War in Syria 5

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NDPP

First Fallout of Trump's Decision to Withdraw From Syria

https://t.co/n6CJR5j9EL

"President Trump's strategic decision to withdraw US troops from Syria creates signfiicant fallout. Besides the presence of 4,000 to 5,000 US troops and contractors in northeast Syria there is also a contingent of 1,100 French troops and an unknown number of British forces. France for now says it wants to stay..."

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

The Bombings Will Continue: Phyllis Bennis Warns U.S. Military Role in Syria Is Not Actually Ending

quote:

PHYLLIS BENNIS:

I think that the notion of a military defeat of terrorism, we know this is—if we want to talk about fake news, that’s been the classic piece of fake news for the last number of years, in the so-called global war on terror. You cannot defeat terrorism, as Yazan said, militarily. Terrorism is a phenomenon that emerges out of social and economic and national and all kinds of crises, in all kinds of countries. And stopping it doesn’t mean playing whack-a-mole with your military, slapping them down here, and they rise up again there, and slapping them down there, and they rise again there. That’s precisely what will happen again.

It’s fascinating to hear these tweets from Trump claiming, on the one hand, we’ve defeated ISIS, and that’s why we’re coming out, at the same time saying, well, ISIS hasn’t been defeated, but we’re going to leave it to the people in whether it’s Syria, whether it’s Russia, whether it’s Iran; it’ll be their job to wipe them out. Where you look at the distinctions between what the various presidents have said is the reason for U.S. troops being in Syria in the first place: We’re there to go after ISIS. OK, except that the Pentagon says we’re there to protect our allies—in this case, it’s the Kurds, who, as Yazan says, will be quickly abandoned by the U.S. John Bolton, the national security adviser, says we’re in Syria to make sure that Iran doesn’t build up its presence there. And the State Department says that we have to stay there because ISIS is still there. So we don’t even know what was the rationale for U.S. troops to be in Syria. There certainly is no clarity on what any future rationale should be, because we know that terrorism cannot be destroyed militarily. And I think that’s the fundamental question here.

We do know that the warplanes and the drones are going to continue to be bombing in Syria. And it’s those U.S. bombs and U.S. coalition-led bombs that are creating enormous pressure, enormous—wreaking enormous havoc on the people of Syria—again, this is something that Yazan spoke about very eloquently—when we look at Raqqa, when we look at the other cities that have been largely destroyed by U.S. bombing, after being under attack, both people and the infrastructure of cities, by ISIS. This is not going to qualitatively change that on the ground. The presence of 2,000 U.S. troops, most of them Special Forces, that’s not enough to change a military balance of forces, when you’re talking about thousands of fighters from all these different countries, on all these different sides, fighting each other to the last Syrian.

The Syrians are doing the dying. It’s the militaries of the U.S. and Britain and Russia and Iran and the Saudis and Qataris and Turkey, all these countries in the region, the global powers have been fighting each other, in combination, in Syria since 2011. And I think, in that context, the withdrawal of any one of those major military forces is important as an advantage for the people of Syria, who will have one less force bombing them. Is it going to change the political dynamics on the ground? No.

Trump Pledges to Withdraw U.S. Ground Troops from Syria—But Global Powers & Deadly Air Forces Remain

quote:

YAZAN AL-SAADI: Well, Erdogan’s concerns, obviously, for the Turks—we need to understand a bit of history, because there’s a really long, dark history in terms of dealing with Kurdish rights and Kurdish representation. So, the PYD, as a force of—a Kurdish force that is militarily strong and growing due to the vacuum that happened over the years, this was a major security concern for the Turks. So the Turks started backing various rebel—Syrian rebel groups against the PYD. So these discussions are happening.

What I find interesting is that, today, the Iranian president is in Turkey, and they just had a press conference. So it seems like there might be more coordination, because the Iranians themselves aren’t really interested in Kurdish autonomy, because that might affect the Kurdish community there. Neither does Iraq want that. And neither does the Syrian government, in many ways.

So I think there is going to be a support of the Turks going in, to a degree. And there might be coordination in order to ensure that there isn’t going to be a spillover battle between the Turks and the Russians and everyone else. And I think the biggest victim will be the PYD, for many reasons.

YAZAN AL-SAADI: And ultimately—and I think this is a very key point—with all these like power games played by all these countries and leaders—revolting men, they are all—the biggest losers, obviously, are communities in Syria, whether they are Kurdish, Arab, Armenian or whatever, because the struggle for self-determination and actual freedom is really taking a pounding here. And it’s taking a pounding by all sides.

WWWTT

Thanks for the link epaulo13. Really painful reading how Amy Goodman is all disappointed Trump is pulling US troops out of Syria. 

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..that is not my take on goodman. so are you looking for a fight wwwtt? because i've been seeing that you are calling people names today.

WWWTT

Ya possibly epaulo? But I think it’s more like a good debate that I’m looking for, depends on your viewpoint I guess. 

I’ve always found Democracy Now to be misguided when it came to Syria and the Obama administration. 

As far as your comment about me calling people names? What are you referring to?

NDPP

First Fallout of Trump's Decision to Withdraw From Syria

https://t.co/n6CJR5j9EL

"President Trump's strategic decision to withdraw US troops from Syria creates some significant fallout. Besides the presence of 4,000 to 5,000 US troops and contractors in northeast Syria there is also a contingent of 1,100 French troops and an unknown number of British forces. France for now says it wants to stay..."

 

Syrian War Report - Dec 21, 2018: US Evacuates Base in Al Tanf, Prepares to Halt Aerial Operation (and vid)

https://southfront.org/syrian-war-report-dec-21-2018-us-evacuates-base-i...

"While the White House has still provided no comprehensive details on the real form of the so-called US troop withdrawal from Syria, the move has already had an impact on the development of the conflict..."

WWWTT

As always, fantastic link NDPP! Thanks. Looks like, according to your link anyways, that the US withdrawal is going to trigger the same move from Britain and France. 

Finaly the people of Syria will be able to rebuild their country and come home. 

Maybe just maybe Israel will get the idea? Let’s keep our fingers crossed. 

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..i mean your calling some people on this board trolls. instead of debating them.

WWWTT

Oh that. I usually call trolls out when it happens. My comment count has been hi today due to the fact that there’s been a few good topics surfacing worthy of debating. And a few of my predictions have been hitting the mark so it’s not sitting right with other posters and they resort to trolling. 

I don’t take it personal and just move on, but thanks for your concern brother!

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..i'm not concerned. people here can take care of themselves. just don't want to get caught in your debate practices. calling people names is disrespectful.

WWWTT

Than please just ignore me than epaulo13. I’ll tell you what, I’ll ignore you for a while ok if it makes you feel better? 

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..if your truly interested in making me feel better why not stop calling people names?

josh
NDPP

"All of Syria's prisoners are being executed, says Syrian man recently released from prison.' Wait...what?

https://twitter.com/OffGuardian0/status/1076945372570943493

Lol. The US may or may not be leaving but the Washington establishment's premiere propaganda organ's poison pen continues its desperate attempt to reverse the decision. Expect more. 'The Syrian government did not respond to requests for comment for this article': Textbook balance in WaPo journalism. 

josh

Ah, it’s like ringing a dinner bell.

NDPP

Trump Made the Right Decision to Quit Syrian Conflict

http://www.atimes.com/article/trump-made-the-right-decision-to-quit-syri...

"Despite the criticism, there is a strong argument that the US president has done the right thing by withdrawing his forces from Syria..."

 

Time To Get Out Of Syria

https://ericmargolis.com/2018/12/time-to-get-out-of-syria/

"We will breathe a huge sigh of relief if the US deployment actually goes ahead: it will remove a major risk of war with nuclear-armed Russia, whose forces are in Syria at the invitation of the recognized government in Damascus. The US has no strategic interest in Syria and no business at all being militarily involved there. Except perhaps that the war party wants never-ending wars abroad for arms production and promotion..."

 

The Jimmy Dore Show (April)

https://youtu.be/_O2TRzA2ezk

Bombshell: Professor Jeffrey Sachs stuns MSNBC

NDPP

"As Syrian men and women of all faiths enjoy Christmas together in Damascus, spare a thought for the West's governments, Intel services, ['progressives'], 'experts' and journalists who for over seven years backed Islamist rebels whose victory would have made such scenes impossible."

 

Merry Xmas from Israel (and vid)

https://twitter.com/Partisangirl/status/1077665102038355968

"Syrian Christmas dinner interrupted by screams as Israel rains missiles down on the capital."

 

Syrian Air Defences Intercept 'Hostile' Targets Over Damascus (and vid)

https://on.rt.com/9l7l

"Missile defence systems have been activated against targets over Damascus according to Syrian state agency. According to a military source cited by Sana, an ammunition depot was damaged in the attack and three servicemen sustained injuries..."

But as it's Israel, 'the only democracy in the Middle East,'  all is permitted.

NDPP

Israel Attacks Damascus on Christmas...(and vid)

https://t.co/gqCy93jpy5

Israel is once again in violation of international law as it violates both Lebanese airspace and Syria's sovereignty. After his failure in Gaza, Israeli prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is desperate to regain his credibility as Israel's strongman. Netanyahu's fragile coalition government has fallen apart, forcing a call for new elections scheduled for April.

Also Trump's recent announcement of pulling US troops out of Syria has angered many pro-war Zionists who were expecting the US to maintain its illegal occupation of northeastern Syria in order to prop up the shaky Kurdish ethnic petro-state project, which Israel sees as its long-term strategic foothold in both Iraq and Syria, but also to justify the existence of Israel's own European settler-state in the Middle East."

NDPP

Moscow Slams Israeli Strikes Against Syria

http://tass.com/politics/1038037

"...The Russian Foreign Ministry emphasized the manner of strikes carried out by Israel's Air Force. 'The air strikes were again conducted by the Israeli aircraft under cover of civilian planes descending to land at the airport of Damascus and Beirut..."

Clearly an attempt to draw return fire from Syria to strike the civilian aircraft. Just like last time with the Russian military plane. Israel badly needs to be taught a lesson. Preferably painful enough it doesn't forget.

Paladin1

NDPP wrote:

 Israel badly needs to be taught a lesson. Preferably painful enough it doesn't forget.

 

Like, kill a few of them? What kind of painful lesson do you propose?

NDPP

whatever works.

WWWTT

Syria is still taking up a big part of Chinese international news coverage on CCTV4.

So is this Israeli involvement.

To me it looks like the Chinese media is trying to shame Israel for it's pro war actions against Syria so there is next to no Israel support among it's citizens.

I predict a 33% chance Russia will now upgrade Syria with it's more advanced missle defence system, the S-400.

WWWTT

Paladin1 wrote:

NDPP wrote:

 Israel badly needs to be taught a lesson. Preferably painful enough it doesn't forget.

 

Like, kill a few of them? What kind of painful lesson do you propose?

Shooting down more advanced Israeli military aircraft in self defence is a good start! No need to be offensive. Stronger and effective defence is all that is needed to stand up to aggresion.

Paladin1

NDPP wrote:

whatever works.

Ban guns in Canada because guns are bad but (possibly) murder Israelis to "teach them a lesson".

Love it lol 

WWWTT wrote:

Shooting down more advanced Israeli military aircraft in self defence is a good start! No need to be offensive. Stronger and effective defence is all that is needed to stand up to aggresion.

I'm not so sure.

Shooting down very expensive aircraft could possibly work. $31 million dollar F15's (or $115 million F35s), not to mention pilot deaths, could definitly piss people off and possibly cause public approval ratings to drop. Or if the government sells them on what the aircraft are doing, IE they're launching strikes in "self-defense" then that could rally people together.

Or the government could switch to a drone or missile based strike approach.

A self-defense only approach might be like trying to beat a bully by letting him or her punch you in the face until they get tired. I mean that's basically what happened in Rawanda where they got bored murdering people and gave up after a while but that' not a great example IMO. 

As logn as Israel has the backing of the US they're neigh untouchable.  Convincing the US to withdraw support (up to and including the millions or billions in money and equipment) might cause them to rethink their approach?

WWWTT

You overestimate the strength of the US Paladin1. And the US support for Israel!

Damascus has said that China will be getting the bulk of the rebuilding infrastructure contracts.  China has already paved the one belt one road path from China Pakistan Iran Iraq and all that’s left is Syria and possibly Afghanistan on route westward to the Mediterranean. Syria is critical for the one belt one road plan. 

I’m sure the US pull out of Syria pisses of Israel. 

Here’s what I’m speculating here. The trade war the US is waging against China is not going too good for the US. So the US and China probably made some kind of deals where the us will win some concessions on the home front with China/US trade. And in return the US will pull out of the countries that are on China’s one belt one road list. 

I expect the US will do exactly as you suggest, and withdraw support for Israel if they continue with these attacks. 

But who knows how Israel will react? The Israel’s probably think they control the US anyways, so they may not even care if they have the US backing? If this is the case, I would expect Russia to supply more lethal defence systems and probably the training to go along with it. 

Give it a year.  If after that the Israel’s are still pulling the same shit, then Syria may start sending missiles to Israel?

NDPP

Civilian Flights Into and Out of Lebanon Must Be Re-Routed to Avoid an Israel Authored Tragedy

https://t.co/Vdt2Dm2tW1

"It's paradoxical that the 'IAF' might be so concerned about the safety of its pilot that it would put dozens of civilian air travelers at risk, but it shouldn't be forgotten that it did this exact same thing back in September vis-a-vis a Russian spy plane but with dramatically different results.

As the accidential downing of the Russian plane makes clear, the aircraft that Israel's attacking fighters use as shields are in clear and present danger every time Israel's air force employs this deeply unethical manoeuvre. 

But taking things a step further, knowing that Israel has been privately upset about the current US withdrawal from Syrian territory, it can be safely assumed that Tel Aviv will do just about anything it can to convince the US to go back on its decision..."

NDPP

Residents Ask Damascus to Send Military Forces to Manbij

http://en.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13971006000649

"A large number of residents of Manbij have called on Damascus to deploy army forces in the strategic town in northeastern Aleppo. Relevant reports said earlier today that the Syrian army was preparing to enter Manbij as Turkey threatened to occupy the strategic town..."

WWWTT

I recently read one article that Syria claims 14 of the 16 smart bombs were destroyed. Netenyaho, during an military address claimed all bombs hit their target. He also claims that their f-16’s were targeted but failed. Syria says that because of civilian flights, they couldn’t jeopardize targeting the Israeli f-16’s. 

At this point, taking into account that Russia has upgraded Syrian air defences from the s-200 to s-300 system (not sure to what extent) and their previous success rates using the s-200 systems, the Syrian claims appear more reliable than Israel’s 

NDPP

The S-300 was not used. Syrian personnel are still being trained and are expected to complete their orientation within weeks after which time the S-300 system will become operational. It will still be problematic if IDF jets use civilian aircraft as shields behind which to mount their strikes. 

NDPP

Syrian Kurds Call on Damascus to Protect Manbij From Turkish Invasion

http://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/1b7c816d-564e-4ec2-905c-ca9c7a040b7a

"The Kurdish People's Protection Units (YPG) called on the Syrian government on Friday to take control of the city of Manbij to protect the area against a threatened Turkish invasion...'We invite the Syrian government forces which are obliged to protect the same country, nation and borders, to assert control over the areas our forces have withdrawn from, in particular Manbij, and to protect these areas against a Turkish invasion..."

 

'The Case is Closed. East of the Euphrates Next'

https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1078605997906759680

"Russia coordinated with Turkey the control of the Syrian Army to Manbij. The Syrian troops raised the Russian and Syrian flags over some areas of the city following the absence of all Kurdish armed presence (important) in Manbij. The case is closed. East of the Euphrates next."

NDPP

Evo Morales: US Retreat From Syria is a Victory For the Syrian People

https://orinocotribune.com/evo-morales-us-retreat-from-syria-is-a-victor...

"...Trump sings victory by withdrawing his invading troops deployed without authorization from his Congress, or from the Security Council of the United Nations, but the true victory is of the Syrian people, worthy and sovereign..."

Paladin1

WWWTT wrote:

You overestimate the strength of the US Paladin1. And the US support for Israel!

I think a lot of people underestimate the strength of the US.

As for support for Israel then maybe you're right. They've always seemed super pro-Israel to me. Maybe Trumps new America First approach will change that relationship and Israel won't have their big brother backing them up in fights- or sending them billions of dollars.

Quote:
Damascus has said that China will be getting the bulk of the rebuilding infrastructure contracts.  China has already paved the one belt one road path from China Pakistan Iran Iraq and all that’s left is Syria and possibly Afghanistan on route westward to the Mediterranean. Syria is critical for the one belt one road plan.

Never heard of that road before, thanks for mentioning it. China doesn't need to fight any wars because everything now days seems to be made in China. And western cultures really like our shinny things.

Quote:
Here’s what I’m speculating here. The trade war the US is waging against China is not going too good for the US. So the US and China probably made some kind of deals where the us will win some concessions on the home front with China/US trade. And in return the US will pull out of the countries that are on China’s one belt one road list.

Good observation. I agree a trade war with China wouldn't do well for the US.

Quote:
I expect the US will do exactly as you suggest, and withdraw support for Israel if they continue with these attacks.

I really wonder how many of those attacks are in self-defense and how many are because the US is backing Israel (and protecting them).

Quote:

Give it a year.  If after that the Israel’s are still pulling the same shit, then Syria may start sending missiles to Israel?

 

there's still a very strong ISIS presense in Syria. They've been regrouping, training and resupplying and they're starting to infultrate back into places like Iraq. The US pulling out of engaging ISIS in Syria, to me, indicates the US will be disengaging from ISIS across the middle east and leaving them and the countries they terrorize to their own.

NDPP

Syria Sitrep - Army to Regain Northeastern Territory - Political Isolation Ends

https://t.co/8ZPEN0T1Xk

"...Israel, like others, will learn that any further attacks on Syria are futile and will only lead to effective retaliations. The war on Syria, while not yet over, is drawing down. Syria's political isolation is ending. Those who insist on continuing it will in the end lose out."

NDPP

UAE Reopens Embassy in Damascus (and vid)

https://www.syriana-analysis.com/uae-reopens-embassy-in-damascus-video/

"The UAE reopened its embassy in Damascus on Thursday after 6 years of diplomatic boycott, is a reflection of rapprochement between Syria and some of its Gulf foes as the war winds down. Kevork Almassian covers this topic among others..."

 

Breaking: Turkish-Backed Rebels Announce Start of Manbij Battle

https://twitter.com/TheArabSource/status/1078646186293252100

"The Turkish military, alongside their rebel allies, have allegedly begun their Manbij offensive in northeastern Aleppo..."

The Arab Source twitter feed is a good source of updating information on the current Syrian  situation...

NDPP

Trump Critics of Syria Withdrawal Fueled Rise of ISIS

https://consortiumnews.com/2018/12/27/trump-critics-of-syria-withdrawal-...

"Too many of those protesting the removal of US forces are authors of the catastrophe that tore Syria to pieces, reports Max Blumenthal for Consortium News."

WWWTT

NDPP wrote:

The S-300 was not used. Syrian personnel are still being trained and are expected to complete their orientation within weeks after which time the S-300 system will become operational. It will still be problematic if IDF jets use civilian aircraft as shields behind which to mount their strikes. 

Ok then that’s probably why the Syria military didn’t target the Israel jets. I remember reading that the s-300 system can differentiate between civilian and military targets. 

In turn I’m going to have to give the Syrian side of the start about what exactly happened more credibility for the simple fact it adds up. 

WWWTT

Paladin 1 wrote:

Never heard of that road before, thanks for mentioning it.

Speaking metaphorically. But I believe China wants to build s railway through Iran Turkey and Syria 

NDPP

In Syria, US-Backed Kurdish Fighters Face Trump's Withdrawal - And the Legacy of Their Own Mistakes

https://theintercept.com/2018/12/28/syria-withdrawal-kurds-pkk/

"US reliance on the PKK and its Syrian affiliate has driven these militias to conscript at gunpoint and stirred ethnic tensions. The PKK may be sorry to see the Americans go, but a lot of Arabs are not.

Deserters also say the PKK has lost its way politically and cannot deliver on its promises to unite Kurds from Turkey, Iraq, Iran and Syria into one state - or to promote Kurdish cultural rights and spread democratic rule.

'They used to call it a people's democracy,' Ali told me. 'In reality, they don't uphold democracy. They don't care about human rights..."

josh

Don’t care about democracy and human rights?  Sounds like the Assad regime as well.

NDPP

US Helicopters Spotted Over Manbij as Turkish Forces Enter Syria (and vid)

https://on.rt.com/9lea

"...Tension is mounting around the key Kurdish-held hub of Manbij in northern Syria. Shortly after Damascus announced the deployment of troops in that city, Turkish APCs crossed into Syria and US helicopters were filmed in the air. The footage is a reminder that while US President Donald Trump said he will withdraw the American troops from Syria, the actual pullout is yet to materialize and may take many months to complete..."

 

Sen Rubio: We've Slowed the Withdrawal from Syria

https://twitter.com/vvanwilgenburg/status/1078966960665382912

"Sen Marco Rubio (R., Florida) said on Friday that the US withdrawal from Syria has been delayed somewhat."

NDPP

Turkey Sends Team to Russia to Talk Manbij and US Pullout from Syria

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YQmSKIfqIc

"Top diplomats and high ranking military officials from Turkey have agreed to coordinate with Russia on the Syrian crisis after holding talks in Moscow..."

NDPP

'Land Swap' Between Turkey & Syria - An Option to Avoid Standoff Over Manbij? (and vid)

https://on.rt.com/9lg2

"The Kurdish-held city of Manbij is a huge conundrum for Damascus, Ankara and Moscow as no one wants to lose land, troops or allies. To stop a northern Syrian standoff, it all could be sliced into areas of influence, analysts say. Meanwhile tensions are mounting in northern Syria..."

NDPP

US 'Slowing Things Down' on Troop Withdrawal From Syria - Top Senator

https://on.rt.com/9lj6

"The US troop withdrawal from Syria needs a 'pause' in order to protect the Kurds, the potential interests of Israel, and to prevent Iran from scoring a big win in Syria, a top GOP senator said. The withdrawal of the US military from the country is currently in a 'pause situation,' Sen Lindsey Graham (R-SC) told reporters on Monday after having lunch with President Trump at the White House. 

'We talked about Syria. He told me some things I didn't know that made me feel a lot better about where we're headed in Syria,' said Graham, who is an outspoken critic of Trump's decision to pull troops out of Syria."

NDPP

Trump U-Turning on Syria Pullout?

https://stephenlendman.org/2018/12/trump-u-turning-on-syria-pullout/

"Whether Pentagon forces stay or leave Syria, whether some stay, others redeployed cross-border to Iraq or elsewhere, Washington's regional and overall imperial agenda remains unchanged - under Republicans and undemocratic Dems..."

NDPP

Syria - 'Country of the Year' - 2018

https://t.co/OYtGpHqa5d

"The defeat of the imperialist armies and their head-chopping auxilliaries in the alphabet soup of Islamist extremism by the Syrian Arab Army and its allies was the most significant event of the year or any other year since the US defeat in Vietnam. It will change the world..."

Canada supported the enemies of Syria.

WWWTT
NDPP

Pompeo, Netanyahu Vow To Continue Cooperation Over Syria and Iran

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2019/Jan-01/473062-pompeo-n...

"The US and Israel vowed on Tueaday to continue cooperating over Syria and in countering Iran in the Middle East, even as President Donald Trump's plans to withdraw US troops from Syria..."

iyraste1313

Syria: The Western Rogue States Must Confess Their Crimes Against Humanity and be Held Accountable

Vanessa Beeley....from globalresearch.ca

real news, from the streets...what´s missing in the title, is the role of the fake news media (of Canada) and their crimes of intellectual complicity

NDPP

Syria: The Western Rogue States Must Confess Their Crimes Against Humanity and Be Held Accountable

https://t.co/pj3vKReEkZ

"The West and its allies in the Gulf States, Turkey and Israel have waged an eight year war against the Syrian people. The West has besieged, starved and deprived the Syrian people of humanitarian aid while pouring 'aid' into the areas controlled by their extremist sectarian proxies. The West has violated international law and it has enabled the destruction of Syria's history, heritage and cultural footprint. The West has behaved as a collective rogue state without conscience and without pity..."

NDPP

Western MSM Coverage of Syria Continues as Usual

https://twitter.com/asadabukhahlil/status/1080901012947296257

"The Syrian opposition human rights network, which all Western media rely on for their news on Syria, reported just two days ago the death of Syrian civilians from US bombs. None of the Western media bothered to report that one."

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