Justin Trudeau says he’d be open to coalition with NDP - if Thomas Mulcair wasn’t leader

241 posts / 0 new
Last post
terrytowel
Justin Trudeau says he’d be open to coalition with NDP - if Thomas Mulcair wasn’t leader

===

Regions: 
terrytowel

Liberal Leader Justin Trudeau says he might be more open to the idea of forming a coalition with the NDP – if Thomas Mulcair was not its leader.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/trudeau-says-hed-be-more-op...

josh

That's lame.

Debater

I agree that he's going to have to clarify this and walk it back.

Just like Mulcair had to walk back his anti-coalition comments he made about the Liberals during the NDP Leadership.

It's not up to LPC to dictate who the NDP leader is, and this comment by JT is not helpful.

swallow

Waht does he not like, Mulcair's accent? 

mark_alfred

JT is setting the stage for a repeat of their "two sides of the same coin" ads.

Aristotleded24

Wow. It's one thing for Trudeau to either set conditions for a coalition or to rule it out outright, but for him to state that it's because Mulcair is leader is just nasty and personal. I thought Trudeau was above that kind of politics?

NorthReport

It's obvious Trudeau is having a temper tantrum because things are not going his way.

I suppose Justin now being last in the preferred PM category, probably does not like Mulcair's polling numbers. 

Trudeau, no class there - what a little man he is! Frown 

NorthReport

I have heard that Trudeau in private is a nasty person - this kinda confirms what has been going around.

terrytowel

NorthReport wrote:

I have heard that Trudeau in private is a nasty person - this kinda confirms what has been going around.

According to Ray Heard (a former staffer of Pierre Trudeau) a scathing tell-all book about Justin will be released right in the middle of the election campaign.

NorthReport

But Ray Heard is a loyal Liberal trooper and or promoter isn't he?

terrytowel

NorthReport wrote:

But Ray Heard is a loyal Liberal trooper and or promoter isn't he?

I guess you never watched Sun News when it was on

He is a HUGE supporter of Stephen Harper.

And when he spilled the beans on this allegedly book, he was rubbing his hands with glee.

He does nothing but criticze the Liberal Party, even though he is a long-time member!

Marco C

It's one thing for JT reject a coaliton pre election.

 

But this is just petty and childish, I was never going to vote for him and I don't think you have to like the people you work with but saying this is just petty, I would never have guessed he was spitful and crass.

 

Definatly conferms he's not a person I would want as leader or even as my MP. 

nicky

This is really dumb, petty and immature.

There is considerable appetite for an arrangement of some type to supplant Harper. I believe that Ignatieff's rejection of a coalition was instrumental in delivering progressive Liberals to the NDP in 2011.

Trudeau is risking the same thing.

Maybe he has been spokked by his declining poll numbers into this fit of petulance.

Debater

Here's an updated version of the story.

Trudeau actually says some complimentary things about Mulcair.

As usual the press has kind of misrepresented what was said and made it sound more sensational.

Mulcair has also made some snarky remarks about Trudeau, btw.  So both sides have done so.

---

Asked on Tuesday whether having someone other than Mulcair as leader would change the dynamic in terms of a coalition between the two parties, Trudeau replied: "I don't know....Honestly, I don't want get into hypotheses. Maybe, but maybe not.

"There are no problems in terms of personality," he told The Canadian Press in an interview from Oakville, Ont. "Mr. Mulcair is a veteran politician who has proven himself.

 

http://www.nationalnewswatch.com/2015/04/14/trudeau-might-be-open-to-for...

Pondering

So this was another attempt to smear Trudeau. Why am I not surprised. 

jjuares

Debater wrote:

Here's an updated version of the story.

Trudeau actually says some complimentary things about Mulcair.

As usual the press has kind of misrepresented what was said and made it sound more sensational.

Mulcair has also made some snarky remarks about Trudeau, btw.  So both sides have done so.

---

Asked on Tuesday whether having someone other than Mulcair as leader would change the dynamic in terms of a coalition between the two parties, Trudeau replied: "I don't know....Honestly, I don't want get into hypotheses. Maybe, but maybe not.

"There are no problems in terms of personality," he told The Canadian Press in an interview from Oakville, Ont. "Mr. Mulcair is a veteran politician who has proven himself.

 

Not a smart move on Trudeau's part but it's a one day story.

http://www.nationalnewswatch.com/2015/04/14/trudeau-might-be-open-to-for...

Pondering

What's not smart about it?

sked on Tuesday whether having someone other than Mulcair as leader would change the dynamic in terms of a coalition between the two parties, Trudeau replied: "I don't know....Honestly, I don't want get into hypotheses. Maybe, but maybe not.

"There are no problems in terms of personality," he told The Canadian Press in an interview from Oakville, Ont. "Mr. Mulcair is a veteran politician who has proven himself.

"His style is anchored in the old way of practising politics. Politics needs to be about rallying. And we have very different perspectives on how politics should be practised."

"I'm not interested at all in any formal arrangement," said the Liberal leader. "On the contrary, I find that wanting to make arrangements with other parties is putting the desire for power ahead of the interests of Canadians. What Canadians are interested in is having a coherent government."

Trudeau noted that the two parties have major differences of opinion on economic and constitutional issues.

Mulcair speaks insultingly and dismissively of Trudeau and in return Trudeau is civilized and restrained. Maybe that's where the "angry Tom" stuff comes from. 

 

 

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
Maybe that's where the "angry Tom" stuff comes from.

Or maybe Tom's just sick of this shit.

But I think the "Angry Tom" meme began when some staff photographer shot 100 frames of him at some scrum, and his/her editor chose the one frame where his hand was in the air and his mouth was open.  Add the caption "Third Party Leader So Mad About Something That He Could Bite His Own Belly" and voila.

Marco C

OK.... now I want to read a transcrip of this event.

 

The Headlines all say somthing that's not listed as a direct quote, so either the headline needs to be changed or the article has has been altered.

 

I withdraw one of my comments, I'm sure JT would be just as useful as the curren conservative MP I already have. 

NorthReport

Trudeau must mean conducting politcs like having Eve Adams cross the floor and then creating huge turmoil in the riding association by trying to bypass the democratic process.

Sorry but that's just sleazy old-fashioned politics that Canadian voters are so tired of.

The only thing new that Trudeau brings to politics is his hairstyle.

Brachina

"NDP commits crucial error, fails to get Trudeau's approval before picking leader"

 

The above was twitted by Gerry Nicoles, pretty funny.

 If true its pretty shitty and childish, so right up Trudeau's ally!

 If not, well I'm getting fucking sick of headline editors taking liberities with the truth when making headlines, I honestly think headlines have become one of the most dishonest things in journalism and it needs to stop, I don't like Trudeau but if its misinformation then its not fair, because it will burn him big time, too many people read only headlines and not the meat.

Unionist

Mulcair should say:

"We're open to a coalition with the Liberals - even if they have the worst possible leader in the world - oh wait..."

 

Brachina

 Having read its over stated slightly, he said maybe, but its not wrong. Another Trudeau gaffe, this will burn him, especially given the rest of his statement is completely contradictory and incoherant. He says Mulcair is a Vetran Politician who has proven himself, yet then says he does politics differently then Mulcair, yeah I guess that's true Trudeau is nether of those things.

 I'd laugh if the NDP put Trudeau saying Mulcair is a veteran politician who has proven himself into they're ads, addding even our oppentents admit to Mulcair suppior experience and ability :-) 

 

NorthReport

What's really going on is that the Trudeau Liberals are losing support for their opposition to the idea of working with the NDP to oust Harper so Trudeau thinks lashing out and attacking Mulcair will change the channel. How stupid can Trudeau be!

Pondering

NorthReport wrote:

What's really going on is that the Trudeau Liberals are losing support for their opposition to the idea of working with the NDP to oust Harper so Trudeau thinks lashing out and attacking Mulcair will change the channel. How stupid can Trudeau be!

What did he say that was attacking Mulcair?

nicky
NorthReport

The Liberal frustrations with their sinking ship is beginning to show.

Now the public is beginning to see Trudeau's nasty side, which will only make matters worse for the Liberals. Oh well, they chose him.  Frown

Debater

Brachina wrote:

"NDP commits crucial error, fails to get Trudeau's approval before picking leader"

The above was twitted by Gerry Nicoles, pretty funny.

 If true its pretty shitty and childish, so right up Trudeau's ally!

 If not, well I'm getting fucking sick of headline editors taking liberities with the truth when making headlines, I honestly think headlines have become one of the most dishonest things in journalism and it needs to stop, I don't like Trudeau but if its misinformation then its not fair, because it will burn him big time, too many people read only headlines and not the meat.

Yeah, I agree with you.

The media is really going after Trudeau right now, too.  They know he is the only one who can beat Harper so they want to bring him down.

The media is not Liberal in this country any more - it is Conservative.  It supports a Conservative financial agenda and a right-wing, pro-War foreign policy.  It is angry with Trudeau for opposing Harper's War.  It wanted him to sign off on it.

If Trudeau sinks that may make North Report and some others happy, but it won't lead to an NDP victory.  It will just help the Conservatives again.

Brachina

 Actually the papers seem more pissed about bill C-51, all the newspapers in Canada lean to the right fiscally, but left or liberation on social/rights issues, so that's where he got burned.

 I'll also point out what I said about the Tories ads against Trudeau, they were landmines, they were never supposed to damage him right off the bat, they love fest for Trudeau was too great for that back then, so they sowed relatively simple seed of doubt about Trudeau, drip,.drip, drip, that most people shrug off. But that is was fed and nutured by Trudeau gaffes and bad choices, he's stepped on a few small mines with those gaffes and bill C-51, but the question when will he step on the big one that will send him to 3rd place in more then just leadership numbers?

Sean in Ottawa

Debater wrote:

They know he is the only one who can beat Harper so they want to bring him down.

This is an absolute fantasy. A real flight into delusion.

The unbiased experts have been pretty clear that the likelihood of a clear majority win is remote for all parties. The Conservatives are well placed to win the most seats but short of a majority. Trudeau's arc is downward right now and Mulcair's is upward and the gap is small. To say at this point that Trudeau is the only one who can win is the kind of statement that might make Liberals feel good but it won't pass as serious analysis.

At best you can say that in some respects the Liberals are slightly better positioned at the moment but the gap is nothing like what Liberals here want you to believe. At this point Trudeau cannot hold a ten point gap over the NDP and struggles to keep it half that much. Any party within ten of the lead is clearly a potential contender. A ten point change during an election period is quite normal.

I don't care if you Liberals want to say you love your party and leader best -- but don't pretend that you have facts suggesting the NDP is not a contender in what is clearly a close election between the top three parties.

This election may well start with the three main parties closer than they have ever been before in Canadian history at the time of the start of an election.

I do suspect that Liberal arrogance of this flavour by their boosters is actually a problem for the Liberals as they go into an election. It turns people off.

terrytowel

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

The unbiased experts have been pretty clear that the likelihood of a clear majority win is remote for all parties.

Which is why Sid Ryan is setting up his union machine to advocate strategic voting, like he did in the Ontario election in 2014. To break it down riding by riding, and identify which is the candidate with the most electoral support. Then throw resources at that candidate, so vote splitting can be avoided.

And it is also why Nathan Cullen and Joyce Murray advocated 'joint' nomination meetings and only have one progressive candidate running against the Con candiddate. Even Elizabeth May was on board with that.

But some here on Rabble have rejected both ideas.

Sean in Ottawa

terrytowel wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

The unbiased experts have been pretty clear that the likelihood of a clear majority win is remote for all parties.

Which is why Sid Ryan is setting up his union machine to advocate strategic voting, like he did in the Ontario election in 2014. To break it down riding by riding, and identify which is the candidate with the most electoral support. Then throw resources at that candidate, so vote splitting can be avoided.

And it is also why Nathan Cullen and Joyce Murray advocated 'joint' nomination meetings and only have one progressive candidate running against the Con candiddate. Even Elizabeth May was on board with that.

But some here on Rabble have rejected both ideas.

Absolutely. More than some. If we had merged I would be voting for a candidate who supported Bill C-51 among other things.

Sid Ryan is making a fool of himself. There are more differences in policy between the NDP adn the Liberals now than the Liberals and the Conservatives. People are waking up to that.

NorthReport

Trudeau is being ridiculed this morning for his latest comments

Yesterday it was a coalition without Mulcair

Today he has changed his mind

What a moron!

mark_alfred

Justin Trudeau wrote:
I don't know....Honestly, I don't want get into hypotheses. Maybe, but maybe not.

The fact that Trudeau would even consider the idea that he'd change his mind and be open to a coalition with the NDP if there were a different leader from Mulcair is ridiculous.  It indicates to me that their campaign will largely echo the theme of "two sides of the same coin" that they did last time (when they bizarrely claimed Layton and Harper were two sides of the same coin).

 

mark_alfred

From the article:

Quote:

On Tuesday, Trudeau categorically rejected the idea of a coalition.

Disappointing.

Quote:
Whenever we have opened that door, Justin Trudeau slams it shut,'' Mulcair said. "My first priority is to get rid of Stephen Harper."

As it should be.

ilha formosa

JT just gave himself a big "idiot" certificate. What an airhead. Zero political acumen.

This clearly shows he doesn't even understand how a federal government is formed. And that he either has crappy advisors or good ones that he doesn't listen to, neither of which bodes well for the Libs. And also that he knows nothing about talking to the media, keeping his cards close to his chest. He could have said something ambiguous, because coalition negotiations would come after the election when the chicks have hatched. I had some hope in him helping to usurp Harper, but his lack of not only basic political skill but also basic math skill has caused my opinion of him to drop like a rock.

Could he not even see that he had, and I emphasize the past tense, a very good chance of becoming PM supported by the Mulcair-led NDP?

So the media needs to press him hard now on whether or not he would form a coalition with the Conservatives, with JT playing the role of Harper's jock strap. His answer would let the public know for sure where he stands, if that's the right verb.

ilha formosa

Brachina wrote:

 If not, well I'm getting fucking sick of headline editors taking liberities with the truth when making headlines, I honestly think headlines have become one of the most dishonest things in journalism and it needs to stop, I don't like Trudeau but if its misinformation then its not fair, because it will burn him big time, too many people read only headlines and not the meat.

Social media and cell phones especially has made this is epidemic. Click bait, info overload.

Brachina wrote:

 I'll also point out what I said about the Tories ads against Trudeau, they were landmines, they were never supposed to damage him right off the bat, they love fest for Trudeau was too great for that back then, so they sowed relatively simple seed of doubt about Trudeau, drip,.drip, drip, that most people shrug off. But that is was fed and nutured by Trudeau gaffes and bad choices, he's stepped on a few small mines with those gaffes and bill C-51, but the question when will he step on the big one that will send him to 3rd place in more then just leadership numbers?

Dion, Ignatieff, Trudeau: what a string of failed leaders from Canada's "at least they're not the Cons" party. The Conservative attack ads work because they have some actual truth to stick to.

Charles

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

terrytowel wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

The unbiased experts have been pretty clear that the likelihood of a clear majority win is remote for all parties.

Which is why Sid Ryan is setting up his union machine to advocate strategic voting, like he did in the Ontario election in 2014. To break it down riding by riding, and identify which is the candidate with the most electoral support. Then throw resources at that candidate, so vote splitting can be avoided.

And it is also why Nathan Cullen and Joyce Murray advocated 'joint' nomination meetings and only have one progressive candidate running against the Con candiddate. Even Elizabeth May was on board with that.

But some here on Rabble have rejected both ideas.

Absolutely. More than some. If we had merged I would be voting for a candidate who supported Bill C-51 among other things.

Sid Ryan is making a fool of himself. There are more differences in policy between the NDP adn the Liberals now than the Liberals and the Conservatives. People are waking up to that.

 

To that end: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/a-coalition-why-trudeau-has...

 

NorthReport

The media are having a field day ridiculing Trudeau about this today

Trudeau just seems so inexperienced to be running to be prime minister

Geoff

Some, more senior, Liberal should remind Justin that it was exactly this kind of arrogance and sense of entitlement that got the Liberals thrown out of office in the first place.  Either that or someone should just give the kid a lollipop and send him home.

ilha formosa

Alright. Calming down a little to see things from a Liberal point of view rather than what I wish were the Lib view. Must assume they do have some astuteness among them, even despite JT's jumbled messaging.

Say the seats end up pretty much as projected right now: Cons in first place, Libs 2nd, NDP 3rd. No majority, although Lib+NDP exceeds 169 by a good margin, say by over 10. Trudeau doesn’t form a coalition with the NDP, instead becoming Leader of the Opposition. From that position, the Liberals try to steer the Conservatives the way they, the Libs, want. In this way they can be seen as exerting some leverage on the government, without reliance on the NDP.

If the Cons don’t listen, the Libs have the option of trying to defeat the government on a confidence vote and then trying to form a coalition with the NDP without an early election. This option is the stick they would have to use against the Cons.

There are a lot of unknowns and unpredictables, not least of which are the electorate and the NDP, but maybe this is what the Liberals are thinking. Maybe?

Or...behind the closed doors, the Libs supporting the Cons is simply what Canada's corporate masters say they want.

nicky

Tweet from Warren Kinsella

@kinsellawarren: Sigh. #cdnpoIi http://t.co/hwrTCZiBA7

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

So sad and hopeless reading thread after thread of Liberals fighting the NDP and vice versa.

It's counter-productive and it opens the door to another 4 year term of tyranny under the Harpercons.

Wise up,Trudeau and everyone else stop fighting. A little cooperation goes a long way.

NorthReport

Trudeau's position tomorrow!  Frown

"Well if the NDP membership was different The Liberals would reconsider a coalition."

 

http://warrenkinsella.com/2015/04/sigh-7/

mark_alfred

So, yesterday it was he'd consider it if the leader was different.  Today it is he'd never consider it.  Presumably getting rid of Harper isn't the top priority of Trudeau.  I guess he's open to repeating the behaviour of the recent past Libs (Dion and Ignatieff) and just sitting on his hands and allowing the Conservatives to govern even if they only win a plurarity.  Stupid on Trudeau's part, in my opinion.  Coalitions and accords are perfectly reasonable options in parliamentary democracy, and for him to feed into the Conservative myth that there's something wrong with coalitions is stupid.

Pondering

If you quote the question and Trudeau's answer everything he said was perfectly acceptable. If you disagree, quote him directly and completely and explain what you think is bad about his answer. 

He has been very clear that the NDP and Liberal policies and approach to unity differ too greatly for a coalition. It is feasible that under a new leader policies would change therefore it would change the equation. Hence his answer, maybe, maybe not. He was in no way suggesting that the NDP should consult him on leadership choices.

He also complimented Mulcair and said there is no personality clash and that he respects Mulcair's experience. 

In return Mulcair talks trash about Trudeau and NDP supporters twist Trudeau's words. 

This is the kind of thing that continues to erode the respect I once had for the NDP. 

sherpa-finn

Well his mother says you're all just a bunch of bullies. so there.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/margaret-trudeau-says-she-dreads-bullyin...

 

 

 

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

What do you mean bullies? Justin Trudeau is a very good boxing fighter!

The interview of Margaret Trudeau on Global News is quite a treat as well.

jjuares

I wouldn't get to upset with Trudeau's position. If you don't like it just wait until tomorrow he will have a new position then.

mark_alfred

ETA:  I came close to breaking a resolution.

Pages