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Syndicate
Your fucking right it is too civil. So stop being so prissy polite and fucking swear more. But never ever tell another person to fuck off. Interesting history according to Urban Legends.
Gxddbov
This thread is getting confuckinfusin
I was composing the below when the Blatchfor thread got closed.
I despise Blatchford. That aside, I never thought I would live to see the day when a thread discussing the permissible uses of "bitch" would take place on Babble. Colour me gobsmacked.
Yeah, I have to wade in here and say, regardless of the various associations or sticky attachments the term has picked up in the course of its venerable history, the language and the culture would be the poorer for the passing of 'bitch' derogatory.
For every incorrect use, there is the inspired door-opening of a new permutation and application. Earlier today listening to BBC Radio Four's 'Ed Reardon's Week' I heard a fabulous use, some sentence involving the term 'bitch-goddess' which identified with irreplaceable specificity a particular constellation of associations that was a comedic TREAT.
Just now on my facebook page a local friend has posted this. It's not to my taste but I defend her right to say such nonsense!
'I'M A BITCH!...Unfortunately most women won't repost this. I'm a handful, I'm strong willed, independent, outspoken and I tell it like it is. I make mistakes, I am sometimes out of control and at times hard to handle. But if you can't handle me at my worst then you sure as hell don't deserve me at my best. If you're a bitch repost this...I dare you. I'll be looking for the ladies who repost.
Remember...BITCH means Babe In Total Control of Herself!!'
Hasn't 'nigga' been repossessed?
Reclaiming oppressive language has nothing to do with using a word, a "swear" or otherwise, in its original intent: to insult and degrade.
Women who attempt to reclaim "bitch" and "slut" are irrelevant to this discussion, or to the one about Blatchford.
Fuckin' A, man.
'Blatch' will never, as a vehicle, deliver the same aural EFFECT, sharp, punctuated even percussive as 'bitch'.
That is why 'bitch', along with cock, cunt, prick, damn, shit, fart, piss, fuck, has survived so long in the language. Its original fixed meaning along with its negation - and all the space between have long since established separate identities within the language commons and it continues to operate creatively, in the language, as a living word. It is not a pleasant word perhaps, but I'm not sure that matters. The host of associations it is presumed to conjure are not pleasant - but neither are they fixed.
I'm trying to think of a few instances where men have used "bitch" as anything other than a sexist, misogynist put-down. None come to mind. Not that I don't have my own appreciation of the word, it's just that it's so often the last word a woman hears before her husband/boyfriend breaks her jaw or throws her down the stairs. It's also the "oh, you don't want to have casual sex with me? Haven't given me the sexual attention that, by being male, I am due? You bitch."
I like the word. I use the word. And many feminists will disagree with me with solid grounds for doing so, and I completely respect that. One thing I can say is that men have forfeited their use of the word on the basis of their long-standing misogynist use of the word. Women - whether we reclaim it or rebuke it - are pretty much the only people who should be involved in deciding for themselves what the word means to them.
Rebecca West... got many gay friends?
Several - why?
Let me help you. "Life's a bitch" is a common expression used to characterize existence as difficult even at the best of times. It's used all the time by men and women alike. Sometimes " ... and then you die" is added for effect.
bagkitty, are you suggesting that "gay friends" who use the word bitch are using it without misogynist connotations? It's difficult to tell what you are insinuating.
Maybe we should toss this one over to the transgressive art class 101 and see what they think.
I know there are certain words I avoid using. As for some people not having the right to use certain words, there might be a moral argument there, but in terms of practical application it's meaningless.
Most people are not going to pay attention to being told they are not allowed to do something, especially not those who use it in the worst way.
And on the other hand, I am sure there are some who think no one - including women - should use it. I have heard exactly that opinion about other highly-offensive words which are in common usage. So from the start there is no absolute position.
Use of the word may tell us something about the attitudes of the person using it, but clearly it doesn't always mean the same thing when it comes out of different peoples' mouths.
Before I start educating people about the meaning of words I also need to educate myself what that word means to them - particularly when it is used in a context or culture I am not entirely familiar with. And that is true whether I have a case or not.
(that last sentence may sound highly facetious, but I assure you I don't mean it that way)
This fucking thread has been derailed. I don't mean to go all "alpha dog" on other posters but start fucking swearing or open another fucking thead.
'Cause I am wondering how you reconcile making essentially blanket statements like:
and
although I do very much appreciate the qualification of that in the remainder of the paragraph [emphasis added]
I definitely don't want to overstate the case, but there are times in gay male discourse where it is not used a pejorative, but rather as a term of approbation. Perhaps
NSFWNSFB[abble], and I wouldn't toss it into the mix casually -- but nor would I endorse the blanket condemnation of the word.____________________
What I am insinuating is that its misognynist connotations are not dominant in all instances. Too many, but not all.
I've heard the word used in a context you are describing, bagkitty, and I don't agree that it's stripped of its misogynist baggage in those instances, dominant or not.
That said, there have been a number of attempts by feminists to reclaim the word. I'm don't think the THH22M sketch represents one of those attempts, but it is a contested word.
I'd be open to a further discussion of this, but perhaps in another thread. Northern Shoveler is fucking right: this fucking thread is for fucking swearing.
My only regret is not being able to find that clip of Tony Randall demonstrating how complete gibberish works just fine as ersatz profanity. Can't remember which talk show it was on, but if my childhood memory serves me, it was amazing.
The internet is great, but it is not the sum of all knowledge.
Plus, think I paid my dues with that Sopranos clip, for fuck sakes.
There is a word which I think has to be rethought in terms of progressive social and cultural acceptance, especially in the context of politics.
South Park opened the floodgates for its political use.
And there really is no other word to describe those such as:
Rick Perry, Rick Santorum (whose name itself has been recently Savaged), Barak Obama, Stephen Harper, Tim Hudak, etc.
The word starts with a D and ends with a BAG.
It's common Big Bang Theory as well, along with the blatch word.
Should we just accept Sheen as a fucking shining example of freedom of speech. No fucking way is all I have say. Our society is being inundated with nasty nasty images of how people should act towards each other. Rude is the norm and if it is sexist or racist well that is just the way of the world isn't it?
I love swear words especially when they are used in inappropriate situations to really make a point. You know when you are meeting with HR and the mealy mouthed young person is going into mini-lecture mode about things that are irrelevant to the employment relationship. My wife tells me great stories every week about her go arounds with the new breed of HR people who have been hired to harass workers and who doesn't even bother to read the collective agreement. She also loves a shop stewart that every one knows affectionately as Nana since she looks like a small town west coast granny. She loves to chew up fresh faced new managers and HR people and they are always astounded at the language that comes out of her mouth. Very fucking effective in the right context.
My favourite book this year: Go The FUCK To Sleep
Favourite page from the book:
The owls fly forth from the treetops.
Through the air, they soar and they sweep.
A hot crimson rage fills my heart, love.
For real, shut the fuck up and sleep.
When did the middle finger become offensive?
The whole half-time at the Super Bowl was offensive schlock.
This all reminds me of being on the receiving end of a lot of that sort of thing, in different languages even, from my faith bound separated ex-partner, after it became clear in the long run that I couldn't personally subscribe to any sort of spiritual belief system. I like to think it was really her that needed the extra daily prayer sessions toward the end...but I know she was praying for me sometimes, from an otherwise irrepressible and innate sense of kindness.
Blasphemy!
See what I mean? Rather limited in her moves to say the least.
Where was she on that Hail Mary pass when we needed her?
There was a fucking game on? (This is the swearing thread after all)
My fandom began when she once made reference to the fascist state of Toronto during a visit.
Look, if you can't count on fucking Madonna to help on a fucking Hail Mary pass who the fuck can you count on? Fuck!
Fucking forceful point.
Just fucking basic RC fucking theology.