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When did the country make a right turn? That's what I'd like to know.
I think some of us think that if we wait long enough and hold-out for the perfect party in government, the job will be easier.
And it won't be.
We wouldn't wait 35 years to brush our teeth. So why would we think having the same two parties in government with the exact same political agendas on the right doesn't result in decay and rot in Ottawa?
What could have been a checkup and teeth cleaning 25 years ago has become super-gingivitis and major dental surgery. And I'm sorry but it will require more than one appointment.
It's just the way it is.
I suspect the Liberal Party will focus much of its attacks on the Sherbrooke Declaration.
Liberals who?
I'll hold up and not get ahead of myself here, it's only day 2 with the new leader. But I hope we don't spend the next 3 or more years winking at each other as the NDP turns into a perfectly acceptable liberal party.
What's a Liberal?
It's absolutely on as long as you realize there are constraints that aren't exactly easy to work in. The amount of revenue the federal government has to pay for programs won't be (unless we get extraordinarily lucky) much larger than it is today. There's spending to be shifted around from unnecessary or ineffective programs like the F-35 purchase and prison expansions but there is a limit and these represent real people losing real jobs too (if you suppose the union representing corrections officers will be thrilled with layoffs, you would be wrong). The case needs to be made for higher taxes and that's an uphill battle, especially while stories of government waste and ineffectiveness abound. Deciding who to whack, for how much and with what economic effect isn't simple. Our opponents won't be standing by twiddling their thumbs while the NDP governs in what they believe to be their place either.
AS I said this BS is right out of the LPC playbook. Unsuccessful Mulcair means we would be forced to merge rather than just let the Liberals die the slow painful death they deserve. People starting threads like this should be ashamed of themselves. Dobbin's a Liberal. And if he isn't he should be, and we should take up a collection to buy him a membership in the LPC. This is so obvious LPC strategy
If Mulcair can’t hold the NDP’s gains, the merger whispers will beginhttp://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2012/03/26/wayne-k-spear-if-mulcair-...
I voted for Mulcair. I also think a lot of the emotional anti-Mulcair reactions I have seen in the past 2 days have been too simplistic. However, I'd like to know where the line is drawn between legitimate criticism (especially from the left) and "divisiveness", being a liberal stooge,etc. Don't forget, this isn't an official NDP message board, no one has to be ashamed of themselves just yet.
Does anyone have a link to Mulcair on P&P today?
I find deciding between the NDP and the Harpers is a lot like choosing between wine and swill. Some swill drinkers swear it's not so bad that they would switch, though. I suppose it's an acquired taste.
You know what, I know a few Liberal supporters who could match anyone here for their dedication to progressive causes , and not taking any shit from anyone. So support whatever party you like, but these derogatory labels are bullshit.
For that matter, I can't say that I know any progressive conservatives now, but I used to.
And I think we should encourage everyone to vote strategically for the NDP next election. Really.
It pains me to read that, having always opposed strategic voting. It would be another of my life's ironies if in the next election I began to encourage my Liberal friends, who previously had encouraged me to vote strategically for the Libs, to now do the same but for the NDP.
BREAKING NEWS : ANTICHRIST UNACCOUNTABLY ELECTED NDP LEADER
A lot of people are taking their cues on Mulcair from the mainstream media and the Conservative Party. Even the word "opportunist" has come up in some folks' posts to describe Mulcair, and that word came straight from the Conservative propagandists - quickly, and rightly, denounced by Mulcair and others as absurd, given the state of the NDP in QC when he joined 5 years ago. There's a lot of hysteria in progressive circles, but it should be calmed by Mulcair's actions of the past two days... from keeping on Libby Davies as dep leader, to his interview with Evan Solomon, which, minute for minute, had more accute and progressive content than we've seen for some time. And anyway, if Mulcair should prove problematic at some point, are we powerless to do anything about it? Of course not. The whole point of a party like the NDP (unlike the others) is that it's an ongoing discussion, the leader isn't in a position to lead by diktat.
Evan Solomon speaks with Thomas Mulcair after his first day in the House of Commons as the new leader of the NDP.
Taking up Jack's chair (cbc.ca)
It would make perfect FirstPastThePostian sense to me given that your friends(and some of my own acquantances) were open to the idea before.
We don't have proportional voting today, and we can be 100% sure that the Harpers won't be introducing a modern voting system soon in Canada. In the mean time it's a free for all, and that means we have to utilize all of the ways and means at our disposal in the same way the Liberals stuck it to us before.
I think that PR makes sense for the Liberal Party now more than ever. And perhaps they need to suffer the reverse consequences in order to convince themselves that PR is what we need.
I have a lot of respect for Murray Dobbin but I think he may be jumping the gun here and engaging in some hyperbole like describing Mulcair as a "right wing liberal" - not just a regular liberal, but a right-wing one. As for voter turnout it wasn't as "incredibly easy to vote" on e-day. I don't think that's what went wrong with the turnout but there were no doubt some who gave up. As for the "when did the occupation of Palestine begin" issue, people made a lot of noise in defence of Libby at the time. He just reappointed her as NDP House leader. That's got to count for something, no? Dobbin makes some valid points about our concerns but makes them sound like fait accomplis rather than challenges for progressives.
Here's my latest blog post on Mulcair. And while I woke up on Saturday morning not intending to give him my vote, in the end, I did because he was the better of the two remaining choices in my view.
Congratulations to Tom Mulcair
To quote myself :-),
I think legitimate criticism would have to involve something real and verifiable to criticise. Dobbin's article doesn't qualify, being the same sort of stuff we hear from all the detractors: "Mulcair's right-wing because... just because. But he is! And I'm against that!" Repeating innuendo and sketchy smears to rationalise your antipathy towards someone is just embarrassing yourself. When Mulcair actually does something, then we can talk about it in a reasonable fashion and hopefully no one will pull out the "don't be divisive" card. Right now, the card is appropriate.
The rightward drift of the NDP is not something that's going to happen tomorrow, next week or next month. But I do see this happening over the next couple of years.
My expectations for Mulcair aren't high.
So far? Keeping Libby on as deputy leader? Positive move.
His victory speech on Saturday night sucked. But in a one on one with Mansbridge right after he did quite well. He seems to be pretty good at handling the mainstream media and the punditocracy.
So I will praise Mulcair when he does the right thing and I will be critical when he doesn't.
OK, that makes sense.
Chimurenga-- nice to see you here. Heard from Keith- says he is shocked that I supported Mulcair in the end. I gotta hope I was right now since he won.
As for Dobbin and Judy (someone I respect immensely), I am so very sorry that they have so little faith in that large, 40% women, progressive caucus.This is not a Liberal caucus.
Those who say Rae and Mulcair are the same forget that there are a good 100 reasons to be a little more optimistic. Go back and look at some of their speeches last spring during the Canada Post debates.
Give Mulcair a bit of time as well-- he can't be that much of an ogre-- this is the party he picked and this is the caucus he wants to lead.
If things don't go well then trust the membership to scream. In the meantime, chill. Think of how far we have come from when we did not have party status -- do you really think our principles were stronger and more influential then?
And we have Radiorahim. We have Unionist and others. Principled progressive people both in and out of the party who will speak their minds and say what must be said.
Let Mulcair earn his praise-- but give him a chance to do that now that he has won the leadership.
And don't hesitate to criticize when mistakes are being made. If you keep that side of the bargain you can make Mulcair keep his.