really think somebody posting here is thinking of killing her or himself. The last thing a person in that situation(and, obviously, steve wasn't, but you thought he might have been)needs to be told is that the person he is communicating with isn't interested in listening. Listening is the most important thing that you can do at such a moment. OK?
So then what are you doing here?
My annoyance is that every discussion of suicide ends up with some well meaning fuckwad pointing out how wonderful lifre is.
We've heard you.
Many times.
Go away.
Let this be an honest discussion of suicide.
OK...Not sure why you're hostile to me here...I meant no attack on you, and actually engaged your subject in an earlier post.
Ok..not sure why you are assuming I`m talking to you.
This is too fuckin funny.
?
I assumed you were talking to me because your post immediately followed mine. A lot of people would have thought that. My mistake. Sorry.
No need to be `sorry``.
Stop posting in a thread in which you have nothing to contribute to the topic.
That`s all I ask.
A lot of people would have thought that.
I thought the same thing.
Of course you would have sven, cuz yer just so fuckin.....ahhhhhhhh
Bypassing the drift, I think it's a serious topic, albeit dark. Having considered the option a few times in my life when I was younger and having shared the loss of a young loved one who actually succeeded at it, it's a real topic. Being an atheist I believe we only get one turn at being conscious.
ETA: I think hostility has killed whatever discussion may have been forthcoming, shame about that.
ETA: I think hostility has killed whatever discussion may have been forthcoming, shame about that.
Regrettably, the wholly unnecessary hostility may have done exactly that.
And Captain Obvious is on the scene!
Being an atheist I believe......blahblahblah.
When is hostility ever nesessary?
When is hostility ever nesessary?
Why don't you try directing that question to...yourself?
Fuck you Sven. The answer is never, but as a war mongering piece of shit american motherfuckin cocksucker.....that may have escaped your view.
Wow. That's a serious question. I suppose for myself, if there comes a time when nobody would notice I was missing I'd probably have to consider it. Knowing the impact it has on others, I don't think I could hurt them that way unless I had their blessing and consent.
Geez, I dont know about that.
I have had a friend commit suicide, and others I am close enough to the situation to have an idea.
And the cases I know of were tortured desperate souls. Literaly, tired of the pain. [And what difference does it make if its physical or mental anguish?]
Related to that: one of their tortures was knowing what pain their suicide would cause others. But that only made them hold back and get more miserable- it did not stop them.
And while one might think that 'no one would notice,' it is highly unlikely to be true. There may be no one there, and they may have chosen to be more distant... but they will know. Not to mention the poor sucker who gets to stumble upon the body.
It has come up in the thread the idea of suicide because the world is such a fucked up place. That one, I've never thought of. It makes logical and intellectual sense. But I just can't picture it.
FWIW, there is a big difference between being hopeless and tired of living, and in anguish over the pain.
Like when I'm savouring the one rise and shine of the week where I don't have to be anywhere or do anything too early, unlike every other morning, with a little organic mellow and a cup of coffee in hand...body and soul on the 7th day after a 6 day week as it were, only to open up on this door. And in case there's a follow up...with the nearest utensil.
Personally I think it should almost always have be one of those 'you have to be there' moments, where conjecture and theory exchange places with a praxis. Then you finally understand what it takes. And that moment has to be accompanied by the right conditions...no interruptions...utterly alone.
Aaah...the phone. brb.
Hi stevebrown. I'm stepping out of retirement long enough to suspend your account. I'll leave it up to the permanent mods to decide for how long, but this isn't how we talk to eachother around here.
I think it's the biggest stumbling block because every development thus far conspires against this recognition. And while the idea is certainly not an uncommon one within the last 50 or so years across many philosophical works...the stuff of today's obscure pamphlets for the most part is about as general to the people as it gets. Huddling together perhaps in small, cognitive groups or communities has plenty of examples on offer....its a matter of arriving at the least offensive and most joyful for all involved, where the work mainly involves just that. This is why I was particularly struck by the purgatory analogy from Agamben's coming community after reading it. Their advantage consists in being mostly left alone by the respective powers, while appearing incapable of creating their own in this interpretation. Not much hope of that in our circumstance, except that people experiment more as a result nowadays with different forms of imperceptibility. Speaking of which, there is also a stumbling block perhaps with the one demand movement. As the premier and most novel expression of the left today, people have already begun to look at one another with shrugged shoulders to ask who precisely should they address now, after decades of ill response. This might be worth further examination if we could rid ourselves of Foucault. Now there's a hope.