'Fucking Idiot, Lunatic,'Classic Paleo-Con (neo-Bircher) or Pseudo-Libertarian Anti-Semite'..Responds
"He's Not Even A Socialist.." !!!
"It's not about what you do or do not believe, it's about intent. If your purpose here is to invite discourse and encourage debate, that's welcomed and applauded..."
"All babblers agree, through your use of the service that you will not use this discussion board to post any material that is knowingly false and/or defamatory. You agree to avoid personal insults, attacks and mischevious antagonisms.."
"We decry intolerance...But that doesn't mean we have all the answers. So we act and we babble and even argue sometimes - knowing that this gets us somewhere..."
"I think the mods are trying to do their best but to me the idea of banning/suspending people from a progressive site seems kinda wierd unless it's a pretty extreme circumstance. Just seems these suspensions cause more trouble and ruin more goodwill than they are saving!
"Let Babblers work it out on their own while there are still Babblers left."
"Where did I say anything about banning?"
"Really: NDPP was suspended? That seems really unjust. I value the breadth of articles he posts that provide an insight into world events rarely covered, if ever, by the MSM."
"Your intervention in that thread was extremely one-sided in that it ignored completely the repeated personal attacks by others and didn't so much as issue a 'warning' to anyone else."
"Contrary to your allegation, he did not 'use' the term 'Zio-Nazis' in that thread. There was an encounter about the appropriateness of the term, in which another babbler brought up the term first and in fact mentioned it three times in the thread, by way of dredging up old grievances against NDPP. NDPP mentioned the term only by way of response to the baiting provocation against him."
"Oh stop picking nits from a dead dog. He still uses 'zios' after being told not to use Zio-Nazis. Big difference. Is Zionist too hard to spell out in full? Do you think its nice and friendly sounding or a valid anthropological term? As for not saying its all the fault of Zionists, well you'll just have to take a step into basic interpretive reality. Do any of the articles he published point ELSEWHERE for fault? Or is the idea of a single Muslim making a poor moral choice or displaying individual human failing too much for the all-too-PC-left?
"The recent terrorist shootings in France by a lone gunman have targeted people who were Black, Moslem, North African and Jewish."
"I'm willing to acknowledge that I may have gone out of line in calling Slumberjack and NDPP anti-semite, and for that I offer an apology. However, I continue to assert that, in general, the use of calling Israel 'Zio-Land' and in general, the use of constructions of the term 'zio' [noun] is anti-semitic, that calling Israel's nuclear arsenal 'zio nukes' may be an anti-semitic statement.."
"I am objecting to the use of a three-letter prefix."
"The Cat: We're all mad here. The Hatter: Why is a raven like a writing desk?"
"I find the interruption in threads and on behalf of the Zionist occupation authorities to be offensive and an obvious scripted ploy to silence criticism of the zionist state of Israel as it exists in the West Bank, and as it continues as we speak to surround and strangle and to kill at random with impunity the people of Gaza. Here in utterly disgusting fashion they spare their only concern for three letter prefixes.."
"Enough is enough. I am labelled a jew hater because they don't like my material, or anti-zionist point of view. It is not their right to make such disgusting, defamatory statements no matter how powerful they think their little club is here. I shall require retractions from both. I do not slander, silence or interfere in their activities here and I expect to be accorded the same courtesy...
"As for 'Zio- Nazis' this is an entirely accurate description of the Zionist JDL and their formal and public alliance with the English Defence League (EDL) Nazi-boys. How would you say it?"
"Clearly you have no respect for this board and its guidelines, or for the people you insult and offend here. You are suspended..."
"If NDPP's suspension was solely based on his referencing that term in response to someone who questioned his use of it, then I have to say I'm a little surprised by such a rigid enforcement of the proscription on the use of that term."
"I read the thread twice and found that ndpp was being attacked/baited and responded/defended himself by describing where the term came from. He shouldn't have been suspended for doing so. At the same time his attacker gets to walk away without mention of the vile insinuations."
"I am an ardent supporter of Israel in all situations and in all circumstances.
"And worst of all - these are defenders of Israel and its lawlessness. We must not allow them to influence what is posted here - and still less, who is allowed to post here."
"I've reviewed my decision to suspend NDPP and agree with M Spector and others who have asked me to take a closer look at the thread. He is reinstated with my apologies for misdirecting the blame for the disintegration of the Toulouse massacre thread. I need to rethink how I respond when people are provoked and how I respond to inviduals who bait...
Thank you all for the input. Its been truly helpful."
That goes double from me!
The people united can never be defeated!
in sol and resistance
ndpp
Welcome back.
Thanks NR.
¡Hasta La Victoria Siempre!
Good to see you, NDPP.
And thanks to the mods for being fair, true to our policy, admitting a slip-up, and doing the right thing!
thanks again all!
..glad your back in such fine form ndpp. and thank you rebecca for those words at the end of that thread.
thank-you epaulo, rebecca..
glad you're still here mate!
thnx M me too!
Is there like only a limited number of available slots or something? NDPP is back, but now Gaian has gone off again.
I'll miss Gaian.
Me too, but sadly, Gaian was not able to enter discussions without repeatedly insulting his interlocutors. George Victor/Gaian won't be back. Believe me, I wish it was otherwise.
Also, if NDPP's only contribution to babble was this thread title, that would have been sufficient to cement his place in babble lore. Superb.
I wish it were otherwise too. You know how close we were. I could search for a bit, but I'm lazy, so can anyone put up a link as to where it finally went down? So you mean there's no negotiating room here?
Did gaian leave or was he banned?
If banned/suspended, I don't support it . The practice is objectionable and unnecessary.
Your opinion has been made quite clear to the mods, NDPP. We disagree. Gaian was banned, with the unanimous consent of Rebecca, oldgoat and me. At some point, our practical need to work in a positive environment without repeated dealings with years of nastiness trumps our general distaste for bannings.
The stuff we've discussed around here for years mostly involves detailing the very nasty business out there, and so it's likely to come out in some people more than others. Apart from some of the debatable content and analysis, his style of delivery never bothered nearly as much.
never bothered nearly as much [as _______ ] (?)
I'd also like to see a link to the tire tracks leading out over the cliff.
Well, anyway...it sounds like that's that then. You might as well put me down in the unhappy column over it too. On the bright side for Gaian, enmasse seems to be desperate these days for someone to talk to, and I can personally attest from experience that they're none too picky about who they let in.
The analysis and findings.
I didn't realise you thought so ill of EM as well but I guess it could be confusing for some sorting out the difference between an open political site and a small self selecting social club. I don't know who Gaian is exactly, but you shouldn't really direct your attacks aghainst the dearly departed, or has that rule become as arbitrarily upheld as others now are?
Er, Erik, SJ was clearly being self-deprecating there, and he seems to be defending Gaian, despite having fundamental disagreements with him.
Normally, I'd welcome you to babble, but it seems you're already familiar with us. Do I need to remind you that sock puppets aren't allowed on babble, ERik? Or have you lost a password?
Aha! Sounds like the ol' sock puppet who lost his password on a Monday trick. We've seen that one before.
Well I am glad I came back to catch this brilliant bit of self martyrdom. Rather than try interpret and counter your rambling point by point(?), let me just reiterate a few points of my own that shouldn't be too too fine to follow even for the habitual dialecticians here.
I didn't exactly say you WEREn't a socialist NDPP, I just said casual onlookers would really have no way of knowing by your posting habits. Your posting to various "libertarian" Ron Paul sites for example might leave one to doubt it. I did however make it clear (I thought) that I didn't give a flying fig leaf if you were indeed a socialist -whatever that means anymore -as racism isn't particular to the right. I don't think that's exactly news, even here. Sorry if you feel terribly wounded but its not exactly unknown that you constantly push the boundries and I've yet to see the slightest sign of contrition on your part.
The fact that you immediately took a terrible crime and personal tragedy and tried to politicise it, immediately came up with another silly conspiracy theory pointing all the blame back on the same evil Zio-capitalists or wyatever you call them now hardly inspires faith in your noble intentions. ITs not even a matter of political awareness but a simple matter of Decency. When someone dies in the real world its usually understood that we should observe at least a few moments silence before we start in on our preaching about how evil their kinfolk is, unless that is they are someone truly evil. Maybe noone ever told you that.
As for getting you banned, well, apparently so long as you don't actually link to neo-Nazi sites directly, but content yourself with sites which run pieces BY neo-Nazis I guess that means its ok. I know that does bring up the uncomfortable issue that the dear MUllahs of Iran may not be entirely inncocent victims of US=capitalism imperialism, but I'm resigned that some deep thinkers here will simply insist that the average prole couldn't possibly understand the difference between criticising another regime and calling for its imminant destruction. If I'm wrong about you, well, you yourself can try to be more careful yourself given your own prior history. I'll live with the heavy 'social democrat' meanwhile.
Not quite, my old coms dead and it babble.ca doesn't recopgnise my new address. And I apologise to SJ if he was merely being self depraciting, sometimes its hard to tell who his target is. Onething I like about my fellow Canucks. I don't think EriK AR is too far from the old ERik Redburn to be misunderstood surely(?) and I don't think I'll be able to get the old one back now anyhow, so why not just stick with this handle? Consider Any Redburns turning up can be summarily dismissed, as he/she/I/them surely deserved anyhow.
Oh. I think I know who Gaian is now. Well ironic that I too half defended him, but what the heck. he could be irritating but bad humour is hardly a banning offence on a political scrap site no? Final decision remains yours I know. I acede to your colective wisdom Re NDPP as well of course and will try my best to ignore but please don't expect me to express joy.
Yes I see that now. TRuly gauche of me to miss it I admit.
My level of paranoia is running extra high right now but noone would believe what the fuck is happening in my own little bubble right now so I'll leave it at saying thios government has GOT to go down and soon. I've lost too much already.
And ya, I can attest to that too. Night.
Yes, I see now how it could be taken like that...recommending them to Gaian. :)
Love the thread title ...
I think every banning of a long-term member diminishes us a la John Donne. I think a better way has to be found for dealing with these situations other than bannings. That said I recognize the moderators rights under the current rules to do so and I don't believe for one minute that the moderators take this power lightly.