Trudeau Liberals are failing Canadians on the China file!

152 posts / 0 new
Last post
NorthReport
NorthReport
NorthReport
NorthReport
NorthReport
contrarianna

Don’t Let China Take the World Hostage

Trust NR's easily  triggered xenophobic gene for foreign threats,  resulting in a sh*tstorm of frenzied re-posts of every corporate media demonization of  (non-western) foreign activity in the ramped-up economic hegemony wars.

Let's be clear, there are plenty of very bad Chinese trans-national corporate business practices in Canada that Canadian Governments should never have allowed, let alone encouraged.  And the Canadian Government  lack of interest in BC becoming a world capital for foreign money laundering is not unrelated. 

Powerful corporate exploitation is normalized where there is encouragement from  neoliberal,  corporate-connected governments, (supposed guardians of the commonweal) and will always be VERY ugly, 

 But let's also put the "China threat" in perspective, and here I am re-quoting someone's online  reply to one of the flood anti-Chinese articles; a reply which applies generally:

Half tiger:  
We don't really have to worry about "the corrosive influence of the 
Chinese state in Canadian affairs" because they would first of all have 
to displace the corrosive influence of the US in Canadian affairs. The 
Meng arrest shows just how willingly we toady to every American wish. 
The US also has our solid support when it comes to Russophobia and the coup d'etat under way in Venezuela.
When it comes to foreign policy Ottawa is a suburb of Washington and our relationship with China and the rest of the world has been and will continue to be defined from Washington. Unfortunately for China, the US colonized us first and will guard their prize covetously.
In the meantime Canada continues as the land of diminishing returns dishing out tribute to the empire and a mere parody of the "true north strong and free."

In the hyenas'  feeding frenzy over the tastiest bits of the cadaver of "sovereign Canada" NR seems more concerned over the colour of the a hyena's fur rather than  who gets the lion's share.   

NDPP

How can anyone with half a brain be so committed to msm narratives? The resulting confusion is hardly surprising. 

Sean in Ottawa

I agree with the point about the seriousness of the Canadian government's willingness to look the other way to get any foreign investment no matter the cost. I also agree that by far the surrender has been to the US. The very signing of the FTA is a part of that trend.

That said I still disagree that the Meng arrest is an example of this. I believe that the extradition treaty is a practical necessity given the geography and population weight. I don't think this is true regarding the trade agreements signed or the allowing of foreign investment to swamp local economies.

JKR

Hasn’t the U.S. already taken us hostage?

NDPP

Perhaps that explains the widespread Stockholm syndrome so many here obviously suffer from.

NorthReport
NDPP

Ecobar: Get Over It: Asia Rules

http://informationclearinghouse.info/51073.htm

"They call it Euro-Asia in Beijing and they call it Greater Eurasia in Moscow. The whole process is historically inexorable, already forging the future - call it Asian or Eurasian."

NorthReport
Noops

NorthReport wrote:

After what has happpened Canadians will never accept Huawei operating in Canada. It's over.

Not true.

If Meng is released back to China, everything will be roses once again.

Canada and China will be kissy kissy once again.

And the U.S. will probably declare another State of Emergency.

 

Noops

"Don't Let China Take the World Hostage"?

Huh?

If one didn't know any better, they'd probably say you were scare mongering!

There has been more spying on U.S. citizens and citizens around the world by U.S. government agencies and U.S. tech companies than China could ever dream of doing.

This is all manufactured scare mongering on the part of the U.S. and North Report.

 

 

JKR

Maybe Huawei is ruffling feathers because they are developing excellent products that threaten Western companies?

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

JKR wrote:

Maybe Huawei is ruffling feathers because they are developing excellent products that threaten Western companies?

Especially if that better product includes the possibility of blocking 5Eyes' back door hacks.

NDPP

Escobar: US Elites Remain Incapable of Understanding China

https://www.asiatimes.com/2019/02/opinion/us-elites-remain-incapable-of-...

"...Another example of how supposedly bipartisan US intellectual elites, instead of offering impartial advice, do little more than parrot Washington's talking points, failing to admit they know nothing of substance about the existential 'threats' posed by Russia and China."

Sounds familar...

NorthReport
NorthReport

.

NorthReport
NorthReport

Douglas Todd: China’s long surveillance arm thrusts into Canada

State intimidation and electronic surveillance can be highly effective. It's affecting China's 180,000 students in Canada, as well as journalists.

https://vancouversun.com/opinion/columnists/douglas-todd-chinas-long-sur...

NorthReport

Student groups call for Ottawa to investigate alleged interference by Chinese officials on Canadian campuses

https://nationalpost.com/news/student-groups-call-for-ottawa-to-investig...

JKR

Could there be something to this great yellow peril?

Mobo2000

Article at #124 was posted in another thread, and actually discussed there:

http://www.rabble.ca/comment/5541066#comment-5541066

For babblers who would like a critical perspective on recent Canadian coverage of China and the Chinese government, check out this thread:

http://www.rabble.ca/babble/international-news-and-politics/demonization...

 

NorthReport

Rare interview with Huawei founder is part of ‘charm offensive’ against U.S.-led security concerns, says expert

 

https://www.thestar.com/vancouver/2019/03/18/rare-interview-with-huawei-founder-is-part-of-charm-offensive-against-us-led-security-concerns-says-expert.html

NorthReport

‘You’re with China or you’re with us’: Global relations hinge on outcome of trade talks, U.S. analysts say

 

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2019/03/11/youre-with-china-or-youre-with-us-global-relations-hinge-on-outcome-of-trade-talks-us-analysts-say.html

WWWTT

NorthReport wrote:

Rare interview with Huawei founder is part of ‘charm offensive’ against U.S.-led security concerns, says expert

 

https://www.thestar.com/vancouver/2019/03/18/rare-interview-with-huawei-founder-is-part-of-charm-offensive-against-us-led-security-concerns-says-expert.html

wrong thread, this would fit better in the demonization of China thread

NorthReport

Canadians need to stop being naive about China

China has stopped buying Canadian canola seed

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/canada-canola-china-1.5067307

NorthReport

Time for Canada to drop the 'white gloves' in diplomatic feud with China, says ex-diplomat

 

As Beijing continues to ramp up diplomatic pressure on Canada through its decision to stop importing Canadian canola seed, one former ambassador to China says it's time for Canada to "remove our white gloves" and retaliate against the Asian superpower.

"One of the first measures that I would take would be to expel all Chinese athletes that are training in Canada in preparation for the Winter Olympics of Beijing that are going to take place in 2022," Guy Saint-Jacques told host Vassy Kapelos in an interview today with CBC News Network's Power & Politics.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/powerandpolitics/canada-china-saint-jac...

NorthReport

China's crackdown on Canadian canola expands as 2nd company, Viterra, has licence revoked

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/china-canola-viterra-1.5071611

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Thanks NR, a thread meant only to demonize China. You have proved the point of everyone who thinks that China gets demonized, even on this board.

NorthReport

Give it a break. No one is demonizing China, but Canada needs to stop putting its eggs all in one basket whether it be the USA or China or Europe or wherever else, as it is not healthy for Canada to do so, because of the problems that arise as we are now seeing first hand when we have a political dispute, which really is a business dispute. I believe PET had the wisdom to try and get us to diversify out trading partners, as we were too closely entwined with the USA. I think that applies as well to any of our other trading partners which includes China.  

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

The US is Canada's largest trading partner. It accounts for over 47% of our trade. The EU is number 2 and accounts for less than 9% and China at number 3 is 6% but lets have a thread warning us about China's domination of our economy. You are an idiot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_largest_trading_partners_of_Ca...

JKR

Has the title of this thread significantly changed?

Unionist

JKR wrote:

Has the title of this thread significantly changed?

Ooooooooooohhhhh yes.

I believe it used to be something like: "Don’t Let China Take Canada Hostage". 

Stay tuned for more changes.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

I think it went through an inclusive phase, too, when it was "Don’t Let China, or Any Country, Take Canada, or Any Country Hostage" which I thought could be more easily stated as "Don't let countries take other countries hostage" or some such.

NorthReport

Tell that to Canada's Canola farmers

WWWTT

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Thanks NR, a thread meant only to demonize China. You have proved the point of everyone who thinks that China gets demonized, even on this board.

I believe this thread was my inspiration for the China demonizing thread I created here. 

The link you provided about trade numbers puts everything into perspective. 

Heres another specific to BC

https://www.bcstats.gov.bc.ca/Files/abf58192-be2b-471f-bd16-f1f87ad1f512/ExportsAnnualData.pdf

It appears that BC does have greater trade with China. I assume this is due to geography. 

Notice Africa and or African nations percentage is so small! If even mentioned. And that there’s a distinction made separating Egypt and the middle east from Africa (like as if we were doing laundry and separating the colors!)

Meanwhile, Africa is the second largest continent geographically and has the second highest population of humans. 

Any threads here on babble about expanding trade with Africa? Does North Report ever even suggest this?

Now to be fair, i’ve tried to start a couple different threads here related to Africa and they fizzle out fairly quick if I don’t constantly bump them. And there are threads about African nations  

And when China increases trade with Africa, they get accused of attempting colonialism. 

NorthReport
Mobo2000

Oooh I was just going to post that one in the Demonization of China thread.

Unionist

From the article:

Quote:

Matthews received an email from consul Wang Wenzhang on Monday, the day before the event. The French-language email, which he shared with the National Post, said the vice consul general, Xing Wenjian, wanted an “urgent meeting” with him that afternoon or Tuesday morning to “communicate our points of view.” Matthews said he decided not to respond. Neither the consulate nor the embassy in Ottawa responded to a request for comment.

So if the National Post has the email - why don't they just quote it? Like, where did the email say the Chinese consulate wanted to "shut down" the event?

Pondering

It seems to me that Canada was demonized during recent trade negotiations with the US. We might even say that the US was demonized during the same negotiations. I doubt either was due to racism.

I admit I don't know a lot about China factually so I do want to know if these are lies:

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2019/03/11/youre-with-china-or-youre-with-us-global-relations-hinge-on-outcome-of-trade-talks-us-analysts-say.html

But as experts have told the Star, Huawei is no outlier in this regard. Politics and economics in China are not separate. The conduct of private firms is subject to the will of the party, and companies — which often receive state subsidies that allow them to undercut international competitors — are tasked with realizing the government’s overall goals domestically and internationally.

“(President) Xi Jinping has declared the party leads everything. And like any other Chinese company, Huawei is expected to have a party secretary and party committee who exercise some rather ambiguous position in terms of its leadership and management,” said Elsa B. Kania, adjunct senior fellow with the Technology and National Security Program at the Center for a New American Security.

China denies the above. Who am I to believe? Is Kania lying? 

Meng’s arrest hurled Canada into a heated diplomatic dispute with Beijing, which has since detained a pair of Canadians in China — Michael Kovrig and Michael Spavor — apparently in retaliation. A third man, Robert Lloyd Schellenberg, was handed a death sentence after a one-day retrial on charges related to drug offences for which he’d already been tried and sentenced to 15 years in prison.

Am I to believe the above is coincidental?

“Make no mistake, I think the Canadians do feel somewhat instrumentalized, here,” Leuprecht said.

“I think Canada does feel that it’s a bit of a pawn in the U.S. game with China, and that this (extradition request) was (one of) many moves that the U.S. could make in that game as a way of turning up the heat on China in general and on Huawei in particular.”

There is little question, he added, that Meng’s arrest and the prosecution of Huawei are part of a broader strategy to contain China.....But since so much effort goes into an extradition request, he noted, the U.S. only does it selectively, when the stakes are incredibly high. “So it’s clear to everybody that both the request in general and the timing were hardly accidental,” he said.

No proof of any of the above so is it demonization of the US?

NorthReport
swallow swallow's picture

The Chinese consul's e-mail can be read at http://plus.lapresse.ca/screens/b00c6f06-d6b2-4111-bd24-205e71246769__7C___0.html?utm - it asks for an urgent meeting to express China's concerns. 

I realize that the English-Canadian media thinks nothing has happened if it didn't happen in English, but the e-mail is available in its original language with 1 seocnds of googling. As are some direct quotes from the consult explaining China's viewpoint that the Uigher speaker is a "terrorist" and therefore should not be permitted to speak so soon after the New Zealand terrorist kilings, since his resentation would not be"good for students."

Joint au téléphone, Wang Wenzhang a toutefois confirmé avoir « exprimé les préoccupations de la Chine par la voie diplomatique ». Il a justifié son intervention auprès de la Ville et de l’institut de recherche universitaire en soutenant que Dolkun Isa est un « terroriste » et que sa conférence « n’est pas bonne pour les étudiants ».

« Inviter un terroriste quand on commémore encore les attaques de Nouvelle-Zélande, c’est inconvenant et ridicule. »

Unionist

swallow wrote:

The Chinese consul's e-mail can be read at http://plus.lapresse.ca/screens/b00c6f06-d6b2-4111-bd24-205e71246769__7C___0.html?utm - it asks for an urgent meeting to express China's concerns. 

I realize that the English-Canadian media thinks nothing has happened if it didn't happen in English, but the e-mail is available in its original language with 1 seocnds of googling. As are some direct quotes from the consult explaining China's viewpoint that the Uigher speaker is a "terrorist" and therefore should not be permitted to speak so soon after the New Zealand terrorist kilings, since his resentation would not be"good for students."

Joint au téléphone, Wang Wenzhang a toutefois confirmé avoir « exprimé les préoccupations de la Chine par la voie diplomatique ». Il a justifié son intervention auprès de la Ville et de l’institut de recherche universitaire en soutenant que Dolkun Isa est un « terroriste » et que sa conférence « n’est pas bonne pour les étudiants ».

« Inviter un terroriste quand on commémore encore les attaques de Nouvelle-Zélande, c’est inconvenant et ridicule. »

[emphasis added]

Swallow - thanks for the La Presse article, which unfortunately repeats without source all kinds of anti-China allegations ... such as claiming that the U.N. has denounced China for a wave of repression against the Uighurs.

But question: Where did you see anyone say that Dolkun Isa "should not be permitted to speak"? I was unable to find that in the article.

swallow swallow's picture

He asked that the university not give this speaker a platform. I should have added "at the university" I suppose. 

The article says various organizations have documented and denounced abuses, including the UN. It is true that the UN has not denounced China's treatment of the Uighur Muslim minority, and it will not do so any more than  it would denounce US treatment of Muslims - both China and the US can veto resolutions at the Security Council and China can generally assemble enough votes to block resolutions at other UN bodies. But I didn't share the article to endorse it, just to share the e-mail text and the interesting interview with a consul that English-langauge media said could not be reached for comment. 

Unionist

swallow wrote:

He asked that the university not give this speaker a platform. I should have added "at the university" I suppose. 

Sorry to keep bothering you, swallow. But I didn't see where "he asked that the university not give this speaker a platform". He said (and this is according to La Presse's account alone) that this man is a terrorist, that his conference would not be "good for the students", that inviting a terrorist when we're commemorating the victims of the New Zealand massacre would be "inappropriate and ridiculous". But please show me where he demanded that the conference must not be held? I can't see it. And it makes a difference. It's about fake news, hysterical and exaggerated reporting, lies.

swallow swallow's picture

I suppose the consul could have meant that it was bad for students to have a terrorist speak, but that that was fine and he only wanted to express concern, urgently, in person, within 24 hours, that the event was bad for students but of course China had no objection. Anything's possible, I guess. My reading is that this is an effort to get Concordia to deny a platform to this speaker, an effort to prevent an individual from speaking. If you feel that is a hysterical lie, I suppose we'll have to disagree. 

Sean in Ottawa

I agree that the Trudeau government has let down Canadians with respect to China.

As I pointed out, Trudeau's sanctimonious comment that China's legal process was random (suggesting non existent) was pointless and harmful. His comment was like a peacock preening and showing feathers.

We can, if people like (since I do not have a problem with examining any government) discuss in context the merits of the Chinese legal system with respec tot the Canadians who are there, but the comment that it is random is wrong, imperialistic, insulting, damaging to Canadian interests and counter productive. This comment has preceded more arrests that may have been less well defended as China, its pride justifiably hurt, makes a point.

Canada could have done better with a PM who had responded by regreting the conflict, outlining what Canada's position is with respect to the extradition request and need to let the courts decide, saying it wanted and expects a fair process as does China with the Chinese national, and wanted to resolve the conflict. Instead, Trudeau decided to play to politics and virtue signal. By doing so he made the conflict worse, made it important for China to snub his little pompous nose and set back Canada's interest. Trudeau is in favour of poking the other in the eye, a process that continues until both are blind which is the present situation. Trudeau should have dialed the thing down and sought to help Canadians. Instead he proved that his interests are with himself and the Liberal party. As always.

He made his stupid comment flailing as he had previously stated that he would not bother contacting the Chinese at a high level becuase he was too good for the process. What an idiot. His job was to call the Chinese and express a desire for a bettter relationship, to explain the legal position he understood he was in, and seek to help the Canadians. He pompously snubbed the Chinese publicly by saying there are times he knew (in his arrogance) that a leader should not be involved. Completely incompetent on this file from start to back.

 

Pages