"a viable alternative government " / "un gouvernement de rechange viable"

116 posts / 0 new

Topic locked

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:19

Unionist

Bookish Agrarian wrote:
Unionist wrote:

He can't go see the G-G unless his government falls. And if it falls, it will either be with a coalition ready to go (in which case the G-G will select the coalition) or not (in which case there will be another election). Either way, it would appear that he no longer controls the outcome here.

Oh, and remember "fixed election dates" LOL?? Mme Jean may be enough of a lackey that she agreed to the October election (which she didn't have to do) - do you think she's been well-enough paid to grant Harper a second wish contrary to his own lying hypocritical law?

Probably...

Actually Unionist Harper can visit the GG and ask for an election whenever he wishes. He would have to make the case that Parliament is deadlocked and he does not have the confidence of the House. She went for it once, who is to say it wouldn't happen again.

Isn't that what I just finished saying in the portion you quoted?

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:21

#103

Unionist

Webgear wrote:
gram swaraj wrote:
Tommy_Paine wrote:

And they wonder why the generic public view of politicians is so negative.

We need to fix the system, it's broken. Bring on PR.

I do not see how the daily actions of our elected members would change through PR.

I must concur (even though this is thread drift). PR doesn't change elected reps. If anything, party dictatorship (and hence individual irresponsibility) may be strengthened, because PR tends to overemphasize parties.

Get rid of parties (as in NWT I think?) and you'll see individuals behaving themselves better.

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:22

#104

Stockholm

Its funny how these bully neo-cons can never resist overplaying their hand. Remember how Newt Gingrich blew it in 1995 when he shut down the US government and this set wheels in motion that caused Clinton to make a big comeback.

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:24

#105

Wilf Day

A quiet coup (like the "revolution tranquille"):

Quote:
Something exceptional happened yesterday in Ottawa: Stephen Harper backed down. He reversed his decision to abolish subsidies to political parties.

Nevertheless, this is unlikely to be sufficient to allow the Harper government to save its skin because, in the last two days, something even more rare happened in Ottawa: the Liberals and the NDP, drunk with the prospect of taking power, now speak of a red-orange coalition.

Here's how an Ontario Liberal MP summed up the situation yesterday afternoon in an email: "Stephen Harper and Jim Flaherty have lost too much credibility. We can not believe what they say now, anything they can say or do this week will not change the fundamental question of their credibility and their motivations. "

The English have a perfect expression to describe the mood of Liberals and the NDP: They smell blood. They know their enemy is wounded, he bleeds and, like sharks, they ready the fatal attack.

The Liberal enthusiasm at the prospect of regaining power by a sort of quiet coup d'état enrages Conservatives, of course. But it is their own leader who has sown the seeds of revolt.

Here is a prime minister who renounced his own law on fixed election dates, on the pretext that he needed a new mandate to tackle the economic crisis.

Once reelected, he brings out unpleasant surprises, such as the end of subsidies to political parties and the suppression of the right to strike in the public service, but little or nothing for the economy.

If Mr. Harper wanted to launch such reforms, why did he not utter a single word about them in the recent campaign? To ask the question is to answer it.

Stephen Harper thought he could shove these policies down the throat of an opposition disunited and exhausted. It seems however that his political radar this time has led him into a wall.

- Who will be the first minister?

Mr. Harper spoke of Stéphane Dion, but the Liberals are not warm to the idea. A movement organized within the Liberal caucus advances instead the idea of replacing Stéphane Dion by Michael Ignatieff.

- What role for the Bloc (and for how long)?

The dilemma facing the Bloc is this: how far can a sovereignist party go in making the Canadian government work? In a coalition scenario, the Bloc is stuck: either it becomes an ally of a red-orange government or brings it down with ... the Conservatives.

Between contortions, the Bloc has become a snake biting its tail. Now, the snake may swallow itself.

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:28

#106

Mojoroad1

Quote:
The Conservatives are going to do everything to save power. They will come back with an economic stimulus package.

That's what I thought.... but after just watching Flaherty on Question Period, they're sticking to their guns on the update...They're just going to spin it as best as they can. The rest I totally agree with you on though Max.

It was funny to watch Brison quote the Letter to the GG with regards to 2004 and coalitions signed by Harpo, Layton and Duceppe. What a Hypocrite!

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:30

#107

bush is gone ha...

Well with the tories trying to manufacture consent, I sure am glad it has been exposed in the globe and here's hoping that with Tories foaming at the mouth someone is going to shove a big o' barn yard boot in it. those muzzles can't stay on in a tension like this.

---------------------------------------------------------

why is it that polling booths look like cattle chutes?

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:36

#108

Bookish Agrarian

CTV is now reporting that the Tories are pulling back on the public service right to strike.

No matter what happens in the days to come both Harper and Flarehty are mortally wounded. They might survive, but they will be very weakened. It couldn't happen to nicer guys either.

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:36

#109

The Bish

remind wrote:

Harper's fighting will only consolidate his already consolitdated base. And a lot of swing voters may be really turned off. They expected calmness and non-partisanship.

Perhaps I'm being hopelessly optimistic here, but I think this is accurate. Harper won the campaign largely on the basis of the fact that he seemed like the calm, cool hand to guide Canada through an economic crisis when the other option was a dithering, uncertain Dion. Now the tables have almost completely reversed: the Liberals and NDP look very strong and certain, Harper is backsliding, confused, and scrambling. He's already gone back on a pretty significant portion of what he said during the election, admitting that deficits may be possible, showing he has no interest in cooperating, etc. The only support Harper really seems to have at the moment is the die hard neoliberals who simply will not accept anything other than a Conservative government no matter the cost. That may change if the "Dion is organising a coup d'etat" line takes hold, but I really think right now it has to look to the public like Harper has become all the things he criticised during the campaign.

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:37

#110

Wilf Day

I found a really good report on the GG's role and related issues:

Quote:
If a Prime Minister who has lost a confidence vote asks for a dissolution, the Governor General probably has the discretion to decide whether anyone else is capable of forming a government.

Her job is always to protect Parliamentary democracy and the Parliament that the people have elected has to have a chance to see if it can support a government.

Unless the government already in office continues in office, the Governor General asks the person most likely to enjoy the confidence of the House to form a government. Traditionally, the leader of the party with the most seats in the House is most likely to enjoy the confidence of the House, but this need not always be true

The Miller government was defeated on 18 June 1985 after the debate on the Throne Speech. Although Mr. Miller threatened to ask for a dissolution, his letter of resignation suggested that Mr. Peterson would be able to gain the confidence of the House and that he should be asked to form a government. The Lieutenant Governor followed this advice, and the Peterson government took over on 26 June 1985. However, the Lieutenant Governor made clear in his official statement that the written agreement had no legal force or effect and did not affect the powers of the Lieutenant Governor or of Members of the Legislative Assembly.

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:48

#111

bush is gone ha...

Quote:
CTV is now reporting that the Tories are pulling back on the public service right to strike.

Yeah the tories keeping holstering theirs guns and pocketing their knives but we know that they have them and will pull them out later. I hope the opposition realize this and keep going. Harper is trying to fluff up his sweater vest and show he is co-operative - charlatan.

---------------------------------------------------------

why is it that polling booths look like cattle chutes?

Sun, 2008-11-30 12:57

#112

Unionist

Bookish Agrarian wrote:

CTV is now reporting that the Tories are pulling back on the public service right to strike.

Yeah, well why wouldn't they? PSAC has already signed tentative agreements for over 100,000 of their members in the face of the blackmail, and others are in the process of following suit.

Once the victim is dead, why wouldn't the murderer put away his gun?

These bastards must be chased from office asap. While they are down, they must be kicked. This will be a victory which the Canadian people will savour, and they will then expect much from the victors. Time to deliver.

Sun, 2008-11-30 13:00

#113

robbie_dee

Since this thread is now at 110+ posts and counting, I humbly suggest we continue [url=http://www.rabble.ca/babble/canadian-politics/opposition-has-rediscovere....

Sun, 2008-11-30 13:02

#114

remind

Apparently Baird has announced that they will also remove the blocking of the right to strike from their proposed Bill. So they now have back away on 2 proposed positions? The 1.95 and blocking strike actions by the public service sector. Oh, and they will move up the budget to January instead of February and include some stimulus packages.

Do they really believe these measures will change a thing? And isn't nice to see that they kept getting rid of woman's pay equity rights?! That should bring all the males on board nicely, eh?!

Let me tell you, if the Liberals back down now that Harper is trying to pretend concessions, women across Canada should boycott the Liberal Party forever. However, I do not suspect that the Liberals will, it would only make them look more lame duck than they currently are.

___________________________________________________________
"watching the tide roll away"

Sun, 2008-11-30 13:06

#115

Bookish Agrarian

Unionist wrote:
Bookish Agrarian wrote:

CTV is now reporting that the Tories are pulling back on the public service right to strike.

Yeah, well why wouldn't they? PSAC has already signed tentative agreements for over 100,000 of their members in the face of the blackmail, and others are in the process of following suit.

Once the victim is dead, why wouldn't the murderer put away his gun?

These bastards must be chased from office asap. While they are down, they must be kicked. This will be a victory which the Canadian people will savour, and they will then expect much from the victors. Time to deliver.

I'm not suggesting it is worth anything, just that CTV was reporting it. In other words Harper Co. is starting to shit bricks.

Sun, 2008-11-30 13:06

#116

Michelle

Let's continue here.

Pages

Topic locked