Healing Israeli Apartheid not its Victims: An Open Letter to Leonard Cohen - Don't Play Israel
http://www.pacbi.org/etemplate.php?id=1006
"If you had just emerged from three weeks of unfettered bombing from land sea and air with no place to hide and no place to run, your hospitals overwhelmed, sewage running in the streets and white phosphorous burning up your children, what would the news that the great Canadian musician Leonard Cohen had decided to play for your tormentors say to you?"
No worries. I have been boycotting him for years solely on the strength of his pretentiousness.
"Palestinian Campaign for the Academic and Cultural Boycott of Israel (PACBI) calls on all supporters of a just peace in our region to shun your concerts and CDs and to protest your appearances everywhere." Because Cohen will give a performance in Israel.
If this over-reaching does not serve finally to discredit the obnoxious concept of an academic boycott of Israel, I don't know what will.
A cultural boycott of Israel means you don't perform there. How is that "overrreaching"? What part of "boycott" do you not understand?
If this over-reaching does not serve finally to discredit the obnoxious concept of an academic boycott of Israel, I don't know what will.
"Academic"? There is nothing "academic" about him, he writes pop ditties.
While I support the boycott I think if the war against the Palestinians will end it must come from the Israeli people, having listened to Leonard I hope the people who hear him will lean ever more in that direction. I have read that there will be some Palestinians attending the concert and that seems positive.
A cultural boycott of Israel means you don't perform there. How is that "overrreaching"?
Because they are calling for a secondary boycott of Cohen everywhere.
Perhaps someone will ask that opponents of Israel should boycott you because you post to a site where some people oppose the academic boycott?
You seem to think that there should be no consequences for breaking a boycott.
I suppose you think there should be no consequences for crossing picket lines as well?
Is your position based on some actual principle, or is it just because you want to see the boycott fail and Israel go on committing crimes against humanity?
Oh I see, they should only boycott him in Tel Aviv, not everywhere. That would be unfair.
The Boycott Israeli Goods Campaign - the cutural boycott - Leonard Cohen
http://www.bigcampaign.org/index.php?page=the-cultural-boycott-leonard-c...
"Cohen, who is Jewish and has described himself as religiously observant, has not hidden his affiliation with Irael. During the Yom Kippur War he toured IDF bases with a guitar entertaining the troops. During the 1973 War Leonard Cohen volunteered to fight in the Israeli army.."
Time to see which Cohen albums I still need to purchase.
My favourite observation about Cohen's incessant whining was that it was "hard to have sympathy for someone who seeks spiritual enlightenment in Las Angeles."
Well, I don't support the overall boycott of Israel, however I have been boycotting Cohen for many years now...so I will continue to do so. I am with Cueball in post #1 - but I would add in the grating and annoying singing voice he has.
It is his words that return to me, such as, "here's to the few who forgive what you do and the fewer that don't even care".
Yeah, what a great humanitarian mensch he is! So sensitive! Such great lyrics!
Such a poseur!
Yeah, what a great humanitarian mensch he is! So sensitive! Such great lyrics!
Such a poseur!
LOL
What I find funny is that people take his Buddhist experience and lay their opinions of what that must mean onto him and then when he doesn't conform to their thinking about what Buddhism is they attack him.
There are thousands of Leonard Cohen fans, maybe hundreds of thousands, maybe more than a million who have found his words and music of value. I know I am grateful.
Like he said, "here's to the few who forgive what you do" and obviously you don't fall into that category LOL "and the fewer who don't even care" and even more clearly you don't get what that means.
All your contempt says to me is that you are filled with contempt. Sad.
As for any boycott, I think we can decide to boycott and we can ask for support for that boycott but if others do not support the boycott we still need to practice respect for them and their to right to make other choices.
What I find funny is that people take his Buddhist experience and lay their opinions of what that must mean onto him and then when he doesn't conform to their thinking about what Buddhism is they attack him.
That's not me, fortunately. I have recognized Cohen as a second-rate singer and third-rate poet from the very beginning.
There are thousands of Leonard Cohen fans, maybe hundreds of thousands, maybe more than a million who have found his words and music of value. I know I am grateful.
I don't doubt there will be hundreds of thousands of Israelis holding hands and singing Hallelujah along with Lennie. Then when it's over they can all go back to enabling the vicious regime that oppresses and kills Palestinians.
As for any boycott, I think we can decide to boycott and we can ask for support for that boycott but if others do not support the boycott we still need to practice respect for them and their to right to make other choices.
"Please, Mister Cohen, boycott Israel. Oh, you won't? Well, have a nice day, then!"
I recognize the world is larger than my opinions, I respect that others have the right to choose something different than what I choose.
As far as your comments regarding the Israeli audience that would listen to Leonard, perhaps many of them are also opposed to what the Israeli government is doing, perhaps many fans will boycott his performance there, we don't know. You don't know and yet you make sarcastic statements regarding their "holding hands and singing to Hallelujah ........enabling the vcious regime that oppresses and kills Palestinians". Are you saying that all Jews living in Israel are for the murder of all Palestinians?
AI Sponsors/Whitewashes Leonard Cohen's Violation of PACBI Call for Israeli Boycott
http://stopwar.org.uk/content/view/1391/27/
"The following letter was sent to Amnesty International USA, following its decision to sponsor Leonard Cohen's concert in Israel in September 2009, despite the Palestinian call for a cultural boycott of Israel.."
Now that is interesting info about AI, I was wondering what they were up to these days, now I know.
Guess it is time to boycott AI too.
I recognize the world is larger than my opinions, I respect that others have the right to choose something different than what I choose.
It's not just a matter of someone having different opinions. I have no problem with that. It's a matter of someone [b]taking action[/b] to thwart efforts by millions of people around the world to put an end to Israeli apartheid through the peaceful means of a boycott, divestment, and sanctions campaign.
That's what is reprehensible.
As far as your comments regarding the Israeli audience that would listen to Leonard, perhaps many of them are also opposed to what the Israeli government is doing, perhaps many fans will boycott his performance there, we don't know. You don't know and yet you make sarcastic statements regarding their "holding hands and singing to Hallelujah ........enabling the vcious regime that oppresses and kills Palestinians". Are you saying that all Jews living in Israel are for the murder of all Palestinians?
I didn't even mention Jews living in Israel. I said Israelis.
Perhaps you weren't paying close attention last January when the [url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/14/gaza-israel-palestine]opinion polls showed overwhelming public support[/url] among Israelis for the murderous assault on Gaza?
I see no reason to assume that those attending Cohen's concert aren't similarly inclined.
The Zionist Bias of Amnesty International
http://sydwalker.info/blog/2009/07/30/the-zionist-bias-of-amnesty-intern...
"In 2002, International lawyer Francis Boyle was interviewed by Dennis Bernstein about the Politics of Human Rights. Professor Boyle gave an inside perspective on the long-standing and increasingly obvious pro-Israel bias of Amnesty International.."
As far as your comments regarding the Israeli audience that would listen to Leonard, perhaps many of them are also opposed to what the Israeli government is doing, perhaps many fans will boycott his performance there, we don't know. You don't know and yet you make sarcastic statements regarding their "holding hands and singing to Hallelujah ........enabling the vcious regime that oppresses and kills Palestinians". Are you saying that all Jews living in Israel are for the murder of all Palestinians?I didn't even mention Jews living in Israel. I said Israelis.
Perhaps you weren't paying close attention last January when the [url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/14/gaza-israel-palestine]opinion polls showed overwhelming public support[/url] among Israelis for the murderous assault on Gaza?
I see no reason to assume that those attending Cohen's concert aren't similarly inclined.
Fine, so in your opinion Israelis attending Leonard Cohen support the murder of the Palestinians. I don't know that that is true but you are free to rely on opinion polls. I suspect there will be quite a few Jewish Israelis there and I suspect that they are horrified by what is happening to the Palestinians too.
I won't be responding to any of your posts in future.
Fine, so in your opinion Israelis attending Leonard Cohen support the murder of the Palestinians.
Since an overwhelming majority - 90-96% - of Jewish Israelis supported the massacre of Palestinians last January, it's likely that 9 out of 10 Israelis attending a Leonard Cohen concert support Israeli murder of Arabs anyway.
This is too much.
NDPPThis is too much.
too much by far - but true:
Overwhelming Israeli Support of Gaza Op
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull...
.....
too much by far - but true:
Overwhelming Israeli Support of Gaza Op
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull...
If that is true then they are fucked but is it true? Or was the survey shaped to show that support? Is the Jerusalem Post unbiased? Is there anyone posting here who actually spends time in Israel?
There you go again showing off your wonderful capacity for mean spirited smallness, please continue, you are just getting smaller and nastier and smaller and nastier. LOL
Enough already with the flattery. He's intolerable as it is. 
Enough already with the flattery. He's intolerable as it is.
LOL
I watched Cohen on Strombo last night, perservering through half of the interview with a determination fueled by delightful kettle chips, in the hope of ultimately finding some strand of coherence that would explain his success. While undertaking another foray into what became the bottom of the bag, I changed course in mid-reach to grapple for the remote, and the beckoning off button that I had ignored for far too long.
Tickets for Leonard Cohen concert in Tel Aviv Go On Sale Saturday
If that is true then they are fucked but is it true?
For decades I've noticed that, when presented with information that shatters the illusory image they've had of Israel, many people question the information, rather than their illusions.
For example, following a presentation of a paper on Palestinian nationalism that I made in a senior PoliSci seminar twenty years ago, my professor said that he questioned the information I gave, yet couldn't argue with the credibility of my sources, so reluctantly accepted what I had written.
If that is true then they are fucked but is it true?
For decades I've noticed that, when presented with information that shatters the illusory image they've had of Israel, many people question the information, rather than their illusions.
For example, following a presentation of a paper on Palestinian nationalism that I made in a senior PoliSci seminar twenty years ago, my professor said that he questioned the information I gave, yet couldn't argue with the credibility of my sources, so reluctantly accepted what I had written.
I read the paper here and know that my views are being shaped and that the MSM is completely manipulated so why would I trust another paper which appears to be MSM?
I did find a site, a fan site for Leonard, and I was shocked by some people's veiws, it appears I am naive in my thinking that those who listen to him take what he says seriously. So I must revise my thinking on that and hope that at least some of those attending his concert will be people working for change but I can't because sadly I have to say that if they really were working for change they too would support the boycott. I think they would be the best people to tell him not to play there.
I suspect there will be quite a few Jewish Israelis there and I suspect that they are horrified by what is happening to the Palestinians too.
Put the emphasis on "few" and you've got it. The Zionist war on Arabs is so popular among Israelis as to make a babble thread called "All Hail the Israeli resistance" a deceptive, sick, joke.
Tickets for Leonard Cohen concert in Tel Aviv Go On Sale Saturday
I would imagine Cohen will sell out. He's very much a Canadian music icon, revered by lots of fans worldwide. Cohen apparently was cleaned out financially by a business manager several years ago, and now is trying to recoup his savings.
If that is true then they are fucked but is it true?
For decades I've noticed that, when presented with information that shatters the illusory image they've had of Israel, many people question the information, rather than their illusions.
For example, following a presentation of a paper on Palestinian nationalism that I made in a senior PoliSci seminar twenty years ago, my professor said that he questioned the information I gave, yet couldn't argue with the credibility of my sources, so reluctantly accepted what I had written.
I read the paper here and know that my views are being shaped and that the MSM is completely manipulated so why would I trust another paper which appears to be MSM?
I did find a site, a fan site for Leonard, and I was shocked by some people's veiws, it appears I am naive in my thinking that those who listen to him take what he says seriously. So I must revise my thinking on that and hope that at least some of those attending his concert will be people working for change but I can't because sadly I have to say that if they really were working for change they too would support the boycott. I think they would be the best people to tell him not to play there.
Maybe he isn't as profound as you think (thought), and his lyric are so open to interpretation, they can sit well with anyone's ideology.
It is true, I think that Cohen volunteered for the IDF during the Yom Kipur War, something that was a little bit more understandable at that time, since the general level of understanding of the situation in the occupied territories was less well known, but by now ignorance of the facts is just inexcusable, especially since the situation has deteriorated substantially. Israel fights agressive wars far outside the limits of its UN mandate, and engages in wholesale massacres of persons in the Arab cities within the range its aircraft on a regular basis, with virtual impunity. During Yom Kimpur, at least the Arabs states had some serious military capability, given their status as Soviet clients, but now, they basically have squat, while the IDF remains one of the most powerful armies in the world.
It makes absolutely no difference who buys the tickets for the Tel Aviv concert, and what their opinions are about Palestine and Zionism.
Cohen's flouting of the cultural boycott would be no less reprehensible if the entire audience were Sikhs or Buddhists.
Entertaining Apartheid Israel Deserves No Amnesty
http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/22184
Open letter to Amnesty International
A Plea to Leonard Cohen
http://www.counterpunch.org/aloni08032009.html
"it may be difficult for me, emotionally, to accept a cultural boycott..With my actions I will offer those denied self-determination the right to determine their response. By accepting their right to decide; I will empower those who've been disempowered for so long and help to restore the Sovereignty they lack. That is what solidarity really means.
Er... as far as I understand this, I think some peeps might want to have a second look at what he's actually doing. Just food for thought.... I might be wrong, but trying to play both in Israel AND Palestine with the message he proposing doesn't sound like a bad thing? Thoughts?
"Leonard Cohen will donate ALL of his Israeli concert profits to a newly established fund for Palestinian and Israeli children, Israeli sponsors said.....
Tickets for Cohen's Reconciliation, Tolerance and Peace concert in Israel go on sale this weekend, the sponsors said Friday.....
"It is still unclear whether Cohen will perform for Palestinians in Ramallah. A scheduled performance Sept. 26 was postponed after the Palestinian Prisoners' Club Society said Cohen was not welcome...."
I LOVE THIS! I'm sorry, I'm not taking sides in this particular argument, I'm just laughing over the image itself.
Fine, so in your opinion Israelis attending Leonard Cohen support the murder of the Palestinians. I don't know that that is true but you are free to rely on opinion polls. I suspect there will be quite a few Jewish Israelis there and I suspect that they are horrified by what is happening to the Palestinians too.
I won't be responding to any of your posts in future.
Hey ennir, give Spector a chance. He's progressive, and quite a brilliant resource around here. He does have this minor tendency to exaggerate certain issues, and once he's challenged, [b]he never gives an inch[/b].
For example, let's say I claimed that the almost 50% of Canadians who (according to polls) either support or are indifferent to our invasion of Afghanistan were all [b]bloodthirsty individuals who craved the death of innocent Afghan civilians[/b]. You would see that as an exaggeration with the tiniest grain of truth, right? Hopefully?
Just trying to be a conciliator here, although I recognize the risk - being scorned by both sides - which in itself is ironically a form of unity!
For example, let's say I claimed that the almost 50% of Canadians who (according to polls) either support or are indifferent to our invasion of Afghanistan were all [b]bloodthirsty individuals who craved the death of innocent Afghan civilians[/b]. You would see that as an exaggeration with the tiniest grain of truth, right? Hopefully?
I would never say such a thing.
In response to some fantasy about masses of anti-Zionist Israelis flocking to watch Leonard Cohen thumb his nose at the BDS campaign, I would, however, quote reliable statistics to indicate the improbability of such a scenario.
Just trying to be a conciliator here, although I recognize the risk - being scorned by both sides - which in itself is ironically a form of unity!
Not to mention the unanimity of being scorned by casual observers.
Er... as far as I understand this, I think some peeps might want to have a second look at what he's actually doing. Just food for thought.... I might be wrong, but trying to play both in Israel AND Palestine with the message he proposing doesn't sound like a bad thing? Thoughts?
I agree with what is said in the two links posted immediately above your post by NoDifferenceParty Pooper. They explain better than I could why what Cohen is doing is wrong.
For example, read this from the second link:
But then my daughter looked me right in the eye, and said in her straightforward way: "Daddy, write to Leonard and explain to him why the Palestinians are right to cancel his concert. They don't have the privilege of free access to culture that we have in Tel Aviv or New York. They're tired of all the goodwill gestures and the petty benefits we concede to as an alibi for our own dirty consciences. They want justice, and that's why they are asking: 'Don't go and amuse our occupiers, and then come to us with a consolation prize.'" Her words were so simple, so wise, that as soon as I heard them I knew I had to write to you [Cohen].
If as many Israelis supported the mass murder of Palestinians as the polls would indicate, then the only solution to the Middle East problem is the expulsion or execution of almost all Israelis - as indeed we ought to have done with Germans and Japanese after World War II, right?.
That's why I prefer to think that polls (which generally, but not always, elicit the responses that the ruling circles have themselves engendered) are not accurate guides to the way Israelis really feel, if provided with a framework whereby all inhabitants could live in freedom.
Personally, before going apeshit over boycotting those who won't boycott, I'd rather see [b]us boycotting something[/b] - as some trade unions and Canadian organizations have actually begun to do. Otherwise, we will be boycotting the AFN for visiting and praising Israel, instead of just engaging them in debate over why they would be so misled as to mistake enemies for friends. That's just one example.
Let me repeat that. Start by generating a significant movement, in this country, to boycott everything to do with Israel. Then have debates later about what to do with those who won't abide by the boycott. Otherwise, the cart is careening wildly ahead of the horse.
And while we're at it, we might consider boycotting Canadian artists who entertain the troops in Afghanistan.
And while we're at it, we might consider boycotting Canadian artists who entertain the troops in Afghanistan.
I don't know if that was serious or sarcastic (it's not always easy to tell), but I'm already doing just that. And by the same logic, I advocate boycotting Leonard Cohen and anybody else who knowingly and wilfully breaks the cultural boycott of Israel.
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjWENNe29qc]Sun City[/url] (YouTube)
No, I'm not kidding about boycotting those who facilitate our invasion of Afghanistan - that's why I raised the issue. I still think we need to do [b]direct[/b] work to convince people of the need to boycott everything Israeli. The Cohen issue is more difficult.
![http://i27.tinypic.com/2v9yi6b.jpg[/IMG]](http://i27.tinypic.com/2v9yi6b.jpg[/IMG]){kind=link}