The demonization of China

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Timebandit Timebandit's picture

You’re conflating two things I’ve said. Yes, I could attempt to prove my point, but doing so would mean talking openly about others who might suffer consequences, and a message board post may have only a small risk, but it’s still not worth it. 

WWWTT’s posts are comparable to the stuff 50 cent army posts. If he isn’t, he’s certainly sympathetic. Either way, he’s promoting his own imperialism here. 

ETA: And in doing so he’s smearing people trying to protect their civil liberties by calling them xenophobes. I don’t know why that’s admirable, but you do you, I guess. 

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Timebandit wrote:

WWWTT’s posts are comparable to the stuff 50 cent army posts. If he isn’t, he’s certainly sympathetic. Either way, he’s promoting his own imperialism here. 

That is your opinion of him but frankly I find Magoo to be just as predictable as the VOA in his attacks on leftist leaders and yes WWWTT is the polar opposite of him and they are both as unbiased as each other. This is a discussion board so stop trying to limit the discussion to voices that agree with your perspective.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

Yes, that is my opinion.

Im not trying to limit voices, I’m trying to limit outright lies. A million people protesting extradition legislation are only saying that because they’re secretly protesting mainlanders? 

Magoo’s a provocateur, no question. But like him or not, he’s not posting things that are demonstrably false.

ETA: No one on this board is immune to being challenged. None of us are. I get that you don’t like this, but when WWWTT makes an outrageous claim, it’s going to get challenged. 

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Timebandit wrote:

ETA: No one on this board is immune to being challenged. None of us are. I get that you don’t like this, but when WWWTT makes an outrageous claim, it’s going to get challenged. 

I agree totally and it is why I posted when you defamed him instead of debating him.

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

I wouldn’t go that far. I also pointed out much earlier in this thread that it wasn’t a serious accusation - although his reaction and posting since hasn’t done anything to dispel the idea. 

Pondering

Canada's behavior here and in the world at large has been horrible. I accept the term genocidal in relation to indigenous peoples of Canada.  Our mining corporations could be called evil if you are a religious sort and we are responsible for not stopping them. We are guilty for wearing clothing made in unsafe sweatshops sometimes by children. We have no business interfering in Venezuela and impoverishing the country while claiming nobility. As a people you could argue we are more guilty than the Chinese because we have so much freedom to object and not enough of us do.  No claim of moral superiority is being made. 

You cannot argue that that the Chinese government is less repressive than the Canadian government because it makes no sense. All you have to do is compare the treatment of the executives arrested in each country. 

I watched a tiny bit of Peter Mansbridge and The Future of War. From the bit I saw he understands the rise of China and that the US perceives it as a threat and is fighting for supremacy.

NDPP

'The Chinese Are Coming': US Attempts to Turn the Phillippines Against Its Beijing Ally

https://on.rt.com/9w62

"...The potential for a conflict in this part of the world appears to increase on a daily basis. Just last week, a Russian warship and a US warship came extremely close to colliding with each other with both sides disputing which part of the sea, the incident took place in (whether the Phillippine Sea as the US suggested or the southeast of the East China Sea as Russia claimed, I think you should be starting to get the point by now).

While the Phillippines will want to maintain a balance between the US and China which does not involve putting its territory at the heart of open conflict, another point worth noting is how the Phillippines has been pursuing stronger ties with an unlikely Washington ally, who [has very enthusiastically pursued back, and] undoubtedly has separate motives of its own; Israel. According to The Diplomat, Israel and the Phillippines seem set to move forward with joint counter-terrorism efforts, all the while the Phillippines places large orders for a range of military equipment from Israeli firms.  The Phillippines is also happy to learn directly from the Israelis as to effective counter-terrorism efforts by receiving direct training.

At the same time, the US and the Phillippines have also also reportedly collaborated to lauch a three-year program to fight home-grown [and  jihadi proxies imported by guess who] isis-inspired extremism in the Phillippines. Because at the end of the day, the US will always have the threat of terrorism to keep the Phillippines in line. In this context China may just not be able to compete with America's wide-ranging ability to bomb 'Islamic militants' right across the globe."

NDPP

John Pilger: The Coming War on China

https://youtu.be/QXFProJC5FY

As anyone with eyes open can observe the cheering squad that always  helps warm us up for coming imperial ventures  has been called and answered the imperial dogwhistle under various guises and humanitarian subterfuges and the barking, snarling and snapping has already begun...

Martin N.

NDPP wrote:

John Pilger: The Coming War on China

https://youtu.be/QXFProJC5FY

As anyone with eyes open can observe the cheering squad that always  helps warm us up for coming imperial ventures  has been called and answered the imperial dogwhistle under various guises and humanitarian subterfuges and the barking, snarling and snapping has already begun...

Is it difficult to hear the "Imperial dog whistle" whilst hiding under one's bed?

 

"More swords are required to maintain the peace than to wage war."

NDPP, do you really believe that if one lays supine, the Chinese inclination is toward tummy rubs?

NDPP

Hong Kong police are as brutal as the Spanish pigs were suppressing the Catalans. Peacefully  protesting Palestinians get shot every Friday by Israeli sharpshooters. Gilets Jaunes also get brutalized by police weekly. Why so little concern or criticism here of those cases too? See answer below...

"I don't think Western politicians and media who support the protests in Hong Kong really want what's best for Hong Kong. [North] Americans in particular want Hong Kong to become a new tool to contain Beijing..."

https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1138850069875109888

Timebandit Timebandit's picture

How would Hong Kong have the ability to “contain” mainland China? What would that even look like?

Pondering

NDPP wrote:

Hong Kong police are as brutal as the Spanish pigs were suppressing the Catalans. Peacefully  protesting Palestinians get shot every Friday by Israeli sharpshooters. Gilets Jaunes also get brutalized by police weekly. Why so little concern or criticism here of those cases too? See answer below...

"I don't think Western politicians and media who support the protests in Hong Kong really want what's best for Hong Kong. [North] Americans in particular want Hong Kong to become a new tool to contain Beijing..."

https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1138850069875109888

Well duh. The US and China are at war they just aren't using bombs. China's rise has been incredible. That is what Trudeau was aluding to when he joked about admiring the country's government. Because China is so centrally controlled they can make radical changes quickly as they did with the one child policy. That rise has been so dramatic that they are beginning to rival the US. It would be idiotic to think the US who has the biggest military and economy on Earth would just sit back and welcome China as an equal on the world stage. 

Stopping Huawei is about dominating technologically and economically. The US is not going to let Huawei get all the 5G network business. Who are their rivals anyway? I never hear them mentioned. 

The 5 eyes are the UK, Canada, Australia, the US, and NZ. The US will pressure all 5 eye countries not to use Huawei or risk being ejected from the 5 eyes based on security concerns. 

China doesn't quite "get it" yet it seems. With both China and the US strong-arming Canada the US wins easily. No contest. There has been some suggestion that Trump's remarks prove the request is political but that argument has to be presented in court and I am sure it will be. I can't imagine her lawyers not using it. 

Does Trudeau even have the power to order the courts to accept or refuse the request for extradiction? 

cco

As discussed in one of the earlier Meng threads, extradition is a political decision, no matter how much politicians like to pretend it's a hands-off process they can't touch. If a court rules the request valid, the decision will land on David Lametti's desk. He remembers how he got his job, so I'm guessing a whisper in his ear from the PMO will not go ignored.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

If this proposed timeline for the judicial proceedings is accurate, it may or may not be Lametti who decides.

NorthReport

In the real world Trump will probably tell Trudeau how it will all shake down at their upcoming meeting prior to the G20

NDPP

China Issues Warning After Canada Raises Concerns Over Planned Extradition Law

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/china-freeland-hong-kong-1.5173486

"China is once again issuing a warning to Canada after Foreign Affairs Minister Chrystia Freeland put out a statement outlining concerns over planned extradition law. 'Hong Kong affairs are purely China's internal affairs. No other country, organization or individual has the right to interfere. Recently some people from the Canadian government made irresponsible and erroneous comments on the Hong Kong government's amendment to the ordinance and other Hong Kong affairs. We deplore and firmly oppose this..."

 

US Using Hong Kong Protests To Inflame Public Opinion Against China (and vid)

https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2019/06/13/598405/US-using-Hong-Kong-prot...

"In reality, the demonstrations are not so much against the extradition bill as they are a reactionary backlash  against Chinese sovereignty over Hong Kong. Although the bill is still being debated, it has been seized upon by enemies of the Chinese government to push their pro-Western agenda. The proposed extradition treaty is just the latest excuse to do so..."

WWWTT

Timebandit wrote:

How would Hong Kong have the ability to “contain” mainland China? What would that even look like?

Not sure if containing is the right term the US wants. Spreading violent chaos would b more like it. 

NDPP

Hong Kong Wealth Gap At Its Widest in Decades

https://twitter.com/MarkAmesExiled/status/1140281232250605569

"HKers are mad because there is (rightly) the feeling that Hong Kong is a shitty place to live...The political and economic elite of HK in material character and ideology has not changed for half a century. Whether under authority of London or Beijing..."

NDPP

American Govt, NGOs Fuel and Fund Hong Kong Anti-Extradition Protests

https://www.mintpressnews.com/hong-kong-protests/259202

"The protest's messaging and the groups associated with it, however, raise a number of questions about just how organic the movement is. Some of the groups involved receive significant funding from the National Endowment for Democracy (NED), a CIA soft-power cutout that has played a significant role in innumerable US regime-change operations..."

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