EVERY Province Has Had A Female NDP Leader In Except Saskatchewan

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Mighty Middle
EVERY Province Has Had A Female NDP Leader In Except Saskatchewan

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Mighty Middle

Watch the short video of the 19 women who have been NDP Leaders across the country (Except Saskatchewan).

Why is it that Saskatchewan has never had a female NDP leader?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T41lJ2vSAHo

Stockholm

coincidence...btw: some of the NDP leaders mentioned were only interim leaders like Flor Marcellino in Manitoba

Mighty Middle

Quote:
coincidence

Think NOT cause NDP does have a policy to recruit more women and minorities.

Quote:
some of the NDP leaders mentioned were only interim leaders like Flor Marcellino in Manitoba

No matter, leader is a leader

But Saskatchewan is WAY BEHIND other provinces in respect to having a female NDP leader.

6079_Smith_W

What has happened in other jurisdictions is ultimately irrelevant, and the problem with framing it that way is that it distracts from the real issue:

There is no good reason why the Saskachewan NDP has not had a woman leader, and it is long overdue.

It is not a competition, and it does not mean that other provinces are necessarily better or more progressive or don't have their own work to do when it comes to gender equality and women's rights generally.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

True, but even progressives in rural SK are somewhat conservative when it comes to race and gender. There was always a concern you couldn't get a majority with a woman leader. And there was, for many years, an old boys' club that rooted out ambitious women and upstart young men, which is why the SK NDP is in the state it's in now. Hopefully there will be some strides made as the renew, but odds are the next leader will be male.

6079_Smith_W

TB, I agree completely. That same network of discrimination is everywhere, even if the problem is more pronounced here than it is in some places. My point is that the comparison doesn't help solve the problem, especially when it turns on technical points. It is a good thing to point out, but it also takes us down the tangent of some getting defensive, and others thinking they are more progressive.

A recent article on a wider aspect of the problem here:

http://leaderpost.com/news/saskatchewan/saskatchewan-still-has-a-ways-to...

6079_Smith_W

And we just went down to the co-op and noticed there is only one woman on the eight-member board. So no, putting it down to women not running, or there only being few options is not an explanation or a justification. It is everywhere.

Given that, it is kind of hard to believe that we wound up with a majority of women on our city council. But again, the fact it happened this time doesn't erase that reality.

 

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Exactly. There's a time to be pragmatic about your population's quirks and foibles as well as their strengths.

I hear that Wab Kinew is going for the leadership of the MB NDP. I believe that will be our first indiginous leader here - another progressive milestone, if he succeeds.

Mighty Middle

There will be a Saskatchewan NDP Leadership race next year. That is why the video ends with the words

"It's Time"

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
Think NOT cause NDP does have a policy to recruit more women and minorities.

Such a policy cannot guarantee a female party Leader, though.

Quote:
But Saskatchewan is WAY BEHIND other provinces in respect to having a female NDP leader.

WAY BEHIND?  Or just one female leader behind?

While I completely understand not wanting any legislative assembly to remain an "old boy's club", I'm kind of ambivalent about the apparent need for those assemblies to always and in every case be some statistical mirror of the population.  Or otherwise, where are all of our double-amputee MPs?  When will we have a Tamil MP who uses a hearing aid?  Why is no party led by a leader on the autism spectrum?

It's fine as a goal, to aim for.  But I see no point in trying to use failure to realize that goal as some kind of whacking stick.

And just out of curiousity, have either of the other "big" parties done better?  The Conservatives, or the Liberals or the Greens?  Have they all had female leaders from sea to shining sea?  If not, why start with the party that seems to have made progress in all but one of the provinces/territories?

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Mighty Middle wrote:

There will be a Saskatchewan NDP Leadership race next year. That is why the video ends with the words

"It's Time"

I'm well aware. I also personally know at least one woman who is being called on to step into the race. She'd be great, but I'm not sure that the NDP membership or the general population of Saskatchewan is ready to elect her.

Mighty Middle

There has only be ONE (yes count 'em ONE) Female Party Leader in the Saskatchewan Legislature.

Liberal Leader Lynda Haverstock. She was also the first woman to be leader of the official opposition in Saskatchewan.

When I say Saskatchewan is WAY BEHIND, it seems that province has a problem with women political leaders. Canada is 150 years old, and that province has only had one female party leader in the Legislature.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Yes, the SK Liberals preferred implosion to being led by a woman. They still haven't recovered from the self-immolation.

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

Mighty Middle wrote:

There has only be ONE (yes count 'em ONE) Female Party Leader in the Saskatchewan Legislature.

Liberal Leader Lynda Haverstock. She was also the first woman to be leader of the official opposition in Saskatchewan.

When I say Saskatchewan is WAY BEHIND, it seems that province has a problem with women political leaders. Canada is 150 years old, and that province has only had one female party leader in the Legislature.

You appear to think that everyone else on this board is an apologist for the fact that the SNDP has never had a female leader.  Please don't assume that.

Also, don't assume that a party that happens to have had a woman as its leader is automatically feminist.  There's no reason to believe that about the Saskatchewan Liberals, a party that is not only well to the right of thr SNDP but(in the Ross Thatcher tradition)is arguably to the right of the Saskatchewan Party(I.E., the Saskatories).

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

(self-delete. dupe post).

Mighty Middle

It's TIME! For a woman to lead the Sask NDP!

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

Have you got a particular woman in mind, here?  And, for the record, are you a New Democrat yourself?(I've always thought your posting name was an indication that you vote Liberal).

 

Mighty Middle

Nettie Wiebe

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

I don't think that's helpful. They need to shed some old baggage, and Nettie, while an otherwise awesome candidate, was part of the old guard.

Unionist

Timebandit wrote:

I hear that Wab Kinew is going for the leadership of the MB NDP. I believe that will be our first indiginous leader here - another progressive milestone, if he succeeds.

You had Louis Riel.

Mighty Middle

There have been 19 women who have lead NDP parties across the country. If Sask elects a woman to lead their party, she would be number 20! We need to hit that milestone!

6079_Smith_W

Regarding Riel, that is complicated, as he was head of the provisional government, but only nominally a Father of Confederation, as he had to run to Montana to escape the law (and wasn't in support of confederation anyway),and later and after he was elected federally had to sneak into the House of Commons to sign the register to have himself registered as an MP.

As for SK, I do sympathize, really I do. But if we were to choose a Thatcher (margaret, not Ross) or a Clinton would that really be an accomplishment? Again, here in Saskatoon we have a majority of women on our city council,  so I don't buy that we have something inherenly against women in politics. But I am under no illusions that that fact makes us more progressive when it comes to women's rights. We still have the highest rate of domestic violence in Canada.

It is a good target, but it sure ain't the brass ring.

 

Mighty Middle

It is just strange that the birthplace of the NDP has never had a female leader. It seems the Prairies have had the least amount of success electing female leaders across all party lines.

6079_Smith_W

Sharon Carstairs might agree. Or not. It isn't a numbers game.

And if it was, I might point out that the first woman elected to office in the entire British empire was in the prairies - Alberta MLA Louise McKinney. And the same year, Calgary city councillor Annie Gale.

And that the Alberta NDP caucus elected last year is the closest any government in Canada has come to gender parity - 47 percent.

Given that, one could say the province of Alberta has had the greatest success in Canada when it comes to electing women representatives.

I am aware of the shortcomings in our part of the world. I'm sure not crowing about those firsts. But I don't buy making assumptions about a whole region based on those kind of numbers. Or maybe Calgary really is the least racist city in Canada because they are the only place to have elected a Muslim mayor.

 

 

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
But if we were to choose a Thatcher (margaret, not Ross) or a Clinton would that really be an accomplishment?

That's an excellent question.

Surely, female politicians should be allowed to hold a diversity of opinions and policies, but somehow the left likes to put an asterisk beside names like Thatcher and Gandhi and other women who "aren't REAL women".

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Fair point, U, but as Smith pointed out, a fairly complicated situation. And there certainly hasn't been one since!

Smith, it's beyond awesome what Saskatoon has done at the civic level. But take a look at RMs and SARM. They do have issues with women and minorities - or rather, the majority of rural voters do.  It's not much different here in MB, so I'm not looking down on SK or anything - just that these two provinces have a lot of work to do yet. Saskatoon's city government is great cause for hope!

6079_Smith_W

Again TB, I agree completely that it is a problem. One that goes way beyond just party politics.

Where I stop short is saying that it is something particular to the prairies. I think it is a mistake to leap to those kinds of assumptions about any region. And more importantly, it does nothing to help solve the problem. It just makes some people defensive, and others thinking they don't have the same problem.

Being in the city I might be inclined to think myself more progressive than people in the country. That would be a mistake, and not just because we have had the benefit of a lot more awareness and opportunity when it comes to these issues. Again, it is not a competition for who is better. We all have work to do.

 

Mighty Middle

Well you know Allison Brewer said she had two strikes against her as NDP leader in New Brunswick (which have rural areas that are quite Conservative)

She is a lesbian and a pro-choice activist. When 50% of the province won't vote for you on just those two stances, you are doomed. That is her saying that, not me. But that was 10 years ago, so maybe voters in NB might have a difference stance today.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

I think racism and sexism is much more prevalent in the rural areas than the cities all over Canada. The challenge for the prairies is the higher ratio of rural to urban. I don't care if it makes people defensive - doesn't make it less true. 

Mighty Middle

TB can you share the above video to that woman who is being urged to enter the Sask NDP race? Maybe it will inspire her!

6079_Smith_W

TB. I'm not saying don't call it out. I'm saying don't assume we're any better in the city, or in another province just because we might be a bit further ahead. And while I think urban centres have better resources and support networks for women, beyond that I'm not sure it is all that much better. Certainly it should be way better than it is, given what urban people are exposed to.

I think I may have mentioned our last MP - Lynn Yelich - lost her nomination before the last election. The party decided to toss over a 15-year MP and cabinet minister - of state for foreign affairs, and western development -   and go for a sport broadcaster who had no political experience, but the important credentials of having a penis.

And you'd think at least he would know something about sports, but not too long after getting in, he said this:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/waugh-comments-female-athletes-1...

So no, the city isn't all that much better.

 

 

 

Mighty Middle

I've been reading a few books of women party leaders in Canada. Interesting trend. Parties will let women assume the leadership when the party is low in the polls and marginalized. But when that woman turns the party around, and achieved electoral success. The men push the female leader aside saying "We'll take it from here". Only to make things worse.

Examples include Sharon Carstairs and Lynda Haverstock (who took their parties from one seat to Official Opposition) only to be knifed in the back by the men. Lorraine Michael in NF who increased NF NDP from one seat to five seats. Then there are sitting female Premiers like Catherine Callbeck, Kathy Dunderdale and Allison Redford who were forced out by men wanting to take over.

There are several other examples, but you get the point.

Cody87

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Quote:
But if we were to choose a Thatcher (margaret, not Ross) or a Clinton would that really be an accomplishment?

That's an excellent question.

Surely, female politicians should be allowed to hold a diversity of opinions and policies, but somehow the left likes to put an asterisk beside names like Thatcher and Gandhi and other women who "aren't REAL women".

Le Pen comes to mind as a current example, although she is unlikely to win the presidency this time around.

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

Unionist wrote:

Timebandit wrote:

I hear that Wab Kinew is going for the leadership of the MB NDP. I believe that will be our first indiginous leader here - another progressive milestone, if he succeeds.

You had Louis Riel.

Riel was an indigenous leader...he was not leader of the Manitoba NDP(and could not have been, as neither the NDP nor the CCF existed during Riel's lifetime).

Aristotleded24

Timebandit wrote:
True, but even progressives in rural SK are somewhat conservative when it comes to race and gender. There was always a concern you couldn't get a majority with a woman leader. And there was, for many years, an old boys' club that rooted out ambitious women and upstart young men, which is why the SK NDP is in the state it's in now. Hopefully there will be some strides made as the renew, but odds are the next leader will be male.

Before becoming an MLA for Point Douglas, Kevin Chief unsuccessfully tried to win Winnipeg North for the NDP after that seat became vacant when Judy Wasylycia-Lies ran for mayor. A big reason Chief was not successful in his campaign was due to people not voting for him because of his race. I still don't think him running was a mistake, and even if I knew  for sure that someone else would have  won that seat for the NDP, I still wouldn't have prefered that person over Chief. Racism, sexism, ageism, ableism, and queerphobia are very unpleasant realities of life in this country, but the only way to move forward is to challenge those prejudices head on. Brandon had never voted for a female mayor, then Shari Decter-Hirst won. No major city had ever elected an openly gay mayor, then Winnipeg voted for Glenn Murray, and supporters and critics alike generally kept their opinions related to the job he was doing. Michelle McHale organized a Pride celebrations in Manitoba's Bible Belt, and she continues to courageously challenge the deep-rooted homophobia in the Steinbach area.  To roll over is not an inspiring message, especially to people in those rural communities suffering from that kind of prejudice. Go forward, pick your best candidate, and make your case based on merit, and you may be surprised by how many people join you and say, "it's about bloody time!" Your leader may even emerge from these communities, so don't write anything off.

Hell, maybe with a bit more support, out queer kids from places like Winkler, Morden, or Steinbach wouldn't feel as if taking their chances on the streets of a major city is the best shot they have.

Mighty Middle

Everything Aristotleded24 wrote is just another reason why only a woman should be the next leader of the Sask NDP.

IT'S TIME!

Misfit

MM. maybe the people of Saskatchewan should make that determination and not you. And for the record, only two women have ever run for the leadership of the SNDP, Nettie Wiebe and Deb Higgins. The NDP has its strongest history in Saskatchewan than in any other province in Canada. Historically, there were very strong and high profile male candidates to assume the role of the next leader of the party unlike in other provinces where the NDP was never as dominant a party. Roy Romano had so much respect for Linda Haverstock that he appointed her as the Lieutenant Governor of Saskatchewan, a position that she rightly earned and deserved. I would rather have a strong male candidate than a female candidate just because she is a female. I voted for Nettie Wiebe for party leader only because I felt that she was the strongest candidate of the bunch at that time. Ryan Meilli will likely be the next leader.

Aristotleded24

Mighty Middle wrote:
Everything Aristotleded24 wrote is just another reason why only a woman should be the next leader of the Sask NDP.

IT'S TIME!

No, that's not what I said at all. There's a difference between "the next leader has to be a woman" and "we need to encourage strong, qualified capable women to run." The former gets you disasters like Margaret Thatcher, Hillary Clinton, Marine LePen, and Teresa May. The latter gives you strong leaders like Rachel Notley, Nina Turner, Tulsi Gabbard, and Linda Haverstock.

Misfit

New poll shows SNDP with a 9% lead in the polls over the SP.

Misfit

It is a Mainstreet/Postmedia poll.

Aristotleded24

Misfit wrote:
New poll shows SNDP with a 9% lead in the polls over the SP.

And the Saskatchewan NDP doesn't even have an actual leader right now!

What I found most interesting was that support for the parties was tied outside the 2 big cities. Certainly the NDP would win a majority of seats, I don't think their vote is that concentrated, but I wonder where those rural seats would come from.

Misfit

I actually think that winning would still be hard because Brad Wall created thee extra seats in the legislature and made all of them rural. It says that the NDP is way out in front in Regina. The NDP have a 2 point lead in Saskatoon and that rural Saskatchewan is more evenly split.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

I think you'll see a lot of blowback against the Wall government over the grants-in-lieu debacle - smaller cities, like Yorkton, who normally go conservative have been hit incredibly hard by those cuts and are very unhappy right now.

6079_Smith_W

Yeah, I don't expect that will get any better once we get those tax bills. And the STC cuts haven't even hit yet.

An interesting spin on the radio this morning - that the NDP may be benefitting more because they do not have a leader yet, so this switch is primarily anti- Sask Party, and people can project whatever they want on the alternative. That will change once there is a leader and platform.

And speaking of cuts, the Saskatoon Catholic School division just cut all their aboriginal retention workers, Odd, because indigenous education was the only reason why they were of any use at all:

http://thestarphoenix.com/news/local-news/gscs-cuts

 

 

quizzical

i hadn't heard anything about grants in lieu. looked it up and wow.

Yorkton has a 58% loss by Walls dumping of this.

when the tax payers in the cities get their new assessments it's going to hit home.

are he cities nd large towns going to fight this in court? from what i think i read is this is a long standing activity beyond when it was officially put into law in the late 90's.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Yes, Smith, I think shutting down STC may hurt the SP - and it should. I'm still shocked at the callousness of that move, and I've had the SP pegged as utterly heartless from the beginning.

6079_Smith_W

At this point I htink they are just going to throw all their energy into pushing their agenda through, since they know they are going to lose next time. Much the same as the Filmon tories did in Manitoba when I left there. In a way that makes them a lot more dangerous.

Though we are moving away from the original topic of this thread.

Aristotleded24

6079_Smith_W wrote:
An interesting spin on the radio this morning - that the NDP may be benefitting more because they do not have a leader yet, so this switch is primarily anti- Sask Party, and people can project whatever they want on the alternative. That will change once there is a leader and platform.

There is a grain of truth to this. It's one thing for people to say they don't like the current government, it's quite another for a different party to convince voters to take a chance on them. Nothing should be taken for granted, the NDP need to work at assembling a coherent platform and a competent team to challenge in 2020. We all remember how public opinion polling had the BC NDP winning in 2013 with a much larger margin than what the NDP holds over the Saskies right now.

ghoris

Are there any prospective female candidates waiting in the wings? There always seems to be some buzz around Danielle Chartier - does anyone know if she's in the mix? What about the other female MLAs in caucus?

I know Ryan Meili has declared again. Will the third time be the charm?

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

EVERY province has had an out, lesbian Premier except all of the provinces whose names don't begin with "O".

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