Do you feel that the acrimony in BC politics is a bad thing?

prowsej:

Welcome to the "wild west" politics that is BC provincial politics. It is quite acrimonious and has always been.  The reason being is the polarization of the political spectrum here in BC.  Thats nothing new in BC politics except for the fact that the Campbell Liberals are dominated by the far right of the political spectrum (think Harper's Neo Cons) while the NDP is being dominated by the "activist" agenda of the groups within its own party.

In actuality, the cementing of this polarization came about when the Liberals took power in 2001.  When you hold a 77 to 2 majority I guess you can get pretty arrogant pretty quick. It started with legislation like Bill 29, which ripped up collective agreements between the govt and unions like the Health Employees Union. This violated contract law, drew the condemnation of various groups in the world, and when looked at objectively from a non partisan point of view, was nothing more than a vicious attack on working people and their rights.  Elements of the Bill were overturned by the Supreme Court of Canada in 2007, and it cost the taxpayers of BC over 80 million dollars in "reparations."  And thats only one example of a broken promise so viciously delivered. The sale of BC Rail is another one. It was such a good deal for the citizens of BC that when you look at the public document, 99 percent of it is blacked out.  A premier convicted of drunk driving, yet not resigning at all. The same premier that called for the head of Glen Clark over a mere allegation of impropriety over a sundeck. Mr. Clark was later found NOT GUILTY, but no apology or any comment coming from Campbell on that one. Clark did it right, resigned, and is now doing very well in the private sector. Meanwhile the people of BC are stuck with a convict for premier. Not namecalling, just the truth.

But as they say, you get the government you deserve, and the good citizens thought it just to send the jailbird back into office with a greatly reduced majority granted, in 2005.

The BC Liberals are the socreds on major steroids. I remember thinking how right wing Bill Bennett jr and Bill Vanderzalm were. Particularly Vanderzalm. He was the poster child of the religious right at the time in BC. Well today, those 2 look more like communists, when held up in comparison to Campbell. Never would I have ever thought that I would see Bill Vanderzalm at a labour rally in my lifetime. But there he was over the issue of off shoring the building of ferries for BC Ferries. And also on the issue of the attempted privatization of BC Hydro. What has the world come to when you look at the past, at people who were highly adversarial who now you stand alongside of?

Thats how far right the Libs have gone. Ask the small business people who took it up the butt over the Canada Line construction. Ask the people who are now going to be forever indebted to a foreign company to pay for a bridge to be built, when the govt could borrow the money at a vastly cheaper rate than the private companies can under Public Private partnerships.  Yet ideology rules their logic and it has to be a 3P.

On the other side of the spectrum you have the BCNDP. Its a coalition of trade unionists, environmentalists (though with the carbon tax debate they may be leaving in droves) socialists and at the far left of the party communist / leninists.  Without rehashing my views on things (you can search my handle out and read away yourself)  I think that joe / jane average BC voter, one that wants the strong social programs with fiscal responsibility, those people who are pragmatic and want to have balance in the province, have been totally abandoned, as the positions of both parties have crystalized on the right and left respectively. And when they look at the Greens, they're all over the place and not the right party for them.

So what happens now? I think that a majority of British Columbian views aren't represented by either one of the 3 main political parties in BC. And yet every campaign its the same thing. Both parties chase those people and most vote one way or the other. Yet in government their views are chucked out the window, in favour of the small minority of groups on both sides of the spectrum who pull the strings through various means. As old Todd Bertuzzi said....

"it is what it is" 

prowsej, the word "corruption" bothers you? I would suggest that's rather mild, compared to what could be said about them. Perhaps a more accurate term would have been better, but they don't have to prove why the Liberals are corrupt. It's their opinion that slashing funding to Legal Aid and then lying about it is a symptom of corruption. Works for me.

Yeah, no kidding. I would have liked to have seen that. My impression of the Zalm though was always that he was a social conservative whereas Campbell is an extreme fiscal conservative, and not, I don't think, as interested in the social issues. (And Harper, I think, is both.)

Just as an aside,

what exactly did they take up the butt, and what's wrong with taking things up the butt?

I did, and it was no scandal, and BCers would not even have lost money on them had not Gordo off loaded them for a fraction of their worth. A bad deal, much like the BC Rail CN boondoggle.

How about we talk about Gordo's more recent boondoggle, his off shoring the building of new ferries, which are worse than the Cats ever were.  Have a look into them.

Moreover, I disagree with their, the Cats, removal from use.

Just some things:

1. Never ever trust what you read on wikpedia. Fact is is that the Campbell Fiberals kept the Fast Cats in plain view at the dry dock for a few years after winning the election, to remind people about the fiasco surrounding the boats. When they got their mileage out of that, they auctioned them off at Canada Place... to Vancouver Shipyards, oh sorry Seaspan Int'l. Same company that built them, bought them for a fraction of what they cost to build. Would have been better salvaging them and selling the parts off, would have got more money.  Did I ever ride one. No.

That project was a case in point of political interference screwing up what could have been a great project. The Fast Cat  project was Fast Tracked and major changes were made in the design that made the boats too heavy and too low in the water, so that debris was constantly getting caught in their intakes. The boats would have been good in the open seas, just not in coastal waters. (my opinion only.)  It wasn't the workers that screwed up the fast cats, it was the constant political interference on  the project. Yet the workers were made to pay for it by being denied the opportunity to build the new C class boats.

In terms of the boats built in Germany, like the fast cats, they too are tied up at the dry docks on the Fraser. A strictly ideological manoever by an ideological idiot. A so called business like government does not get how money spent locally on building things is a spin off effect long term.

In terms of the small business people and the Canada Line project. Particularly on the Cambie portion. Those people were flat out lied to when it came to the issue of disruption of business when "cut and cover" tunnelling was used vs boreing a tunnel. The net effect was that Cambie street resembled a war zone, with traffic single laned all the way, and a huge major disruption of foot traffic and other traffic for a significant amount of time. Now they're talking about a connection east west to UBC, and have mentioned not using cut and cover apparently.

Though I'm a trade unionist, I'm also of the belief that government projects should not do permanent damage to a person's livelihood, and that includes small businesses. Gregor Robertson did a good job in speaking out for the Cambie Merchants, and along with Susan Heyes really pounded on this so called "business like government" over their ineptitude over this project. But no one has seen anything yet when it comes to boondoggles. Just wait for the new Port Mann bridge. All Public Private Partnership for no discernable reason.

Surely the government can get money at a better rate than I get on my mortgage. (Note: that rate currently is 2.25%) Yet in these tough times to try and attain credit, we're going to get hooked for probably around 9 to 11 percent. One could argue that Campbell and his bunch couldn't manage a lemonade stand, without paying off all their buddies first.

Wrote a long post back to you last night that never made to the site apparently. Anyhow the gist of it was:

1. Your link does not show that the NDP were sellling them for FAIR market value, and were not giving them away as perhaps payment for political support.

2. You are completely ignoring the actions of the BC Liberals such as campaign trail intimidation, the lies about a fudget budget which were not correct, the CN BC Rail fiasco, the lies about Glen's deck, the gutting privatization of the social welfare system which now costs the BC taxpayers more, plus plus plus...there is good reason for BC people  and workers to have acrimony against Gordo.

3. Your article has John Winter, the Vancouver centric corporate shill, making statements that are way off base. And good find on finding an article from 2000, seeing as how you JUST moved here to BC. Makes me realize that you are perhaps more than you seem, or try to appear here.

4.  Read some back issues of the Tyee, the Walrus and perhaps the Straight to inform yourself a bit more, if that is you are actually interested in reality and not what the BC media wants you to believe, or what you want to put forth.

Ya, there is, how about you find the resale price that Seaspan got for them,  I won't bother providing you with a  LINK, because I believe you are being disengenuous at best.

Plus the whole BS around BC Rail should be causing you concern it isn't which indicates where you are at.

Pardon me jprowse i thought they had sold them to China, it was a different ferry i see.