Venezuela: the party is over!

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NDPP

What you think is one thing published corroboration is a better thing. 

NDPP

Venezuelan Crisis: Former UN Rapporteur Says US Sanctions Are Killing Citizens

https://t.co/u4QPYs4IOL

"The first UN rapporteur to visit Venezuela for 21 years has told The Independent the US sanctions on the country are illegal and could amount to 'crimes against humanity' under international law..."

Canada supports.

WWWTT

NDPP wrote:

What you think is one thing published corroboration is a better thing. 

Sorry comrade I don’t understand this comment?

NDPP

Would still like to see a more complete published breakdown of governments for and against the Maduro government. If anyone finds a list, please post. This will do for now:

Country Recognition of Venezuela as of Today:

https://twitter.com/StratSentinel/status/1089676935427444742

"Blue supports Guaido. Red supports Maduro."

The fact that the governments supporting Guaido may not reflect the sentiments of their citizens should give pause to reflect upon that disturbing reality. 

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

A failed coup in Venezuela

The fulcrum of geopolitical tension sits on Caracas, the capital of Venezuela. An attempted coup on January 23 has failed. The U.S. decided to recognise a member of the Opposition, Juan Guaidó, as the President of Venezuela. U.S. officials called upon the military to rise up against the government of President Nicolás Maduro. This was against the charters of the United Nations and of the Organisation of American States (OAS). None of that mattered. The drumbeats sounded from Washington to Caracas. There was a minor drum playing from many Latin American capitals, those whose governments had joined the Lima Group — set up in Peru in 2017 to overthrow the government of Venezuela.

There is little respite for the country, where tension sits heavily from one end to another. Thus far, the government of Mr. Maduro remains in power, and the military has pledged its fealty to the re-elected president. It is unlikely that the Venezuelan Opposition — controlled by the old oligarchy — will be able to engineer a coup from within the country. It tried such a political manoeuvre in 2002, which failed. This time it has failed again.

quote:

Steeped in trouble

Venezuela is in trouble. No one doubts that. Oil prices have fallen to half of what they were at the highpoint of Chávez’s government. Since the treasury of Venezuela is almost entirely replenished by the incomes from oil sales, the collapse of oil prices means the collapse of Venezuela’s public finances. Unable to borrow easily, the country faces serious economic difficulties. Sanctions by the U.S. and the seizure of refining sites in the Caribbean put the country into a situation of great crisis. No wonder that people are leaving the country, fleeing their homeland as it is suffocated for political purposes by the U.S. and its Latin American allies in the Lima Group.

quote:

The isolation of Venezuela is remarkable. Not long ago, the country was the heartbeat of the leftist assertion in the hemisphere. Now, with the emergence of right-of-centre governments in Latin America and with an explosive energy for regime change in Washington, matters are more complex. Mr. Arreaza said that Mr. Maduro had invited the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Michelle Bachelet, to visit Venezuela. She has not yet come. Mr. Maduro, he said, wanted the UN to host a dialogue with the Opposition to restore some balance to the politics in the country. No such assistance has been provided. A hand is outstretched from Caracas, Mr. Arreaza said. It is waiting for someone to take hold of it.

 

 

montgomery

NDPP said:

Quote:
"Blue supports Guaido. Red supports Maduro."

Which should read: Blue has accepted US demonizing propaganda. Red doesn't.

Then eqaulo says:

Quote:
Venezuela is in trouble. No one doubts that.

Which should read: Venezuela is int troube because of US interference in their affairs. The majority of Canadians don't understand that. 

And so this is lining up as the US's 41st. war of aggression since WW2. And every single one of the other 40 were for the same basic reason. Some may know it as the 'dominoes tumbling'. 

JKR

Is Venezuela being prevented from selling their oil? 

NDPP

JKR wrote:

Is Venezuela being prevented from selling their oil? 

NDPP wrote:

Trump Sanctions Against Venezuela Have Decimated Oil Production

https://venezuelanalysis.com/video/14236

montgomery

NDPP wrote:

JKR wrote:

Is Venezuela being prevented from selling their oil? 

NDPP wrote:

Trump Sanctions Against Venezuela Have Decimated Oil Production

https://venezuelanalysis.com/video/14236

Well thanks for finding that link NDPP! It's saved me a lengthy explanation. Some people are really just totally out of touch with the truth about the US. 

I've been vocal about that since I started on this forum because I don't think a majority of NDP'ers are really aware of the facts. I say that because I expect the people who post on this board would and should be, but many aren't.

But I see value in this forum in that they can be re-educated on US/Canada/world politics and this board serves as the forum in which it can be discussed, as good as any.

I really do wish though that criticism of the Conservative fascists wouldn't be construed as support of the Liberals. In my opinion the NDP has already made that mistake and we don't need to keep making it.

josh

Unsurprisingly, U.S. administration puts sanctions on Venezuela state oil company.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/venezuela-sanctions-political-crisis

WWWTT

NDPP wrote:

Would still like to see a more complete published breakdown of governments for and against the Maduro government. If anyone finds a list, please post. This will do for now:

Country Recognition of Venezuela as of Today:

https://twitter.com/StratSentinel/status/1089676935427444742

"Blue supports Guaido. Red supports Maduro."

The fact that the governments supporting Guaido may not reflect the sentiments of their citizens should give pause to reflect upon that disturbing reality. 

No no no, that’s completely fucking wrong!

If a country has had some kind of diplomatic relations with Venezuela and recognition of Maduro as the president, then they still do unless they have clearly and distinctly say otherwise! Case in point is India. I know from my research that India was maintaining strong relations with Venezuela despite the US’s disappointed. India hasn’t said anything since this phoney coup so by default India still supports Maduro.

NDPP

As far as I know India has not yet recognized the American coup-leader. 

iyraste1313

Monday, January 28, 2019

by

Common Dreams

'This Is Very Dangerous': Trump Administration Seizes Venezuela Oil Assets, Renews Threat of Military Action If Maduro Stays...

this is very instructive, for any of us, engaged in attempts to build alternatives to the imperialist system, a sovereigntist self reliant society, with social organization in control

NDPP

More:

US Announces Sanctions Against The Venezuela State Oil Company PDVSA

https://on.rt.com/9n7u

"Washington has imposed sanctions againt the Venezuelan state oil company PDVSA, seizing $7 billion in assets, Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin said. Citgo will continue operating in the US, but all profits from its sales will have to go into a blocked account, which will only be made available to Guaido's government..."

"The levels of liberal cowardice on Venezuela:

https://twitter.com/EternalBusboy/status/1088781827932856320

1. - Ro Khanna's barely lukewarm response

2.- AOC retweets Ro Khanna's barely lukewarm response

3.- Bernie burying a barely lukewarm response 3 tweets deep in a thread full of right wing propaganda."

"You back the coup, you back this. You sit on your hands and muse that the Bolivarian Revolution doesn't fit your purist vision of socialism, you back this! No centre ground here. Stand with Maduro or stand with US imperialism."

https://twitter.com/7815PWK/status/1090025662482694144

NDPP

Sanctions Are Wars Against People

https://t.co/9yTe9y6pAL

"A former UN rapporteur says that the numerous US sanctions against Venezuela are devastating and illegal. 'Economic warfare practised by the US, EU and Canada are significant factors in the economic crisis. Sanctions kill..."

 

"So US sanctions carrying a $6 billion hit in one year to a country while it is only able to import $11.7 billion in goods is a huge deal, but the usual creeps look for ways to dismiss it."

https://twitter.com/rosendo_joe/status/1088988797147271174

WWWTT

Not crazy about some of these news outlets but I need them to make some points. I suspect Iran and Russia are going to get very militarily involved in Venezuela! I wouldn’t be surprised if Turkey joins in as well? But speculation at this point. 

https://www.newsweek.com/russia-iran-warn-us-venezuela-crisis-1308109

I’m thinking that the election of a right wing neo conservative in Brazil has emboldened the US to pull this shit! And China Russia and Iran desperately do not want to lose their strong ally in South America. 

Its also possible that India South Africa Syria and possibly another dozen African Asian countries don’t like hearing the US Canada and a few other western countries just all of a sudden unilaterally declare that someone else is now the president of a country because they don’t like the leadership!  

After all, if the US is allowed to get away with this, then who’s next? And I guarantee everyone here at babble, if the US gets their way with Venezuela, there will be another country in a couple years facing this kind of coup, if not multiple!

montgomery

WWWTT wrote:

Not crazy about some of these news outlets but I need them to make some points. I suspect Iran and Russia are going to get very militarily involved in Venezuela! I wouldn’t be surprised if Turkey joins in as well? But speculation at this point. 

https://www.newsweek.com/russia-iran-warn-us-venezuela-crisis-1308109 

------------------------------------------------------------------------

We might disagree on some issues but you nailed it on this one! However, I dare not hope for you  being right because if you're not, the disappointment will be too hard to handle. Russia and China definitely were the reason why the US didn't get their war on Syria for sure. There is once again resistance to US aggression. Is it too early for Russia and China to assert their power and influence in Venezuela? 

Quote:
I’m thinking that the election of a right wing neo conservative in Brazil has emboldened the US to pull this shit! And China Russia and Iran desperately do not want to lose their strong ally in South America.

It's always possible but but the US gaining control over Venezuela has been planned ever since Hugo came to power, and almost positively even before. 

Quote:
Its also possible that India South Africa Syria and possibly another dozen African Asian countries don’t like hearing the US Canada and a few other western countries just all of a sudden unilaterally declare that someone else is now the president of a country because they don’t like the leadership!

I think you're really talking about the rise of the BRICS as the force to counter US aggression and the planned conquest of the entire globe. There was a window of opportunity for the US to accomplish their PNAC agenda but they didn't get it done in time and now Russia and China have slammed that window shut! 

Quote:
After all, if the US is allowed to get away with this, then who’s next? And I guarantee everyone here at babble, if the US gets their way with Venezuela, there will be another country in a couple years facing this kind of coup, if not multiple!

Clearly the only hope for the world is in China and Russia with their nuclear threats of MAD. That is the only language that the US understands and the only factor that can stop them. Indeed, MAD has saved us from WW3 for nearly 75 years. And it's not because the Russian were coming, the Russian never were! 

NDPP

Trudeau Pushes Trump's Regime Change in Venezuela

https://youtu.be/RCq3tMtCrSI

"Why is Canada violating the UN Charter and leading the way for regime change in Venezuela? Paul Jay and Yves Engler join Sharmini Peries."

The Ugly Canadian...

iyraste1313

OAS Interventionist Resolution Against Venezuela Defeated

A total of 18 countries rejected the interventionist statement proposed by Argentina at the OAS.

Published on TeleSURJan 25, 2019

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

UN Security Council Debates the Future of Venezuela

Excerpts of the UN Security Council's debate on whether countries should recognize opposition leader Juan Guaidó as the self-declared president of Venezuela exposed important geopolitical and ideological rifts among world leaders

..while the above is a 12.52 min video, the one below is 48.43 min.

UN Security Council meet over Venezuela crisis

UN Security Council is currently meeting on the crisis in Venezuela. The US is seeking the Council support in denouncing the government of Nicolas Maduro and recognise Venezuelan opposition leader Juan Guaido as the Interim President of the country. We now cross to the UN Security Council in New York.

montgomery

Here's another new method being used by the US to overthrow Venezuela's elected government.

https://www.rt.com/news/450049-us-gives-opposition-assets/?utm_source=br...

And a good reason for all countries to withdraw from trade relations with the US. 

But China is pushing back!

https://www.rt.com/news/450019-china-opposes-sanctions-venezuela-us/

NDPP

The Making of Juan Guaido

https://t.co/LufvHL6sV4

"How the US regime change laboratory created Venezuela's coup leader..."

montgomery

NDPP wrote:

The Making of Juan Guaido

https://t.co/LufvHL6sV4

"How the US regime change laboratory created Venezuela's coup leader..."

It's a good detailed link, at least the bit I read of it. But I wonder if it's true that most of us who don't have our heads up America's ass, already know the facts on US aggression. And we don't need to read all the details anymore. Not to mention that we don't have the time to do it.

I'm actually saying that those who still need convincing, and undoubtedly there are some NDP'ers on this forum who do, probably won't read that link. We have to come together on the common cause and then coerce those holdouts who are still slobbering over the US as Canada's ally, to take some baby steps toward seeing how they're so wrong. 

I think the best hope for Canada in the coming fight for world domination by the two sides is that Canada become a neutral. Supposing the US would allow that?

contrarianna

86% of Venezuelans Oppose Military Intervention, 81% Against US Sanctions, Local Polling Shows

The vast majority of Venezuelans oppose military intervention and US sanctions to try to remove President Nicolás Maduro from power, according to polling by the local firm Hinterlaces....

By Ben Norton

https://grayzoneproject.com/2019/01/29/venezuelans-oppose-intervention-u...

Meanwhile, a minor domestic tiff, summing up the Imperial Republicrat Thugocracy:

Pro-war liberal pundit Bill Maher endorsed the US-led coup in Venezuela with blatant neocolonial language: “This was the Monroe Doctrine! This is our backyard!” [with video]

By Ben Norton

....Maher made these comments in a January 25 interview with his self-declared “frenemy,” ultra-conservative pundit Ann Coulter, who strongly supports Donald Trump, advances the far-right “white genocide” conspiracy, and pals around with white nationalists.

In the interview, Maher advanced the Russiagate conspiracy that Trump “is working with a foreign adversary.” Maher insisted that the United States is effectively at war with Russia, claiming “we didn’t win” the Cold War; “it’s still Russia.” And the liberal pundit claimed that “the president is a traitor who is in their camp.”

As an example of this, Maher pointed to the ongoing coup in Venezuela, where the US and its right-wing allies are trying to overthrow the leftist government of President Nicolás Maduro and replace him with an unelected opposition leader, Juan Guaidó, who hopes to implement neoliberal capitalist policies and privatize the oil-rich country’s state assets.

https://grayzoneproject.com/2019/01/26/bill-maher-us-coup-venezuela-neoc...

 

WWWTT

Thanks for the rt link montgomery!

I suspect that Iran and Russia will get militarily involved with Venezuela security shortly. Very possible that Syria Turkey and South Africa will also send military support?

A serious advantage the US has is geography and I’m sure this has been a dilemma the Venezuela supporters are fully aware and know must be overcome. 

NDPP

Canada's new PM Ken Stone!

https://youtu.be/yS2Ex3pFz0k

"Chrystia Freeland, you're fired!"

NDPP

England Blocking $1.2 Bn in Venezuelan Gold

https://youtu.be/Uq4NRLl2EDM

Former UN Rapporteur Alfred de Zayas and ex UK MP George Galloway discuss.

Sean in Ottawa

WWWTT wrote:

Thanks for the rt link montgomery!

I suspect that Iran and Russia will get militarily involved with Venezuela security shortly. Very possible that Syria Turkey and South Africa will also send military support?

A serious advantage the US has is geography and I’m sure this has been a dilemma the Venezuela supporters are fully aware and know must be overcome. 

I don't see Iran doing this although their sympathies will be there along with their concerns.

I can't see how they would have the reach or even the interest high enough for the cost.

iyraste1313

Canada become a neutral. Supposing the US would allow that?

To think that we can make Canada a sovereign neutral country, by political means is of course absurd!
A grass roots movement, holistic, built on personal commitment to a sovereign non corporate society must be put into place first!

WWWTT

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

WWWTT wrote:

Thanks for the rt link montgomery!

I suspect that Iran and Russia will get militarily involved with Venezuela security shortly. Very possible that Syria Turkey and South Africa will also send military support?

A serious advantage the US has is geography and I’m sure this has been a dilemma the Venezuela supporters are fully aware and know must be overcome. 

I don't see Iran doing this although their sympathies will be there along with their concerns.

I can't see how they would have the reach or even the interest high enough for the cost.

You sure about that?

Check out this link and tell me what u think

https://theiranproject.com/blog/2019/01/06/iranian-warships-in-us-backyard-tehran-to-deploy-navy-to-western-atlantic-commander/

 

WWWTT

Here’s a follow up on NDPP’s link about Britain seizing Venezuela gold

https://www.breitbart.com/middle-east/2018/12/04/turkeys-erdogan-cover-venezuelas-necessities-including-mosque/

Apparently Venezuela has some gold mining Turkey is interested in! Maduro and Turkey struck a deal and the British are playing with fire on this one!

WWWTT
WWWTT

Here’s an interesting link I found that builds on a geographic divide from Asian allies that Venezuela must overcome 

https://thesaker.is/america-to-venezuela-your-money-and-your-life/

NDPP

I note from the comments that the West's Russian champion, the neoliberal fascist Alexey Navalny supports a coup by Guaido. No surprise given they are both Western proxies but the Russophobes and know-nothings who read the Guardian too much will be crushed.

https://mobile.twitter.com/navalny/status/1088142984519008256

laine lowe laine lowe's picture

NDPP wrote:

The Making of Juan Guaido

https://t.co/LufvHL6sV4

"How the US regime change laboratory created Venezuela's coup leader..."

That is an amazing read, NDPP. Notice that the mainstream media throughout the west and our neutered politicians never make any reference to who this character is or what the party he represents is about.  There is no interest in even checking out why this character is so supported by extreme right wing political leaders in Latin America and elsewhere. I knew nothing of him but I smelled something pretty fishy since I had been following Venezuela Analysis for awhile back when Hugo Chavez was still alive.

NDPP

Glad you liked it Laine. VA is good too.

iyraste1313

 

Venezuela’s Prosecutor General Tarek Saab stated on Tuesday that the court should start an investigation against Guaido following the recent violent clashes in the country and the blocking of Venezuelan assets abroad.

“We are asking the Supreme Court to introduce preventive measures, including a ban on leaving the country, a ban on alienation or pledge of movable and immovable assets and the blocking of [Guaido’s] bank accounts,” Saab said in a speech broadcast on Twitter.....Sputnick

NDPP

Mark Carney: The Canadian Crook Who Stole Venezuela's Gold on Orders From Bolton

https://on.rt.com/9n9p

Sean in Ottawa

WWWTT wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

WWWTT wrote:

Thanks for the rt link montgomery!

I suspect that Iran and Russia will get militarily involved with Venezuela security shortly. Very possible that Syria Turkey and South Africa will also send military support?

A serious advantage the US has is geography and I’m sure this has been a dilemma the Venezuela supporters are fully aware and know must be overcome. 

I don't see Iran doing this although their sympathies will be there along with their concerns.

I can't see how they would have the reach or even the interest high enough for the cost.

You sure about that?

Check out this link and tell me what u think

https://theiranproject.com/blog/2019/01/06/iranian-warships-in-us-backyard-tehran-to-deploy-navy-to-western-atlantic-commander/

 

I think it is either Iranian fantasy or bluster. It is designed to make the Americans consider how they feel about the US close to them. It is not a plan to become involved in anything other than recording a tour. These ships do not constitute a threat or a support to anyone.

The plan is to send a 2-3 warships to Venezuala. They will go and come back having done nothing but spit in the eye of the US. They will have other ships in the Atlantic as well. They are making a point by sailing there. This is not the same as becoming involved in any conflict or support.

Iran, as I said, does not indicate having the desire to extend any power to do more given other priorities. Having them tour around the Atlantic in international waters just to show they were there is not projecting real power - just a point about the US near Iran.

Sean in Ottawa

What would be interesting is if the Chinese also consider a tour to make the same point. The difference being that China actually realistically has enough reach to do something realistic there and has shown significant interest in making an international argument for non-intervention in internal affairs of other countries (regime change or sessession).

The Chinese have been extremely consistent about non-intervention of any kind for any reason by other countries. Its interest is obvious as it considers Taiwan, Tibet, Hong Kong etc to be internal affairs that others should not even comment on, nevermind become invovled in. China has taken predictable positions considering this with respect to independence movements in Spain and other countries where it has a significant interest only in the principle rather than the countries themselves.

People who are a little older may remember Canada speaking in a similar way during the height of international comment about Quebec independence. At that time Canada would often speak out to discourage the principle of other countries becoming involved in independence movements. I think if you scratch the surface, Canada still has a sensitivity that is more than average on this point.

NDPP

When is a Democracy Not a Democracy?

https://venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/14275

"When it's Venezuela and the US is pushing regime change..."

Sean in Ottawa

NDPP wrote:

When is a Democracy Not a Democracy?

https://venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/14275

"When it's Venezuela and the US is pushing regime change..."

Even a faulty vote from inside a country is better than a campaign from outside to overturn that vote.

Imperialists in Canada, the UK and the USA won't admit this.

NDPP

Especially if there was nothing 'faulty' about it.

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

NDPP wrote:

When is a Democracy Not a Democracy?

https://venezuelanalysis.com/analysis/14275

"When it's Venezuela and the US is pushing regime change..."

Or, as Phil Ochs put it:

"We own half the world

'O say can you see',

and the name for our profits is 'democracy',

So like it or not, you will have to be 'free'.

'Cause we're the cops of the world, boys,

We're the cops of the world. "

Sean in Ottawa

NDPP wrote:

Especially if there was nothing 'faulty' about it.

I am not judging this vote one way or the other - I am questioning the idea that any allegation of faults in a vote can ever justify intervention like this.

NDPP

Venezuela: Elections are Above International Standards for Scrutiny - Rabble.ca

Were the Elections in Venezuela Fair?

https://youtu.be/8C7WciF96Rk

iyraste1313

It is very questionable to call democratic process in Canada meeting international standards.

(Section 3 and 25)

And for a Government to run on one platform, then to reverse its course afterwards? Very questionable!
 

WWWTT

This needs repeating. 

The sanctions placed on Venezuela are illegal! They are only placed because the US and their servants don’t like the popular socialist government of Venezuela. 

If these sanctions were never in place, Venezuela would be a very different country right now 

montgomery

WWWTT wrote:

This needs repeating. 

The sanctions placed on Venezuela are illegal! They are only placed because the US and their servants don’t like the popular socialist government of Venezuela. 

If these sanctions were never in place, Venezuela would be a very different country right now 

This is encouraging, though even some of the old guard are still slobbering over the US as our friends and allies. Old habits are hard to break.

This may be the only board where the truth about the US can be told and people can get away with it. Telling the truth on any of the other ones, including the  MLW, will get you shown the door within two days. 

This needs to be mentioned in order for anybody not 'getting it' yet to hear it as a challenge. The sucking up to US imperialism has goine on long enough. Even some Americans are coming to their senses ahead of us. The commenters at antiwar.com are actually putting the boots to Raimondo now! That's somethin!

laine lowe laine lowe's picture

As if there were no questionable electoral shenanigans in the elections of Trump (Russian hacking and influence) and Bush Jr (hanging chaps). Some consider parliamentary democracy with first past the post voting to be undemocratic as well.

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