North Korea

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Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
North Korea has repeatedly offered to suspend its nuclear weapons development in exchange for a freeze in US-South Korean joint war exercises.

Would DPRK also suspend its own so-called "war games"?

If so, I would heartily endorse this.

Sean in Ottawa

As I understand it the US has some confusion about war making powers.

The President can send forces for up to 90 days.... But the President cannot declare a war.... There have been undeclared wars....

To make this muddier -- not only are wars often undeclared, Korea is not at peace but technically already in a state of war although with an armistice. Are the President's powers different in this case than where there was no war to begin with?

josh

U.S. involvement in the Korean War was based on a UN resolution, not a declaration of war or a Gulf of Tonkin like resolution.  But as a practical matter, a president can pretty much do whatever he wants militarily.  

Sean in Ottawa

josh wrote:

U.S. involvement in the Korean War was based on a UN resolution, not a declaration of war or a Gulf of Tonkin like resolution.  But as a practical matter, a president can pretty much do whatever he wants militarily.  

I think that is close to true but not quite. As a practical matter Congress can limit a President in many ways and while the President can take action Congress has not spoken on it can prohibit or require the President to do things by vote.

NDPP

Trump Warns North Korea New Threats Will Be Met With 'Fire and Fury'

https://on.rt.com/8jup

" North Korea best not make any more threats to the US. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen,' Trump said on Tuesday afternoon..."

 

TRNN: Has Trump Threatened Nuclear War on North Korea?

https://youtu.be/T6rFJnKYPNU

"The need for diplomacy is as urgent as ever, says veteran journalist Tim Shorrock...These sanctions will hurt the North Korean people."

Sean in Ottawa

NDPP wrote:

Trump Warns North Korea New Threats Will Be Met With 'Fire and Fury'

https://on.rt.com/8jup

" North Korea best not make any more threats to the US. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen,' Trump said on Tuesday afternoon..."

 

TRNN: Has Trump Threatened Nuclear War on North Korea?

https://youtu.be/T6rFJnKYPNU

"The need for diplomacy is as urgent as ever, says veteran journalist Tim Shorrock...These sanctions will hurt the North Korean people."

The Sec. of State today is dialing back the irresponsible utterances of the President. This is, as everything else about this administration, quite pathetic.

Rev Pesky

From josh:

U.S. involvement in the Korean War was based on a UN resolution, not a declaration of war or a Gulf of Tonkin like resolution.

This may be, strictly speaking, true, but it's not really true. Post WW2 the USA and the Soviet Union split the Korean peninsula between them, which set the stage for the Korean War. There were USA trooops in Korea from the end of WW2.

​The United Nations resolution was a formality which provided legal cover for the USA. Another one of those 'coalition of the willing' things.

NDPP

More 'Fire and Fury'

https://youtu.be/NZm_C4bltgk

"North Korea threatens to strike US territory in Guam. 'The fear is that if somebody flinches, if somebody screws up, there could be hundreds of thousands of dead people here...."

 

The Intercept: Trump Intel Chief: North Korea Learned From Libya War

https://t.co/Yiwesj3wdU

"Dan Coats did something truly shocking at the Aspen Security Forum: He told the truth about the effects of US foreign policy..."

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
North Korea best not make any more threats to the US. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen

I wonder if Trump is aware of just how much that sounds like a DPRK spokesman speaking.  Swap "North Korea" and "the US" in that sentence and see if you don't agree.

I wonder if Trump is itching for the chance?  When you play some video games, half of the excitement and anticipation comes not from the objectives or questlines, but the opportunity to unlock the BFG and use it.

SeekingAPolitic...

North Korea just reponded to the Trump statement.  I don't remember  the whole thing but they stated that speaking with Trump is useless and they will use force as it is the language to communicate with Trump.  Something like that.  It should all over the web by now.

Rev Pesky

I look forward to the day the USA takes the same stand against Israel's nuclear weapons as they do against North Korea's. After all, Israel has invaded a lot more countries than North Korea has.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

I believe Israel's policy is to neither confirm or deny that they have nuclear weapons.  Of course it's assumed they probably do.

DPRK's policy has always been to boast to the world that they have nuclear weapons, even when it was assumed they didn't.

But I'm not entirely disagreeing.  I, too, look forward to the day that everyone drops their biases and team allegiances  and treats (let's say) DPRK forced labour camps with the same disgust and contempt as (let's say) Guantanamo Bay. 

Can you even IMAGINE what babble could be like if all that mattered was what a state did or didn't do, and not "whose side they're on", or whether the U.S. was for 'em or ag'inst 'em?

NDPP

Stop The Bluster - N Korea Is A Nuclear Weapon State

https://t.co/YiSVFr1zwU

"North Korea has good reasons to want nukes and the US missed all chances to remove those reasons. It is way too late to lament that..."

 

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/KGaqnONbRHk

'Trump threatens N Korea with 'Fire and Fury'

NDPP

Are N Korea's ICBM's Justified? - Hyun Lee

https://youtu.be/kerDyBz-MbU

 

Why There's No Reason To Worry About War with North Korea

https://www.counterpunch.org/2017/08/10/why-theres-no-reason-to-worry-ab...

"It will be handled. So relax..."

 

Pyongyang May Hit US Targets in South Korea if Provoked By Americans - Russian General to RT

https://on.rt.com/8k29

" North Korea may well fulfill its threat to hit US targets on South Korean territory if continued pressure by Washington puts Pyongyang at an impasse, Pavel Zolotarev, a retired Russian Major General, told RT.

'A US strike against N Korea may go against common logic, buty when a country is governed by propaganda - and the US are going through such a period - political decisions go beyond rational logic, and there we can have consequences that are hard to foresee,' Zolotarev warned.

'The Americans should have enough brains not to do it. As long as they don't hurt N Korea, it will not take any action in return..."

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

Andrew Bacevich: Trump's Handling of N. Korea, His First National Security Crisis, is Very Troubling

quote:

ANDREW BACEVICH:

But that said, you know, one of the things that strikes me about this president is his inability to use the English language with any sort of precision or finesse. And I think this was evident in spades in the "fire and fury" statement. And we should emphasize that it was a threat of "fire and fury," meaning—necessarily meaning the use of nuclear weapons, in response to further threats. And I think it’s that, the notion that threats voiced by another country could lead to preemptive nuclear attack by the United States of America—I think it’s that—that notion, which is embedded in that statement, is what causes great concern and, again, is what is so indicative, and indicative in such a troubling way, about the inability of this individual to speak with some understanding of the implications of what he says.

I mean, many people have commented—and I think accurately commented—on the narcissism, which seems to be such a prominent characteristic of Trump’s personality. And you—when you watch the video of him making that "fire and fury" comment, it’s difficult to avoid thinking that the motivation of the moment is to make himself feel good, to somehow demonstrate that he’s a tough guy, that he’s standing up to what he perceives as a threat, and to, somehow or other, derive some sense of personal satisfaction from that—from issuing that threat, utterly oblivious as to the larger implications and how that statement will play to other audiences. And that’s—that’s got to be very troubling.

And again, to emphasize the fact that he still does these things, despite the fact that he’s now surrounded by, ostensibly, more mature figures, does not bode well for how well this crisis is going to play out. But it doesn’t bode well for how other crises, which he will inevitably encounter—how other crises are going to play out.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
A US strike against N Korea may go against common logic, buty when a country is governed by propaganda - and the US are going through such a period - political decisions go beyond rational logic, and there we can have consequences that are hard to foresee,' Zolotarev warned.

Ah, yes. THE U.S. is "going through such a period".

DPRK has been "going through such a period" for the last couple of decades.  I mean, please.

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

NDPP

Newsweek Exclusive: North Korea Missile Claims Are 'A Hoax'

http://www.newsweek.com/trump-north-korea-missiles-nuclear-scientists-64...

 

Hurtling Toward 'Fire and Fury'

https://consortiumnews.com/2017/08/10/hurtling-toward-fire-and-fury/

 

US Imperialism and the Threat of Nuclear War Against North Korea

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/08/11/pers-a11.html

WWWTT

I think that the more ridiculous the comments, the more this sounds like WWE wrestling hype. I wouldn't doubt it if this was all fixed and scripted.  The biggest disagreements the US and NK probably have is how long they're going to continue this fake tough guy display going. 

Wake me up when something actually happens. Because I'm not going to rush to this thread when Trump says something  just to try to top the last thing he said he was going to do.  Maybe next time Trump makes another threat, he should smash a fake bear bottle over his head so he looks real crazy! Anything less than that then this has pretty much lost all entertainment value

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

On Guam, Resistance Grows to US Military Presence as N. Korea Threatens Missiles Off Island's Coast

quote:

LISALINDA NATIVIDAD: 

So, I’ll give you an example. In 2009, the Department of Defense released what was called a draft environmental impact statement of this planned military buildup for the island, and really, you know, it’s an expansion of their existing footprint. And in response to that, as part of the—not just the scoping process, but their collections of testimonies and what have you from our community, we responded with 10,000 testimonies in a population base of 160,000 people. That was unprecedented in U.S. DOD history. And they actually reported that number, and they also reported that that was unprecedented in their history for that kind of a community response. What’s very disheartening, however, is that regardless of this kind of mobilization, which ultimately resulted in our suing the Department of Defense on their plan to take a ancient, sacred village of ours called Pagat—and so, as a result of that, it delayed the buildup, because we were able to win that lawsuit. Unfortunately, since then, they have released new plans, and they, just in the last few weeks, have gotten the green light to go ahead and clear an additional 1,000 acres of land for purposes of this military expansion in the ancient village of Litekyan. So there’s this whole—I mean, these atrocities, it’s like one assault after the other.

You know, in terms of our ocean space, let me give you an example. In 2014, the Marianas Island training and testing range was also established. We outpoured. We resisted. It did make a difference. And ultimately, what has been the consequence of that is the establishment of a training range in the ocean and the sea and the skies of nearly a million square nautical miles. That’s larger than the states of Washington, Oregon, California, Idaho, Nevada, Arizona, Montana and New Mexico, all combined, for this purpose. And just in the last month, they’ve announced an expansion even more so of this range. So, you know, the just insane, magnanimous nature of this expansionism has really just evoked a lot of heavy response in terms of anger, in terms of resurgence of the knowledge of our colonization and how this really has been what we’re—the price we’re paying because of our colonization by the U.S. government.

NDPP

'You're Going To Become Extremely Famous': Trump Gives Guam Governor Pep-Talk Phone Call (and vid)

https://www.rt.com/viral/399404-trump-calls-guam-governor/

 

An Open Letter From Guam To America

http://bostonreview.net/war-security/victoria-lola-m-leon-guerrero-open-...

"Dear America,  I am glad that you are finally paying attention to what is happening in Guam...So please stop all this bomb talk. And instead ask yourself why Guam is still your colony in 2017?"

 

North Korea Says 3.5 Million Volunteers 'Ready To Retaliate Against US ' (and vid)

https://on.rt.com/8k65

"In the meantime, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said on Friday that there is a strong risk that Washington and Pyongyang could engage in military conflict. 'There are direct threats of deploying [military] power,' he said, adding that the side that is stronger and smarter should take the first step to defuse tensions..."

 

'Death To US Imperialism!'

https://youtu.be/SOzLAyhtiME

"

NDPP

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/8Crf7dubJ3k

"Defense Department Brags About Killing One Million Koreans."

 

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/HRwf0qdy_S8

"Chomsky Bombshell: US Rejected N Korean Peace Offer."

Aristotleded24

WWWTT wrote:
I think that the more ridiculous the comments, the more this sounds like WWE wrestling hype. I wouldn't doubt it if this was all fixed and scripted.  The biggest disagreements the US and NK probably have is how long they're going to continue this fake tough guy display going.

I hope to God that you are right.

NDPP

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/zl2wEP-NvN4

North Korea sitting on stockpile of minerals worth trillions.

 

Canada Had 2 Meetings With N Korean Officials This Week

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/north-korea-canada-1.4244177

"Chrystia Freeland said Friday that she met with Ri Yong-ho, her counterpart from Pyongyang, during a meeting of Asian-Pacific foreign ministers last weekend in Manila. Freeland made it clear Canada is standing firmly beside the United States and the threats were totally unacceptable. 'When they are threatened, we are there,' Freeland said.'

NDPP

North Korea (English site)

http://www.rodong.rep.kp/en

NDPP

China Says It Will Defend North Korea in Event Of US Invasion

https://t.co/qkHjIVQToZ

"Editorial in Chinese official newspaper Global Times sets out China's red lines: China will intervene in event of US invasion of North Korea to prevent regime change..."

NDPP

Hyping North Korea To Relaunch Reagan's Star Wars?

https://t.co/giSh9UrQ0i

"To set the Trump crew straight, China reissued its guarantee for NK's security..."

Sean in Ottawa

NDPP wrote:

China Says It Will Defend North Korea in Event Of US Invasion

https://t.co/qkHjIVQToZ

"Editorial in Chinese official newspaper Global Times sets out China's red lines: China will intervene in event of US invasion of North Korea to prevent regime change..."

This is no surprise. China has long considered NK as a buffer state and for good reason.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

Jon Schwarz has an article up on The Intercept about the analogy between the Cuban Missile Crisis of 1962 and today's North Korean Crisis. After an interesting review of the facts from 1962, he has this to say about North Korea.

Jon Schwarz wrote:

And that brings us to our conflict today with North Korea. The U.S. of course has possessed the ability to instantly destroy North Korea with nuclear weapons for 60 years. Moreover, we already leveled the country once with conventional weapons during the 1950s, killing perhaps one-fifth of its population. The equivalent number of deaths for the U.S. today would be over 60 million people.

That, however, has never been a “crisis,” just as it was not a crisis when the Kennedy administration put nuclear missiles in Italy and Turkey. It has become a crisis because it appears North Korea may be close to being able to put nuclear weapons on ICBMs that can reach the continental U.S.

Now, in an echo of Kennedy’s September 1962 remarks, Trump has declared that that “won’t happen!” Just as during the Cuban missile crisis, we start from the position that we must have the power to kill others, but it is illegitimate for them to have the power to kill us.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

If DPRK really does have the nukes they boast about then they have the only nukes on the Korean peninsula.

I wonder if they understand that that makes them the aggressor, not the poor wee victim?

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