Hard to overstate the seriousness of the SNC-Lavalin accusations

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Martin N.

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Quote:
nancy boys like him.

Could you keep your homophobia to yourself, please?

Obviously we have different interpretations of the term. I refer to it as a synonym for trust fund dilettante, remittance man or upscale champagne socialist. I have no homophobic inclinations at all. My apologies and I will edit the post accordingly.

Martin N.

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Quote:
nancy boys like him.

Could you keep your homophobia to yourself, please?

Obviously we have different interpretations of the term. I refer to it as a synonym for trust fund dilettante, remittance man or upscale champagne socialist. I have no homophobic inclinations at all. My apologies and I will edit the post accordingly.

Martin N.

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Martin N why are you taking a story about corruption and abuse of authority and deflecting it into a sexual innuendo slag fest?

This has the potential to destroy the re-branded Liberals with the exact same brush as the Ad-Scam scandal did.  The Liberal party insiders are corrupt to the core and this just shows it one more time.

Unintended sexual innuendo slag fest. Since edited.

Martin N.

JKR wrote:

bekayne wrote:

Martin N. wrote:

Strange it is how little interest there is in this topic. How very l(L)iberal to avoid any unpleasantness regarding corruption. The Librano brand resurfaces and idiot Trudeau has no idea that by demoting Jody Wilson Raybould he has sown the seeds of his own destruction.

Jody stands accused of being 'difficult' and not a 'team player' but, if she were a man she would be 'decisive' and one not suffering fools glady. Trudeau is about to find out that the FirstFeminist dilettante cockapoo is up against a pit bull in lipstick with a couple of hundred years of grievances against nancy boys like him.

C'mon Martin. Just call Trudeau the f-word. You know you want to.

Sadly it seems that homophobia is acceptable in conservative circles!

You do me too much credit. It is a reach that exceeds its grasp to infer that my ( insert caveat here: I am not homophobic but fill your boots regardless) opinions influence 'conservative circles'. 

And furthermore, thank you all for holding the hanging before the trial. I shall refrain from using the H word so as not to wind up the more excitable among us. It was a simple mistake, to me, not requiring a brand on my forehead.

Martin N.

"Mount your horses, draw your swords". hmmm, much too imperialistic. "Mount your bicycles, grab your torches,there's a heretic to burn". The Dominicans could have learned from you lot.

Rushing to judgement of a poor choice of term in a post of mine while mostly ignoring the topic shows, to me, that Trudeau supporters cannot defend the indefensible but can and will ( I will not use a common expression that is offensive to some and reach further back in time to reference an acceptable Christian horror, ergo the Inquisition.) reach for their pitchforks to obliquely silence your humble messenger.

I apologise for the thread drift but not for the renewed interest in a topic many of the faithful seem to prefer to avoid: Justin Trudeau, progressive environmental feminist or elitist poseur.

I have no doubt Trudeau is a personable individual as I have no doubt he is a not-too-bright poseur with an intellect a mile wide and an inch deep.

My concern with his government is that I want good governance with a deep regard for the welfare of all the nation's population, its institutions, economy and environment without favour.

I want fair, progressive taxation policy that allows each succeeding generation to pay for its own benefits without forcing its debts on to future generations. To leave the environment in better condition than they received it.

Trudeau has proven himself incapable of any of the above. It is the corrupt Librano machine that needs to go, sooner than later. Trudeau is just the empty figurehead.

Martin N.

bekayne wrote:

Martin N. wrote:

Strange it is how little interest there is in this topic. How very l(L)iberal to avoid any unpleasantness regarding corruption. The Librano brand resurfaces and idiot Trudeau has no idea that by demoting Jody Wilson Raybould he has sown the seeds of his own destruction.

Jody stands accused of being 'difficult' and not a 'team player' but, if she were a man she would be 'decisive' and one not suffering fools glady. Trudeau is about to find out that the FirstFeminist dilettante cockapoo is up against a pit bull in lipstick with a couple of hundred years of grievances against nancy boys like him.

C'mon Martin. Just call Trudeau the f-word. You know you want to.

Contrary to your scurrilous accusation, I do not, did not, and never will "want to". Furthermore I am a popular, accepted anachronism in the area gay community.

voice of the damned

Martin wrote:

Furthermore I am a popular, accepted anachronism in the area gay community.

While some might agree that you are an anachronism, not sure if that status is confined to the gay community.

(Sorry, I know that was a typo. Couldn't resist.)

voice of the damned

On a more serious note, for future reference, if an epithet combines female imagery with a synonym for "male"(eg. Nancy Boy, Girlie Man), it's usually a pretty good bet that it's intended as homophobic.

Mighty Middle

Meddling in the justice system could be Trudeau’s end

If the shocking allegations are true that the PMO pressured the former justice minister to cut a deal for the party’s corporate friends, the prime minister has no choice but to resign.

by Former Liberal Party President Stephen LeDrew (now vocal Justin Trudeau critic)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwfg3NBxnm0

Martin N.

voice of the damned wrote:

Martin wrote:

Furthermore I am a popular, accepted anachronism in the area gay community.

While some might agree that you are an anachronism, not sure if that status is confined to the gay community.

(Sorry, I know that was a typo. Couldn't resist.)

hehe true enough.

Martin N.

voice of the damned wrote:

On a more serious note, for future reference, if an epithet combines female imagery with a synonym for "male"(eg. Nancy Boy, Girlie Man), it's usually a pretty good bet that it's intended as homophobic.

good to know. 

bekayne

Here's all of SNC Lavelin's entries in the Lobby Registry:

https://lobbycanada.gc.ca/app/secure/ocl/lrs/do/clntCmmLgs?cno=4995&regI...

Look for your favourite politicians.

JKR

voice of the damned wrote:

On a more serious note, for future reference, if an epithet combines female imagery with a synonym for "male"(eg. Nancy Boy, Girlie Man), it's usually a pretty good bet that it's intended as homophobic.

It was obviously homophobic despite the protestations.

Mighty Middle

Conservative Leader Andrew Scheer met with the head of SNC-Lavalin to discuss the criminal charges facing the Quebec construction giant in May 2018, the Opposition leader’s office confirms.

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2019/02/10/tory-leader-andrew-scheer...

bekayne

Mighty Middle wrote:

Conservative Leader Andrew Scheer met with the head of SNC-Lavalin to discuss the criminal charges facing the Quebec construction giant in May 2018, the Opposition leader’s office confirms.

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2019/02/10/tory-leader-andrew-scheer...

Their description of the meeting seems to be at odds with what was disclosed to the Lobby Registry ("Subject Matter of the communication"). Ooops.

  1. SNC-Lavalin Inc. 
    In-house Corporation 

    Designated Public Office Holders who participated in the communication:

    • Andrew Scheer, Leader of the Official Opposition | House of Commons

     

    Subject Matter of the communication: Energy, Industry, International Trade, Infrastructure, Budget, Climate, Environment, Transportation

    Communication date: 2018-05-29
    Posted date: 2018-06-15
    Communication number: 4995-429512

NorthReport

dp

NorthReport

That SNC who break the law on a regular basis, still is allowed to function in Canada speaks volumes about our justice system 

NorthReport
NorthReport
NorthReport
quizzical

and the new AG says "it's not too late for me to interfere".

time to call for his resignation. 

NorthReport
NorthReport
Sean in Ottawa

I think in contradiction to the thread title -- this is being over stated as a political problem. It is perhaps understated in terms of meaning but that does not matter. We have a thread now with "will the PM be forced to resign?" as a title. Come on.

The Liberals have a lid on this. They are as dirty as always but there is no indication that the laundry will be aired.

People have long suspected this was the case. Most probably think that it is normal for ll politicians to be dirty to some degree. The public has a short attention span even if the media want to make it a story becuase they don't have any thing better. The media are frustrated becasue there is a story here -- but they do not have it. There are many stories they do not have are fustrating because they can sense content.

The true story. The perhaps a little predictable and boring story is this:

There is a story we don't have and it means nothing unless the media get any evidence to go with the theories. The public won't stay with a non story once a real story comes.

The probem with this particular story is it relates to what one Liberal said to another in private. Sure it would be great to have a recording -- but really? You think that someone is going to speak up about it? It is possible -- but that would be news, In the meantime this is a low grade news story. The kind of dumpster fire that can be put out with a portable fire extinguisher - or better yet, just left to burn itself out.

The sky is falling on the Liberals is just a distraction to make NDP supporters feel good as their numbers crater. The story that has legs is the dire position of the NDP. It is more practical to hope the media stumbles on the real goods with the Liberals but in the meantime focus on something that can be done. The raging dumpster fire is the NDP. We all know it and this thread is simply denial and wishful thinking.

The moment it is anything else will be a story.

bekayne

Wilson-Raybould resigns from cabinet.

lagatta4

Wilson-Raybould has resigned her cabinet posts.

By the way, a better term with no homophobic connotation would be "upper-class twit". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX0xi9tpBRI

voice of the damned

lagatta4 wrote:

Wilson-Raybould has resigned her cabinet posts.

By the way, a better term with no homophobic connotation would be "upper-class twit". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX0xi9tpBRI

Well, on the other hand, I've always thought that skit was sort of making fun of people with mental disabilities. Yes, I realize the larger target is the British ruling class, but the immediate joke is supposed to be that they're suffering from mental deficiencies as a result of inbreeding.

Though I suppose if you just use the phrase "upper class twit" without explicitly connecting it to the skit, it should be okay.  

Martin N.

JKR wrote:

voice of the damned wrote:

On a more serious note, for future reference, if an epithet combines female imagery with a synonym for "male"(eg. Nancy Boy, Girlie Man), it's usually a pretty good bet that it's intended as homophobic.

It was obviously homophobic despite the protestations.

In hindsight, I do not disagree with your opinion but I do note that you do not consider the poster homophobic.

Martin N.

"The moment it is anything else will be a story."

Bingo!

I completely disagree with the non-story denial. To me, the story is a mini-series: Episode 1) PM railroads Vice Admiral out of pique. Episode 2) Exemplary woman character assassinated as 'difficult' and 'in it for herself' when a man would be honoured as 'a leader'. Episode 3) Incompetent, Corrupt figurehead thrown under bus by rats deserting sinking ship. Episode 4) Revenge of a woman spurned or, alternately, Woman shows her leadership skills by toppling corrupt government and its hapless leader.

Martin N.

voice of the damned wrote:

lagatta4 wrote:

Wilson-Raybould has resigned her cabinet posts.

By the way, a better term with no homophobic connotation would be "upper-class twit". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PX0xi9tpBRI

Well, on the other hand, I've always thought that skit was sort of making fun of people with mental disabilities. Yes, I realize the larger target is the British ruling class, but the immediate joke is supposed to be that they're suffering from mental deficiencies as a result of inbreeding.

Though I suppose if you just use the phrase "upper class twit" without explicitly connecting it to the skit, it should be okay.  

hmm. Land mines everywhere. I suppose that more effort than simply beaking off the top of the kapusta is required.

lagatta4

I never thought of that skit in that respect, though it is true that the Royals for example are sometimes referred to as inbred.  I'll remove the link if you want me too. Many things were acceptable a couple of generations ago that aren't nowadays.

 

Martin N.

I wonder how the PM fares in a direct comparison of personal achievements with Jody Wilson Raybould?

NDPP

Martin N. wrote:

I wonder how the PM fares in a direct comparison of personal achievements with Jody Wilson Raybould?

NDPP wrote:

Neither did much for Indigenous peoples.

Sean in Ottawa

So now the question will be if she speaks publicly or not. If not the resignation makes it a little worse than this morning but possible to weather. If she does speak then she could sink the government. If really angry -- she could join the NDP and kill of the Trudeau government.

Lots of possibilities and a story becuase of the resignation but still it would be an exaggeration to say this is a big deal unless she talks and then, if she disagrees with the PM it would be an earthquake.

On the other hand she could get advice saying she can talk and then she could back up the PM who could bring her back to cabinet later.

Martin N.

In that context, no one has done anything for indigenous peoples. Yet. I consider that the PM's 'sunny ways' is all he has to offer while JWR is just getting started.

There is speculation that JWR was previously offered the IA portfolio but turned it down because she did not want to be responsible for administering tha "Indian Act".

Martin N.

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

So now the question will be if she speaks publicly or not. If not the resignation makes it a little worse than this morning but possible to weather. If she does speak then she could sink the government. If really angry -- she could join the NDP and kill of the Trudeau government.

Lots of possibilities and a story becuase of the resignation but still it would be an exaggeration to say this is a big deal unless she talks and then, if she disagrees with the PM it would be an earthquake.

On the other hand she could get advice saying she can talk and then she could back up the PM who could bring her back to cabinet later.

Did you catch the look on her face upon her demotion? Do you really think that a cabinet minister resigns in order to support their PM?

I believe she will either stay in the Liberals to finish him off or she will bolt and finish him off. Either way, the First Feminist looks like a right numptie after the Librano 'insider' character assassination attempt.

Sean in Ottawa

Martin N. wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

So now the question will be if she speaks publicly or not. If not the resignation makes it a little worse than this morning but possible to weather. If she does speak then she could sink the government. If really angry -- she could join the NDP and kill of the Trudeau government.

Lots of possibilities and a story becuase of the resignation but still it would be an exaggeration to say this is a big deal unless she talks and then, if she disagrees with the PM it would be an earthquake.

On the other hand she could get advice saying she can talk and then she could back up the PM who could bring her back to cabinet later.

Did you catch the look on her face upon her demotion? Do you really think that a cabinet minister resigns in order to support their PM?

I believe she will either stay in the Liberals to finish him off or she will bolt and finish him off. Either way, the First Feminist looks like a right numptie after the Librano 'insider' character assassination attempt.

I did not watch it so did not see her face. As angry as she is she might play with the team to get in cabinet after the election. Her feelings won't necessarily reflect her decision.

The Liberals have a cult of loyalty and tell their people to be good soldiers to get reward later. Given this woman is on a mission to try to make a difference (which I think is the case), she may be capable of accepting humiliation as part of the longer term plan -- even if she is furious.

All possibilities remain for now I think.

JKR

Martin N. wrote:

JKR wrote:

voice of the damned wrote:

On a more serious note, for future reference, if an epithet combines female imagery with a synonym for "male"(eg. Nancy Boy, Girlie Man), it's usually a pretty good bet that it's intended as homophobic.

It was obviously homophobic despite the protestations.

In hindsight, I do not disagree with your opinion but I do note that you do not consider the poster homophobic.

I don't consider the poster to be homophobic, just "old fashioned." Unfortunately mainstream Canadian society was very homophobic not too long ago. Fortunately we have come a very long way since then.

JKR

Martin N. wrote:
...the First Feminist....

This sounds sexist to me.

Sean in Ottawa

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

Martin N. wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

So now the question will be if she speaks publicly or not. If not the resignation makes it a little worse than this morning but possible to weather. If she does speak then she could sink the government. If really angry -- she could join the NDP and kill of the Trudeau government.

Lots of possibilities and a story becuase of the resignation but still it would be an exaggeration to say this is a big deal unless she talks and then, if she disagrees with the PM it would be an earthquake.

On the other hand she could get advice saying she can talk and then she could back up the PM who could bring her back to cabinet later.

Did you catch the look on her face upon her demotion? Do you really think that a cabinet minister resigns in order to support their PM?

I believe she will either stay in the Liberals to finish him off or she will bolt and finish him off. Either way, the First Feminist looks like a right numptie after the Librano 'insider' character assassination attempt.

I did not watch it so did not see her face. As angry as she is she might play with the team to get in cabinet after the election. Her feelings won't necessarily reflect her decision.

The Liberals have a cult of loyalty and tell their people to be good soldiers to get reward later. Given this woman is on a mission to try to make a difference (which I think is the case), she may be capable of accepting humiliation as part of the longer term plan -- even if she is furious.

All possibilities remain for now I think.

In view of the council she hired -- it looks like whe does want to speak out. It is looking like this might be a major Liberal scandal after all.

voice of the damned

lagatta4 wrote:

I never thought of that skit in that respect, though it is true that the Royals for example are sometimes referred to as inbred.  I'll remove the link if you want me too. Many things were acceptable a couple of generations ago that aren't nowadays.

No, I don't want you to remove the link at all! First off, and this might not be the most pleasant thing to say, but anyone suffering from a severe enough mental disability to be a plausible model for the "twits" is not likely to understand the joke(partly because it uses non-current slang for disabilities), and hence wouldn't be offended.

As for everyone else, I think it's totally okay to examine and discuss possibly offensive material. And I wasn't complaining about the presence of the skit on the thread, more just ruminating about something I've always noticed about it, but which I think tends to fly under the radar a bit.   

voice of the damned

Idiot Song by Python collaborator Neil Innes is another one that subtly spoofs mental disabilities, though I think the character there is meant to be more of a positive stereotype, ie. the Holy Fool, venerated for his indifference to the cares of the world.

https://tinyurl.com/y4ctghf4

Apparently that song is now most known for being the subject of a plagirarism suit by Innes against Oasis.

 

 

 

Noops

bekayne wrote:

OK, so what are the allegations that could be proven and how could they be proven? And the likelihood they could be proven?

"A proof is a proof. What kind of a proof? It's a proof. A proof is a proof. And when you have a good proof, it's because it's proven." J. C.

Pondering

JKR wrote:
Martin N. wrote:

JKR wrote:

voice of the damned wrote:

On a more serious note, for future reference, if an epithet combines female imagery with a synonym for "male"(eg. Nancy Boy, Girlie Man), it's usually a pretty good bet that it's intended as homophobic.

It was obviously homophobic despite the protestations.

In hindsight, I do not disagree with your opinion but I do note that you do not consider the poster homophobic.

I don't consider the poster to be homophobic, just "old fashioned." Unfortunately mainstream Canadian society was very homophobic not too long ago. Fortunately we have come a very long way since then.

It is mysogynistic as it suggests femaleness is a negative. 

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