Ukraine 5

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MegB
Ukraine 5

Continued from here.

Issues Pages: 
ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Follow-up. A number of Ukrainian saboteurs were caught, or killed, as well two Russian soldiers, in the recent terrorist incident involving Ukrainians acting on behalf of the Ukrainian military. 

Off-Guardian has a piece over here: Ukraine's 'October Surprise' may be coming in September.

Some key points ...

1. After the Russian authorities parading one of the captured suspects in front of the TV cameras, the US ambassador to Ukraine Geoffrey Pyatt basically denied that anything had happened at all. Talk about cognitive dissonance.

tweet by US Ambassador Pyatt wrote:
US government has seen nothing so far that corroborates Russians allegations of a ‘Crimea incursion’ & Ukraine has strongly refuted them.”

The whole reply by the Kiev regime and its Washington puppet masters is just idiotic. As the article notes, "Apparently two dead Russians don’t count for much in Pyatt’s book: perhaps Putin personally killed them, and the whole thing is a set up."

2. Even MSM like NPR in the US is covering for the Kiev regime here. In fact, it's practically an embargo on the facts. So, what happened?

Quote:
At least two of the infiltrators were killed, and of those in the first group five were captured: a total of ten people have been detained, including Panov. Some had Russian passports and the majority are residents of Crimea. Kommersant also said those captured admitted they were engaged in sabotage, acting under orders from Ukrainian intelligence; their objective was to plant bombs at tourist sites and incite panic, effectively destroying Crimea’s lucrative tourist industry, although they denied wanting to kill anyone.

State terrorism, pure and simple. Sponsored by ... NATO-member states. Charming.

3.

Quote:
So why should we care about this showdown at the Ukrainian corral, anyway?

It’s important because the Ukrainians – like the rest of the world – have been watching the US presidential campaign, and they don’t like what they see. Donald Trump, while disdaining to get involved in Ukraine’s feud with the Kremlin, is asking “Wouldn’t it be good if we could get along with Russia?” This has provoked the Ukrainians into paroxysms of spittle-flecked hysteria.

On the other hand, Hillary Clinton is openly accusing Donald Trump of being a Russian agent: former CIA chief Mike Morrell, in the process of endorsing her, said Trump is an “unwitting agent” of the FSB. And the “mainstream” media, which is brazenly campaigning on Clinton’s behalf, has been playing the Trump-is-a-Russian-stooge card for all it’s worth.

In short, the leaders of Ukraine hate Trump, have continually denounced him, and are openly rooting for a Clinton victory in November

But, but but! the MSM says it's the Russian President who's taking sides, sponsoring a Manchurian candidate, etc. , etc.

4. in conclusion , then ...

Quote:
Russia has lost two servicemen: Putin isn’t going to let this go. And neither are the Ukrainian coup leaders, who came to power by overthrowing the elected President and have a very tenuous hold on power. They need perpetual war scares to keep the populace diverted from their pathetic economic plight and the growing repression exercised by the regime. And certainly Hillary Clinton is ready, willing, and able to use a looming Ukrainian “crisis” to claw her way to the White House – even if she has to risk a nuclear showdown with the Russians. After all, what’s the mere prospect of World War III compared to the supreme importance of installing the First Woman President in the Oval Office?

Well said.

"After all, what’s the mere prospect of World War III compared to the supreme importance of installing the First Woman President in the Oval Office?"

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

rabble blogger Roger Annis: Western media changes the subject over latest Ukrainian sabotage against Crimea

Well, yeah, whaddaya expect? As Annis notes, there's the ritual denial, of course, trivialization of the Russian "allegations" (I suppose the two Russian soliders killed are only "allegedly" dead), changing the subject, and all the sort of subterfuge we've come to expect from Western MSM on covering Ukraine. But the wheels are coming off anyway. 

Russia will, however, honour the servicemen [Lieutenant Colonel Roman Kamenev and Private Semyon Sychov] killed defending Crimea from the Ukrainian state-sponsored terrorists.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Quote:
Ukraine marks Babi Yar massacre’s 75th anniversary

Ukrainians have marked the 75th anniversary of the Babi Yar massacre, one of the most infamous mass slaughters of World War II. Babi Yar, a ravine in the Ukrainian capital, is where nearly 34,000 Jews were killed within 48 hours in 1941, when the city was under Nazi occupation. The killing was carried out by SS troops along with local collaborators. President Petro Poroshenko visited the Babi Yar monument on Thursday in a small commemoration that included people laying flowers. A larger ceremony was scheduled for the evening. (AP)

Those very same local collaborators are now the subject of heaping praise by the Kiev regime and its sizable fascistic supporters. Let's see them square this circle.

NDPP

Ukraine Marks 'Dignity & Freedom Day' as Euromaidan Dream Fades

https://youtu.be/9GL67K-GmRw

Three years after Maidan protests which resulted in riots, over a hundred deaths and an ousted government, Ukraine is an impoverished country rife with corruption and far from its Euromaidan dreams.

NDPP

The British Government and the Waffen-SS Galitsia Division

https://t.co/wPaFza2IPU

As then, so now. Canada has also always had a soft spot for Ukro-nazis. Many came to Canada. "When the President of the Canadian Society of Veterans of the Waffen SS Galizien passed away earlier that year, the UCC claimed 'he will be remembered as a hero of Ukraine who fought for her independence."

UCC on Old Nazis

https://twitter.com/veravanhorne/status/585956481377378304

UCC on New Nazis

http://www.atlanticcouncil.org/news/press-releases/atlantic-council-and-...

 

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Ukrainian nationalist leader: “ISIS is our ally in the struggle against Russia”

Quote:
A Ukrainian nationalist, leader of the “Brotherhood,” Dmitry Korchinsky proposed to offer asylum to ISIS terrorists in Kiev, the former head of UNA-UNSO [Ukrainian National Assembly – Ukrainian People’s Self-defense] wrote on his social network page. According to Korchinsky, SSU (Security Service of Ukraine) must see ISIS as “allies in the struggle with Russia.”

The enemy of our "enemy" is our friend.

Quote:
Why should Ukraine worry about the revolution of the poor in the Islamic World? Why should we pick a side of the barricades? At the moment, the oppressed peoples of the former Soviet Empire, and the proletarian peoples of the Near and Middle East are our only viable allies in the war against Moscow imperialism..

Moscow imperialism! I'm only a little surprised he didn't call it "Soviet Social Imperialism".

NDPP

'Poroshenko Fuels War & Corruption With IMF Money' - Fugitive MP to RT (and vid)

http://rt.com/news/369295-poroshenko-ukraine-war-corruption

"Onishchenko, who said he was a key figure in the complex scheme for two years, vowed to show western sponsors of the Ukrainian government where their money is actually going. He told RT that most IMF aid money is being used by President Poroshenko and his accomplices to fuel the ongoing civil conflict in the east of Ukraine.

'Most of the money, they use for war..."

Canada has given hundreds of millions to Ukraine. Think any Canadian MP will even ask the question? I don't.

iyraste1313

Ukrainian nationalist leader: “ISIS is our ally in the struggle against Russia”

Yes my beloved Kherson...near Odessa, apparently now ringed with military camps in training with ISIS fighters, just a short trip from the Crimea border

NDPP

Israel Shocked As Revered Rabbi's Grave in Ukraine Desecrated With Pig Head, Fake Blood

http://rt.com/news/371121-ukraine-rabbi-grave-desecrated

"The grave of Rabbi Nachman of Breslov was defaced by red paint and a pig head with a swastika carved in it, while some pilgrims were reportedly attacked with 'tear gas'."

 

Ultra Nationalists Attack Jewish Pilgrims at Uman, Ukraine

http://newcoldwar.org/ultra-nationalists-attack-jewish-pilgrims-at-uman-...

" Kirshboim said the current mayor of Uman was 'appointed' by members of the nationalist Svoboda party following the revolution in Ukraine. 'There is a crazy state of anarchy here,' he said. The right wing activists were seeking to harass the Hassids in order to gain political points among the local public, Kirshboim asserted. 'Whoever harasses the Hassidim more has a better chance of winning the elections in October,' he said.

Ukrainian nationalists destroyed a tent city created by Hassidic Jews in Uman ahead of the annual Rosh Hashanah pilgrimage."

 

6079_Smith_W

NDPP wrote:

Israel Shocked As Revered Rabbi's Grave in Ukraine Desecrated With Pig Head, Fake Blood

http://rt.com/news/371121-ukraine-rabbi-grave-desecrated

"The grave of Rabbi Nachman of Breslov was defaced by red paint and a pig head with a swastika carved in it, while some pilgrims were reportedly attacked with 'tear gas'."

Really bad news, and the comments on the article are just as bad.

According to one article it was two "skinheads". The Jerusalem Post article points out the Ukrainian Prime Minister  Groysman is visiting Israel next week.

http://www.jpost.com/Diaspora/Rabbi-Nachmans-grave-desecrated-with-pigs-...

Some background for those who are not familiar with Reb Nachman, and the site, which was almost destroyed in the late 70s, and rarely visited because people were not allowed access.

http://www.ucsj.org/2016/11/01/how-rabbi-nahmans-grave-in-uman-was-saved...

NDPP

NATO Ramps Up Ukraine War After Defeat in Syria

http://sptnkne.ws/dbTb

"A surge in military attacks this week by NATO-backed Kiev regime forces on the breakaway eastern Ukraine region is no mere coincidence. It is the reaction to events in Syria by the US-led military alliance in its hybrid warfare against Russia."

nicky

What the Putin propagandists will not tell you is that the far right parties polled less in Ukraine than in any other European country.
Certainly much less than what the proto- fascist Putin polled in Russia, assuming you believe the manipulated election results.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

nicky wrote:

What the Putin propagandists will not tell you is that the far right parties polled less in Ukraine than in any other European country. Certainly much less than what the proto- fascist Putin polled in Russia, assuming you believe the manipulated election results.

What the NATO sycophants will not do is define the terms they use for their broad brushed smears of anyone standing in the way of Pax Americana. The far right in Ukraine politics is that only one party and the rest are peace loving social democrats? Proto-fascist Is that a real term or one that you have gotten from a fake news site? 

 

sherpa-finn

C'mon Krop, you are starting to sound like Babble's very own grumpy old man. "Hey, you kids GET OFF MY LAWN!" 

Proto-fascist is a perfectly acceptable term. Geez, it even has its own wiki page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-fascism

From the Greek word proto, - that which comes before. The prescursor. The antecedent.

And here is an article from a respectable journal posing the age old question: Is Donald Trump leading a proto-fascist movement?

"... I also think it's fair to call Trumpism a proto-fascist movement, not in line with Hitler, but with the likes of Benito Mussolini, who was at the forefront of European fascism. Before the Nazis, he was regarded as a somewhat clownish dictator with an unusual degree of mass support. He was a racist, authoritarian warmonger, but nowhere close to the genocidal maniac that Hitler was."

http://theweek.com/articles/574097/donald-trump-leading-protofascist-mov...

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Thanks Sherpa so this term applies to Trump and Putin. Would it have applied to Hillary?

So Sherpa is it only you that gets to poke fun at peoples posts?  Since it is only non-NATO cheerleaders' posts that you like to zero in on, maybe you can answer a question I have about making money on the internet.  How well does trolling on behalf of a foreign government pay?  Is there a site on line you can go to to get employed or should I just phone random NATO embassies and ask who's hiring?

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

It's a deflection, in any case, kropotkin. The Kiev regime is, well, impossible to defend so the only thing left is to say, "Hey! Look over there! Vlad is bad!" etc. The main point is to get you off discussing the rather obviously odious Kiev regime and its latest atrocities.

Did anyone else notice how Kiev ramped up their bombing campaign of civilians in Donetsk (and probably Lugansk as well) when things were getting very bad for the Western-backed jihadists in Aleppo?

Funny how that is.

 

6079_Smith_W

ikosmos wrote:

The Kiev regime is, well, impossible to defend

Well I don't know about impossible, but it is pointless in this room.

NDPP

Exiled Ukraine Parliament Member: I Witnessed Presidential Corruption

http://time.com/4616802/ukraine-corruption-president-poroshenko/

"The time has come for the rest of the world to call for reform instead of turning a blind eye to these crimes and atrocities."

'

 

NYT Admits Yanukovich Was Right Not to Sign EU Deal

https://www.rt.com/op-edge/371934-ukraine-eu-yanukovich-nyt/

"Three years after the event the establishment media is finally issuing mea culpas for its self-interested support of 'Euromaidan', the Western-backed 'regime change' crusade which destroyed Ukraine."

 

'This is the best government Ukraine has had in its entire history." - Chrystia Freeland, Minister of International Trade 

6079_Smith_W

Well if you want another look at the same situation that isn't through a toilet paper tube:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2016/10/14/how-corruption-corrodes...

 

sherpa-finn

6079_Smith_W wrote:

Well if you want another look at the same situation that isn't through a toilet paper tube:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2016/10/14/how-corruption-corrodes...

"Ukraine is 130th out of 168 countries ranked by Transparency International’s Corruption Perception Index 2015."  That is pretty grim and a huge indictment of EU / US / IMF complicity with the current regime.

But gracious, - Russia is ranked 119th on the very same scale? Pretty daunting. You have to pity the poor Russian citizens trying to make ends meet while dealing with that level of state and corporate corruption. Meanwhile their President is gallivanting about the world sending troops to foreign lands and generally meddling in the affairs of others.  Kind of mis-placed priorities one would have thought.

But Russians can look on the bright side: when it comes to corruption they did tie Sierra Leone (#119), and were a spot ahead of Gambia and Guatemala.  So something to be proud of, to be sure. 

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

The excellent thing about Russian corruption is that all the spoils seem to go to Czar Putin, who is now estimated to be one of the richest men in the world because of it.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Right. Because Forbes Magazine says so.

6079_Smith_W

No, but it does take a bit of a wider look at the situation like the effect of the war, the motives of the various parties, and that the most attractive alternative for Ukrainians at this point isn't moving backwards to where they were with Yanukovich.

And I agree about the complicity to a point, sherpa-finn. No one is in full control of that situation, and parties have to work with what is there, and what the people choose.

Also, it is worth noting that as arbitrary as that measure probably is, the country has been moving slowly upwards, not down.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

sherpa-finn

montrealer58 wrote: The excellent thing about Russian corruption is that all the spoils seem to go to Czar Putin, who is now estimated to be one of the richest men in the world because of it.

ikosmos replied: Right. Because Forbes Magazine says so.

Well, no. Forbes limits their lists of the world's richest to business people and "excludes members of royal families and dictators who derive their fortunes entirely as a result of their position of power.”  So Vlad seems to be safe from the Forbes list.

http://www.newsweek.com/why-putin-isnt-forbes-billionaires-list-310818

But there is always: 

The Washington Post: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2015/02/20/is-vladimir...

and the BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06z9584

Of course, these are western sources so presumably in the clutches of the CIA.  Perhaps we could cite some Russian-based investigative journalism?

Oops, my bad. It appears that Russia sits at #179 out of 202 countries in terms of press freedom. (For context, that is several places BEHIND Somalia!) What does the latest country report say on freedom of the press in Russia?   

"Although the Russian constitution provides for freedoms of speech and of the press, government officials frequently use the country’s politicized and corrupt court system to harass the few journalists and bloggers who expose abuses by authorities. Russian law has a broad definition of extremism that officials invoke to silence government critics. Enforcement of this and other restrictive legal provisions has encouraged self-censorship. ... Prosecutors in 2015 continued their practice of charging individuals—including journalists, bloggers, and in one case a librarian—with defamation, extremism, and other criminal offenses designed to limit free speech. In January, jailed journalist and blogger Sergey Reznik, who had written articles on alleged corruption and abuses by officials in Rostov-on-Don, received a three-year prison sentence on new charges of insulting and misleading authorities; his earlier 18-month prison term on similar charges would have expired in May."

Damn that's awkward. https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-world/2016/russia

What to do? Hey, surely ikosmos won't quibble if I cite one of his own favoured "news" sites - Sputnik International. Because in an SI article last year, shortly after the release of the Panama Papers, they acknowledged that "The latest figure provided in the Panama leaks places Putin's wealth at no less than $2 billion." 

They also acknowledged that much higher figures (ranging from $40 - $200 billion in personal wealth) have been cited by Putin's business confidants with regards to his ownership shares in major oil and gas companies. Remarkably, they also repeat Putin's ill-advised claim in 2008 that he is indeed "the wealthiest man not just in Europe but in the whole world"!

 So, I am presuming that we can take THAT to the bank.  No wonder Putin gets on so well with Donald Trump. Birds of a feather....

https://sputniknews.com/politics/201604051037523060-putin-personal-wealth/

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

sherpa-finn wrote:
What to do? Hey, surely ikosmos won't quibble if I cite one of his own favoured "news" sites - Sputnik International. Because in an SI article last year, shortly after the release of the Panama Papers, they acknowledged that "The latest figure provided in the Panama leaks places Putin's wealth at no less than $2 billion." 

They also acknowledged that much higher figures (ranging from $40 - $200 billion in personal wealth) have been cited by Putin's business confidants with regards to his ownership shares in major oil and gas companies. Remarkably, they also repeat Putin's ill-advised claim in 2008 that he is indeed "the wealthiest man not just in Europe but in the whole world"!

 So, I am presuming that we can take THAT to the bank.  No wonder Putin gets on so well with Donald Trump. Birds of a feather....

aha ha ha ha. Did you think I just fell off a turnip truck? That was a satirical article you rocket scientist, you. bwa ha ha ha.

Quote:
On a more serious note, Vladimir Putin's income is open to the public. According to documents published by the Kremlin in April 2015, Putin's annual income in 2014 amounted to 7,654,042 rubles (approximately $150,000). The Russian president also owns a 77-square-meter apartment, plot of land, a garage and four cars.

For comparison: US President Barack Obama is making $400,000 a year, while German Chancellor Angela Merkel's salary is said to be approximately $230,000.

Read more: https://sputniknews.com/politics/201604051037523060-putin-personal-wealth/

C'mon, get serious. These other sources openly publish pieces comparing the Russian President to Hitler. The US President, from the rostrum of the UNGA, within the last calendar year, openly compared Russia, generally, with the Ebola virus and ISIS terrorists. Not in that order. The barbarous US regime, and its obsequious satellites in the UK, Canada, etc., and their pliant MSM, are no more reliable than Joseph Goebbels in 1935.

 

NDPP

'Ukraine Today' Shuts Down After Oligarch Sponsor Kolomoisky Loses Assets To Kiev Regime

http://theduran.com/ukraine-today-shuts-oligarch-sponsor-kolomoisky-lose...

"Ukrainian Oligarch Igor Kolomoisky's 'Ukraine Today' closes it's doors for good after a quick 2-year stint working as an anti-Russian propaganda channel. Taking PrivatBank out of Kolomoisky's control deprives Kolomoisky of a bank he has used as a cash cow to finance his various activities [like funding Nazi terror-gangs and fighters] and which he might have used to finance his position in the oligarchic feuding, which in Ukraine passes for politics."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Retired Winnipeg Professor Alex Basilevsky has a new book on Ukrainian history. He says in advance that it will "rile up" some in the hopelessly divided Ukrainian-Canadian community.

See "Author Expects New History Book to Stir Controversy"

6079_Smith_W

ikosmos wrote:

C'mon, get serious. These other sources openly publish pieces comparing the Russian President to Hitler. The US President, from the rostrum of the UNGA, within the last calendar year, openly compared Russia, generally, with the Ebola virus and ISIS terrorists. Not in that order. The barbarous US regime, and its obsequious satellites in the UK, Canada, etc., and their pliant MSM, are no more reliable than Joseph Goebbels in 1935.

So let me get this straight... you point out how ridiculous it is for media to compare Putin to the Nazis, and then you turn around and do exactly the same thing - compare the U.S. and Canada to the Nazis.

 

sherpa-finn

sherpa-finn wrote: surely ikosmos won't quibble if I cite one of his own favoured "news" sites - Sputnik International

ikosmos responded:  aha ha ha ha. Did you think I just fell off a turnip truck? That was a satirical article you rocket scientist, you. bwa ha ha ha.

So sad. 

As anyone knows, despite Russia’s long and distinguished tradition in satirical writing,  political satire is effectively verboten under Vlad.  And to suggest that an official news agency like Sputnik International ("Telling the Untold" is ther motto!) would consciously mock The Impaler, well THAT’s sooo not going to happen!

The last folks who tried that stunt (google Kukly puppets) are probably out in some frosty field digging up the turnips ikosmos is so determined to deliver.

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/the-rise-and-risks-of-political-satire-in-putins-russia-a7022436.html

So, back to the topic at hand: Vlad’s billions in ill-gotten gains.  In the Sputnik International article cited, - they clearly state (dear reader, please note that this was done with no sarcasm or satire font):

a) "The latest figure provided in the Panama leaks places Putin's wealth at no less than $2 billion."

b) A higher figures (ranging from $40 - $200 billion in personal wealth) have been cited by Putin's business confidants with regards to his ownership shares in major oil and gas companies; and

c) In 2008, Putin claimed  to be "the wealthiest man not just in Europe but in the whole world"!

Leap back on that turnip truck, my friend. You have plenty more deliveries to make.  (Probably a good time to call the Mother Ship and ask for directions.) 

Is this where I append the ‘bwahaha’?

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

6079_Smith_W wrote:

ikosmos wrote:

C'mon, get serious. These other sources openly publish pieces comparing the Russian President to Hitler. The US President, from the rostrum of the UNGA, within the last calendar year, openly compared Russia, generally, with the Ebola virus and ISIS terrorists. Not in that order. The barbarous US regime, and its obsequious satellites in the UK, Canada, etc., and their pliant MSM, are no more reliable than Joseph Goebbels in 1935.

So let me get this straight... you point out how ridiculous it is for media to compare Putin to the Nazis, and then you turn around and do exactly the same thing - compare the U.S. and Canada to the Nazis.

6079 

No you didn't get it straight. I would think you need remedial comprehension in reading training but that would imply that you don't post disingenuous shit purposely.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

sherpa-finn wrote:

c) In 2008, Putin claimed  to be "the wealthiest man not just in Europe but in the whole world"!

Here is the full quote from the article that twice in this thread you have misquoted and tried to make it say the opposite of what it says.

A lying liar is what you are my friend. You are not debating you are deliberately spreading misinformation. So who pays you to come on this site and spread disinformation and lies? 

I think Putin is in competition with me for the wealthiest person on the planet.  I have the love of my family and friends and that is the greatest wealth of all.

Quote:

"I am the wealthiest man not just in Europe but in the whole world. I collect emotions, I am wealthy in that the people of Russia have twice entrusted me with the leadership of a great nation such as Russia – I believe that is my greatest wealth," Bloomberg View quoted Putin as saying.

Read more: https://sputniknews.com/politics/201604051037523060-putin-personal-wealth/

 

 

sherpa-finn

Kropotkin wrote: Here is the full quote from the article that twice in this thread you have misquoted and tried to make it say the opposite of what it says.  A lying liar is what you are my friend. 

Oh, Krop you are a better man than this. You should not feel compelled to defend the foolish posts of the usual suspects around here just because they are so determinedly anti-American and enamored of a corporatist kleptocracy. At our age we should not be fooled into believeing that the enemies of our enemies are necessarily our friends. Particularly when they are sitting imperiously on the turnip wagon, shouting inanities at the rest of us. 

Oh, - and on my posts and quotes, - you are 100% wrong on both counts.

1. I did not misquote. I very carefully and accurately quoted - that's what those funny little "apostrophes" mean.  What I did was 'selectively quote', extracting clauses from larger statements.

2. I did not lie.  I simply cited and quoted (selectively) from the Sputnik International article in a manner that would lead the reader to conclude something that was likely quite different from the aithor's intent.

But there was no misquoting and no lying.

FWIW, this is a standard tool of the type of misinformation widely used by the media sources that our resident Putin boosters link to so regularly. So this was my little Christmas present back to them ... a taste of being hoisted on their own petard.

It appears that ikosmos was so shocked by my humble efforts that in desperation he lamely suggested that the Sputnik article must have been a satire. Not likely.  

Indeed,  I recall reading somewhere here that he probably needed to call back to the mother ship for instructions once it had been pointed out to him that an official Russian media source had openly acknowledged reports of Putin's ill-gotten gains, and cited figures between $40 - 200 billion.  

Anyhow, thanks for the fun.  My own sense is that those who dish it out really should be better able to take it when there is return fire. To be honest, it was kinda like shooting fish in a barrel. 

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Sherpa keep the condescending pap to yourself. I am merely tired of the ongoing campaign to silence any opposition to the current propaganda war that says it is the Russians who are the evil empire and the US is merely doing what they do for the good of us all. You preach that message very well and strangely you seem to attack the enemies of the US the most. There is no balance to your posts, you are a cheerleader for the real evil empire and in that role you want to silence any other viewpoint. 

Frankly I want to read sources that both people like Ikosmos and people like you post because all propaganda contains some grains of truth. If one only gets one side's propaganda, which is what you are trying to ensure, then one never gets the full nuances.  In this age almost all media outlets are propaganda machines so please stop saying your propagandists are better than other people's.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
I am merely tired of the ongoing campaign to silence any opposition to the current propaganda war that says it is the Russians who are the evil empire and the US is merely doing what they do for the good of us all.

There's a similar campaign here at babble to silence any opposition to the idea that the U.S. is the evil empire and Russia is merely doing what they do for the good of us all.  What say you to that?

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Quote:
I am merely tired of the ongoing campaign to silence any opposition to the current propaganda war that says it is the Russians who are the evil empire and the US is merely doing what they do for the good of us all.

There's a similar campaign here at babble to silence any opposition to the idea that the U.S. is the evil empire and Russia is merely doing what they do for the good of us all.  What say you to that?

I think that is typical of your stupid posts that are merely designed to provoke a fight or insult. I often read your posts and my first reaction is fuck off asshole but I almost always refrain from that because it is frowned upon. You post in nasty style and you hate socialism but you pretend to be progressive. What say you to that?

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
I think that is typical of your stupid posts that are merely designed to provoke a fight or insult.

You're bigger than that, aren't you?

Quote:
I often read your posts and my first reaction is fuck off asshole

OK, maybe not.

Quote:
but I almost always refrain from that because it is frowned upon

Do you feel like you passive-aggressively refrained this time?  I don't think you did.

Quote:
What say you to that?

#hoorahbecausefreedom

 

NDPP

Gorbachev's PM on Ukraine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rPA8b44ODE

"Kiev leaders are freaks,idiots - they've lost Donbas forever."

NDPP

McCain Visits Ukraine's Frontline Troops in Gesture Against Russia

http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2017/01/504333/McCain-visits-Ukraines-front...

"UN Senator John McCain spent New Year's Eve at a frontline outpost in eastern Ukraine, pledging continued support for Kiev in the face of Russian 'aggression'. The Arizona Republican, accompanied by fellow Senators Lindsey Graham and Amy Klobuchar, met with Ukrainian soldiers Saturday in the village of Shyrokine, one of the towns worst hit in the ongoing conflict.

'In 2017, we will defeat the invaders and send them back where they came from. And I would like to tell Putin that he will never be able to deprive Ukrainians of freedom and independence,' the senator said.

Trump's election has caused panic in Ukraine that the New York businessman might drastically reduce aid to the country and shift loyalty to Russia. Kiev has repeatedly requested from Washington more advanced weaponry. The senators have been visiting countries bordering on Russia, namely NATO members Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania, as well as Ukraine and Georgia."

 

Over 300 People Murdered By Poroshenko Nazi Ukraine Regime

http://novorossia.today/155734-2/

 

'Blind Mice' OSCE Scatter Away As Ukraine Junta Bombs Debaltsevo

http://novorossia.today/155541-2/

"Representatives of the OSCE Special Monitoring Mission (SMM), which has long been dubbed 'blind observers' in Donbass, chose to evacuate away from the hotspot in the area of Debaltsevo..."

NDPP

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NDPP

Ukraine Honors Nationalist Whose Troops Killed 50,000 Jews

http://www.timesofisrael.com/ukraine-honors-nationalist-whose-troops-kil...

"Once regarded by Ukrainian authorities as illegitimate to serve as national role models because of their war crimes against Jews and Poles, Petliura, Bandera and Shukhevych are now openly honored in Ukraine following a revolution spearheaded by nationalists in 2014..."

 

 

josh

Brazilian police have unveiled a plot led by a Ukrainian armed movement to recruit Brazilian neo-Nazis with combat experience to fight pro-Russian rebels in the European country's civil war. 

 

http://forward.com/news/breaking-news/359770/brazilian-neo-nazis-head-to-ukraine-to-fight-in-civil-war/?attribution=articles-article-listing-1-headline

 

NDPP

'Immoral & Uncivilized': Ukrainian Jewish Community Slams Move to Rehabilitate Nationalist Fighters

https://www.rt.com/news/373520-ukraine-nationalists-rehabilitation-draft/

"The head of Ukraine's Jewish Committee has learned of a draft bill that might see fighters from Ukrainian nationalist groups [Nazis] rehabilitated. 'As it relates to people who committed mass murders ,he believes the move goes against fundamental European values. 

The Ukrainian Institute of National Memory plans to legally rehabilitate members of several nationalist movements, including those from the Organization of Ukraine Nationalists (OUN) and the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA), the head of the Ukraine's Jewish Committee, Eduard Dolinsky, wrote on his Facebook page..."

6079_Smith_W

Here's article on the Institute, and what they are really doing:

Quote:

Good history is perfectly possible in Ukraine, but only if the two extremes are avoided and historians are willing to be subjected to vicious criticism from both sides.

“Have you ever been attacked by the nationalist right?” I ask Viatrovych.

“Of course,” he says, smiling. “The neo-Soviets call me a nationalist, while the nationalists accuse me of being a liberal. I know I must be doing something right.”

...

Viatrovych’s demonization by both the left and the right may be a testament to the fact that both extremes are losing influence and know it—and, as a result, are fighting rear-guard actions to hold on to their power.

https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/ukraine/2016-08-04/national-memo...

As for your RT  piece, as it says in the article, and on Dolinsky's facebook page, he is concerned about what the proposed legislation might open the door to. Fair enough. Nice of RT to run it with a completely unrelated photo of a torchlight rally.

On that, it is worth pointing out what Dolinsky himself had to say about that kind of propaganda, and about Russia's invasion of Ukraine:

Quote:

However, the President of the Ukrainian Jewish Committee Eduard Dolinsky said that the community did “not feel any specific threat at this moment. And we can solve any issues inside our country in dialogue with all political forces peacefully.”

“We are very skeptical of Mr. Putin’s assertion that he is coming to fight fascism and anti-Semitism” in Ukraine, he added.

“It’s ridiculous. We don’t need protection from fascists," said Dolinsky. "We were shocked when he used this as an excuse for the invasion. This is absolutely unacceptable.”

Crimeans will head to the polls on Sunday to vote in a referendum to decide if they want their autonomous republic to break away from Ukraine and join Russia, but Dolinsky questioned the validity of any result.

“This is a pure military invasion, which breaks all the rules,” he said. “Any vote with guns pointed at people cannot be fair.”

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ukraine-crisis/putins-anti-semitic-clai...

 

NDPP

What To Expect From Biden's Swansong Visit To Ukraine

http://sptnkne.ws/opRz

"Petro, you're not getting your billion dollars,' Biden quipped, recounting his conversation with the Ukrainian president in The Atlantic. 'It's OK, you can keep the [Prosecutor] general. Just understand - we're not paying you if you do,' he added.

'Biden,' Loginov noted, 'curated US policy on Ukraine during Obama's tenure. Kiev is feeling stressed that in the new administration there will be a gap in lobbying for Ukrainian interests."

The Ukro-nationalist diaspora will work hard to remedy this gap to the Banderite regime and their agent Canada's new foreign minister Chrystia Freeland will most certainly assist in this.

NDPP

Moscow Says Response to Human Rights Violations in Ukraine Need To Be Tougher

http://tass.com/politics/927445

"Violence in Ukraine persists, unfortunately. Neo-Nazi sentiment is recorded and extremist acts continue..."

NDPP

Russian Foreign Ministry Statement on the Rapidly Deteriorating Situation in Donbass

https://www.newcoldwar.org/russian-foreign-ministry-statement-on-the-rap...

"The situation in Donbass has deteriorated sharply in recent days. Ukrainian troops continue to conduct offensive operations to seize positions held by self-defense forces, including in the suburbs of Donetsk. Heavy weapons, including heavy artillery and multiple launch rocket-systems are being actively used to shell residential areas.

Strangely enough, every escalation of the situation in Donbass, comes at a time when the Ukrainian leadership is away on a foreign trip. Clearly, this is an attempt to keep the crisis provoked by Kiev on the international agenda..."

 

German Newspaper Reports German Govt Believes Kyiv is Guilty of Exacerbating Situation in Donbass

https://www.newcoldwar.org/german-newspaper-reports-german-govt-believes...

"...The newspaper notes that German government circles beleive that Kyiv is deliberately trying to increase tensions in the hope that an escalation of the conflict will help derail any plans by US President Donald Trump to mitigate anti-Russian actions.

'In Berlin, they understand that Petro Poroshenko would do anything to prevent the lifting of sanctions against Russia,' the author writes. Considering the risk, Berlin is asking itself if it is possible to dissuade Ukraine from provocations. It doesn't yet have an answer."

 

Canada 'Looking At All Options' For Improving Support to UKraine, Sajjan Says

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-ukraine-sajjan-troops-1.3962210

"Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan says the federal government is concerned about a new outbreak of fighting in Ukraine and is looking at ways to 'improve' Canada's military support of the country. 'I'm looking at the options right now in terms of how we can improve our support, what changes that we need to make,'Sajjan said Wednesday.

'But one thing is for sure, that Canada remains committed to Ukraine."

NDPP

Ukraine: Coup Government Tries to Sabotage US-Russia Rapprochment

https://t.co/FWiLrDD1YL

 

Woman Killed by UAF Shelling in Makeevka Went Out From Her House To Get Coal (and vid)

http://novorossia.today/killed-woman-by-the-shelling-of-uaf-in-makeevka-...

See what you support Canada. You and your Banderite Foreign Minister CF,  John McCain et al...

6079_Smith_W

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ukraine-russia-fighting-avdiivka-1.3962203

Quote:

After two years of relative calm, Ukraine's war with Russian-backed rebels took a deadly and destructive turn this week, pushing one town in the country's eastern region to the brink of a humanitarian catastrophe.

Intense shelling has left Avdiivka, a community of 20,000 people located just north of Donetsk, without electricity, heat or water during a particularly frigid cold spell that's seen temperatures drop to -22 C at night.

kropotkin1951 kropotkin1951's picture

CBC is a biased news site. Here is what an unbiased report reads like. But then one "news" service has reporters on the ground while the other reports based on Ukrainian government news releases.

Quote:

Fighting between Ukrainian troops and pro-Russia rebels in eastern Ukraine has escalated, with at least 13 civilians and fighters on both sides killed in the worst outbreak of violence in several weeks.

The warring sides were locked in heavy battles for a third day on Tuesday at the government-held town of Avdiivka, accusing each other of launching attacks and firing heavy artillery in violation of a two-year truce agreement.

The fighting damaged infrastructure and left thousands without water and electricity amid freezing conditions, with temperatures plunging to -20C at night.

As a result, authorities in the industrial town, in the region of Donbass, also known as Donetsk, declared a state of emergency. 

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/01/ukraine-fighting-flares-eastern-to...

 

6079_Smith_W

Actually the aljazeera reporter filed that piece from Moscow. It is in the story. They use Agence France-Presse, and if you look at the microphone it is a Ukrainian TV station. Not clear where the Donetsk footage is from.

The CBC reporter is in Ukraine. If you do a search on him you'll see that he regularly reports from the front line. He doesn't cite any other sources, so I doubt anyone else interviewed those people. In short, he was on the ground.

The photographer who was on the ground also does work for BBC.

But it is always good to have as many sources as possible to get a well-rounded picture of what is going on. Thanks for posting.

 

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