Magna Carta Today
Sat, 2004-07-24 17:35
#1
Magna Carta Today
Sat, 2004-07-24 17:35
#2
This is an interesting birthday discussion of Magna Carta:
[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1268208,00.html]http://ww...
Sun, 2004-07-25 08:11
#3
Bottom line. Due process is often honoured more in theory than in practice, especially in times of "war," real or imagined.
Sun, 2004-07-25 15:56
#4
Maybe Dubya will celebrate by burning a copy.
Sun, 2007-12-16 22:21
#5
M. Spector
[url=http://www.newstatesman.com/200712140004]Ross Perot's copy of the Magna Carta is up for sale.[/url]
Got $30 million to spend on a scrap of vellum?
Wed, 2007-12-19 00:26
#6
M. Spector
How ironic!
The iconic symbol of freedom and the rule of law has fallen into the hands of one of the very [url=http://www.hereinreality.com/carlyle.html]enemies of freedom and the rule of law:[/url]
quote:
[url=http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=David_M._Rubenstein]David Rubenstein[/url], co-founder of the private-equity firm [url=http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article3995.htm]Carlyle Group[/url], last night bought a 1297 copy of the Magna Carta, an English royal document and symbol of freedom, for $21.3 million including commission at Sotheby's in New York.
- Bloomberg News
[ 19 December 2007: Message edited by: M. Spector ]
Wed, 2007-12-19 07:56
#7
quote:
Originally posted by M. Spector:
[b][url=http://www.newstatesman.com/200712140004]Ross Perot's copy of the Magna Carta is up for sale.[/url]Got $30 million to spend on a scrap of vellum?[/b]
this is my favorite part from the article:
quote:
...News of the sale of the Magna Carta roused some correspondents to the Times to a fever of indignant, nationalistic fury. According to J. Roberts of Manchester: "The fact that one of the greatest documents of democracy ever written is to be sold at a crass and vulgar auction by some crass and vulgar Americans says everything you need to know about American 'culture' and what their brand of ugly capitalism means for the world."[b]J. Roberts overlooked the fact that the Charter was sold to its current American owners by members of the English aristocracy in the mid-1980s (confirming Magna Carta’s original intent: to increase the wealth and power of the peerage). [/b]
Wed, 2007-12-19 08:59
#8
itsx not [i]just[/i] a piece of vellum- its contains the basic ideas of democracy in terms of being against absolute rule in terms of the king no longer being able to do anything he wanted.
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magna_Carta]wikipedia[/url]
Wed, 2007-12-19 09:59
#9
This is my favourite passage from Magna Carta:
quote:
If one who has borrowed from the Jews any sum, great or small, die before that loan be repaid, the debt shall not bear interest while the heir is under age, of whomsoever he may hold; and if the debt fall into our hands, we will not take anything except the principal sum contained in the bond. And if anyone die indebted to the Jews, his wife shall have her dower and pay nothing of that debt; and if any children of the deceased are left under age, necessaries shall be provided for them in keeping with the holding of the deceased; and out of the residue the debt shall be paid, reserving, however, service due to feudal lords; in like manner let it be done touching debts due to others than Jews.
I wonder if I could make a claim here? Is there a statute of limitations?
Wed, 2007-12-19 10:51
#10
quote:
Originally posted by unionist:
[b]I wonder if I could make a claim here? Is there a statute of limitations?[/b]
Dating to 1287, according to this [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion#_note-Prestwich_1997_306... entry[/url]:
quote:
While in Gascony in 1287, Edward ordered English Jews expelled. All their property was seized by the crown and all outstanding debts payable to Jews were transferred to the King’s name.
The expulsion actually took place in 1290, IIRC.
I once toured the site of the appalling 1190 [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/legacies/immig_emig/england/north_yorkshire/article... of the Jews of York: a sobering reminder of the intolerance of the age.
Wed, 2007-12-19 17:25
#11
one should note who profited from the Jews expulsion- and we have to be careful not to think anachronistically when we talk about Jews in that era with regards to ideas about Jews expressed n the Magna Carta.
The same thing happened with the Spanish inquisition and the 1st expulsion of the Jews from Spain- the state took the cash and property. But that's off topic- but it does go to show that there was more to anti-semitism than religion
[ 19 December 2007: Message edited by: Pride for Red Dolores ]