babble is rabble.ca's discussion board but it's much more than that: it's an online community for folks who just won't shut up. It's a place to tell each other — and the world — what's up with our work and campaigns.
Babble needs a forum: Animal Welfare
November 10, 2011 - 3:59pm
see below
The subject of animal welfare is broader than "animal rights" and it intersects with many other subject areas; to name a few - sports, agriculture & food, recreation, entertainment, hunting and fishing, environmental justice, public health, land management and planning, criminal justice, biodiversity, and activism.
More Canadians are living with companion animals now than ever before and we spend billions of dollars annually on them. Increasingly, we share our urban environments with wild animals that we have displaced from their natural habitats. We are also becoming more aware of concerns around the industrialization of agriculture and its effect on livestock and questions of food safety and food security. Climate change and habitat destruction are putting mass extinction of animal species on the agenda.
Humans are animals, too. Animal welfare is just an expansion of the category of human welfare.
I'm not saying an animal welfare forum would be popular. Since animals don't vote, I'm sure there would be little interest from the perennial ballot-box fetishists whose threads dominate the site these days. But it might help to attract new people.
Good idea. About attarcting different people too.
But take note that a lot of ballot box fetishists are also big on animal welfare.
I'm in favour. Really good idea. And with declining voter turnout, polling stations might be repurposed as shelters.
And ballot boxes make great homes for hamsters.
I've always admired the Bread n Roses forum "Critters Great and Small," so I'm not averse to this idea. I'd consider it if there's adequate support. What makes you think it would attract new hamsters babblers, M. Spector?
If we could get Lagatta back, that alone would be worth it.
Seriously, though, I don't know if it would attract new babblers. But I get the impression that the existing bunch doesn't contain a lot of animal rights activists, zoology majors, or cat ladies.
Whenever I get concerns about animal welfare issues, I never feel as if they fit in here, so I go elsewhere. Maybe that's just me. If anyone else likes the idea, maybe they'll post in this thread.
Generally speaking, I believe that people who concern themselves with these issues are left of centre for the most part, and they should be able to find a home here with the rest of us.
I love the idea. Question: how do we feel about PETA?
That can be the first thread in the new forum, if you like.
That's an idea.
I think this is a great idea.
Another good reason for babble to have an animal welfare forum: Rabble.ca has in recent months greatly increased its original content related to animal rights/animal welfare.
As a complement to Rabble's content, babble needs to get with the program.
As a new babbler, I support the suggestion. The category of animal welfare is sufficiently broad to encompass such disparate topics as ethical farming and livestock maintenance, municipal licensing of domestic pets, protection of native species in the wild, regulation of animal use in research, etc.
Let's go for it.
Wish we had a "like" button - I like post #12 as well as Spector's.
Hi infracaninophile! Welcome to babble and thanks for speaking up for this idea--I'm warming to it, and so is Rebecca West. I'd like to hear from a few more babblers on the subject--why Animal Welfare and not, say, Homelessness, Peace Forum, etc. (notwithstanding the valid reasons we've already heard)? And is there a way to merge AW with Environmental Justice, or are they fundamentally different?
Hey, we've already got a newbie interested just by talking about this!
Here are some possible thread titles we might find in an animal welfare forum:
• The campaign to close Quality Meat Packers in Toronto
• Sled-dog tourism in B.C.
• Vegetarianism: political strategy or personal lifestyle choice?
• Using animals in medical research
• Using animals in product safety testing
• Using animals for military purposes
• Canada's toothless animal cruelty laws
• What to do about bunnies at U Vic?
• Dog racing: commodifying animals for human entertainment
• Rhino horns and tiger bones: destruction of wildlife in the service of pseudoscience and superstition
• Highlights of the 8th World Congress on Alternatives and Animal Use in the Life Sciences in Montreal
• Do people care more about cruelty to animals than cruelty to humans?
• Sustainable methods of animal husbandry
• Major species under pressure from climate change
• Banning the seal hunt
• Therapeutic uses for pets
• Stop canine profiling!
• Do animals have personhood?
• Legitimate forms of animal hunting
• So you're a vegan. What do you feed your cat?
• Do polar bears belong in zoos?
• Animal chiropractic: Fake or Fraud?
• The Iditarod race and sled-dog cruelty
• Humane forms of pest control
• Does sheep-shearing need to be cruel?
• Birds versus wind turbines
I think it is a good idea.
I think there is a lot of cross over between animal rights/environmental issues and progressive politics in general that it would attract more babblers.
In fact if we get it, I'll make a point of advertising it to some animal rights people I know from another on line venue.
Don't forget this guy -- he needs the forum too. Beauty isn't everything. This Ontario native has recently been added to the Threatened Species list.
Support the Ontario Turtle Tally:
http://www.torontozoo.com/adoptapond/turtletally.asp
Also a group on Facebook, check it out.
Should be interesting. Especially when you get a case like the Canmore bunny cull. Of course this is a case where the little critters with the twitchy noses and doeful eyes are feral domestic rabbits, not indigenous hares or jackrabbits. But of course, they are just so damn cute that the problems with introduced species seem to be buried under the indignation of people who have pets just like them. [rolleyes]
I support the creation of an animal rights/animal welfare forum!
I forget where I found this, but we've had a good discussion on Facebook:
Inside the mind of the octopus
I like the comments that follow the article, especially this one: "Fabulous article. Why is it we are surprised that other creatures think? Ours is only one consciousness amongst many. But articles like this are beautiful reminders of the majesty and mystery of life. "
Thanks for the octopus link, Boom Boom.
This has always been my thought about octopuses, as well. If we imagine that there is intelligent life in outer space, it would have evolved in very different circumstances from our own, and might be as hard to recognize (at least initially) as the intelligence of the octopus, which has evolved, of course, entirely in an ocean environment.
The last common ancestor of both humans and octopuses was a sea creature that had essentially no brain at all, so the intelligences of both humans and octopuses evolved quite independently of each other.
Several years ago I saw an underwater video of an octopus opening a jar to get at the contents. Fascinating stuff.
Fine. Are there any objections to merging an animal welfare forum with Environmental Justice? The forum topics need a bit of reorganizations anyway, it's true, but I don't want to overload the page with forums.
In conclusion:
I don't actually know what that means. Does it mean simply changing the name to something like "Environmental Justice and Animal Welfare"?
Yes, exactly. It's a bit of an ugly portmanteau, but it might work.
Well, essentially what you are saying is "No, we can't have an Animal Welfare forum. If you want to post on animal welfare topics, do it in Environmental Justice."
I'm not saying anything. I'm asking for feedback and giving a suggestion--which is expanding (or even narrowing) the environmental forum. If that doesn't suit the expectations/desires of those who want an exclusive AW forum, then we can work something out.