Boycott Leonard Cohen

102 posts / 0 new

Topic locked

Mon, 2009-08-03 19:35

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Popular entertainers getting embroiled in controversy, in this post-literate era of infotainment news, gets more attention from the public than war news or financial news.

That's why the Cohen controversy is important for bringing the BDS issue to public attention. Just as United Artists Against Apartheid raised the consciousness of millions with the Sun City song, the Cohen concert in Israel can provide the focus for widespread discussion and understanding of the issue of Israeli apartheid and Zionist aggression in general.

So it's not a matter of cart-before-horse. It's a matter of being able to recognize a horse when you see one.

Mon, 2009-08-03 20:37

#53

remind

So you are all for boycotting Amnesty International too mspector?

Mon, 2009-08-03 22:16

#54

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

How would I do that, exactly?

Mon, 2009-08-03 22:48

#55

remind

How do you boycott Cohen?

Mon, 2009-08-03 23:51

#56

NDPP

Unionist wrote:

Let me repeat that. Start by generating a significant movement, in this country, to boycott everything to do with Israel. Then have debates later about what to do with those who won't abide by the boycott.

And while we're at it, we might consider boycotting Canadian artists who entertain the troops in Afghanistan.

NDPP

The Palestinian people have declared a cultural boycott and have every right to expect supporters to honour this. Clearly Mr. Cohen is not a supporter. In front of the whole world he violates and attacks this people yet again with a perfect AI USA accomplice too. Palestinian supporters worldwide have more than enough energy and motivation to continue to advance BDS AND deal with Mr Cohen's ticket sales as well, just you wait and see..

Most definitely with Afghanistan too. How could it be otherwise?

Tue, 2009-08-04 20:40

#57

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

remind wrote:

How do you boycott Cohen?

Um, gee, I don't know, remind.... maybe by not buying his music or going to his concerts?

So, um, does Amnesty International have any CDs or concerts that I can boycott?

Tue, 2009-08-04 21:08

#58

remind

what if you do not ever buy his CD's, nor go to his concerts ever, how do you boycott him then?

Tue, 2009-08-04 21:25

#59

Papal Bull

Then don't buy his t-shirts ;)

Tue, 2009-08-04 21:32

#60

NDPP

NorthReport wrote:

NoDifferencePartyPooper wrote:

Tickets for Leonard Cohen concert in Tel Aviv Go On Sale Saturday

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1104362.html

I would imagine Cohen will sell out.

NDPP

clearly he already has..

Tue, 2009-08-04 21:44

#61

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

remind wrote:

what if you do not ever buy his CD's, nor go to his concerts ever, how do you boycott him then?

If you don't really have an answer as to how I can "boycott" Amnesty International, then why don't you just say so, and admit that your question at post #52 above was B.S.?

Tue, 2009-08-04 22:03

#62

remind

Well I would say boycotting AI is self evident, so did not think it really needed one, I.e. do not give them any money and do not spread their initiatives about and speak out against their pro-Zionist affiliations.

Fri, 2009-08-07 03:35

#63

NDPP

Action Alert: Protest Amnesty International/Leonard Cohen

http://bodyontheline.wordpress.com/2009/08/06/action-alert-protest-amnes...

"By assisting Cohen in his ruse to bypass this boycott, Amnesty International is in fact taking a political stance, in violation of the premise of political neutrality with which it so regularly justifies its failure to side unambiguously with the oppressed. Amnesty is telling us: resistance is futile, the voice of the oppressed is irrelevent..."

Fri, 2009-08-07 04:51

#64

Michelle

Caissa wrote:

Time to see which Cohen albums I still need to purchase.

Be sure to pick up some Rod Stewart and Julio Iglesias too, Caissa, if you want to build your collection based on artists who support apartheid.

I Ain't Gonna Play Sun City

Fri, 2009-08-07 08:35

#65

Caissa

The only good Rod Stewart Album, Michelle, is A Night on the Town and i bought that on vinyl in 1978 and own it on CD. Ro Stewart and Elton John produced Long John Baldry's Everything Stops for Tea, an iconic album. I never liked Iglesiais; I'll stick with Cohen, Michelle, but thanks for the recommendations.

Sat, 2009-08-08 01:37

#66

NDPP

Boycott Amnesty International's Toronto Fundraiser, August 27, Harborfront Center, 231 Queen's Quay W

http://www.aito.ca/Events/2009_Events/Events-08-content.html

Sat, 2009-08-08 09:40

#67

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

NoDifferencePartyPooper wrote:

AI Sponsors/Whitewashes Leonard Cohen's Violation of PACBI Call for Israeli Boycott

http://stopwar.org.uk/content/view/1391/27/

Clicking the above link produces this message: [b]"You are not authorised to view this resource.
You need to login."[/b]

What kind of antiwar movement would have a website that requires you to log in in order to read its message? I assume one that has absolutely no sense of how to communicate with a mass audience.

Here's a link that's open to the public: http://www.zmag.org/znet/viewArticle/22184

Sat, 2009-08-08 10:06

#68

NDPP

sorry it didn't do that when I first went there - thanks for finding an alternative link MS

Sat, 2009-08-08 12:03

#69

The Bish

Since the intent of a boycott is to affect some particular change, I'm curious what specific change a boycott of Leonard Cohen is expected to lead to. Let's say that everyone who buys Leonard Cohen albums and goes to his concerts stops supporting him. OK, so Cohen gets the message and no longer plays shows in Israel. The response of the Israeli public to that action is going to be what? Nothing, probably. If anything, it will likely entrench in the more militant Israelis the belief that the rest of the world is out to get them and doesn't understand their situation. I mean, I seriously doubt that foreign concerts in Israel are such a huge economic boon to the local economy that they'd really miss the revenue.

And presumably given the complicity of the American government in Israel's campaigns in Gaza (not to mention American military efforts elsewhere), we should also boycott people who play concerts in the U.S., right? And, I mean, Canada's governments aren't exactly known as the greatest critics of Israel either, so we should probably stop supporting anyone who plays concerts in Canada too. This will clearly show the Israelis that we really mean it.

Sat, 2009-08-08 20:35

#70

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

That's the Noam Chomsky reductionist argument against the BDS campaign. It's a recipe for doing nothing.

I recommend you spend some time reading about what the academic/cultural boycott is about and what it aims to accomplish. You could start [url=http://bdsmovement.net/?q=node/7]HERE.[/url]

Sat, 2009-08-08 21:46

#71

Stockholm

so why no academic/cultural boycott of the United States - the great satan???

Sat, 2009-08-08 22:05

#72

Stephen Gordon

Dude. That would be inconvenient.

Sun, 2009-08-09 19:46

#73

epablo

..in my almost 40 years of activism there is one thing i have learned and that is who the enemy is. leonard cohen for all his faults and virtues is not the enemy no more than the scabs are that crossed the picket line when i was on strike. there needs to be a different way of dealing with people who fall by the wayside if we are ever going build coalitions strong enought to alter the powers that be. demonizing does not work because purity does not exist. it never has and it never will.

Sun, 2009-08-09 21:50

#74

NDPP

the Palestinians have erected a'picket line' and whether you think they should have or not is neither here nor there. If you support the Palestinian struggle you will respect the line. If you do not you will cross the line. I choose to respect it and counsel others to do the same. Scabs may not BE the enemy but they work FOR the enemy. Cohen and his accomplice A.I. have chosen to cross the line. On their heads be it.

Sun, 2009-08-09 22:14

#75

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

We're not talking about a strike here.

We're talking about [b]matters of life and death[/b] for hundreds of thousands of Palestinians.

It's all very well for us to sit around here and decide for the Palestinians who their enemy "really" is and, like Roman emperors, turn our thumbs up or down.

The fact is the Palestinians themselves have called for an academic, cultural, and economic boycott, along with dis-investment of capital in Israeli businesses and economic and diplomatic sanctions against Israel. The object is to isolate Israel as an outlaw among nations and pressure it into ending its blockades, wars, occupations, and theft of Palestinian land.

Those who support the Palestinian cause should observe and comply with the BDS campaign, in solidarity. Those who knowingly refuse to do so are expressing their solidarity with Israel, and playing their own small part in enabling the crimes of the Israeli state against the Palestinians to continue.

There are times when progressive people are called upon to stand up and be counted. This is one of them.

Sun, 2009-08-09 22:17

#76

epablo

..there is a need to maintain perspective. to this day i boycott shell because because of it's behaviour in south africa when there was a boycott. shell is an enemy of humanity.
..we all cross picket lines in our lives for one reason or another, we can't escape it and i include palistinians in this all. it is in the nature of the system we live in..the clothes we buy, the food we eat, the computers we play with. we need to keep perspective or we begin to look like the left portrayed in the life of brian.

Sun, 2009-08-09 23:29

#77

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

You're still conducting a personal secondary boycott against Shell for breaking the South Africa boycott that ended 15 years ago, and yet you present bullshit rationalizations for Leonard Cohen's knowingly breaking the boycott against Israel?

The only rational conclusion is that you don't support the Israel boycott. Why not just say so?

Sun, 2009-08-09 23:45

#78

epablo

m. spector i came on this bog because i felt i had something to contribute. you attack me personally even though you have absolutely no idea of who i am. you are disrespectful and i don't want to talk to you.

Mon, 2009-08-10 01:32

#79

NDPP

epablo wrote:

..there is a need to maintain perspective. to this day i boycott shell because because of it's behaviour in south africa when there was a boycott. shell is an enemy of humanity.
..we all cross picket lines in our lives for one reason or another, we can't escape it and i include palistinians in this all. it is in the nature of the system we live in..the clothes we buy, the food we eat, the computers we play with. we need to keep perspective or we begin to look like the left portrayed in the life of brian.

NDPP

Keeping "perspective" as you suggest means that we remember that Israel was also a staunch supporter of Shell and the South African Apartheid state and that the malevolent oppression of Palestinians by Israel more than qualifies it for the same "enemy of humanity" consideration by you. There's a giant contradiction here resolved only by you getting your ass over to the right side of the line on this.

Mon, 2009-08-10 04:06

#80

epablo

..as i understand it this thread is not about israel. it's about leonard cohen doing a concert in israel thus breaking with the boycott. this is what i would like to focus on if for nothing else than to resove this issue in my own mind.
..cohen does not live in israel. he does not vote there and as far as i know he has never went around publicly declaring support for isreali military positions. but because he breaks with the boycott he must now be punished. this is where my concerns lie. there is something very wrong in people boycotting israel out of fear of retribution.

Mon, 2009-08-10 07:43

#81

Caissa

The other thing to keep in mind is that not everyone on this list is boycotting Israel.

Mon, 2009-08-10 08:06

#82

Maysie

[drift]

Welcome to babble epablo.

Since epablo is so new, I would really be gratified if people could back off on the "full throttle ahead" attack mode that has become the culture on babble of late.

Thank you.

[/drift]

Mon, 2009-08-10 13:47

#83

NDPP

Leonard Cohen Sells Out in Israel

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3755990,00.html

"A Leonard Cohen concert to benefit Palestinian and Israeli peace groups has sold out in less than a day.."

Mon, 2009-08-10 13:56

#84

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

epablo wrote:

..cohen does not live in israel.

If he lived in Israel he would not be breaking the boycott by performing there. The fact is he does not live in Israel and has knowingly flouted the boycott by performing there. You said he didn't live in Israel as if that were a mitigating circumstance, when in fact it is the reason why his performance there violates the boycott.

And to say this thread is "not about Israel" is absurd.

Mon, 2009-08-10 14:07

#85

Ghislaine

Hypothetical question: You hear some music being played at a friend's house, party, etc. that you absolutely love and think to yourself that you want to find out the artists name and get their album. When you look them up online, you discover that they are Israeli. Do you refuse to listen or get their music? Is your answer different if you know that they are active in Palestinian solidarity work?

Mon, 2009-08-10 14:12

#86

Caissa

Is post #83 correct, this concert benefits palestinian and Israeli peace groups?

Mon, 2009-08-10 16:45

#87

NDPP

Caissa wrote:

Is post #83 correct, this concert benefits palestinian and Israeli peace groups?

NDPP

No. It's a scam. See post #41 or the following:

Resigning from Cohen and Amnesty

http://pulsemedia.org/2009/07/30/resigning-from-cohen-and-amnesty/

Amnesty urged to reject "tainted" funds from Leonard Cohen

http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article10687.shtml

Leonard Cohen, Amnesty partner with Settlers to play phoney peace gig

http://www.artistsagainstapartheid.org/?tag=leonard-cohen

Tue, 2009-08-11 08:04

#88

Caissa

Thank you, NDP.

Thu, 2009-08-13 18:35

#89

epablo

NoDifferencePartyPooper wrote:

Leonard Cohen Sells Out in Israel

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3755990,00.html

"A Leonard Cohen concert to benefit Palestinian and Israeli peace groups has sold out in less than a day.."

..for a short while it was nice to think that the above was real. alas it is not. and since it is not i acknowledge that cohen should not have broken with the boycott. i have no appetite for punishing him though and i do not see him as the enemy.
..i was hoping that the concerns i raised in previous posts would find resolve but not today. another time perhaps. i do appreciate the opportunity to raise them.

Wed, 2009-08-19 10:35

#90

NDPP

Amnesty International Withdraws from Cohen's Israel Concert

http://www.pacbi.org/etemplate.php?id=1080

"Amnesty International has announced today that it will abstain from any involvment in the Leonard Cohen concert in Tel Aviv and will not be party to any fund that benefits from the concert's proceeds.."

Wed, 2009-08-19 20:50

#91

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Amnesty International USA gives no real reason for pulling out of involvement in the distribution of proceeds. Their [url=http://www.amnesty.org/en/library/asset/MDE15/025/2009/en/4f6becdc-e532-... release[/url] makes it clear they have no regrets at all over their support for Cohen's activity in Israel, but obviously they are bowing to pressure from supporters of the BDS campaign:

Quote:
AIUSA is impressed by Leonard Cohen's commitment to use his talent to benefit directly those working for human rights and continues to hope that this wish will be realized.

Amnesty International has taken no position on boycotts anywhere in the world. AIUSA's participation in discussions related to this project was based firmly on the belief that setting up such a fund could be beneficial to Israeli and Palestinian efforts on behalf of human rights."

Sun, 2009-08-30 21:13

#92

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

[url=http://www.bdsmovement.net/?q=node/506]Madonna urged to stay away from performing for Israel[/url]

Quote:
More than 100 Jews and Israeli Arabs are calling on Madonna to call off her Tel Aviv concerts, scheduled for September 1 and 2.

The group has formed an organization called Boycott! Support the Palestinian BDS (Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions) Call from Within, and on Sunday sent a letter to Madonna asking her not to perform at the Tel Aviv Fairgrounds.

According to Tel Aviv University Prof. Rachel Giora, a member of the group, the organization is also encouraging Israelis to boycott Madonna's performance, "to let Israel's government know how they feel... thereby hoping to encourage the Israeli government to reconsider its policies."

"A performance here would imply that Israel is behaving in an acceptable manner, and would be interpreted by Israelis as moral support for the illegal and inhumane policies, described by many as war crimes and crimes against humanity," Giora said in the letter.

The letter refers to Madonna's study of Kabbala and her understanding of the Jewish concept of tikkun olam, or healing the world. The group suggest that "Israel's actions don't reflect this [tikkun olam], as Palestinian dignity and life are being trampled upon."

Although Madonna is not Jewish, she is known for her affection for Israel and the Jewish people, and her appreciation of Kabbala. It seems unlikely that she will comply with the boycott request.

Sun, 2009-08-30 21:42

#93

NDPP

of course not she's a "material girl"

Tue, 2009-09-08 12:32

#94

Joel_Goldenberg

Caissa wrote:

The only good Rod Stewart Album, Michelle, is A Night on the Town and i bought that on vinyl in 1978 and own it on CD. Ro Stewart and Elton John produced Long John Baldry's Everything Stops for Tea, an iconic album. I never liked Iglesiais; I'll stick with Cohen, Michelle, but thanks for the recommendations.

You don't like Rod's Every Picture Tells A Story?

Tue, 2009-09-08 15:16

#95

Caissa

Not really Joel. I enjoyed listening to Cohen's Live in London album last night.

Tue, 2009-09-08 16:38

#96

Boom Boom

I love Rod Stewart's early albums, including Every picture Tells a Story, Gasoline Alley, An Old Raincoat Won't Ever Let You Down, Rod Stewart Unplugged, and Never A Dull Moment. Caissa, good buddy, here's a hint: play Rod Stewart LOUD.

ps: I heard Long John Baldry do the Everything Stops for Tea album in Ottawa, I think Baldry opened for Jethro Tull when they did their Thick As a Brick album.

Wed, 2009-09-09 07:08

#97

Caissa

I tried playing Deep Purple loud the other night and my children told me to turn it down. Bloody generation gap...

Wed, 2009-09-09 09:07

#98

Boom Boom