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Libby has strong leadership qualities, but that's not enough. An NDP leader needs to have a great deal of personal integrity and a commitment to hard work and Libby,, demonstrably, has both those qualities. As far as being bilingual goes, the French language can be learned.
I have to disagree there. Being fluently bilingual on day one is essential. The NDP has too much to lose in francophone Quebec for it to be otherwise.
I just watched those. Quite fascinating.
Besides being fluently bilingual and fully knowledgeable about NDP policy, the next leader will have to be someone who (like Jack Layton) can stand up to Harper and his bullies (especially John Baird) in the House of Commons in fierce debate - and stand up to insults and slurs and not wither away. It's a tough environment. I think Mulcair is the one MP the Cons think twice about trying to provoke because I've seen him give as well as he gets.
yeah, totally agree that french is totally essential, but don't think it's enough. the next leader needs to understand quebec on a fundamental level, it's over half of the caucus. the more this evolves, the more strongly i feel about mulcair (my one reservation is on his left credentials. he's a great lieutenant, but not sure if he has the heart to lead the progressive forces of this country). that said, julian is also pretty compelling, and at any rate, i'd love to see a top shelf quebec union leader or mayor jump into the race so that whichever leader we eventually choose at least comes across as the result of a legitimate contest that involved quebec at a basic level.
I've seen people make this assertion before but the answer in this context is a great, big NO. You don't at the age of 60 just wake up one morning and say "oh gee, i think I'll become totally fluent in French and by this time next year, you won't even be able to tll that my mother tongue is actually English". It does not work that way. Children under the age of 7 can pick up a language very quickly. For adults it involves a commitment of YEARS of study and immersion where learning French is your full-time job 24 hours a day, seven days a week - and even then you will probably never achieve real fluency. In the case of Libby Davies, she has been an MP since 1997 and all those years she has had access to free state of the art French lessons. If she didn't manage to achieve total, perfect, flawless French after 14 years of having access to those lessons - we have to assume that she isn't going to do it in the next few months because a few people think she shoudl become leader.
The next leader of the NDP will have to as close as possible to being PERFECTLY bilingual from the day they announce their candidacy. On the job training is not an option.
It's one thing if you're a back bencher to devote some time to learning a new language on the job - but the leader??? Probably impossible.
At best, if you were an anglophone who already spoke French quite well, you MIGHT be able to argue that you would some some immersion programs to raise the level of your French - but if your French can't be described as "fluent" to begin with then you really cannot be considered a serious leadership candidate. The same would go for anyone French speaking who didn't speak English.
Although didn't Harper himself start learning French after he became the Conservative leader? I'm not sure.
Awesome videos Sara Mayo.
I agree with some of what stockholm has said, bilingualism is required, especially with such a large QC caucus. There are still seats we can win in QC as well as in other provinces with francophone communities. Alot of NDP support comes from populism, and that has to be communicated properly.
(Edit: I smell sarcasm below me)
Good point - with such a huge Quebec caucus, it would be foolish to elect a new leader that is barely competent in French!
No actually Harper got serious about learning French even in high school and back in the 90s when he was a Reform MP, he was often on panels on Radio-Canada because he was the only Reform MP who could speak French.
I didn't say being bilingual wasn't essential - it is. I said one can learn French. Libby can become fluent if she chooses to run. I used to teach ESL. It doesn't take long to acquire a new language under the right circumstances.
Not in time she can't, unless the Telefrancais magic pineapple casts a spell on her or something.
Well, we had French taught to us in 1959 when I was in primary school just outside Ottawa - but it was taught orally, and I'm hard of hearing - and I never really picked it up. I took French for a year as an adult and have a certificate for Basic French, but it was really, really difficult for me - some folks just don't take to learning a new language the way others do, and if, like me, you have a disability (deafness) it's even more difficult.
That of course would have meant Jack was not a possible leadership choice. He did travel for quite some time with a French coach while he got up to speed.
I find it hilarious that Jack is the gold medal standard and he would not make the grade in this new universe.
Drama surrounding succession of Jack Layton 'Shakespearean'
http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Drama+surrounding+succession+Jack+Layto...
Thanks to Sara Mayo for posting the video links. Really worth watching. I was impressed with Mulcair and his background.
Everyone has to remember that the NDP leader is someone who has to represent the party and its values across the whole country, but if she or he is succesful in doing so, there will be many opportunities for others to have a huge impact within government. Just as an example, Libby Davis would obviously be a Cabinet Minister and have great influence in her own portfolio as well as around the Cabinet table. Consequently I am more concerned about who can best do the job of representing the NDP and continuing to build the party - and maybe win the next election. I suppose what I am saying is that I would rather have a left wing Cabinet Minister and an MOR NDP PM then a left wing leader of a (once again) third party. Not that I would identify Mulcair as on the 'right' of the NDP necessarily. He did resign from a Cabinet position over a a matter of principle and that is no small matter.
The Beyond Politics links really are a treasure trove. I look at many of those people in a slightly different light now.
It's Jack's success that raised the bar, so that 2003 French isn't good enough for our leader in 2011. I think that should be obvious.
That's exactly what a good party leader ought to do - elevate the standard for his or her successor.
The new NDP leader has to be able to communicate effectively in both languages right away. I don't see how to get around this given the composition of caucus. It would be embarrassing to have a leader that isn't at least the equal of Stephen Harper in French.
That's exactly what a good party leader ought to do - elevate the standard for his or her successor.
The new NDP leader has to be able to communicate effectively in both languages right away. I don't see how to get around this given the composition of caucus. It would be embarrassing to have a leader that isn't at least the equal of Stephen Harper in French.
Well, there will have to be one or more leadership debates in french, if you stop and think about it - which will be a huge difference from 2003. That should separate the wheat from the chaff. I think government french is acceptable for someone running to raise an issue or represent a constituency within our movement, but to be truly competitive as a candidate (esp. in debates like that), fluency is going to become an obvious criterion very quicly.
exactly. 59 quebec mps, and government within reach with only another 30-35. it's all completely different, a new universe, like you say.
I would be deeply offended if the next leader did not speak serviceable French. This was one of the reasons I supported Jack in 2003. It is true that in that race there were several candidates that did not speak French, but no one was asking them then to immediately demonstrate the ability to be Prime Minister. About one third of this country speaks French and the Leader of the Official Opposition is considered the Prime Minister in waiting. For a francophobic party like Reform maybe it would be acceptable to have a non-bilingual leader, but for a party that preaches inclusion and diversity like the NDP, shutting out the country's 1/3rd of French speakers, especially after Québec so overwhelmingly rejected the sovereigntist Bloc Québecois, would be heartless.
Can you name an affiliate that isn't a Labour organization?
Olivia Chow won't endorse a leadership candidate.
That's a very good point. Our youngest child, who has epilepsy, is in a French Immersion P.S., and because of the cognitive and retention issues associated with her form of epilepsy, she has to work much harder at the language than most of her peers. That's precisely why I qualified what I said about learning a 2nd language fairly quickly under the right circumstances.
Yes, age and innate ability are also factors, but teaching another language in a mainstream public school setting and teaching a language as a 2nd language is different. Several years ago I co-taught an English Immersion course to a 50-something Quebec francophone business executive. I did not focus on written language, because it does take longer for most people to learn to write in a language than it does to speak it and understand it when it is spoken. Reading the acquired language is also relatively easy as compared to writing in it.
It also depends upon your starting point - if your current knowledge of the language is rated beginner, low-intermediate, high-intermediate or advanced, your progress will be significantly different. For example, my French is low-intermediate. It would take a few months for me to move to high-intermediate (the base level of fluency for one to be considered bilingual). Given my age and ability, I would probably never move on to Advanced French (perfectly fluent) unless I were actually living and working in French the vast majority of the time, but I would be able to express myself in French and understand it in fairly nuanced ways.
I would rather have a leader who shared my values, and additionally could demonstrate advancing ability in bilingualism, than a leader who spoke perfectly fluent French and did not share my values.