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Precisely.
The use of the word "the" in that t-shirt is hilarious!
They're usually build on private property no? A subway wall is public space, paid for by everyone. The sight of an glassy office tower with a CIBC or BMO sign etc, offends me as well, but under the current societal arrangements they have the right to show themselves in that manner. But I wouldn't want BMO to begin advertising on the walls of school corridors saying that if you're not with us you're wasting your life.
As a TTC Rider, I am bombarded with advertising of all kinds religious and secular. CDN_FORCES omitted to mention that the image above and campaign against this particular Islamic outreach, as opposed to all the other corporate and religious advertising, is a campaign mounted and promoted by Jewish Defence League Canada in their relentless demonization of all things Islamic and promotion of all things Zionist. Are you a JDL supporter CDN_FORCES?
Offensive t-shirts seem to be part of the academic landscape, perhaps designed to provoke or challenge. I remember some years ago having to endure a freshman in one of my classes who showed up wearing a t-shirt displaying a dozen or so sexual positions.
Why should a Jesus slogan be penalized, or Che's image, or an anarchist slogan?
Then there are the young women wearing what used to be underwear instead of blouses. Bare midriff. Crotch-length shorts.
Young men with baggy pants dragging on the ground and airing half their buttocks.
It might be worth pondering this too.
Technically the subway is private property owned by the company that runs them like a mall is. Since you can get banned from the property according to their rules
Yeah, I don't even see what the issue is here. If I wore that shirt ironically, I would be suspended too?
It is not hate speech. Not the same thing.
If you look at the ad box it is a Patterson. The TTC for a fee allows Patterson to sell advertising to anyone who wants to pay for it. Advertising a mosque or advertising a nightclub, what is the difference?
As for the T-Shirts I think I might be able to change my opinion but I still can't get past the fact christians are oppressors and it is in fact an oppressor's message. For me church repression is not only historic it is also personal. So too me it feels like a hate crime and it is why I think it is similar to direct references to homosexuals. But then I guess it is no big deal to have the majority religion disparage others who don't share their believes even when that specific belief about christian superiority, trumpeted on the T-Shirt, has lead to so much suffering.
I think the kid's a prick for wearing a t-shirt that bears a prick message. Since it in a sense attacks other religions or those with no religion at all, and is really 'in your face' with its message, I would support the school banning his ass if he shows up to school wearing that t-shirt again.
So, in essence, you'd ban the kid for being a prick.
I wonder how much of an impact this actually has on his fellow students. If people at his school are genuinely hurt by his shirt, than I don't want to diminish that. But on the scale of school bullying I don't see this as ranking all that high. 'You're wasting your life' might be the nicest thing some students hear all day.
What if a student gets tired of school, is bored, etc., and resorts to wearing an obnoxious t-shirt in order to get suspended or expelled?
Neat ruse, eh? Easy alternative to playing hooky. Just a thought...
follow-up: Nothing really wrong with some sort of dress code that would preclude provocative items or offensive t-shirts. I don't propose uniforms, necessarily, but certainly clear rules, that only t-shirts with NO images or wording will be acceptable.
Taking the issue to an extreme, someone might conceivably object to a T-shirt showing a foreign country, as being a snob's way of showing off that he or she had the wherewithal to travel, thus humiliating poorer students.
Hell, a simple uniform, nothing expensive, would be the young person's clothing for 10 hours a day 5 days a week and would just take the place of other clothing, which might be even more expensive if there is peer pressure to conform to styles and fashions.
Looks like this has blown over. He's allowed to wear the shirt.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/story/2012/05/04/ns-jesus-shir...
The Nova Scotia student suspended from school for five days for wearing a T-shirt with the slogan "Life Is Wasted Without Jesus" will be allowed to wear it, the school board has ruled.
Good to see it go away. I feel soooo sorry for the poor little boy. Imagine having to live his life of constant discrimination. His arrogant sense of privilege wrapped into a tale of being a victim makes me want to puke.
It's a statement from a certain constituency that is partly an expression of faith. However; it is as well something you might expect from someone or some group feeling threatened. It appears as a relatively benign note of bravado, but one to all the agendas crowding out a way of life that had previously influenced over everything. It could be said that the agenda of the t-shirt enjoys the support of an influential base in this country, that often uses the term 'agenda' to refer to selected expressions of rights which continue to be smothered under many oppressions. The reason for this persistence in society is because it is largely invisible in the way it permeates through every discussion, because there's nothing wrong. Everything appears normal. Even the re-emergence of the way of the cloth in the form of a religious banner waging a counter-offensive.
Well, speaking as an agnostic respectful of others whose religious beliefs are a central part of their lives, my 2 cents is/are:
1) that T-shirts and buttons bearing a profession of faith are bound to make other people of faith, and agnostics and perhaps even some atheists, uncomfortable, or at the very least make it hard to maintain a civil dialogue in spaces like school where such a dialogue is part of day-to-day transactions; and conversely,
2) people wearing t shirts with satanic images are probably even more upsetting to people of faith, but where have we heard of students being banned for displaying horned creatures with fangs and blazing eyes on their torsos or backs?
T-shirts with images and wording are essentially walking advertisements. As someone revulsed by consumer culture, I could never stomach t-shirts emblazoned with trade marks.
Perhaps part of a proper education could be to lead students to understand the significance of such overt statements, whether verbal or visual, and to understand that you are essentially a sandwich-board for Christianity, or satanism, or the local watering hole -- ultimately you become part of a parade of in-your-face marketing. And those people need to own it, in the sense of understanding its significance and learning to consider its potential impact.
Having said this, I think their response might just be to blink at you, with no comprehension, given that they spend hours in front of a screen dominated by advertising, which for them is "no big deal".
I wonder if he will seek damages now.
ETA:
A Nova Scotia student suspended from classes for five days for wearing a T-shirt with the slogan "Life Is Wasted Without Jesus" returned to school today wearing the same garment, but he was quickly taken home by his father.
William Swinimer, who's in Grade 12, was scheduled to attend a session for all students on how to express their beliefs in a way that is respectful to all.
But John Swinimer said he wants Forest Heights Community School in Chester Basin, Lunenburg County, to only teach the basic courses, leaving religion out of it.
Students said William Swinimer has been preaching his Christian beliefs, making them feel uncomfortable, and the shirt was the last straw, so they complained.
Experts from the Nova Scotia Human Rights Commission, the departments of education and justice, and guidance counsellors are at the school to conduct voluntary sessions so students can discuss the issue of religious tolerance.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/story/2012/05/07/ns-jesus-shir...It's as I've said before. Religious fundamentalism belongs on the fringe, in private residences, or in the houses of worship, not out in public to be shoved down everyone's throat. They will always be the give an inch take a mile crowd by the very nature of what they hold to be true. Some of you take no issue with subjecting other students to this nonsense. I can't say that I'm surprised.
A t-shirt with a picture on it is fairly benign in itself if it doesn't say do 'this,' or believe in 'this' or else. A turban on someone's head is enough to make some people of another faith uncomfortable. Witness all the airport delays with passengers refusing to fly because of the attire of someone in another seat. Such religous based attire, or even a t-shirt displaying fangs and horned creatures, only suggests what the person wearing it believes, without the need to involve anyone else. Those examples don't explicitly say anything of any other belief. I mean, is this nuance we keep repeating here rocket science or what? Because I'm starting to think that by introducing the concept of what a person holds to be true, and which doesn't involve some else's belief system, or non-belief system as it were, versus the in your face statements like that kid's t-shirt, is like some technical manual complete with handy formulas and graphs from Einstein's chalkboard.
Finally the piece of the puzzle that clarifies the problem. The Principal should have suspended him for his behaviour not his T-Shirt. No one should have to tolerate being preached to by an arrogant teenager from the dominant religion. Even other teenagers!
I have no problem with folks having faith, as long as they keep it to their own damned selves.
Wasn't the point of the t-shirt their damned selves, Boom Boom.
So, would you be okay with "being preached to by an arrogant teenager from a non-dominant religion"?
If not, then why even refer to "the dominant" religion? Why not just say "being preached to by an arrogant teenager about a religion"? If you would be okay with it, then why in one case and not the other?
So, is it the "in your face" aspect of this that you object to? What about in-your-face political statements?
Souls, not selves.
It is an aggravating feature of his crime and that is why I mentioned it.
So, you now want to elevate the wearing of certain in-your-face, offensive t-shirts to the level of a crime??
God help free speech with thinking like that.
Well, yes now that you bring it up. S'pose I could have been more emphatic about it earlier in the thread. Political statements on t-shirts accompanied by dialogue stating to the effect 'vote this way or that way or you're all losers' would be objectionable in a school setting as well wouldn't you think?