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Premier McGuinty resigns

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jerrym
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Joined: May 30 2009

Its amazing that governments have billions to pay off corporations in what amounts to windfall profits but cutbacks for the middle class and poor. Surely these contracts can be worded in such a way that changes in circumstances do not cost the taxpayer billions.

Oh! but that wouldn't be fair to these poor, poor corporations and  the poor corporate parties wouldn't get any donations from them.


Boom Boom
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Joined: Dec 29 2004

I think what the Sun article is getting at is this question: "Is entering politics really such a sacrifice that you need a substantial severance if you are defeated or quit?" I suppose a reasonable severance (one or two hundred thousand, depending on your length of office) is acceptable, but not a 'gold plated' severance that approaches half a million dollars and beyond. Folks don't enter politics with the intent of getting rich, or at least they shouldn't. Nor should any occupation that is taxpayer funded be a door to riches. I have huge problems with the financial and other holdings of the British royal family, and other monarchs around the world, for example.


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

There is a very good reason the Sun is attacking those kinds of entitlements.  They are not needed by the toadies for the corporations who when they loss elections get rewarded with good "jobs" in the "network."  Any politicians who are not pro corporations are going to need a longer period of time to get their lives back together after an election loss. Many of them actually need that gold to pay the mortgage etc while they try to find a new job where they don't have to sell their soul.

As for pensions I am sick of hearing Canadians rant that other Canadians actually have pensions.  We keep demanding that we tear down anyone who has a retirement with dignity.  They are not just coming for the pensions of politicians they are coming for our public sector workers.  There is no leap when poor people go from ranting about gold plated political pensions to ranting about gold plated public sector worker pensions.  After all don't you know that only upper level executives deserve to retire with dignity. It must be true because no one else expects to get a pension in this day and age.


Boom Boom
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Joined: Dec 29 2004

That Sun article is the only thing I've read from that outlet in a couple of years, so I don't know what else they're attacking besides gold plated severance for politicos. I can't see how anyone could begrudge someone who earns a pension. I get a disability pension myself - but it's not luxurious or gold plated by any means.


kropotkin1951
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Joined: Jun 6 2002

Boom Boom wrote:

I get a disability pension myself - but it's not luxurious or gold plated by any means.

Seems to me the progressive view is that we need to substantially raise your pension not lower other peoples.  SUN Media and the rest of the corporate spin doctors want to get rid of all DB pensions and leave all Canadian citizens to the mercies of the market to ensure a dignified old age.


Boom Boom
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Joined: Dec 29 2004

Well, I think we can agree that Sun represents the Harper view of the world?


Mr.Tea
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Joined: Jul 9 2011

Kathleen Wynne has officially entered the race.


Boom Boom
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Joined: Dec 29 2004

Saw that on CBC. Is she well-known?


Mr.Tea
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Joined: Jul 9 2011

She's a prett high-profile minister. Quite popular in the party cause she defeated John Tory when he ran against her. She's probably seen as more on the left of the party. Seen as a pretty competent minister but not particularly dynamic. She'll be a serious contender in the race for sure.


Boom Boom
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Joined: Dec 29 2004

Thanks. Smile


janfromthebruce
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Joined: Apr 24 2007

The poisoned "Liberal" chalice - a Kim Campbell moment for sure.


scott16
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Joined: Oct 15 2011

If and hopefully when Mcguinty resigns his seat, will his riding Ottawa south be winnable for the NDP?


radiorahim
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Joined: Jun 17 2002

Heard on the CBC Radio news just now that ex-Winnipeg mayor and Toronto Centre MPP  and Minister of Training, Colleges & Universities Glenn Murray is about to announce his leadership bid.

edited to add link


ctrl190
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Joined: Mar 22 2004

I'd be amazed if Murray won the race, and I'm surprised he's even (probably) throwing his hat in the race. A lot of Liberals are not sold on him and he is known to have accumulated a few adversaries in his short OLP stint. I have always wondered if his junior level cabinet posts were indicative of his inner party squabbles, considering his impressive credentials.

I also question if there is enough Liberal lefty Toronto money and resources to go around for Murray, Wynne AND potentially Kennedy and Hoskins. That seems like an awfully crowded field.


Unionist
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Joined: Dec 11 2005

I remember how exciting it was when Glen Murray - openly gay - was elected mayor of Winnipeg (although he did ultimately disappoint many of his activist supporters). Today, I've read several articles in the English and French media about his likely entry into the race - none of them mentioned his sexual orientation. I think that's a sign of progress...?

Speaking of which, I remember attending the début screening of A Kind of Family at Concordia University 20 years ago. Murray had been president of the Concordia students' union before moving to Winnipeg. It was an intriguing film about him and his 17-year-old foster son, a street kid. Maybe I'll order the DVD...

ETA: Glen Murray first to enter the race


janfromthebruce
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Joined: Apr 24 2007

Glen wants to give "taxcuts" - what the geez!


Unionist
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Joined: Dec 11 2005
Hey Jan. Say something positive about a Liberal. Or something negative about a dipper. If you can't, then your critique of individuals doesn't carry much weight. We need to be able to make distinctions.

Michelle
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Joined: May 10 2001

janfromthebruce wrote:

The poisoned "Liberal" chalice - a Kim Campbell moment for sure.

I completely agree!  That's exactly what it will be if she wins.  The party is imploding already, but she'll wear it if she wins the leadership and becomes the Premier, and then they lose the election.


janfromthebruce
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Joined: Apr 24 2007

Michelle wrote:

janfromthebruce wrote:

The poisoned "Liberal" chalice - a Kim Campbell moment for sure.

I completely agree!  That's exactly what it will be if she wins.  The party is imploding already, but she'll wear it if she wins the leadership and becomes the Premier, and then they lose the election.

For sure. Nobody in Ontario, except some card carrying Liberals see the Liberals governing after their leadership race. The bad news just keeps on coming. I don't have anything good to say about the Ontario Liberal government and their representatives in govt, and in particular, the cabinet "players".

They made decisions and supported those decisions. Silence is condoning.


toaster
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Joined: Sep 5 2011

scott16 wrote:

If and hopefully when Mcguinty resigns his seat, will his riding Ottawa south be winnable for the NDP?

 

I think it's more likely to go PC than NDP.  It is not one of the 2-3 ridings in Ottawa where the NDP has a shot (Centre and Vanier)


ctrl190
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Joined: Mar 22 2004

Quick update as of Nov. 5...

In:

  • Glen Murray
  • Kathleen Wynne (as of this aft)

Possible:

  • Sandra Pupatello
  • Gerard Kennedy
  • Deb Matthews
  • Eric Hoskins
  • Charles Sousa

Out:

  • Dwight Duncan
  • Yasir Naqvi
  • Chris Bentley
  • George Smitherman
  • Laurel Broten

 


Brachina
Online
Joined: Feb 15 2012
Sandra Pupatello's in. Sandra has promised she won't recall the legislature until she wins a seat. Prolonged Progrueing, yep that'll be a winner, especially when we all know they'll be a general election in the spring. Oh and Sandra didn't run last year because she said the Province needed change. Which will look good in an attack ad, or as a simple reminder during the debates. Warren has revealed that Wynne is annoying Liberals with robocalls. Warren had endorsed meal ticket, er Sandra, so that explains why he's happy to throw Wynne under the bus. Glen Murray has promised that the day after he wins he will sit down Andrea and Hudak. Which is actually a good idea, but my instincts says he'll fold like a cheap suit to most of Andrea's demands, she'll be defacto Premier. Not that he'll win, I hear he has very few friends in the party. So far so Good, things look good for Andrea Horwath vs. these clowns. My prediction is Sandra wins.

ctrl190
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Joined: Mar 22 2004

Update. Is this the final slate?

  • Glen Murray
  • Kathleen Wynne
  • Sandra Pupatello
  • Gerard Kennedy
  • Eric Hoskins
  • Charles Sousa

Mr.Tea
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Joined: Jul 9 2011

Yeah, that seems to be the final slate. There's one other guy thinking about getting in (whose name I can't even remember).

The media seem to have annointed Sandra Pupatello as teh front-runner.

The outcome is hard to predict because it's not a one member, one vote type of situation like the NDP and Tories use (with preferentially ranked ballots). It's an old-fashioned delegated convention where each riding sends a certain number of delegates and then various party officials are all automatic delegates and you ahve different rounds of voting. It allows for a lot more convention dynamics and deal-making to take place so it's hard to say what will happen.

Personally, I think Eric Hoskins is the most impressive person running. Kathleen Wynne is smart and solid but not so dynamic. Pupatello has the dynamism she's missing. Gerrard Kennedy is a has-been. Glen Murray is an arrogant asshole. I really know little about Charles Sousa but I guess there's the possibility that he could emerge as a compromise candidate as others drop out at the convention. That's how McGuinty ended up winning back in 1996.


ctrl190
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Joined: Mar 22 2004

Perhaps its his junior level portfolios, but I always found Hoskins underwhelming. Considering the crowded field, outstanding debt from his federal campaign, and stigma as a "has been," Kennedy must clearly think he has a good shot. But I think Wynne is the most logical candidate in the event the left wing bands together in the final rounds.

I wonder if Pupatello benefits from being the only non GTA candidate?


Mr.Tea
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Joined: Jul 9 2011

I think she does benefit from that. There was a big push to draft John Wilkinson to be the flag bearer for rural ridings. I think given that Pupatello is the only one not from teh GTA will probably help her.

You're right when you say Hoskins hasn't done much of note since getting elected. I always thought it was a major step down for this Rhodes-scholar doctor who treated kids in war zones to go into Ontario politics and serve in junior portfolios. I actually met him a little over a year ago at a pub and we ended up having a nice chat. Seems all the good Liberals end up in St. Paul's. I also like his federal counterpart, Carolyn Bennet.


janfromthebruce
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Joined: Apr 24 2007

I've thought about the "number of Liberals" wanting to take the lead of the provincial Liberal party, when they are sitting way back in 3rd place in the polls, in minority situation, and knowing that an election will be right around the corner when the legislature re-convenes.

I see it as the "libs last stand" so to speak and circling of the wagons. The Libs are going down in B.C. election - that's a given. So their last stand is Ontario. See it as protecting the fortress in Canada.


Brachina
Online
Joined: Feb 15 2012
I agree Kennedy's a has been with a strong rep for defeat, Trudeau ran off with key parts of his campaign team, he's alienated various Liberals, and the Blue Grits hate him. As a delegated race, Sandra has the edge, she's got the connections. My bet is it comes down to Sandra and Kathleen, with Sandra taking it.

Policywonk
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Joined: Feb 6 2005

janfromthebruce wrote:

I've thought about the "number of Liberals" wanting to take the lead of the provincial Liberal party, when they are sitting way back in 3rd place in the polls, in minority situation, and knowing that an election will be right around the corner when the legislature re-convenes.

I see it as the "libs last stand" so to speak and circling of the wagons. The Libs are going down in B.C. election - that's a given. So their last stand is Ontario. See it as protecting the fortress in Canada.

The Liberals aren't going anywhere in PEI, but losing the three biggest provinces (size and population) will be a big blow to them.


janfromthebruce
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Joined: Apr 24 2007

P.E.I. has a population of 145,855. In comparison, Barrie in Ontario has a population of 166,634 and is rated 19th on the list of 100 largest cities in Canada. PEI didn't have one city listed here.

So yeah, Greater Toronto has become the Liberals last stand.


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