NDP Leadership Race #111

Lord Palmerston wrote:

Very good point, sdm.  I don't want the LPC to disappear.  They serve as a useful boutique party for affluent professionals who are too wealthy to vote NDP and too educated to vote Tory (i.e. St. Paul's is the last Liberal riding in Canada!) 

"Useful boutique party" - that's quite possibly the best description of the LPC I've heard.  Made me laugh too.

very good discussion.

eta on the barack point: i'm a wealthy professional, and i'm also a 3rd generation ndper who lives in quebec (when he's not in sf or dc on assignment) and i fanatically support social democracy in canada, and stand four-square behind the leader whoever it is (though obviously if it's mulcair, we're vastly more likely to win).  we need an ndp government, we need it.  every small thing the conservatives do makes me more insane, i can't believe we've gone back to a royal canadian navy, i can't believe we no longer register human-killing weapons, i can't believe we have cut to the bone the promotion of canadian culture in the founding province of the country.  it's not something i was raised to do, but i've come to hate the cpc and harper, to the point where i'm losing objectivity.  we just need the ndp in there to save the country.

Arthur, I don't consider unions a part of the elites - considering the crap they go through and especially now and how they often act as backup for other social activism (eg. tents, supples for occupy) I think going easy here. Almost like buying into the right wing meme that unions are greedy and evil.

every small thing the conservatives do makes me more insane.

 

Me too and I thought I was going to lose it when they tied health care $ to GDP of each province, but now, every time I see that smug face, I have to scroll down the page.

One of the people I think is in the know, just teased me that it's one of the 20 MPs as of yet undeclared. So very unlikely it's Chow, Turmel, Comartin or any of the MPs who've already endorsed one of the other six candidates. 

 

Lord Palmerston wrote:

I don't think Mulcair has been "bought" by Onex.  But a lot of the corporate elite like what he says, which is unusual for a New Democrat.

You need to identify what he's saying which the other candidates aren't saying that is music to the ears of the corporate elite. Otherwise, this is just innuendo.

 

You guys are aware, right, that to actually run the country, the party will have to foster ongoing and positive (as much as possible) relationships with a broad range of powerful people who have their hands on the levers of society, most of whom will be total bastards. Leadership is about compromises, sad but true. If the leader of the NDP becomes Prime Minister, they will be PM for the whole country, not just the NDP base. Any politician who says, "I don't associate with these business crooks. You won't catch me at their meetings." will never, never win power.

Once again, the tone of these conversations tend to indicate that babblers think that a party's leader sits in a shrouded room issuing decrees like the emperor of fuedal China. Like Topp's tax plan? me too. I just don't think he's the best spokesperson for it. The good news is that Topp's not leaving the party if Mulcair wins and he'll be there at the policy convention advocating for his tax plan. If you agree with him, you could do your part to advocate for it too, and if you convince enough people then it will become policy and Mulcair will be advocating it himself in the next election, despite his reasonable misgivings.

The party is still a community of individuals. The leader is not a dictator. Mulcair cannot "take the party to the right" all by himself. He could only do this with a large swell of NDP members who wanted to do the same, and if that's the case then you were just outvoted, weren't you? Time to find a new party, I guess. But until that happens, let's assume that the NDP will remain essentially what it is no matter who becomes leader, because that's the most rational stance.

SDM:

I too wish we had proportional representation. Yet, here are the unpleasant facts:

--we are not going to get PR unless we win under the current system

--if we win under the current system, we won't want to change it (irrespective of Topp and Nash's promises right now). That's why no provincial NDP gov't ever bothered to introduce PR.