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Why would any "professional Israeli basher" deny that the US client state of Kuwait ethnically cleansed the Palestinians that another US client state (Israel) originally cleansed? I mean, I am not a professional, and maybe that is why I have always thought that the situation in Kuwait highlighted the brutal reality inflicted on Palestinian Arabs that began with their expulsion from Palestine in 1948.
If I remember correctly He reminded them about Rumsfeld's visit to Saddam; true, but Rumsfled is hardly a man of integrity either.
As I remember it all of the allegations about Galloway personally profitting from his opposition to sanctions and the Iraq war were dropped by the senate sub-committee on the oil for food program, (he was never personally charged and the Committee never took up Galloway's challenge to charge him with perjury} and documents that were found that alleged he personally profited were found to have be of dubious quality, and that Galloway won a libel suit against the newspaper that made those allegation, and no evidence has been brought forward to support those allegations.
Nothing was ever established to show that charities managed by Galloway disbursed funds for anything but the intended purposes, even though it was established that Iraqi business people did contribute to those charities. This, Galloway openly admited in his address to the sub-committee.
The Christian Science Monitor also retracted its story concerning millions of dollars that it said Galloway received from that Iraqi government, and it too later retracted that story, apologizing and concluding that the original documents upon which their story was based were "almost certainly" sophisticated forgeries.
Winning 150000 pounds is a substantial reward, but suing for it and winning in court does not amount to "bottom kissing" in my books. Rather I would say it was the Telegraph that was proved to be engaged in bottom-feeding. We do not know how much in damages the CSM dished out, but I think it is pretty safe to say that someone went through an awful lot of effort to smear Mr. Galloway by alleging that he personally profitted from his dealings with the Baath government in Iraq, an allegation you seem to be repeating.
Well the libel laws in UK are quite different from (and a lot more plaintif-friendly than) US and Canada. However, my main beef with him is his position on Iran, and the fact that he works for an organ of the Iranian government is not something he can deny or hide. I recall we had our debate over the election issue, however considering the news and events since then I am sure you'd agree that a man of integrity would pause before collaborating with a regime that has been condemned by many progressives (no less than Noam Chomsky, Desmond Tutu and many others) for horrifying human right abuses.
The Christian Scenice Monitor is based in the USA so it is US and not British libel law that applied. After he filed suit, they collapsed. It also agreed upon further investigation that the documents were fraudulent.
Christian Science Monitor
But that is the great thing about smear campaign, the gullible will believe them because they want to believe them and they will repeat the smear forever. Perhaps you want to try again starting with the silly youtube clip, since you don't have anything else to undermine his credibility ad hominem... well, not unless you want to argue the points of his position... but perhaps that is to much for you?
So, no, I don't agree that there is anything substantive to suggest that Mr. Galloway "collaborated" with Saddam Hussein. Meeting with foreign government officials and saying nice things about them and arguing against bombing their countries into oblivion, does not amount to collaboration in my books.
You misunderstood my post. when I said collaboration, I was talking about Iran.
I didn't misunderstand your post at all. You asserted that the reason that Galloway won his libel suit was because of the nature of British libel laws.
You were clearly under the impression that previous accussations against Galloway concerning recieving funds from the Iraqi government were substantive. They were indeed based on complete forgeries, and you and the Christian Science Monitor were duped. Now you are clearly trying to divert attention away from the fact that what you previously believed was proven to be false by suggesting that because he did a few shows for PressTV he is an employee of the Iranian state.
I personally don't care if the US and the Israelis turn Tehran into a pile of smoldering ruins. What amazes me is that anyone from there actually thinks that somehow Iran is to be saved by the west. Indeed, the only thing that concerns the imperial power is power, and unless there is a compliant regieme, they prefer no regieme and ruination of the nation.
Indeed, if their latest exploits are to be any kind of guide the might actually prefer ruination to compliance. Compliance usually requires some kind of give and take, whereas ruination requires taking only.
You made lots of assumptions about what I must have or have not thought, and most of your assumptions are incorrect. The part of debate that I participated in, was about Galloway's integrity or lack thereof, and I showed that a man so inconsistent who claims to be a supporter of oppressed people while working for another oppressive regime can hardly be a man of integrity. The main focus of my argument was always about Iran and Galloway's working for press TV (while his handshake with Uday Hussein was a sidenote example).
BTW thanks for giving us the only two options of ruin versus compliance! Typical self-centered mentality of a westerner. Fortunately, the world imperial powers (as you put it) are not as dominant as you may think, and as history has shown many times, oppressed nations can find much better options than the choice of cancer versus plague.
For the most part, as far as I know, the main body of the media work that Galloway has done on the PressTV time, all revolved around Palestinian issues, and the Operation Cast Lead where the IOF masseacred over 1500 Palestinians in the Gaza Strip, including a large number of civilians and children. I don't see how this qualifies as supporting the opressor, against the oppressed, indeed it seems to me to be the complete opposite.
You seem a little annoyed at being give limited options "ruin' versus "compliance". I thought you might appreciate this logic, since this kind of dual paradigm of "with us or against us", is precisely the logic that lets you arrive at the conclusion that because Galloway's opinions on Israel happen to largely conform to those of the Iranian government, and that they allowed him to air those views on their English language television station, that this therefore means that he and Amedinejad are in league with each other.
Indeed the former Prime Minister of Britain's wife's half sister has also done similar work with PressTV. I guess you would have us believe that members of Tony Blair's family are agents of the Iranian state as well? Given this one might argue the obverse. If one was really to take the logic of your guilt by association accussation to its proper conclusion one could say that PressTV has been infiltrated by persons with links to the British government opposed to Iran, and is working as a propaganda arm of the British elite.
'Gorgeous George' To Sue Ottawa Over Privacy - National Post Front Page
http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/Gorgeous+George+Ottawa+over+pri...
"Canada was once admired and loved around the world, but is now seen as 'no more than an embassy for Benjamin Netanyahu,' and 'a trumpet for the most extreme Israeli politicians,' the anti-war former British MP told an audience yesterday in a downtown Toronto United Church.."
Di Manno: George Galloway Not A Terrorist Just A Holy Terror - Toronto Star
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/870118--dimanno-george-galloway-...
"George Galloway is not a terrorist. A holy terror, foaming-at-the-mouth blovian, one-trick pony, anti-war crusader and Israel demonizer..'I hate terrorism, be it by a man with a beard in a tunnel in Tora Bora or a man in a suit in the White House!' Galloway thundered Sunday to rapturous applause from an audience of some 600 or so Galloway Groupies, a full house nuthouse of acolytes who finally got the opportunity to hear their idol speak...the Rush Limbaugh loudmouth of the ultra-left...just a demogogue darling of the idiot-ocracy.."
George Galloway Challenges Jason Kenney to 'Go Five Rounds' in a Public Debate
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/george-falloway-challenges-...
"I think Jason Kenny did very much the right thing when he pointed the finger and said here is a man whom we know has raised money for terrorist causes and that is a concern. I hope that the magnifying glass would be more on that than anything else..." Bernie Farber Canadian Jewish Congress
Jason Kenney Refuses to Stroke George Galloway's Chin
http://theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/jason-kenney-re...
"Minister Kenney has no interest in getting entangled in another one of George Galloway's desperate cries for someone - anyone - to notice him.." Jason Kenney's Communications Director
Jason Kenney should resign over his actions re: the Galloway file
kennyj@parl.gc.ca
pm@pm.gc.ca
That's not true. By that logic, should I call every supporter of Palestinian cause an agent of Iranian government? Many high profile supporters of Iranian democracy movement are also strong supporters of the Palestinian cause: Hamid Dabashi, Desmond Tutu, Noam Chomsky,.. In fact, Ahmadinejad's position on Palestine is one that has been rejected even by Palestinians.
As per links that I posted, Galloway did not limit himself to the Palestinian causes on press tv and other speeches but also openly supported the Iranian government in cracking down on the protesters whiel calling it a "democracy". Obviously if all Galloway had done was to support Palestinians on Iranian Press TV (like many anti-zionist groups around the world do), I would still question his choice of venue but would not consider him an agent of the Iranian government.
'agent of the Iranian government'
...I think we should be touching bottom any time now.
Ok. How does comparing the Iranian election to the fraudulent Florida vote that won George Bush his first term in office, and then saying that such did not deligitimize the American government in the eyes of the west amount to supporting Amedinejad's regieme? Saying that Iranian democracy has "come a long way" in that context is neither to deny allegations of fraud, or to openly support Amedinejad. It is actually more a statement that charges western critics of hypocrisy when they denounce fraud in Iran, but ignore it in the US.
If the matter was tried in the UK:
Then UK law would certainly apply.
So, the claim made by the Christian Science Monitor that the documents were actually discovered to be forgeries was a lie that Galloway insisted that it should print as part of their out of court settlement?
The Christian Science Monitor's later investigation that revealed the documents to be forgeries doesn't really have anything at all do with the fact that the matter was heard in the UK according to UK law, not U.S. law.
The reiteration of a debating point originaly intended to imply that allegation that were not true, were true serves what point in a discussion about wether or not Galloway was a paid agent of the Iraqi state?
You made an error in thinking that U.S. law would apply to a British citizen's libel suit against the Christian Science Monitor simply because that publication is based in the U.S. I corrected this error - nothing more, nothing less.
So, in other words you agree that there was no substantive proof that Galloway recieved funds from the Iraqi governement, and that the document are actually evidence that there is a very evolved campaign to smear him?
Planting forged documents in Iraqi government buildings later to be found by investigators shortly after the US occupation began, gives us some clues as to possible suspects. But of course some people are more intersted in talking about embarassing Youtube clips, and US and UK libel law.
This bears repeating:
This isn't an example of a mere mishtake, Farber is actively lying in a sleazy attempt to smear Galloway as a terrorist.
Most definitely. And maybe Farber and CJC can join Jason Kenney and the Government of Canada on the receiving end of Galloway's contemplated lawsuit?
sanizadah said:
"But I guess we may have different standards."
I can't imagine how you would know what my standards are.
I freely admitted that I didn't have much information on this topic and asked people to explain why they disliked Galloway so much, since up to then no explanations had been given. Your strange eagerness to smear me doesn't bode well for the credibility of your claims. In fact, Cueball seems to be demolishing them quite handily. You've gone from "happily receives a paycheck by a fascist dictatorship to regularly defend the arrest and torture of thousands of human right activists, journalists and students", to " once called Iran a democracy". Bit of a gulf between those two, I'd say. And once again Cueball disagrees with even this claim.
I am interested in hearing your response to this: "How does comparing the Iranian election to the fraudulent Florida vote that won George Bush his first term in office, and then saying that such did not deligitimize the American government in the eyes of the west amount to supporting Amedinejad's regieme?"
A lie? Don't think so. There is plenty of evidence that galloway gave cash to Hamas. And whether you like it or not Hamas is a terrorist group so identified by Canada, Usa, UK etc. ee for yourself http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/2060.htm
I guess he decided to wait until he had a clear case. Now he has one: backed up by a ruling by a Federal court judge stating that he was not delivering material aid to terrorists, as alleged by Kenny, Farber and that assimilated Jewish fascist guy whose a fan of mass murderer Baruch Goldstien, whose name I can't remember now because I am in a particularly good mood.
As Galloway said in his talk, Hamas was elected in the only free and fair democratic election ever held in the Arab world and the only people entitled to choose the leadership of the Palestinian people are the Palestinian people themselves. Here, a federal judge just ruled essentially that Galloway is not a terrorist or a supporter of terrorism. Clearly, obviously and self-evidently, Israel is the "terrorist group" not Palestinians or their elected government. That various imperialists and their lapdogs like Canada define Palestinian resistance as "terrorism" indicts only the accusers not the resisters. Fuck them, Jason Kenny, Bernie Farber and anyone else who attempts to argue such oppression is justified or right.
Pffft! MemriTV is an outfit run by "former" Mossad agents. Please! And I thought you were concerned about Galloway's credibility.
Dressing up like a pussy cat might make you look silly, but posting media stories filtered through Mossad front organizations makes you look like twice the fool for trying. Go peddle that tripe over on the Sun comments section or something. The only reason that its not mistranslated is because the original video is in english already. Their Arabic translations are often fanciful to say the least.
In anycase that speech and that evidence was part of the material which the Federal Court judge used to determine that Galloway was not a terrorist.
Anything new? Did Memri come up with a set of documents found in an Iraqi government building showing that he recieved 10 million dollars from Sadam Hussien's government... oh sorry, tried that already... A copy of a cancelled cheque signed by Ahmed Yassin? A copy of Mein Kempf autographed "in solidarity" by Rantisi with trace amounts of blood matching that of a suicide bomber? A picture of Galloway throwing a rock at an Israeli check point,.. anything?
I really enjoyed some of Galloway's one liners and remarks on the rabble live streaming video. Here is a sampling
Galloway made reference to the decision as "the greatest caning by a judge of a government minister in history." He went on to discuss this "judicial thrashing of Mr. Kenny by the judge" in very interesting and informative terms. Minister Kenny, said G, is one of those people who are "always ready to fight to the last drop ... of somebody else's blood." Galloway rightly challenged the Minister of Censorship in a number of ways, including a "challenge to a public debate anywhere, anytime, anyplace". Said Galloway, "Jason Kenny, you can run but you can't hide." And so on.
"He started lying about me ... and I'm never going to stop telling the truth about him."
Now, while I haven't heard the whole video, there is one other line that bears repeating. It's quite important.
Oh yea. That's important. Conservatives and other losers take note. Your ass just got kicked. ha ha. How's it feel? Sore ass? Rest assured, Galloway will be coming back to deliver a further caning of his own. I can hardly wait. It should be informative, entertaining, and likely to result in the firing of yet another of Harper's Gauleiters. Mmm mmm good.
Meir Weinstein. The activities of the JDL have been described by the FBI, in congressional testimony before and after 9/11, as terrorist. (The organization itself is not listed, note.)
Ah, Alykhan "Infandous" Velshi, the smirky popinjay who is Kenney's "communications director" and who led the public campaign last year against Galloway. It seemed fairly clear then that he was being fed information from the JDL -- tsk tsk. So that's where the catsuit story is coming from -- it figures. Some of us comment here for free, y'know.