Just turned off CBC

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Fri, 2009-01-02 01:44

Sven

Frustrated Mess wrote:

In your Utopia, which laughlingly idolizes individualism, most people are entirely dependent upon corporations for every facet of their survival. Individual self-expression is actively discouraged in favour of conformity (patriotism, not being un-American).

I'd rather rely on thousands of different and competing corporations, large and small (not to mention millions of small businesses), for a broad array of choices than to rely on a central government which is only capable of doling out shit products and shit services on a take-it-or-lump-it basis. Most government bureaucrats are incapable of innovation. You want a place to live? Here's your standard-issue box apartment to live in. Don't like it? Tough shit.

Frustrated Mess wrote:
In your Utopia millions of Americans face extreme poverty and deprivation

"Extreme poverty" is the life Ms. Sven's aunt lived in (see above)...or my dad...or Ms. Sven's mother...or Ms. Sven's dad. Very few live in "extreme poverty" in either Canada or America today. "Extreme poverty" is living on $2 [b][i]per day[/i][/b] or less (like about 2 [i]billion[/i] people on this earth live in today). How many Canadians or Americans are living like that? Instead, here on babble, we have people wailing and gnashing their teeth that everyone isn't making at least $16 [i][b]per hour[/i][/b]...while the [b]truly poor[/b] in this world suffer real deprivation.

Many here laud the fact that Cubans live on $4,500 per year in per capita income (which is not much more than a couple of bucks an hour). How many Canadians and Americans are clamoring to go live in that kind of place? In contrast, how many Cubans would love to live in Canada or America...but are prevented from doing so by their "benevolent" and "all-knowing" central, one-party government?

Yet, you seem to look at Canada and America as being hells on earth...because everyone is not "equal". Fuck equality. I'll take freedom (and inequality) over equality (and slavery) any day of the week.

It's laughably middle-class, thumb-up-the-ass Leftist angst to complain about the CBC when in a country like Cuba, which many on the Left laud as Utopia-on-Earth, has only state-run media.

I can understand why you feel that you're a "frustrated mess". You want everyone to conform to your idea of how the world should run...yet most people are not interested in that kind of "utopia" in either Canada or America. I'm sure that's very frustrating.

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[b]Eleutherophobics of the World...Unite!!![/b]

Fri, 2009-01-02 01:57

#103

Sven

Rather than "Just turned off CBC", the thread title should be [b]"Just turn off CBC"[/b]. If you don't like CBC, don't watch it. Ditto for CNN and Fox News. It's like social conservatives complaining about sex, violence and drugs on the boob tube. If you don't like what's on, turn off your fuckin' TV and read a book.

_______________________________________________

[b]Eleutherophobics of the World...Unite!!![/b]

Fri, 2009-01-02 02:01

#104

Aristotleded24

Sven wrote:
I'd rather rely on thousands of different and competing corporations, large and small (not to mention millions of small businesses), for a broad array of choices

Paper or plastic? Window or aisle? Cash or credit card? That is the extent of the choice you have?

Sven wrote:
Very few live in
"extreme poverty" in either Canada or America today.

Ever been to a First Nations community in Canada? People have described them as being in Third World conditions. And if there is no poverty in Canada and the US, why do I trip over homeless people when I walk around downtown Winnipeg or Toronto?

Fri, 2009-01-02 02:06

#105

Aristotleded24

Sven wrote:
Many here laud the fact that Cubans live on $4,500 per year in per capita income (which is not much more than a couple of bucks an hour). How many Canadians and Americans are clamoring to go live in that kind of place? In contrast, how many Cubans would love to live in Canada or America...but are prevented from doing so by their "benevolent" and "all-knowing" central, one-party government?

Many Canadians head to Cuba in the winter for vacation. We're allowed to travel there.

As for the $4500 figure? I can't answer that, but I do know that Cuba's quality of life indicators are higher than every Latin American country, that their infant mortality rate is lower than the US, and they've accomplished this in spite of being a poor country.

As for Cubans migrating to the US? US immigration policy basically forces Cubans who want to immigrate into boats, which is fine because it serves the propaganda purposes of the US government in demonising Cuba. By the way, how many people from capitalist Mexico and Central America try to gain illegal entry into the US to better themselves?

Fri, 2009-01-02 02:23

#106

Sven

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Sven wrote:
I'd rather rely on thousands of different and competing corporations, large and small (not to mention millions of small businesses), for a broad array of choices

Paper or plastic? Window or aisle? Cash or credit card? That is the extent of the choice you have?

Yes. Those three choices are the only three choices that I have in life. [insert rolling eyes emoticon that is no longer available on the "new and improved" babble]

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Sven wrote:
Very few live in"extreme poverty" in either Canada or America today.

Ever been to a First Nations community in Canada? People have described them as being in Third World conditions. And if there is no poverty in Canada and the US, why do I trip over homeless people when I walk around downtown Winnipeg or Toronto?

Did I say that there is "[b][i]no[/b][/i] poverty" in Canada or America? No. I said that there are very, very few people in either Canada or America who live in true poverty. True poverty is growing up like my parents did or Ms. Sven's parents did. Several of them had no running water (they carried their water to their wood-heated homes in buckets) and had no indoor toilet. They worked from sun-up to sun-down six days a week and the idea of a vacation was completely foreign to them. True poverty is trying to survive on $2 per day (like about 2 billion people on this earth live on today).

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[b]Eleutherophobics of the World...Unite!!![/b]

Fri, 2009-01-02 02:31

#107

Sven

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Sven wrote:
Many here laud the fact that Cubans live on $4,500 per year in per capita income (which is not much more than a couple of bucks an hour). How many Canadians and Americans are clamoring to go live in that kind of place? In contrast, how many Cubans would love to live in Canada or America...but are prevented from doing so by their "benevolent" and "all-knowing" central, one-party government?

Many Canadians head to Cuba in the winter for vacation.

The operative word there is "vacation". It's warm, it's cheap...and it's temporary. The real question is: How many Canadian emigrate to Cuba because it's so much more wonderful than Canada? Now, in contrast, look at the massive numbers of people who emigrate to both Canada and America each year. It's really weird. Millions of people have emigrated to Canada and America over the last few decades...yet those two countries are hells on earth. What is [i]wrong[/i] with those people?!?! They must be uninformed morons. Or, they smartly ignore to Leftist bullshit propaganda about the horrors...the [i]absolute horrors[/i]...of living in Canada and America.

_____________________________________________

[b]Eleutherophobics of the World...Unite!!![/b]

Fri, 2009-01-02 02:48

#108

Aristotleded24

Sven wrote:
How many Canadian emigrate to Cuba because it's so much more wonderful than Canada?

Might not be a bad idea after all. Ever heard of the time of year known as January?

Sven wrote:
Millions of people have
emigrated to Canada and America over the last few decades...yet those
two countries are hells on earth. What is [i]wrong[/i] with those
people?!?! They must be uninformed morons. Or, they smartly ignore to
Leftist bullshit propaganda about the horrors...the [i]absolute
horrors[/i]...of living in Canada and America.

Ah yes, a false dichotomy which nobody here has suggested. But it's interesting that you mention immigration. Yes, many people do move to Canada and the US to take advantage of economic opportunities. In Canada, however, many immigrants face siginificant barriers compared to the Canadian-born population, in spite of their qualifications. And many of the jobs that immigrant labourers end up doing are jobs under conditions most Canadain-born people won't tolerate. It's funny how people claim that minimum wage and labour standards are not necessary because "supply and demand" will fix the problem, yet business faced with a labour shortage want more foreign workers as opposed to improving working conditions.

By the way, just what impact has the economic crisis had on illegal immigration into the US from Mexico?

Fri, 2009-01-02 02:57

#109

Sven

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Sven wrote:
Millions of people haveemigrated to Canada and America over the last few decades...yet thosetwo countries are hells on earth. What is [i]wrong[/i] with thosepeople?!?! They must be uninformed morons. Or, they smartly ignore toLeftist bullshit propaganda about the horrors...the [i]absolutehorrors[/i]...of living in Canada and America.

Ah yes, a false dichotomy which nobody here has suggested.

Please explain, exactly, how what I said is a "false dichotomy"? You may be thinking of a different logical fallacy...but "false dichotomy" is not the correct one.

Aristotleded24 wrote:

By the way, just what impact has the economic crisis had on illegal immigration into the US from Mexico?

Obviously, it's curtailed it. But, when the recovery starts, illegal immigration will once again increase.

_________________________________________

[b]Eleutherophobics of the World...Unite!!![/b]

Fri, 2009-01-02 07:15

#110

Catchfire

It is hopeless to discuss capitalism with Sven, as this latest diversionary tactic evidences. Sven repeatedly proves himself incapable of addressing the question of contemporary capitalist life with any critical thought. Incredibly, Sven's latest offering suggests that a) Mexico and Cuba are examples of American life in the c-19 and b) that their poverty is disconnected from the capitalist system they inhabit that has aggressively and repeatedly targeted, exploited and oppressed their populations in a myriad of ways. Yet somehow, their poverty and our affluence proves that 'our' system is better than 'theirs'. Talk about a self-fulfilling prophecy. And, with a further rhetorical sleight-of-hand, he is using this absurd tautology to 'prove' that crown media corporations are coercive and anti-liberty.

Incredible

Fri, 2009-01-02 07:30

#111

Cueball

I have a friend whose girlfriend is from Cuba. They met in Cuba, but she recently moved to Florida and is now living in dire poverty there. My friend is basically supporting her, using his pay cheques from here. Her mother, a long time "exile" living in Florida arranged for the move. What is ironic is that shortly after helping her daughter get to the land of milk and honey the mother returned to Cuba after 20 years and thinks her daughter is an idiot for moving to Florida.

Fri, 2009-01-02 08:16

#112

Maysie

Closing for length.

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