Conservatives Emphasize Punishment and Deterrence in New Youth Crime Bill
Tue, 2007-11-20 09:02
#1
Conservatives Emphasize Punishment and Deterrence in New Youth Crime Bill
Tue, 2007-11-20 09:02
#2
From today's Star;[url=http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/278058]Youth crime bill pushes deterrence[/url]
quote:
OTTAWA–Tougher sentences for young offenders can be expected under legislation introduced yesterday that makes judges take deterrence into consideration.The bill introduced by the Conservative government would also allow the jailing of teenagers charged with serious offences right from the start until their trials are over.
The legislation is part of a law-and-order agenda being pushed this week by the government.
quote:
But experts, including Martha Mackinnon of Justice for Children and Youth, a legal clinic for low-income youth, say serious youth crime is not increasing, except for a blip last year. Mackinnon says the Conservatives are addressing a perception that has been exacerbated by politicians and the media. She also criticized the government's move to bring back "general deterrence" for youths, saying "there's no evidence that deterrence works for young people."
This is absolutely goddamned apalling. This government is continuing to pander to the most mean spirited elements of it's political base, and do so on the backs of our weakest and most vulnerable. Like all conservatives, they stay in power by marketing fear.
Philosophically, they are taking the foundational principles of youth justice legislation back over a hundred years, when the first such legislation appeared in Canada. In 1892, Canadian legislation was changed to recognise that "juvenile delinquents" were not to be treated as regular criminals, but were to be viewed as victims of poverty abuse and neglect and "in need of guidance and protection". This philosophy was behind the Juvenile Delinquents act of I think 1905, which lasted until the YOA of 1982. For all the abuses of how the act was used, these founding principles were sound.
Thank you very fucking much for taking us back 115 years in our child welfare legislation. One can see why they dropped the word "Progressive" from the party name.
[ 20 November 2007: Message edited by: oldgoat ]
Tue, 2007-11-20 09:16
#3
justified outrage oldgoat. but entirely predictable legislation from Harper and his cabal.
now, the real question is will it pass? Will Harper make it a confidence motion? We can hope to see the NDP oppose this, perhaps the Bloc will too, but will the Liberals?
my guess is the NDP will oppose it at the vote stage but make some verbal concession to the mandatory mins, which we embarassingly didn't oppose previously when they came up. The Bloc? who knows. but the Liberals, fearing a potential confidence motion, will telegraph to Harper that they'll play ball.
sad.
Tue, 2007-11-20 09:50
#4
Boom Boom
Joe Comartin on Newman's show was all over this bill - "deterrence" does absolutely nothing. Comartin said what is needed is prevention programs and more cops on the street, among other things. The neoCons are pandering to their base with this bullshit.
Thu, 2009-03-19 15:52
#5
Rexdale_Punjabi
deterrence won't do anything and more cops on the streets which means more of the gang unit. they abuse the shit out of the ppl in the hood and treat everyone like criminals. There is a systamatic problem not something that is fixed with longer prison sentences that is helping the prison industrial complex. Hmm 1st a couple years bacc they start to privatize more prisons now wit a conservative governement making longer prison sentences? hmmm
I hate the conservatives and yea no wonder they took out progressive.
Thu, 2009-03-19 16:09
#6
now, the real question is will it pass? Will Harper make it a confidence motion? We can hope to see the NDP oppose this, perhaps the Bloc will too, but will the Liberals?
Well, more than a year later, we all can reflect on the sad truth.
The omnibus crime bill went on to pass the House by 221 to 1, with all parties whipping the vote. The sole "no" vote was Bill Siksay, and he was disciplined by the party leader for voted against.
There was slightly more opposition in the Senate, with Sharon Carstairs vocally denouncing the discredited theory that more incarceration means less crime. But no one was listening.
Shameful.
Thu, 2009-03-19 19:56
#7
M. Spector
[url=http://www.straight.com/article-206158/its-time-ndp-leader-jack-layton-c... NDP is[/u][/color][/url] still today [url=http://challengingthecommonplace.blogspot.com/2009/03/mr-layton-you-blew... the Harperite law-and-order bandwagon.[/u][/color][/url]
Jack now even [url=http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20090316/bc_surrey_witn... to let municipal councils make their own criminal laws[/u][/color][/url] to facilitate local police crackdowns. Very progressive!
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:03
#8
And where does Steve Harper's lawnorder bandwagon stand on:
[url=http://archive.ndp.ca/page/5332][color=orange][b]1. Unchecked corporate crime[/b][/color][/url] and [url=http://osgoode.yorku.ca/media2.nsf/83303ffe5af03ed585256ae6005379c9/0e56... Canada's economy an estimated $20 billion[/b][/url] dollars a year(2004)?
[url=http://archive.ndp.ca/page/5521][color=darkorange][b]2. Canadian corporate crimes in South America?[/b][/color][/url]
[url=http://cupe.ca/economics/Harper-soft-on-white][b]CUPE says:[/b][/url] Harper is soft on white collar crime ie. crime that pays
[url=http://www.canadianbusiness.com/managing/strategy/article.jsp?content=20... good country for crooks:[/b] Canada's losing war against white-collar crime[/color][/url]
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:08
#9
Harper is soft on white-collar crime. That's why we must support him on youth crime.
Gotcha, thanks.
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:22
#10
So to suggest that the NDP's crime policies are those of the Harperites is misleading and incorrect
I never "suggested" anything. I reminded you and everyone else that the NDP whipped its caucus to vote in favour of Harper's draconian crime bill last year (do I need to remind you of the omnibus details???), and then disciplined Bill Siksay when he voted his conscience.
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:26
#11
No. As a socialist, I also think the conservatives' non-stance on white collar crime sucks just as bad and moreso than their dumb-dumb policies on youth crime, which the NDP says is also intimately related to social policy and a lack of it. So let's not distort things further wrt the NDP as is usually the case here in these kinds of threads whenever relevant and supporting information is offered.
Are the Tories capable of sucking at more than thing at a time?
Yes they are.
So to suggest that the NDP's crime policies are those of the Harperites is misleading and incorrect
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:33
#12
True confession time. Thanks, Fidel. Now we know which constituency Layton responds to, and which conscience Siksay answer to.
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:34
#13
Do you like the idea that handguns are flooding into Canada from the US?
Do you think murder should be rewarded with light prison sentences and slaps on wrists?
What about a gang member in Manitoba who's been caught thieving his 25th car? Is he a victim of circumstances, or has the system just failed him altogether after decades and decades of old line party rule in Ottawa?
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:35
#14
And thanks for distorting things for us in another thread attacking the NDP. It's what you do.
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:38
#15
Do you like the idea that handguns are flooding into Canada from the US?
Do you think murder should be rewarded with light prison sentences and slaps on wrists?
What about a gang member in Manitoba who's been caught thieving his 25th car? Is he a victim of circumstances, or has the system just failed him altogether after decades and decades of old line party rule in Ottawa?
I think I'll just preserve this little gem for posterity. One day, Fidel, I hope you recognize how perverse this viewpoint is.
Thu, 2009-03-19 23:42
#16
And we're so glad that you're expressing concern about Canadian youth in yet another thread. It's the tell-tale sign of a social democrat for-sure for-sure
Fri, 2009-03-20 11:46
#17
Rexdale_Punjabi
fidel you surprise me taking the name of a revolutionary leader but bein the opposite. murder should not be rewarded but the point is to be reformatory not purgatory. Just punishing doesnt do shit just leads to more of the same.
Do you like the idea that if a poor nigga robs a store he go to jail but a rich elite involved in white collar crime and millions of deaths gets nothing?
do you think murder should encourage more murder as in the current system?
what about a system thas has failed us time and time again and continues to unfairly and disproportionately target the most vulnerable parts of society locc em up to make you feel happy and make the elite money? do YOU think that fair? do you think it fair to demonize and criminalize entire segments of the human population? In fact that the majority not even the minority