Invasive Species

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WWWTT
Invasive Species

Not entirely sure where to place this thread? But I believe this is the closest fit. 

First off here’s a link for some background to build on. 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/10-invasive-species-threatening-canadian-habitats-1.950951

There seems to be some interest here to discuss this subject and I don’t want to drift other threads into this so here goes 

 

WWWTT

Mr Magoo wrote in another thread 

 

"Invasive species" is the plant and animal version of "dirty foreigner" -- Zebra mussels are just here looking for a better life!

Discuss.

Ok I’ll bite. 

These other species such as the zebra mussel were brought here by humans. 

As I understand it, they were taken out of their natural environment where they have predators eating them, keeping their population in check. 

When intriduced here, without their predators and other influences and or suppressing factors, their populations explode, putting huge pressure on domestic species to the brink of extinction. 

Australia’s various ecosystems I believe has huge problems with invasive species 

WWWTT

JKR wrote

Is the ICM pro or anti Asian Carp?

Ya that’s funny shyt! I got a good laugh from that whole thread drift conversation we were having. 

But there is a serious side to this and I don’t want to belittle something that some people feel is important 

 

JKR

There is a movement in Canada to put an “Environmental Bill of Rights” into the constitution. I think this would be a great idea. Here’s an article from Policy Options supporting putting environmental rights into the constitution:

Should environmental rights be in the constitution? Policy Options; David R. Boyd; 4 March 2014:

Quote:

There are six compelling reasons why Canada needs to modernize its constitution to include the human right to live in a healthy and ecologically balanced environment.

First, Canada trails behind other countries when it comes to protecting the environment. There are the Conference Board’s rankings. As well, Simon Fraser University researchers ranked Canada’s environmental record 24th out of 25 nations in the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development. Our magnificent natural heritage is being eroded.

http://policyoptions.irpp.org/fr/magazines/opening-eyes/boyd-macfarlane/

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

When I was a kid, we camped at Killarney Park one summer, and they had been battling an outbreak of tentworms -- little inchworm type critters that covered tents and any other stationary surface -- by importing some species of fly from somewhere in Scandinavia,  IIRC.  The flies looked and behaved like a common housefly.  They'd bite you if you were wet, but other than that I guess they kept the tentworm population down as intended, because I only saw one or two tentworms.

But the flies just covered you, constantly.  If you were sitting still there would be a dozen or more on you somewhere, and if you moved a little they would buzz and fly a few inches away, then land again.  The only respite was nighttime, or way out in the middle of the lake.

Quote:
Australia’s various ecosystems I believe has huge problems with invasive species

Originally it was rabbits, brought aboard ships for food.  Then, if the Simpsons are to be believed, cane toads.

One of Canada's worst is zebra mussels, which apparently arrived in ship bilge water.  They clog up water intakes, and they'll absolutely shred your feet if you walk in shallow water, but they do have the interesting side effect of clearing the water.

It's pretty true, though, that where there's an invasive species, there's surely humans responsible.

Sean in Ottawa

Interesting -- I raised the issue of putting sustainability into the constitution in the last week. This can be viewed not just as giving the environment rights (which in constitutional law would be a big deal) but also about recognizing the young and future generations of people's rights.

Sean in Ottawa

The issue of invasive species such as the Asian Carp is serious since they are brought by humans out of a different context. Invasive species when they are animals tend to lack preditors which gives them competative advantage in the more balanced eco-system.

That said the most invasive species in the world is of course humans.

Here is a site that is quite interesting: https://www.invasivespeciescentre.ca/

With respect to the Asian carp there is this: http://www.invadingspecies.com/asian-carps/

Also worthy of note is the issue of abandonned fish -- goldfish are also carp see http://www.invadingspecies.com/goldfish/

Of course there are many other invasive species. The first I was aware of as a child was Sumac.

There are different varieties and some are invasive here (I think including poisonous sumac - looks like Queen Anne's Lace) and there are those not considered invasive like staghorn. However, the non-invasive has become invasive due to human activity. This plant likes poor soil so when the soil is damaged by humans (for example due to construction or bank mitigation rocks being added or flooding due to damn creation) it will take over and spread crowding out other species that cannot compete. When I was a child we saw the river bank taken over by this species as other species were pushed out.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture
Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

I suppose I shouldn't root for any invasive species, but I can't help being fascinated by the marble crayfish.

tl;dr:  a species of crayfish that appears to have spontaneously and naturally evolved the ability to reproduce asexually.

WWWTT

@JKR and Sean in Ottawa 

An environmental bill of rights would be very powerful! 

I seriously doubt something like that would ever be worked into the Canadian charter of rights and freedoms and or the constitution? For the simple reason that the charter lacks any mechanisms for changing evolving. 

This is probably a strong enough issue that deserves it’s own thread, not sure if it relates to invasive species?

WWWTT

@Mr Magoo 

I never heard of those tent worm? Caterpillars I’m guessing?

Here’s a list of invasive species to Australia 

https://wikivisually.com/wiki/List_of_invasive_species_in_Australia

Cane toad is in there. 

Sean in Ottawa

It is definitely a global problem. One of my Chinese friends mentionned that the some 55 invasive species were found in the Three Gorges Dam drainage area including a water hyacinth that threatens to interfere with its pipes.

The Chinese also complain about the American Bullfrog which is an invasive species there -- so not only do they have to deal with regular American bullshit but also the bullfrog.

In Asia they also have an invasive carp species -- it is the European carp and similarly it lacks preditors.

The Chinese are also dealing with an American bottom feeder - other than Trump. This is the Common North American Catfish which has taken hold there. As well small mouth Bass and large mouth Bass have become invasive there. Possibly brought in for sport fishing.

WWWTT

I believe all the fish species you mentioned were originally brought in for food. I have seen live lm bass in aquariums at supermarkets. And this was in Guangxi. Never seen sm bass. That must be in the northern provinces because sm bass are better at tolerating the cold winter and will die off in warmer sub tropical waters. 

I have eaten catfish and carp in YangShou Guangxi before. It’s actually a famous dish there. So I suspect those sub species were introduced as food  

But back to Canada, I have heard from a couple people at the Ontario MNR that even Walley was an invasive species in some parts of Ontario! Believe it or not. 

I know brown trout is another introduced from Europe. As well as other salmon species. In around the Great Lakes.  

But you never hear anyone complain about those fish?

Sean in Ottawa

WWWTT wrote:

I believe all the fish species you mentioned were originally brought in for food. I have seen live lm bass in aquariums at supermarkets. And this was in Guangxi. Never seen sm bass. That must be in the northern provinces because sm bass are better at tolerating the cold winter and will die off in warmer sub tropical waters. 

I have eaten catfish and carp in YangShou Guangxi before. It’s actually a famous dish there. So I suspect those sub species were introduced as food  

But back to Canada, I have heard from a couple people at the Ontario MNR that even Walley was an invasive species in some parts of Ontario! Believe it or not. 

I know brown trout is another introduced from Europe. As well as other salmon species. In around the Great Lakes.  

But you never hear anyone complain about those fish?

As I understand it the invasive species are judged based on the impact they have. These species are not just from another place but they are damaging the local species.

Some of these species in China are having terrible impacts on the local fish or environment much as the Asian Carp is here.

Of course eventually a new ecosystem will prevail - some may go extinct and the former invasive specieis may be displaced in the future. The issue is not that they may be accepted later but what they take away now.

I am not sure what specieis made room for the current fish we have.

Also the Asian carp is voracious and can leave nothing behind so it is long like previous ones.

The Hyacinth I mentionned is also extremely damaging. I am not sure of the degrees of the others.