Liberal Party of Canada

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alan smithee alan smithee's picture

In regards to marijuana decriminalization,Mulcair has said he believes that 'today's ' pot contributes to mental illness...Funny how it's Liberal MP's who come out for full LEGALIZATION.

Yes,Mulcair is against the Keystone pipeline but I really don't see him being any different than the Libs once in power.

He was a PLQ MNA under the Bourassa government...He's leaps and bounds superior to any Conservative but I don't think he'd govern any differently than the Liberals.

If that is the case (and I'm sure it is) ...I,for one, will vote strategically...For whatever party..ANY party,including the BQ that will defeat the Cons in 2015.

It depresses me that King Stephen could very well win the next election because of a split in the vote.

We cannot afford another second of Conservative rule...They are KILLING this country.

BTW,yes...I agree...The Liberals are a party that will do and say anything to appeal to both sides of the political divide...But to suggest the Liberals are worse than the Tories is misguided and just plain stupid.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Calling for a pot study is so last century and we've been there and done that and it was called the Le Dain Commission. It needs to be regulated similarly to alcohol. No other policy makes any sense from a human rights perspective. 

The stupid stupid line about the pot being more potent now and therefore more harmful is always proof that the person talking doesn't know a lot about actual drug use in the past. I have often heard that line from RCMP officials. Did Mulcair really use that line? There is a very good reason that in the '70's and '80's the soft drug of choice in Canada was hashish.  That's because the pot wasn't potent enough. I am not from there but it is my understanding that the black hash that Ollie's gang used to run out Afghanistan in the '80's was readily available in Montreal.  Just thinking about it makes me want to write an Ode to a Nepalese Temple Ball.

The NDP should let its health critic argue for legalization. Libby has been a strong advocate in the past. The last thing that Mulcair needs is a stern father image.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Calling for a pot study is so last century and we've been there and done that and it was called the Le Dain Commission. It needs to be regulated similarly to alcohol. No other policy makes any sense from a human rights perspective. 

The stupid stupid line about the pot being more potent now and therefore more harmful is always proof that the person talking doesn't know a lot about actual drug use in the past. I have often heard that line from RCMP officials. Did Mulcair really use that line? There is a very good reason that in the '70's and '80's the soft drug of choice in Canada was hashish.  That's because the pot wasn't potent enough. I am not from there but it is my understanding that the black hash that Ollie's gang used to run out Afghanistan in the '80's was readily available in Montreal.  Just thinking about it makes me want to write an Ode to a Nepalese Temple Ball.

The NDP should let its health critic argue for legalization. Libby has been a strong advocate in the past. The last thing that Mulcair needs is a stern father image.

 

That's why when I hear someone go on about how 'harmful' the pot of 'today' is,I go crazy.

I remember black hash...More potent,yes AND much better quality than anything being sold today.

Apparently,Mulcair has echoed the new RCMP arguement of potency and mental illness...and that is my point.

We had a global commission in 1971...All studies recommended legalization but only one country (Holland) acted on it (but didn't flat out legalize it,either)

The world capital of prohibition (The US) is legalizing and decriminalizing it almost every second month (slight exaggeration)

But Canada?

The Tories brag about how they are not concerned with statistics (RE: Facts) and have said over and over again that they will not decriminalize it.

The result?..More arrests,more criminal records and more prisoners.

This is a civil rights issue that is right up there with gay marriage.

Out of all the parties,the Liberals are the only one that openly flirts with the idea of legalization...

Where are the NDP?

Apart from Libby Davies,who's championing the cause?....It certainly isn't Thomas Mulcair.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Calling for a pot study is so last century and we've been there and done that and it was called the Le Dain Commission. It needs to be regulated similarly to alcohol. No other policy makes any sense from a human rights perspective. 

The stupid stupid line about the pot being more potent now and therefore more harmful is always proof that the person talking doesn't know a lot about actual drug use in the past. I have often heard that line from RCMP officials. Did Mulcair really use that line? There is a very good reason that in the '70's and '80's the soft drug of choice in Canada was hashish.  That's because the pot wasn't potent enough. I am not from there but it is my understanding that the black hash that Ollie's gang used to run out Afghanistan in the '80's was readily available in Montreal.  Just thinking about it makes me want to write an Ode to a Nepalese Temple Ball.

The NDP should let its health critic argue for legalization. Libby has been a strong advocate in the past. The last thing that Mulcair needs is a stern father image.

I agree completely. I remember the LeDain commission very clearly because he was the Dean of Osgoode Hall Law School when I was there. In fact, I worked the summer after my graduation as a researcher for the criminologist John Hogarth, who was one of the major contributors to the report. Your point about potency of weed is also well taken. I have read from several medical sources, and also observed personally that cannabis users tend to self-titrate. That is, if the smoke is more potent, they consume less, if less potent, they consume more, to reach their preferred level of effect.

mark_alfred

I will eat my hat, and post pictures of it here on Babble, if the Liberals actually include legalization of marijuana in their next election platform document.

socialdemocrati...

I think a commission is completely unnecessary as well.

But the political process being what it is... do you think ANY party will go straight from weed being completely illegal to completely legal?

It's not my preference to stop at decriminalizatinon. But when someone says we'll start there and launch a study to look into full legalization, it certainly sounds a lot more achievable.

And it remains to be seen whether the Liberals will promise anything better, let alone honor that promise. This is a party that relentlessly pisses on what its base wants. They're a completely different party than they were 30 years ago.

 

NorthReport

There are so many investigations, scandals, it is hard to keep track.

RCMP launches probe into Mac Harb, expands Mike Duffy investigation

The documents were released Thursday, the same day CTV’s Ottawa Bureau Chief Robert Fife reported that former Liberal Sen. Mac Harb was also being investigated by the RCMP over his expense claims.

 

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/rcmp-launches-probe-into-mac-harb-expands...

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

I don't believe the Liberals will legalize marijuana but I do believe that they will decriminalize it.

I'd much rather full out legalization but decriminalization is a good start.

It must be demanded to be on the agenda.

It's going to take alot more activism...420 protests everyday..or atleast every weekend.Wink

janfromthebruce

So Canadians are going to vote Liberal (the unprogressive party) because of pot? I don't think so. So since past performance is a good indicator of future performance we will get redbook all new and modern 21st century.

So once again we have those who think somehow the Liberals are progressive and fooled again.

Hopefully all those cool strategic voting sites start up in 2015, and because they will have NDP as the favs based on past election results - right? Oh wait, those were zombie Lib strategic vote sites, fooling folks to vote liberal, so 20 bets they come up with a new and improved strategic voting methology which ignores the last election results. Bets?

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

I never,ever said the Libs were progressive.

socialdemocrati...

I think there's a communication gap here. Are you saying you would support the Liberals as your first choice? Or that you would merely vote for anyone but the Conservatives?

And if both the Liberals and the NDP are devoted to decriminalization, and slow on legalization, what's the difference?

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

The Liberals are not my first choice....My priority is killing the CPC.

The next election I will vote for whomever can and will defeat the Cons.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

alan smithee wrote:

The Liberals are not my first choice....My priority is killing the CPC.

The next election I will vote for whomever can and will defeat the Cons.

Well, I  simply don't understand that line of thinking. Harper is a Corporatist who doens't belive in taxing the wealthy. Trudeau is a Corporatist who doesn't believe in taxing the wealthy. And the difference is?

mark_alfred

In fairness, Mulcair has been less forthcoming about taxing the wealthy than I would like (which is why I supported Topp).  But, he's been open about cap and trade, which is polluter pay, which essentially works out to a tax on the wealthy.  I imagine too the NDP would be more vigilant than either the Libs or Cons when it comes to closing loopholes and offshore accounts.

janfromthebruce

Came across this and not sure if it was posted anywhere but it sure is news with all the outrage over "voter suppression" by the Conservatives in 2011 election.

Meanwhile, in 2008 Liberals used funds to buy "Voter Suppression Cards" for either NDP or Conservatives.  http://cpcp.cc/up25y 

now that's a kettle of fish and just shows that both corporate parties don't mind playing dirty politics and also both act outraged - false - when the other does it and beats them at their own dirty game.

mark_alfred

In the Liberals' case I don't think it was anything illegal (IE, it's not like the Libs directed people toward the wrong polling station).  I think it was just negative advertising.  There's a discussion here about it.

janfromthebruce

I wasn't suggesting what they did was something illegal but even calling it voter suppression cards is telling of the mindset. It's the hypcrisy and just outrage of what the Cons did and yet they have no problems making an invoice with the words voter suppression. Not swift.

mark_alfred

mark_alfred wrote:

I will eat my hat, and post pictures of it here on Babble, if the Liberals actually include legalization of marijuana in their next election platform document.

Great, I may actually have to eat my hat.  Well, we'll see when the Liberals release their election platform in 2015.

janfromthebruce

and that's right up there with a 1993 campaign promise of getting rid of the GST. And we know how that didn't go away at all. Just saying.

Unionist

mark_alfred wrote:

mark_alfred wrote:

I will eat my hat, and post pictures of it here on Babble, if the Liberals actually include legalization of marijuana in their next election platform document.

Great, I may actually have to eat my hat.  Well, we'll see when the Liberals release their election platform in 2015.

Can we at least see pictures of the hat now, before you have time to buy a smaller one?

socialdemocrati...

Something to tell those Liberal types who lie through their teeth that they're for evidence-based rational government, and accuse people of supporting unions out of "ideology" and "partisanship".

http://lawofwork.ca/?p=6881

If you're looking for the center, you missed it on your left.

janfromthebruce

Most Highly Unionized Countries Top ‘Happiest Countries” List, Again. Why?

Today, the United Nation’s released its second annual “World Happiness Index”.   One thing that is striking about these studies is that the ‘most happy countries’ are always countries with the a long tradition of strong government social welfare programs, high overall tax levels, and of interest to a blog on work law, high levels of collective bargaining coverage.  That is, in happy countries, unions and collective bargaining play a substantial role in the setting of conditions of work, which creates a strong middle class.  Not surprisingly, therefore, the ‘happiest’ countries also tend to be the least unequal societies:  they score well on measures of income inequality.  For example, the top 2 most happiest countries (Denmark, Norway) just happen to have the least income inequality in the Western World. 

- See more at: http://lawofwork.ca/?p=6881#sthash.cbvEOFl4.dpuf

janfromthebruce

Meanwhile the Liberal nomination going on in Brandon Manitoba have one candidate who doctored his bio (and hoping not to get caught) and other one was HarperCon until just last week. Both from the right side of the Liberals but that's the "new and modern" progressive Liberal party.

Tory member ditches party in bizarre Brandon byelection

janfromthebruce

Too funny - Trudeau's MPs first release of detailed expense releases turns out to be a bust. And even the story of not enough lead in time suggests that Canadians are stupid. Why back in the spring Trudeau was riding that pony and his 30 something MPs had like half a year to get that one all figured out.

Liberal parliamentarians post first batch of expense disclosures

Yet the online postings provide few details, and only go back a few weeks. That means there’s no way to tell whether a Liberal MP or senator paid $16 for a glass of orange juice, or who was the biggest spender over the past year.

snip

Simson also noted a lack of context, which means the numbers mean very little to those taxpayers trying to understand how and why their money was spent.

“The numbers themselves don’t always tell the tale,” she said. “If you don’t know where exactly the money was spent and why the money was spent, what you’re getting is just numbers.”

snip

What information is available on the Liberal website shows that the majority of claims posted by the Liberals Tuesday were for travel to and from Ottawa for the party’s caucus meeting late last month.

The meeting was called after Trudeau criticized Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s decision to prorogue Parliament for a month, with Trudeau promising Liberals would return to Ottawa anyway and work for Canadians.

Many Liberals spent thousands of dollars travelling the week of Sept. 16 to return to Ottawa for meetings, press conferences and do other work on Parliament Hill.

But while some stayed the whole week, others returned to their home ridings one or two days later.

Some Liberals show expense claims for lunches, though the only information provided was on where the meal took place and how many “guests” attended.

Other Liberals also asked to be reimbursed for “special travel.”

To wrap, it was a bust and also wasted money going to pretend parliament meetings in Ottawa.

Twitter was cheaper than this nothing happening and detailed expenses on line showed no detail. All fluff and no substance.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

I agree that it is much better to hold "pretend" meetings in Saskatoon. After all with the majority of its caucus from Quebec the travel costs to host a meeting in Ottawa must have been way less expensive than the mostly Ontario Liberal caucus going to Ottawa.  Does the NDP have its expenses posted for their September sojourn on the praires?

 

janfromthebruce

Last time I checked I saw that NDP MPs posted their expenses on line but if you are interested you can go look? Love it when the usual come to the rescue for TFB (Trust fund baby) who hoped that nobody actually checked the validity of his latest pronouncements.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

The real answer is most but not all NDP MP's post their expenses on line and like Julian they also do it once a year. His expenses are current to March 2012, the end of the last fiscal year. You will also note that there is no way to tell how much Peter paid for a glass of juice or anything else, just how much was spent globally on each category.

Therefore you should have said no their meeting in September is not on line and that their expense reports on line are also not only dated but mere fluff with no substance.  You are the pot calling the kettle black.

http://peterjulian.ndp.ca/members-expenditures-report-april-1-2011-to-ma...

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

kropotkin1951 wrote:

The real answer is most but not all NDP MP's post their expenses on line and like Julian they also do it once a year. His expenses are current to March 2012, the end of the last fiscal year. You will also note that there is no way to tell how much Peter paid for a glass of juice or anything else, just how much was spent globally on each category.

Therefore you should have said no their meeting in September is not on line and that their expense reports on line are also not only dated but mere fluff with no substance.  You are the pot calling the kettle black.

http://peterjulian.ndp.ca/members-expenditures-report-april-1-2011-to-ma...

I am all for transparency, but Trudeau did this solely for political gain; its faux populism.

People may be calling the "kettle black" around here K, but the fact remains that if Trudeau didn't think he had something to gain by doing this, he wouldn't have.

THAT, is a fact.

janfromthebruce

And it wasn't the NDP who made a big media splash about it but JT and reported widely. As we know, the NDP has been working this past year in committee to get more transparency in these areas, but JT wanted to "grandstand".

Which is why the JT got the bad press and the NDP did not.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Yes Trudeau likes to grandstand since that seems to be his only skill.  Trying to score cheap polltical points by distorting the facts is something I really despise in partisans of any stripe.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

"Trying to score cheap polltical points by distorting the facts is something I really despise in partisans of any stripe."

You wouldn't like my member of Parliment.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

So, I see on Huff Post, the Libs are attacking Harper for deficits. So I note that given the won't raise taxes, the only way the Libs can cut the deficit is by cutting services. So some Lib replies back, no Art, "we'll get the money from transfer" payments? Moronic. My response, "so you are talking about new taxes on oridinary Canadians"? That'll trasnfer money all right. Unbelieveable!

Brachina

 Are they suggesting cutting transfer payments?

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

Might have been. Now, that's interesting. I have to admit, I didn't read it that way.

trotwood73

[oops... posted this to the wrong thread... nevermind]

NorthReport

Bizarre and unfortunate timing for the Liberals but when you play with fire you get burned!

RCMP seeks Mac Harb's bank info, alleges ex-senator committed breach of trust

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/rcmp-seeks-mac-harb-s-bank-info-alleges-e...

NorthReport

RCMP allege former senator Mac Harb committed fraudMounties seeking information on 2 of Harb's bank accounts

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/rcmp-allege-former-senator-mac-harb-comm...

alan smithee alan smithee's picture
mark_alfred

Apparently the Liberal Party of Canada's policy convention is coming up sometime in 2014.  The Kitchener-Waterloo Federal Liberal Association has a resolution on electoral reform to "add an element of proportional representation to its preferential ballot policy."  The full resolution is here.  So, if you're a Liberal and believe in proportional representation, then have a look and support the resolution.

Jacob Two-Two

.

janfromthebruce

London mayor, former Liberal cabinet minister, to stand trial for allegedly misusing federal funds

LONDON, Ont. - London Mayor Joe Fontana has been committed to stand trial on three criminal charges from when he was a Liberal MP.

Fontana, who is expected to run again in the October 2014 municipal election, was committed to stand trial at the end of a two-day preliminary hearing by Justice Ronald Marion.

The judge said he agreed with lawyers on both sides of the case there is sufficient evidence to warrant holding a trial.

snip

The two witnesses heard from Tuesday were from Ottawa where Fontana was an MP for London from 1988 to 2006.

He is charged with three counts after a Public Works Canada cheque was used to pay a $1,700 bill for a room rental at the Marconi Club for Fontana's son Michael's wedding reception in 2005.

Fontana is charged with breach of trust by a public official, uttering forged documents and fraud under $5,000.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

On Huff Post, I note that Harper is in the pocket of Big Oil and that Trudeau went to Calgary to suck up to them. A Lib posts in reply, better big oil in Trudeau's pocket, then Harper in Big Oil's pocket. How do these guys say things like this with a straight face?

NorthReport

One thing for sure, even with that magic name at the forefront, analysing yesterdays by-election results, the Liberals are NOT back, but you would never know it if you just read the BS in the press.

And tHe msp show their desperation in their attempt to block the NDP from forming government as they resort to talking to someone like Liberal Scott Reid, jand who is probably the biggest loser around in Canadian politcs. 

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2013/11/26/ndp_orange_wave_reduced_to...    Best one yet! Laughing Laughing Laughing

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/byelection-post-mortem-trudeau-emerges-as...  LaughingLaughing

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Byelections+litmus+test+opposition+strength+Senate+scandal/9209210/story.html#ixzz2lnjdodsu  Laughing

http://rabble.ca/blogs/bloggers/djclimenhaga/2013/11/he-haunts-us-still-...

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/national/Lesson+elections+Trudeau+doing...

 

NorthReport

Sears has finally developed some backbone. Amazin'

Maybe he actually does realize Mulcair could become PM next election.

Grits’ byelection night triumph all in the spin

eptions of Question Period, where the media and voters can watch and form their own judgments. And not so much when the spinner is flogging a line that flies in the face of the facts. One feels the pain of Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s Senate scandal spinners, repeating daily what most Canadians’ common sense tells them to be nonsense.

But byelections are a spinner’s dream. Few national political reporters know much about “flyover” communities like Provencher, Manitoba, so they can be fed spinners’ colourful and compelling tales with ease. Few Canadians or media organizations have any interest in electoral history. So spinners can paint fantastic political landscapes


 

socialdemocrati...
NorthReport

I guess my question for the Liberals today is what happened in Brandon Souris?

You were polling with a 29% lead and yet you lost the by-election?

What did voters discover about the Liberals that they disliked just before they went into the voting booth?

Liberals were braying like asses that they were going clean up in Brandon Souris before the votes were counted, and Liberals always count their chickens before they are hatched.

socialdemocrati...

If they can't win Brandon-Souris at the heights of Trudeau's popularity, with a nomination controversy causing Conservatives to vote Liberal in protest, then the Liberals don't stand a chance in a real election like 2015. That probaby won't stop them from burning a ton of campaign donations to try. I wish them luck.

NorthReport

According to Trudeau, but according to astute political analysts the Liberals made the same mistakes the BC NDP made in the May '13 BC election, by sending their leader into the wrong ridings. Just count me amongst those who are looking forward to the next federal election, which can come at any time now over the next 2 years. NDPers need to be ready for it.

 

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/trudeau-liberal-party-resonating-across-t...

NorthReport

Former NDP insider to Justin Trudeau: 'You sir, are no Jack Layton'

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/canada-politics/former-ndp-insider-justin...

NorthReport

Counting chickens

Most importantly, byelections are notoriously poor predictors of what voters will actually do when it comes down to determining who will run the entire country.
While the Liberals increased their vote share dramatically in the two Manitoba byelections, some of the Tory vote clearly stayed home. Whether that was because of candidate selection, the Senate scandal or a homophobic gaffe, it’s not likely to happen in 2015. The Tories identify and mobilize their supporters on election day better than any other party and that’s not likely to change much.
Nor will their level of support. The same 37 per cent to 39 per cent of voters who saw Stéphane Dion as a green nerd were equally sure that Michael Ignatieff didn’t come back for them. If they don’t believe Justin Trudeau is a privileged pot-smoking dilettante with no economic policy now, they will by 2015.

http://www.nsnews.com/news/counting-chickens-1.712123

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