Liberals behind alleged by-election bribe: OPP

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NorthReport
Liberals behind alleged by-election bribe: OPP

Frown

NorthReport

What exactly does this mean?

NorthReport

Does this call into question the Sudbury by-election results?

The timing of this bombshell if that is what it is is stunning.

Debater

I see you're already hard at work on your next strategem. Wink

Rokossovsky

I don't think the outcome would be affected if the winner had not been the one who directly benefitted from the bribery. However, the one alleged to have interfered in the election process is also the beneficiary of the fraud, so it would seem there would be a good case to void the results.

Poor Sudbury. A decent Liberal candidate overthrown for a rank opportunist, who is leveraged into position through what police think are dirty tricks. then goes on to win the campaign.

This isn't over yet. :(

robbie_dee

Unless there's evidence of criminality by Thibeault he'll probably be able to hang onto his seat until the next election. And, to be fair, since (1) the attempted bribe didn't work because Olivier ran anyways and (2) the voters were largely aware of the allegations at the time they voted, one can't really argue that the result itself is tainted.

That being said, Lougheed and Sorbara are both staring at some potentially serious legal trouble as is Wynne if it can be proved that she knew what they were up to. Unless the Liberal attorney general just squashes the investigation in the end.

robbie_dee

[url=http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2015/02/06/we-are-disturbingly-compl... Keenan (Toronto Star columnist): We are disturbingly complacent about the Sudbury byelection allegations[/url]

Quote:

Sure, the OPP is investigating and we’ll eventually sort out some degree of criminal guilt or innocence, but on the face of it the scandal doesn’t seem to have rocked the public consciousness. The Liberals won despite the investigation. The public debates beer store options and rumours of a carbon tax with more enthusiasm than this allegation of a major ethics breech staring us in the face.

Indeed, the Lougheed-Olivier conversation is like dialogue from House of Cards, confirming our worst suspicions of how our political class approaches elections and the task of governing. What’s in it for me? What are you giving me? I suspect the answer Ling’s question is that it is not received as a bigger deal precisely because we suspect this is routine. Everybody knows the fight is fixed, that’s how it goes.

Former Ottawa parliamentary secretary Dean Del Mastro is not just charged but convicted of election fraud, and while he faces a possible jail sentence, his party remains competitive in the polls — even after robocalls and a Senate scandal seemed to confirm a pattern of integrity violations. Toronto Councillor Giorgio Mammoliti was reprimanded by city council over an improper fundraiser that appeared to funnel money into his own pocket, and then was found guilty by a court of violating election spending laws, but he remains in office — re-elected by a comfortable margin.

Integrity laws? Bald-faced perversions of our very democratic process? Ho-hum.

If our failure to be shocked isn’t exactly shocking, it may be ultimately more disturbing than the specific allegations themselves. For if we no longer consider the laws that govern how we govern ourselves inviolable, if we accept that the rules are there to be broken with a wink and a nudge and all’s fair for those who don’t get caught, then our democracy itself is severely broken.

KenS

Silver lining if this at least means Wynne does not dare name Thibeault to Cabinet.

KenS

No way demands to have the election results challenged will have any practical challenge.

terrytowel

KenS wrote:

Silver lining if this at least means Wynne does not dare name Thibeault to Cabinet.

Don't be sure about that. Wynne has already said she has done nothing wrong. They are not even one year into their mandate. Best to take hits early, rather than in 2018.

He will be in cabinet for sure, as he represents the North. They need a voice at the cabinet table, and that will be the Liberal narrative.

robbie_dee

terrytowel wrote:

He will be in cabinet for sure, as he represents the North. They need a voice at the cabinet table, and that will be the Liberal narrative.

Does Ontario still have a Ministry of Democratic Renewal, Accountability and Transparency? That would be a good one.

KenS

Of course Wynne says she has done nothing wrong.

That is always done at the same time you run away from an issue fast as you can.

She wont be naming him to Cabinet soon. Later, we'll see.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

As I understand it, parties retain the legal right to tell any prospective candidate "Sorry, we won't let you run under our logo".

So I'm having trouble understanding how saying "We'd prefer you let someone else run, and here's some other valuable things you could do" is specificially worse (or less legal) than "Go away; you're dead to us".

Whatever legal issues may come of this seem to me to be between Mr. Olivier and the Liberals, not between the electorate in that riding and the Liberals.  In fact, anyone in that riding who feels they were unfairly denied the opportunity to vote for Mr. Olivier in fact had the opportunity to vote for Mr. Olivier.

Sorry if I just squandered an opportunity to bring the "Lieberals" down once and for all :(

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

So funny the way the Liberal Red Star goes cluck cluck cluck about ethics violations, when "Liberal" is another word for "ethics violation", and it is the same Liberal Red Star which supports the same Liberals.

GTY

Mr. Magoo wrote:

As I understand it, parties retain the legal right to tell any prospective candidate "Sorry, we won't let you run under our logo".

So I'm having trouble understanding how saying "We'd prefer you let someone else run, and here's some other valuable things you could do" is specificially worse (or less legal) than "Go away; you're dead to us".

Whatever legal issues may come of this seem to me to be between Mr. Olivier and the Liberals, not between the electorate in that riding and the Liberals.  In fact, anyone in that riding who feels they were unfairly denied the opportunity to vote for Mr. Olivier in fact had the opportunity to vote for Mr. Olivier.

Sorry if I just squandered an opportunity to bring the "Lieberals" down once and for all :(

 

The legal issues are between the Ontario Provincial Police and the Liberals who were recorded by Olivier.  They are the ones who are under a criminal investigation for apparently breaking Section 125b of the Criminal Code of Canada.

125. Every one who

(b) solicits, recommends or negotiates in any manner with respect to an appointment to or resignation from an office, in expectation of a direct or indirect reward,advantage or benefit

,…

is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding fiveyears.

 

This can be found here:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/254962075/Ontario-Provincial-Police-search-war...

and the all of the clauses of section 125 can be found here:

http://quesnelnews.com/ethics_criminal_code_handout.pdf

The evidence is in the recordings and the Liberals will have to hire Rob Ford’s lawyer to find some kind of technicality to get out of this one.  As far as I’m concerned, they should be sentenced to prison time like those Liberal Senators.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

I guess we'll have to wait for the results of the investigation, but it's still a bit hard to understand how offering him another job constitutes bribery of some sort when his candidacy under the Liberal banner is at the discretion of the Liberals.  Why would they need to bribe him to not run for the Liberals if all the Liberals have to do (and are within their rights to do) is say "sorry, but we're going with someone else".

Aristotleded24

Mr. Magoo wrote:
Why would they need to bribe him to not run for the Liberals if all the Liberals have to do (and are within their rights to do) is say "sorry, but we're going with someone else".

Because if they did that, they risked a backlash on the grounds of being dictatorial, and this could very easily have cost them votes. If they can "convince" the popular candidate to step aside for their preferred candidate, they avoid that negativity.

Debater

terrytowel wrote:

He will be in cabinet for sure, as he represents the North. They need a voice at the cabinet table, and that will be the Liberal narrative.

The North is already represented in the Wynne government.  The Liberals hold both Thunder Bay ridings, as well as Sault Ste. Marie.

terrytowel

Wrote this in another thread, but I'll repeat it here

The following is neither an endorsement or support of Sudbury Reporter speculation. I'm just posting for public consumption and an FYI to Babble posters.

On Focus Ontario this week, discussion centred on analysing the Sudbury by-election.

Local Sudbury reporter said the Liberals won this for one simple reason. Sudbury wanted an MPP in government at the cabinet table.

The former Liberal MPP for Sudbury was a cabinet minister for a decade, and Sudbury was used to it. Made them feel important, as their representative was in government.

The community wanted that again, as it didn't feel the same with the short-lived NDP MPP

Again these are the reporters words, not mine. I'm just posting this for discussion as maybe that is the reason the Liberals won the by-election.

NorthReport

Sparks sure to fly over Liberal scandal in new Ontario legislative session

A criminal investigation hanging over Ontario's Liberal government is expected to dominate the start of a new legislative session as provincial politicians return to the house Tuesday after a nine-week break.

Opposition parties weren't silent on other alleged government misdeeds last session, such as the deletion of documents in the former premier's office on the cancellation of two gas plants, but since the legislature broke in December, Premier Kathleen Wynne has found herself embroiled in a new scandal.

Wynne decided to appoint Glenn Thibeault, who left the federal NDP for the provincial Liberals, as the party's candidate for a byelection in Sudbury rather than pitting him against the previous Liberal candidate for the riding in an open nomination.

The spurned candidate, Andrew Olivier, alleges that the Liberals offered him a job or appointment to step aside for Thibeault. Olivier, who is quadriplegic and records many conversations in lieu of taking notes, posted audio online of his talks with local Liberal Gerry Lougheed and the premier's deputy chief of staff, Pat Sorbara.

The Ontario Provincial Police and Elections Ontario are investigating. The Liberals have maintained no specific offer was made to Olivier, saying they were trying to keep him active in the party.

Wynne has not faced questions from reporters since police filed a court document in which they say there are grounds to believe an offence was committed.

 

http://www.nationalnewswatch.com/2015/02/16/sparks-sure-to-fly-over-libe...

robbie_dee

Breaking...

[url=http://metronews.ca/news/ottawa/1291946/elections-ontario-says-liberals-... Ontario: Liberals Violated Elections Act[/url]

Quote:
TORONTO – Elections Ontario has found that the actions of two Liberals, including the premier’s deputy chief of staff, constitute an “apparent contravention” of a bribery section of the Election Act.

***

Greg Essensa, the chief electoral officer of Ontario, says since Elections Ontario has no mandate to conduct prosecutions he has referred the matter to the Ministry of the Attorney General.

He says these are “unprecedented circumstances” as no chief electoral officer has ever conducted an investigation into bribery allegations or reported an apparent contravention of the Election Act before.

NorthReport

Behind the scenes, Patricia Sorbara runs the Ontario Liberal machine


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/behind-the-scenes-patricia-...

ajaykumar

This is not a big deal, nepotism is practised on a daily basis in society, and is accepted. I am an immigrant to Canada, when I graduated from University  , all my friends had family members (aunt uncles etc) who got them their first job, while I had a terrible time finding one since I knew noone. This is an example of societal norm.

NorthReport

Bullshit. This could be construed as criminal activity but what's to say about your comments.....

ajaykumar wrote:

This is not a big deal, nepotism is practised on a daily basis in society, and is accepted. I am an immigrant to Canada, when I graduated from University  , all my friends had family members (aunt uncles etc) who got them their first job, while I had a terrible time finding one since I knew noone. This is an example of societal norm.

ajaykumar

NorthReport wrote:

Bullshit. This could be construed as criminal activity but what's to say about your comments.....

ajaykumar wrote:

This is not a big deal, nepotism is practised on a daily basis in society, and is accepted. I am an immigrant to Canada, when I graduated from University  , all my friends had family members (aunt uncles etc) who got them their first job, while I had a terrible time finding one since I knew noone. This is an example of societal norm.

well how is this different from nepotism?

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

I would tend to agree with ajaykumar here. Nepotism is bad. That is why I am suspicious of Justin Trudeau. 

nicky

It's one thing to give a family meber a job in a private company. It isquite another thing, in fact a crime, to offer someone a job to get them to withdraw as a candidate.

AJK like too many Liberals seems incapable of grasping the distinction. 

NorthReport

Different enough for ya. Some folks don't know when to quit while they are ahead.

Jail time possible as Elections Ontario sends investigation of Sudbury byelection to Attorney General

http://news.nationalpost.com/2015/02/19/elections-ontario-refers-investi...

NorthReport

Different enough for ya. Some folks don't know when to quit while they are ahead.

Jail time possible as Elections Ontario sends investigation of Sudbury byelection to Attorney General

http://news.nationalpost.com/2015/02/19/elections-ontario-refers-investi...

Ken Burch Ken Burch's picture

Two other possible subjects of investigation:

1) Did someone in the premier's office manage to intercede with the OPP to delay the polling day release of their findings until it was too late in the day for those findings to register with the voters?

2) Was Cimino offered something by the premier or the OLP in exchange for giving up the seat after only six months in office and causing the byelection in the first place?  As I understand it, Cimino has never offered any explanation for resigning from the provincial parliament at such a weirdly early date.

Aristotleded24

Ken Burch wrote:
Was Cimino offered something by the premier or the OLP in exchange for giving up the seat after only six months in office and causing the byelection in the first place?  As I understand it, Cimino has never offered any explanation for resigning from the provincial parliament at such a weirdly early date.

He said something to do with personal or health reasons, which if you believe him, you would have to take him at his word. Somehow I just can't see an attempted bribe of the NDP going unnoticed in this political climate.

nicky

Ken, I have heard two slightly different explanations for Cimino quitting. Both are highly persoanl and have nothing to do with your question #2.

As for Cimino's ethics we should remember that he voluntarily declined $50,000 in severance pay that he was entitled to.

I wonder how many members of the Ontario Liberal government would do that.

Aristotleded24

nicky wrote:
Ken, I have heard two slightly different explanations for Cimino quitting. Both are highly persoanl and have nothing to do with your question #2.

It should also be noted that unlike the case with Wittmer in Waterloo, the Liberals had a majority going into this by-election and did not need to win Sudbury. I don't think even they would have risked the backlash of trying to bribe a sitting MPP when they already had what they needed in terms of the overall seat count.

 

Brachina

 I don't think Cimino was bribed, refusing the money that he was legally entitled too showed to much integrity and loyalty to the NDP (protecting it's rep), for Cimino to have been bought. If fear it was simply some sort of health issue.

 I hope everyone involved in the Liberal corrupt gets jail time and the Liberal brand gets horrible burned both federally and provincially.

Pondering

Brachina wrote:

 I don't think Cimino was bribed, refusing the money that he was legally entitled too showed to much integrity and loyalty to the NDP (protecting it's rep), for Cimino to have been bought. If fear it was simply some sort of health issue.

 I hope everyone involved in the Liberal corrupt gets jail time and the Liberal brand gets horrible burned both federally and provincially.

I hope only the guilty get punished.

terrytowel

Kathleen Wynne confirmed on Friday she was negotiating with former NDP MP Glenn Thibeault while he was still the NDP caucus chair!

Says Wynne, “I became aware that Glenn Thibeault would be willing to consider running for us. I was very interested . . . once I met Glenn, I was convinced that he was the right candidate for us,” she said.

“It was at that point last November — and well before any conversation with Andrew Olivier — that I decided that this was one of those situations where I would appoint our candidate.”

Glenn Thibeault resigned as caucus chair on December 2, 2014 citing family reasons.

Guess we now know what those reasons really were.

nicky

Lougheed tells Olivier on the tape that they prefer that there be a nomination meeting where Thibeault is acclaimed and Olivier nominates him. Presumably that was Wynne's preferred route as well.The optics would certainly be better than an appointment.

It may be that Wynne was always prepared to appont Thibeault if plan #1 fell through but it still seems that there was a plan #1 whuich entailed bribing Oliver not to be a candidate.

It's just a little hard to believe Wynne. Her defence is not credible.

Stockholm

Kathleen Wynne's "new way of doing politics" consists of bribery, sleazy machinations, innuendo about other parties and getting an NDP MP to spy on the NDP caucus on behalf of the Liberals. Thanks a lot Kathleen!

God only knows what other laws Wynne has broken - the woman is clearly a criminal 

Rokossovsky

nicky wrote:

It's one thing to give a family meber a job in a private company. It isquite another thing, in fact a crime, to offer someone a job to get them to withdraw as a candidate.

AJK like too many Liberals seems incapable of grasping the distinction. 

Government is a private family company according to Liberal tradition.

Jacob Two-Two

Pondering wrote:

Brachina wrote:

 I hope everyone involved in the Liberal corrupt gets jail time and the Liberal brand gets horrible burned both federally and provincially.

I hope only the guilty get punished.

Yeah, that's what he said.

MegB

I've removed a couple of posts because they can be construed as libelous.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

MegB wrote:

I've removed a couple of posts because they can be construed as libelous.

I would like to ask how you came to this conclusion? Did you consult a lawyer? Read up on libel law? This is not a snarky question, I am honestly curious.

And, btw, I apologize for a very harsh post I made some months ago criticizing you. Something to do with my intense opposition to authority, particularly parental authority. But in fact, I seem to agree with your position most of the time.

janfromthebruce

 

Interesting tweet response to TorStar article on WynneGate bribery

Sorry John Barber, but your column on the Sudbury scandal makes multiple statements that are just flat-out wrong http://www.thestar.com/opinion/commentary/2015/02/23/sudbury-scandal-unlikely-to-hurt-wynne-government.html …

    Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    Barber: "one thing is clear: she (Sorbara) wasn’t asking Olivier step aside to make way for preferred Liberal candidate Glenn Thibeault"

    0 replies 1 retweet 0 favorites

  1. Jonathan Scott ‏@J_Scott_ 4h4 hours ago

    @btaplatt Accurate. Olivier had already been told he wasn't the candidate, by the Premier herself.

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

  2. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    Sorbara: "You’ve been directly asked by the premier to make a decision to step aside to allow Glenn to have the opportunity uncontested."

    0 replies 1 retweet 1 favorite

  3. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    How can anyone read those two quotes side by side and think Barber's claim is accurate? Good grief.

    0 replies 1 retweet 1 favorite

  4. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    @J_Scott_ *rolls eyes* You can ignore the transcript if you want, but don't expect me to.

  1. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    Also, Barber dismisses Lougheed allegations because "he had no authority to promise anything or the power to deliver it."

    0 replies 2 retweets 1 favorite

  2. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    But as OPP clearly state in their ITO, you do not need to have the power to carry out the offer in order for the negotiation to be illegal.

    0 replies 2 retweets 2 favorites

  3. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    (fixed a typo in that last tweet)

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

  4. Jonathan Scott ‏@J_Scott_ 4h4 hours ago

    @btaplatt I'm not ignoring it. I'm listening with the timeline of events in mind.

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

  5. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 4h4 hours ago

    @J_Scott_ The transcripts show, clearly and repeatedly, a request for Olivier to step aside so an appointment doesn't have to happen

    0 replies 1 retweet 2 favorites

  6. Jonathan Scott ‏@J_Scott_ 3h3 hours ago

    @btaplatt But per the Premier, an appointment already had happened and was communicated to Olivier. That's my point.

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

  7. Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 3h3 hours ago

    @J_Scott_ If an appointment already happened, why is Sorbara EXPLICITLY asking, multiple times, for Olivier to step aside?

    0 replies 1 retweet 2 favorites

  8. Jonathan Scott ‏@J_Scott_ 3h3 hours ago

    @btaplatt I felt she was sugar coating the fact she was telling him to go quietly into the good night so he wouldn't rage at the dying, etc.

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

  9. Jonathan Scott ‏@J_Scott_ 3h3 hours ago

    @btaplatt I'm not going to convince you, I imagine, but that's honestly what I hear going on.

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

  10. Jonathan Scott ‏@J_Scott_ 3h3 hours ago

    @btaplatt Also, I've never known the Premier to lie. Period. So I take her word on the timeline at issue here.

    0 replies 0 retweets 0 favorites

Brian Platt ‏@btaplatt 3h3 hours ago

@J_Scott_ I don't doubt she would have appointed. But the transcripts show that first, Sorbara/Lougheed wanted him to step aside voluntarily

Poor Jonathan was out of his league, and Barber was trying to clean up the Wynne mess.

janfromthebruce

terrytowel wrote:

Kathleen Wynne confirmed on Friday she was negotiating with former NDP MP Glenn Thibeault while he was still the NDP caucus chair!

Says Wynne, “I became aware that Glenn Thibeault would be willing to consider running for us. I was very interested . . . once I met Glenn, I was convinced that he was the right candidate for us,” she said.

“It was at that point last November — and well before any conversation with Andrew Olivier — that I decided that this was one of those situations where I would appoint our candidate.”

Glenn Thibeault resigned as caucus chair on December 2, 2014 citing family reasons.

Guess we now know what those reasons really were.

Also shows a person lacking any personal ethical standard & appeared willing to line his own pockets through deceit & misrepresention of position bestowed: http://www.parl.gc.ca/Parlinfo/lists/Salaries.aspx?Menu=HOC-Politic&Section=03d93c58-f843-49b3-9653-84275c23f3fb

Caucus Chair - Government and Official Opposition Salary $11,500.00

So slimy.

 

janfromthebruce

Kathleen Wynne’s comment an ‘insult’ to campaign team, says Andrew Olivier http://on.thestar.com/1LwQTfg 

But much better and indepth response by Oliver is here: Wynne: “Not about dragging names through mud.” Loyal Lib who dreamed of being first quadriplegic MPP disagrees: http://www.thesudburystar.com/2015/02/22/oli

It was in response into this "smear" by Wynne, the premier of Ontario

Wynne took a shot at Olivier, who ran for the Liberals in June and lost to New Democrat Joe Cimino by 966 votes, for not retaining the seat held by Liberal MPP Rick Bartolucci for 18 years.

Oliver gives 3 good reasons why they lost Sudbury:

1. Liberals very unpopular in Sudbury

When he decided in January 2014 to seek the Liberal nomination, the Liberals weren't popular here, he said. Bartolucci had almost lost the 2011 election to Paul Loewenberg, who is active in Sudbury's festival circuit and runs two popular downtown bars but wasn't well known by some outside the music sphere. He came within 501 votes of defeating Bartolucci.

Cimino, a city councillor who had been nominated NDP candidate months earlier, was campaigning and seen by many "as a shoo-in," said Olivier.

The Liberals were trailing by 15% in the polls and no one high profile was willing to seek the nomination. There was speculation Wynne was going to appoint then Sudbury mayor Marianne Matichuk for the Liberals, but that didn't happen. Instead Olivier challenged engineer Elise Idnani for the nomination, a woman he called a "formidable opponent" who earned the respect of him and his team.

2. nomination meeting held 2 weeks into the election

"The Liberal Party knee-capped our campaign by waiting too late to hold a nomination meeting."

Bartolucci had announced 18 months earlier he would not seek reelection and Sudbury Liberals were waiting for the party to set a date for a nomination meeting, said Olivier.

Both the Progressive Conservatives and the New Democrats had had their meetings and were campaigning.

"It made no sense until we were told through back channels that then mayor Marianne Matichuk wanted to be the candidate," he said. "Matichuk denied it in the media, but as we now know from the recorded conversation with Mr. Lougheed, she did, in fact, want to (be) the Liberal candidate."

There was speculation Matichuk wanted to be appointed or acclaimed.

"We pressured for democracy, and in the end, an appointment didn’t happen," said Olivier. A nomination was held, "but, by this time, it was too late." He was nominated almost two weeks after the announcement there would be an election. His competitors had signs, offices, volunteers and were raising money.

3. almost no help from the Liberal Party of Ontario when the campaign did start.

So if it was such a long held and prized seat by the Wynne Liberals, sure didn't show it prior to or during the election.

janfromthebruce

Brian Platt does a blog post,  Four definitely false claims about the Sudbury scandal, in response to Barber's this John Barber column on the Sudbury scandal, where "he argues the whole thing is overblown and will come to nothing."

As he states, "I think it’s important not to let falsehoods stand unchallenged."

It's a great read on why some opinion writers In TorStar are just doing "damage control" for their party.

I'll leave the last words to Platt:

There are other parts of the column that are highly dubious, and I’ll leave that to you to decide. But these four errors alone are so significant that I’m not sure why you would take any of the rest of the column seriously.

It may turn out in the end that no charges are laid, but it certainly won’t be for the reasons Barber gives here.

Aristotleded24

janfromthebruce wrote:
So if it was such a long held and prized seat by the Wynne Liberals, sure didn't show it prior to or during the election.

Wow, sounds like the Liberals treated Oliver as if he were a leftover, you know, "we'll take you because we can't get anyone else." I can't imagine how demoralizing that must feel for him. What did he do that marked him as being unworthy in the eyes of the Liberals?

ajaykumar

LOL http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/02/24/alleged-ndp-misuse-of-taxp....

PAY THE TAXPAYERS BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2.7 MILLION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

janfromthebruce

Liberals so desperate to avoid bribery investigation questions Speaker had to scold them to give proper answers today. LOL

"requesting that the answers come somewhat close to the question"

 

 

janfromthebruce

janfromthebruce wrote:

Liberals so desperate to avoid bribery investigation questions Speaker had to scold them to give proper answers today. LOL

"requesting that the answers come somewhat close to the question"

To provide the context:

Who gave Gerry Lougheed and Pat Sorbara their instructions to bribe Andrew Olivier? Wynne has now ducked that question 24 times!

Brian Platt suggests

A good point made in this column by @Carol_Mulligan: the Liberals have clearly distanced themselves from Lougheed http://www.thesudburystar.com/2015/02/24/column-wynnes-actions-shameful-during-sudbury-debacle …

Why:

(Part of the reason, I suspect, is Lougheed was much less nuanced than Sorbara. It'd be hard for anyone to come up with a good defence.)

snip

That Wynne would rewrite history to paint Olivier as the man who lost Sudbury is petty and untrue. It was her and her party's indifference to his campaign that was the real culprit.

Another irksome point about Wynne's Friday statement was the lack of mention of Lougheed, as she praised Sorbara to the heavens. Since Olivier went public about his conversation with Lougheed, in which the Sudbury businessperson said he was speaking for the premier, Wynne has tried to distance herself from her party's most successful fundraiser.

What is the difference between Sorbara and Lougheed in the end? Sorbara gets paid for what she does for Wynne and the Liberals, Lougheed does not. One would expect the premier to show as much loyalty to a staunch Sudbury supporter as to her aide de camp.

To End

Many believe Lougheed should step down as chair of the police board until the investigations are wrapped up.

But many also believe Lougheed and Olivier have been treated shamefully by the party for which they both worked so hard.

NorthReport

Kathleen Wynne facing new pressure to rescind appointment of Liberal fundraiser

Wynne faces new pressure to rescind Lougheed appointment after Sudbury police board seeks guidance

http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2015/02/26/kathleen-wynne-facing-...

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