N Korea shells S Korean Island

Perhaps it's a rite of passage for New Dear Leader.  A boy's first act of military aggression.

Could this intensify to become a serious conflagration? Is that perhaps what the North wants for some reason?

Coincidentally, I received promotional material in the mail today for recruiting students to teach in Korea.

A good translation of this non-American news source.  Holding provocative military exercises on disputed territory is always the sign of peace loving nations. Poke a stick at you opponents eyes and when they respond vilify them.  So when are they planning the regime change and how many hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians will Haliburton murder this time?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuncbujiMAE

It's OK folks, the UN has condemned it.

That should put a swift end to this.

I am sure N. Corea will listen to this UN resolution in the same way that Israel does when the UN condemns it.  Nasty oppressors never listen to criticism because they know god and the angels are on their side.

Thanks AJ, I can see from your answer you are not open to reading anything some people post because of your presumption it would be from a "non-American" news source. Only reading sources that support your world view is not my style.  I much prefer to get a balanced overview rather than merely the propaganda we are feed in the west. North Korea is a brutal dictatorship but that doesn't change the fact that the nastiest nation on the planet is engaged in ongoing poking and prodding of them for maximum effect.  I refuse to be sucked in by the Fox style reporting from the American empire but you or anyone else is free to lap it up and form your opinions based on biased journalism.

To be clear what I am saying is that civilian support staff for the military living in a disputed territory are also universal soldiers not innocent bystanders.

@kropotkin1951, look we all know you hate the USA and all that stuff but quit trying to make excuses for the North in this situation. North and South Korea have been doing military exercises in that area since the war cooled down and there's nothing provocative about them unless they want to make them so... like North Korea just did. The island of Yeonpyeong is South Korean territory as dictated by the UN Security Council (look at the map); just because the North disputes it (and you don't like it) doesn't give them the right to shot artillery at it because they don't like what the South Korean military is doing there.

Yeah, they hit the evil imperialist military installation there, but they also hit the civilian town as well.

Yeonpyeong Island is renowned for its Kumouuri - a specialty spiced crab unavailable elsewhere in South Korea and is the home to over 1200 people; mostly crab fisherman and their families. Now dozens of their homes are burning to the ground. Maybe you should go there with a bull horn and tell them to get the fuck off North Korean soil. I'm sure they'd be happy to give you a sample of some of those spicy crabs...

 It wasn't a totally one sided fight by the way; that military installation recovered from the initial attack and fired back with its own artillery, soon after that the NK guns fell silent. Counter fire can be a real bitch, that K9 155mm SPG is no slacker.

Bec I hate imperialism but the reason I save my venom for the USA is because they claim to speak on my behalf.  North korea has not told me they are fighting to protect MY way of life only Amerika is that fucking arrogant. It is our western news coverage that vilifies american enemies for the same thing that their allies do that really pisses me off.  So when was the last time  in a thread you were critical of a western power for their military raids on civilian targets?   I wish that the imperialist war games had not put this village at risk although I have read reports that what was hit was the base and the houses directly around it.  

If it was the other way around our biased press would be complaining that the North Koreans were using civilians as shields [you know like Hezbollah when Israel invaded] and thus committing a war crime.  So is South Korea using civilians shields as cover for their occupation of disputed territory?

Spin and propaganda is merely spin and propaganda.

Nobody can speak for yourself exept you... some may think they can but they are mistaken.

That island is owned, not occupied by South Korea; don't confuse it with other parts of the world. The people who live there are not shields, if anything the military is the shield (I know that turned a few guts here....LOL) As I said before most of the civilians there are fishermen, and have lived there for generations caching crabs and other fish.

I'm not as fiery or as theatrical in expressing myself as some of you are here; me saying "dropping bombs on that building in that situation was wrong" is equal to one of your two paragraph rants about cooperate stooges ass raping cows and killing babies in their cribs with flamethrowers and all that other stuff you like to throw in for extra effect. One man uses a sentence and another uses a paragraph to say the same thing. I'm good with that. You don't really see me railing about civilian casulties do you? I just mentioned them becouse it seems to me you thought they were "fair game" becouse they supported the military.

By the way some of my info is coming from my wife; she's at home watching Korean satellite TV; believe me they have much better coverage. It looks like the South Korean death toll is going to rise; several of the wounded are in pretty bad shape. The fire is also spreading on the island and the civilians are upset the fire department was slow getting out of the bomb shelters and onto their trucks(no shit) also many of them also evacuated off the island.

For the most part this is over; the next move is up to North Korea. There will also be more military drills; the South Korean military will n ot be intimidated into quitting what they started... I can believe it, Koreans are a proud and stubborn people, I should know, I'm married to one. 

I think it is only a matter of time before this war becomes hot again and what wasn't finished in 1953 is finished. The wildcards will be the US and China.

It probably serves Dear Leader's interests better to have a constant enemy at the gate than it would to let the enemy in and get a total beatdown. 

Fidel still can't figure out why the US and UN are still in Korea... Oh well.

Anyways...

I'm a bit surprised at this... these are parts of of the artillery rounds NK fired, they are the rocket motor for a free flight artillery rocket not an cannon artillery shell. For those of you who don't know cannon artillery is much more accurate than rocket artillery; especially at longer ranges like these guys were firing. Rocket artillery is more an area fire weapon. No wonder they were hitting all over the island. The ROK army fired back with K9 self propelled artillery guns; a much more accurate artillery system.

That's what the S. Koreans get for amassing 70,000 troops along the border and firing shots North Korea's way?

Perhaps the news headlines might be more informative if they stated some facts in their propaganda rags for a change. SOmething like,

'DPRK on high alert after US-backed South Korean Military Regime Mobilizes 70,000 Troops and Shells DPRK'

...or something as informative and not so spastic as the Yahoos who wrote the Yahoo newz diddy. 

According to the South Korean army, yes they shot at some water. For all you know that means they missed their target. The record is clear. Live fire was begun by the South Koreans.

Sarah Palin

Wow - that is both hilarious and sad all at once.

Sure, if their REAL target was some other water a mile further east. 

Every time babblers go all out to defend Dear Leader, I wonder if it's Free Dominion's birthday or something. 

Poke the opponent and see if they will respond.  Too bad we will never know the casualty count on the other North's side.  

China will not allow the North to be subsumed by the South and for good reason.  Unification with the North under a US backed South means that the US troop can be do their friendly maneuvers with their allies along the Chinese border itself.  Now that of course would not be a US provocation but merely military exercises between friendly nations.  I hate it when big boys with big weapons play chicken with each other.  The people always lose.

You can always tell that someone is losing an argument on the internet when they break down your post into decontextualized chunks and try and refute eash point in detail. Usually, none of that has anything to do with the whole point.

The South Koreans know as well as the North Koreans that live fire artillery does not generally have the capacity to distinguish between civilians and military personnel. They knew quite well that civilians might be at risk. The fact that you think that artillery is a precision weapon indicates that you know absolutely nothing.

The response was entirely predicatable and calculated into the excersize. In fact border excersizes are designed to provoke a military reaction. That is part of the excersize. They are testing the capabilities of the response. In turn they get to direct attacks against military tragets inside North Korea, now knowing the locations, and responses of the defenders, including the scramble response time of jet fighters and so on and so forth.

Democracy Now:

TIM SHORROCK: You're always kind of surprised when these things happen. But in the context of the last 50 years, it is not really that surprising, particularly if you look at the maritime zone and particularly if you look at the history of U.S.-South Korean military and its standoff with the North Korean regime. First of all, over the last few years, there has increasing tensions over this zone. As I said, this border area in the sea, this border line was imposed unilaterally by the U.S. Navy in 1953 right after the Korean war. That line has never been recognized by North Korea, nor by the international community. A few years ago, under the former presidency of Roh Moo-Hyun, there was actually a meeting, a summit meeting, between the president of South Korea and Kim Jong Il, the dictator of North Korea. They sat down and worked out sort of a set of agreements to try to decrease tensions in that maritime area, including the making of free fishing zones and having discussions to alleviate the [tension] to make sure there were no incidents like this. This new president Lee is a very conservative man who has rejected the former sunshine policies of Kim Dae-Jung and his predecessor, who were much more open and tried to cement closer relationships and end the enmity between North and South Korea. Lee unilaterally pulled away from this agreement. And over the last few years, our listeners and watchers will remember, there have been quite a few incidents. Earlier this year, in March 2010, a South Korean naval ship was blown up allegedly by North Korea by a torpedo and sank, killing about 33 sailors. This was also a very serious incident. And many people who watch North Korea believe that that particular attack, if North Korea did it, was in retaliation for an incident that took place last year when South Korea fired on a North Korean ship that had crossed the line and many North Korean sailors were killed in that attack. And so you know this has been going on. I think the first thing that needs to be done is it would be important to restore some kind of discussion, some kind of negotiation so they can reduce tensions in that specific area. (emphasis added)

I agree. We should remember that the US/G8/Snert do not consider massive military exercises using live fire in disputed territory by the worlds largest military to be provocation. Therefore considering a homemade rocket fired into the ocean provocation would be absurd.

NATO.

Cueball come on man, I know you're smarter than this.

The South Koreans were doing a scheduled training drill the North Koreans knew about (but didn't like and demanded SK to cancel) It involved practice artillery gunnery where SK artillery units were firing in the opposite direction from North Korea out to sea. You're assertion that the SK units fired on NK and missed their targets (thus starting the engagement) is pretty, I don't know, crazy and I hope it's from your lack of knowledge about how artillery units train and other things military. Please understand I'm not poking fun at you or anybody else here for not understanding this.

Again a little class on modern artillery for those of you who don't know much about it: Artillery doesn't need a physical target to hit during target practice to see how accurate it is, it just has to hit a grid location on the map (out at sea in this case). Also, in Korea, most all weapons gunnery ranges fire south, I spent two tours there on tanks and our tank gunnery fired south when we were up close to the DMZ. Many US Army artillery units fired at a range called "C" range where they fired out into the South China Sea (again with the shooting at a spot in the water). Now grant you the ROK units were on islands in the waters North Korea was claiming is theirs, thus the term disputed, just like were that island they blew up is. But that don't mean it is their sovereign land and even if you want to support NKs claim it still doesn't justify what they did if you ask me.  

The South Koreans were not threatening the North Koreans; they were just pissing them off by not caving into their demands. Now some of you here might say "well that's enough to blame SK" well you go run with that; it's your prerogative.

The ROK units were south of the line established by the UN and in their own sovereign territory. They always have be across that line when they did this drill. As I said above North Korea decided to make a big deal out of this known drill to use it as an excuse to start a fight with SK for whatever reason. They knew their "demand" to stop the drill would be ignored because, well, they always are ignored. South Korea isn't going to let North Korea bully it around (you can call home and ask my wife....LOL). I'm sure most here can understand that.   

Where do you source this assertion that SK units were firing out to sea? Based on your knowledge of military practice? The fact that you don't have to aim at anything in order to practice gunnery, does not mean that they were not firing in the direction of NK.

Regardless, I highly doubt that standing orders for the North Korean army were to stand down until hit. I suspect that it would be much simpler than that. Fire if they start firing. Not "fire if anything lands on you".

You are being a tad bit gullible if you actually think that South Korea did not intend to get a live fire response, after they have been warned not to be there at all. Moreso, if you actually think that the US response agreeing to join military excersizes with a US fleet carriers is an idea that suddenly got tabled yesterday as an emergency measure.

You actually think the South Korean army commanders are so stupid as to believe that North Korea was not going to engage when South Korea started firing live round?

Oh, my apologies then. It was a some what over the top generalization of how some people's posting style seems to me (exaggerated for effect)... it was not aimed directly at you. However, with all things said to others; it's not what I think I said, it's what you think I said and I've obviously offended you. As such I offer my apology to you and anyone else offended by that part of my post.

I have to remember not everyone is an old thick skinned rhino hide like me...  

Cueball noticed that South Korea was conducting an exercise.

M. Spector noted the armistice doesn't define the border in this area and that this disputed territory is occupied by South Korea as a result of the presence of the US military.

Look at the map posted by Bec.de.Corbin. or google it:

http://maps.google.ca/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=korea&sll=49....

North Korea's thin slice of sea is barely navigable and the US imposed boundary cut North Koreans off from rich traditional fishing grounds.

After reading both side's version of events, my best guess is that South Korea's miltary exercise was needlessly provocative. A large and sustained barrage of shells could have shut down North Korean navigation and fiishing in the area.

Imagine a loud party next door.  Its past midnight and the party shows no sign of winding down.  You and your neighbor have a long history of neighborly disputes, but you call him up anyway and ask him to turn it down.  He's says, "F#%& you and cranks up the stereo louder.  You pound on the door and when it opens, you punch him in the face.  A fight breaks out and you both get bloody.  But at least the party is over.

The next day, your fight makes the news. The news puts a big picture of your neighbor's broken nose on the front page, reports their version of events and portrays you like a crazy person. (They may be right).

 Ok so are you saying they were firing at NK as a part of the drill? Where's your source for that? NK news? Globalresearch dot com?

My question for that would be how could they miss? Or are you saying they were splashing the beach just to provoke NK? I guess we're heading down the conspiracy trail AGAIN. So be it... sigh

What I've posted is for you here to consider, if you want to dismiss my experience in the military as whatever then that's fine by me. I'm just tell you what I know, what I've experienced and how its related to the current Korean situation.

I don't have a source for that. However, I just am not going to accept at face value the story as proposed. I know for a fact that SK is not innocent in this affair, otherwise they would have not done something so obviously provocative, as setting up these exercises in disputed waters. Also, they continued with their planned exercises even though NK objected. So given that SK is obviously being provocative, there is no basis for assuming their innocence in anything at all.

Naval gunnery exercises can happen anywhere. There is no need to have them there. Also, if SK was not interested in provoking NK, they could have done them anywhere. Off the coast of Busan for example.

So, there is no basis for presuming SK innocence, so yeah, they may very well have been shooting in the direction of NK. Why would say otherwise, since they have been clearly provocative on two counts; one, location; two, ignoring warnings. Why would you assume that they were not also provocative in the manner of the operation itself? What establishes SK innocence?

I guess we can go back to the idea that the SK military command are totally stupid. No. Of course the SK were perfectly well aware that NK would likely want to join in the live fire exercizes.

Let me ask you this: Do you reasonably expect that South Korea would engage in live fire naval exersizes in disputed waters, without the explicit go ahead from the USA?

That is too bad. I was really hoping you would answer my question.

It's a response to a number of things.

Yes, it's a response to South Korea's naval exercises - where South Korean ships fired their guns facing toward North Korea and where the U.S. decided not to participate at the last minute.

It's also a response to the 1953 Armistice, where U.S. negotiators arbitrarily drew a line across the Korean landmass but did not extend it out to sea. Hence the question over the ownership of waters and the island that was shelled.

The 1953 Armistice was more beneficial to South Korea and created problems for the North, hence North Korea has harbored grievances ever since to the Armistice.

The antagonsim of the U.S. and the current South Korean government and the U.S. embargo against North Korea has only made conditions (like starvation) in North Korea worse.

No it's a medieval way to kill a downed armored opponent; you thrust through the am pit and into the heart... its a finishing move. The face works as well...

YOOOBOOOOYAAAH! (sweetheart)

Cause it kinda reminded me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YKbYLb5GVc

(the part where he thrusts his nose into his armpit)

It is. And believing everything that any military outfit says about itself is best pursued by the naive. In fact that pro-forma denial is almost too perfect to be believed, as if this particular accusation was expected, or known about. I supposed we will never know the precise truth.

What we do know is as follows:

1) The act of conducting a military operation in disputed waters is an overtly provocative act.

2) Doing so, even after being warned (asked) not to is an overtly hostile one.

3) Firing weapons in such circumstances is belligerent, at best.

Therefore, given that there is clear evidence in the record that South Korea was being overtly provocative, hostile, and belligerent, yet they argue that they are completely innocent, when it is completely obvious that they are not, there is no reason to think that they are not lying about that as well.

But even if they are not, as I pointed out before, it is highly likely that North Korean orders were very simple. Commence firing as soon as firing begins. I doubt the orders were so nuanced as to suggest that critical aspects of telemetry and targets be established before shooting.

Indeed, no one asks the police in this country not to fire against armed persons who are being provocative, hostile and belligerent. The courts and most people recognize that as legitimate grounds for shooting someone, regardless of where they are aiming. You seem to be asking for conditions of restraint that we do not even require our police officers to follow. In fact the police are considered to be justified in shooting people, just because people are armed and seem hostile.

Not being naive, I submit that South Korea was expecting some kind of retaliation. Indeed, they would have to be completely stupid not to expect the response that they got. It was certainly part of the calculation. Likewise, I am not so naive to believe that the United States, who will be conducting exercises in close cooperation with South Korea next week, also was not aware of all the details, and subsidiary calculations. I am also certain that they participated in helping make those calculations.

I simply think it is absurd to think that South Korea launches into these kinds of activities without some kind of approval from Washington, or that Washington does not make realistic calculations about possible scenarios that may result. In fact, I would go so far as to say that if they were not informed, and disapproved of these outcomes, their reaction would not have been to reinforce South Korea's hand by arranging military exercises.

South Korea's defence minister tendered his resignation Thursday, just two days after a North Korea artillery attack killed four people on the small island of Yeonpyeong.

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2010/11/25/south-korea-defence-minister-resignation.html#ixzz16IlGIh23

LOL! Asked!

Did they remember to say 'please'??

Anyway, it's fascinating to learn that if someone demands something of you and you don't comply, that's hostility. I'll have to bookmark that one for another day.

But NK demanded that they not do this, and they didn't give in to that demand.

Evidently, not only is this belligerent, it's also provocation, regardless of whether they were within their rights to conduct these exercises.

Remember that the next time a cop demands that you move along. Refusal to comply = a belligerent provocation.

Do you get your crappy anaologies in bulk or something? First you compare military exercises by the US military to homemade rockets. Now you're comparing the relationship between two militarized state governments to a cop and a person on the street? Do you know what power is?

Yup. Comparing foreign policy to two rednecks insulting each other over the fence is very helpful. All those details just hurt my brain, eh.

Silly North Korea to expect that international disputes would be negotiated.  Your Vancouver Island analogy is interesting but actually the Canadian equivalent is on the East Coast.  Imagine France claiming all the sea around their island in the middle of Canadian waters belongs to them.  How ridiculous!!!!  Your logic suggest France would be justified in having military exercises with Iran off their territorial island as long as they stay inside their zone.  Live fire would also be alright as long as it was pointed out to sea.  Have I got your argument correct?

Cueball wrote:

Quote:"This speaks to a bigger picture here that certainly scares me in terms of our national security policy. But obviously we've gotta stand with our North Korean allies."

Sarah Palin

Twitter spot: Like the brave Sarah Palin, I, too, support our allies in North Dakota.

North Korea is not a nuclear threat to anyone. Like Cuba they've been under economic and military siege since the collapse of the former USSR. They are surrounded by US Military and nuclear weapons pointed at them.

It's the US Military that represents the largest threat to peace in the region. It's high time the Yanks got the hell out of the Korean peninsula, and let the Koreas unite once and for all. The cold war is supposed to be over.

Mr Obama, tear down this wall.

The North Korean regime has been on record much longer than the Southern regime in favour of unification. There may have been some recent bumps, as it were, but statements on unification from the NOrth go back to the 80's or further back yet. 

China may value North Korea as a useful buffer between itself and western troops, but my concern, from a humanitarian perspective, is that if North Korea keeps using phoney provocations to bomb civilians, China may resort to disciplinary strategies, like cutting food aid.

It's amazing how people feel the need to take a side on things. It's seemingly impossible for people just to discuss things without making phony moral judgements. South Korea engaged in a case of clear brinksmanship, North Korea called their bluff. It's bloody obvious.

Um, South Korea did not bomb civilians, or anybody else for that matter.  North Korea actually bombed and killed civilians and destroyed people's homes. 

I can't find the article from NZ Herald of a few years ago, but it reported on a CitiBank assessment of NK to the US Government. The news article said that NK's economic reforms were about where China was in the 1980s. At the same time, NK's monetary reforms were where about where China was in the 1990s.

The issue Uncle Sam has with North Korea has nothing to do with North Korea being a military threat. It has more to do with the US' imperialist agenda to maintain division among the barbarians so to speak. A united Korea could become another Asian tiger economy. North Koreans are well educated for the most part. Compared to one of Uncle Sam's model countries for Washington consensus, like Haiti or Thailand, Indonesia, El Salvador etc, a united Korea could become an economic powerhouse. North Korea is already trading with China and Japan and several more countries on a limited basis. Must maintain division among potential economic competitors.

And the reason I say this is because in 1980 the USA was the world'd premier military and economic power. Today they are the world's most formidable military power only. Asia Pacific generates more capitalist wealth than any other region of the world bar none. Russia has struck deals with North Korea for electrical power projects enroute to supplying S. Korea with the same.

But againm, the US and its corporations are not worried about North Korea as a military threat whatsoever. They have NK surrounded militarily and would punch their lights out in any nuclear or conventional military confrontation, no doubt about it. It's the potential economic challenge and having a hand in the region in general. The US Military has threatened NK with nuclear incineration several times since the 1950s. Nuclear blackmail and military threats in general are supposed to be considered illegal since Nuremberg. Genocidal embargos are also a threat to North Koreans. When will the cold war bullshit ever end? I have no idea, but North Korea is being punished like Cuba has been for merely trying to exist outside the sphere of US influence. They can't donate democracy to any country by either military aggression or economic warfare. Attempting to impose US political will by military or economic pressure on any country is as undemocratic on the Korean peninsula as it is in Afghanistan and Iraq, Cuba etc.

WRONG

They admitted to retaliating with greater firepower and no one knows what the injury or death toll is.

Do you believe that the military exercises are necessary and if so could you please explain what that necessity is?  Seems that if as you and I agree this is a nasty regime with brutal leaders then what possible benefit outweighs the risks involved in poking a stick in a hornets nest?

It is not that I don't blame the assholes who murder there own people in the North it is just that I also have distain for the assholes who engage in this imperial shit in my name.  This bully boy with big weapons attitude is done in our name and that is what really disgusts me.  The murderes in the North to not claim to act on my behalf.

So just a question while all this academic discussion goes on. Has anybody actually lived and worked in the ROK? Anybody?

Kanada2America

So just a question while all this academic discussion goes on. Has anybody actually lived and worked in the ROK?

I've lived here since 2001. Was there something you wanted to ask?

Why did South Korea fire first? Previous S. Korean governments fully accepted NK's claim to the same territory shelled by the South for no apparent reason on November 23rd.

In fact, this is cold war baloney warmed over. The west used to do similar things to the Sovs in attempting to provoke the Soviet military responses.

South Koreans like playing war games apparently. And guess who taught them. Three guesses - first two don't count, and trust your intuition. HINT: The country in question has 30,000 troops stationed on the peninsula and apparently can't find their way home thousands of miles away.

Strategy of tension bullshit all over again. Shit disturbing US Military should get the hell home and stay there.

Peace in Korea Could Not be Permitted then or now.

Are we sure that they "exploited" these tensions? I mean, I have grave doubts about the idea that South Korea engages in this kind of brinkmanship without at least the tacit support of the USA, and I am sure the USA was apprised of all the details. I am sure no one was surprised by the North Korean retaliation.

Assuming this is true, then it seems to make sense that they wanted to make use of the incident to justify further military exercises that could be used to test Chinese reactions and gain diplomatic leverage.

It may be that the US thinks now that NATO has Russia in the bag, they can proceed to muscle China more regionally and  also advance with what may be warplans against Iran as well. There are hawks that believe sooner rather than later is the time to go forward with these and other imperial agendas - before their economy completely collapses or China decides to ditch the dollar.

Does anyone really believe these incidents are ever spur of the moment wild west games?

@ Cueball, Ya I think you about have it right. That poster came out and said it, he was in the military. According to him they were just having, you know, a harmless little excersise in the sea right next to their enemy.

Ya, harmeless and all. Just some 70,000 army guys that wanted to know if the guns were working and not rusty. The North had nothing to worry about, cause the drills had nothing to do with them.

I have a question - it's a couple of days after your 1st post, and do you still believe nothing is going to come of this?

I dunno, I like to watch the North Korean situation pretty unceasingly. I have a grim fascination with despotic regimes and the history of Korea in the post-WW2 era plays really, really well into said fascination. I remember speaking to a prof. I had who mentioned that North Korea is a country where you will never know what's going on, where you will have to take either intelligence estimates or internal journalism from the North Korean state. Once in a while journalists will cover big events, but everything is controlled and handled in a way that is unique to pretty much anywhere in the world.

People who say 'the North didn't fire towards the ...' are taking the DPRK's word at face value, same as a lot of people are taking the ROK's statements at face value. Really, it is quite silly, given that most of us are willing to question the far more benign CBC.

So, North Korea's response wasn't some sort of just and fair response - if it were we'd have seen the pictures of North Korean devestation where the ROK had attacked. This was the response of a state that is based entirely on its military. This was a very...masculine response. No recourse to the standard angry rhetoric of North Korea, a terse warning (like the one that gets sent out everyday) regarding a military drill that, historically, would've been openly talked about by both sides through less formal channels. A complicating factor is the election of Lee Myung-Bak whose leadership has been very bellicose and reversed a bit of the good will that had been built up under his predecessors. Not reported in the Western media is a lot of the aggrivating rhetoric of South Korea - I'll find links later. Generally, though, you can just see the diplomatic niceties of the Americans and get a good idea of what the South is about.

The area under question is a sore spot for the North. Remember, Korea is a peninsula and following its demarcation in the post-Korean War world the DPRK's navy is essentially split up into two parts that have no capacity for interoperability. That is a major strategic weakness of the North and one that has been exacerbated by these drills. Holding them on the Eastern seaboard or in the south of the South would have been far less provacative. However, you know, when you have sabres to rattle - it is a party that everyone is more than welcome to join.

The incident won't lead to much though. The North pulls a lot of these sorts of shennanigans and the South likes to show its muscle from time to time as well. This is just prickly brinkmanship between the cynical and unstable North and a smug South.

Anybody interested in the thought of those living in Korea I would suggest an excellent ex-pat site called the Marmot's hole. I found this on the site:

There is a very very small garrison on YP-do. They have very few artillery pieces which are test fired on a regular basis to the West away from NK territory and away from fishing areas. They post notices and make radio broadcasts to enure there are no fishing vessels in the area and that the north Koreans know they will be firing. They also post patrol boats at the edges to further ensure there is no chance of civilians getting injured. They then fire a few rounds per gun to test the systems and then stow them.
http://www.rjkoehler.com/

It seems like some here want to blame the South Koreans for having the audacity to have a military exercise. South Korea has a right to hold military exercises and North Korea does not have the right to stop it. Military exercises have occurred in South Korea since the end of the Korean War. During the 1980s much larger exercises were conducted called "Team Spirit". Of courses North Korea complained but no harm was done to North Korea due to Team Spirit. So, why did North Korea decide to make an attack over something that has occurred year after year for over 50 years?
The live fire exercise at the island was routine and of no significance. Guess what., armies shoot guns. Shooting guns on one's own territory at targets located on one's territory is not being belligerent. The 70,000 troops number pales in size to the size of the North Korean Army.

Evidence is coming out that the attack was premeditated. The rocket artillery used by North Korea is not normally deployed near the islands. Rocket artillery is more suited to attacking large groups of land forces. Using rocket artillery was designed to kill and strike terror not to knock out the supposed threat of hardened military gun emplacements.

Also, North Korea recognizes South Korea's ownership of the islands. But, they make a ridiculous claim over the water that surrounds the islands. That is just absurd.

The bottom line is that North Korea for some reason wants to bully South Korea. South Korea did nothing wrong or nothing new or out of the ordinary. This is just another example of the leadership of North Korea disregard for life. They could have started a war if it was not for South Korean restraint.

Closing for length.

And a note to Bec. You aren't banned for swearing at me, nor are you banned for being a white guy with unexamined racist beliefs. You're not banned at all. But you're on thin ice.