martin dufresne
rabble-rouser-supreme
Member: 12463
Joined: Dec 24 2005

If folks would prefer this discussion be limited to women, I'll support that and bow out.

Until then, two tropes I have difficulty accepting is "Trans are X. If you disagree, you're transphobic" (or whatever nasty bullying term one can come up with). With a group as diverse as transgendered folks (I alluded to the Feinberg definitiion of "all who have at some point not conformed to gender norms", this attempt at generalization ("Trans are X...") seems unrealistic. For instance, I am definitely transgender by that standard. Is it just a matter of uttering the word?

The second trope I disagree with is more tricky. It is the bridge between trans' sense of identity (whichever) and other communities alleged obligations to them. It seems to me there is a disconnect there, as if there could not be negotiations between groups, with both entitled, but merely subservience to whichever claims of identity, as equal to entitlement. If the latter, and if the main group doesn't bow to a minority opinion that would claim non-negotiable entitklement for trans, the space where to resolve the issue seems to be the courts, no? (So far, women who resist such claims by M-to-F trans have been vindicated by the tribunals.)

Just my .02 - and I am out of here if you prefer... or posting no more than once a day. These are issues I am really working on and I am much appreciative of the reference posted by Maysie: My Gender Workbook of which I've read all I could on-line.

 


Trans Inclusion and Feminism By: Maysie (45 replies) July 18, 2009 - 8:38am
  • I see men browbeating women By: martin dufresne (Jul 18 2009 - 11:16pm)
  • Now that is funny, By: remind (Jul 19 2009 - 12:29am)
  • Michael Nenonen By: RosaL (Jul 18 2009 - 11:15pm)
  • RosaL: I think that the By: Michael Nenonen (Jul 18 2009 - 11:07pm)
  • Quote: "Sex” refers to By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 11:11pm)
  • What infosaturated is By: RosaL (Jul 18 2009 - 10:22pm)
  • Here's a good article on By: Michael Nenonen (Jul 18 2009 - 10:17pm)
  • I think I found the perfect By: Infosaturated (Jul 18 2009 - 9:07pm)
  • Ze wrote:   All the trans By: Infosaturated (Jul 18 2009 - 7:38pm)
  • Boze wrote: If you have a By: Infosaturated (Jul 18 2009 - 6:52pm)
  • All the trans women I know, By: Ze (Jul 18 2009 - 7:36pm)
  • The thing is that our By: martin dufresne (Jul 18 2009 - 6:10pm)
  • Maysie wrote: The groovy By: RosaL (Jul 18 2009 - 6:12pm)
  • Michael Nenonen wrote: 1. No By: Maysie (Jul 18 2009 - 5:27pm)
  • Infosaturated wrote:I don't By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 5:02pm)
  • If you have a better way to By: Boze (Jul 18 2009 - 4:28pm)
  • Infosaturated wrote:  To By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 4:14pm)
  • Your posts are transphobic, By: Boze (Jul 18 2009 - 3:55pm)
  • Maysie wrote: As for the By: Infosaturated (Jul 18 2009 - 3:37pm)
  • I did not get anyone banned By: Infosaturated (Jul 18 2009 - 3:13pm)
  • Maysie wrote: Gender is By: RosaL (Jul 18 2009 - 3:02pm)
  • As to the issue itself, I By: Maysie (Jul 18 2009 - 2:22pm)
  • I want to register my By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 2:03pm)
  • I didn't know about Boze's By: Maysie (Jul 18 2009 - 1:53pm)
  • ! By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 12:32pm)
  • It might be worthwhile to By: Michael Nenonen (Jul 18 2009 - 12:16pm)
  • And my point stands, you By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 11:33am)
  • That makes me feel quite By: Boze (Jul 18 2009 - 11:13am)
  • Well aren't you "just By: remind (Jul 18 2009 - 10:55am)
  • A person whose understanding By: Stargazer (Jul 18 2009 - 10:50am)
  • This is a very difficult By: Maysie (Jul 18 2009 - 10:32am)
  • Quote:I'd like to continue By: Boze (Jul 18 2009 - 10:17am)
  • Many trans people prefer to By: Stargazer (Jul 18 2009 - 10:14am)
  • If folks would prefer this By: martin dufresne (Jul 18 2009 - 10:15am)
  • Infosaturated wrote: What By: Maysie (Jul 18 2009 - 8:51am)