Remember federal NDP's road to govt. goes thru BC
BC Election Day reactions
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:48
#102
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:48
#103
The idea of four more years of Liberal nitwit governance is utterly sickening.
These results are incomprehensible, after everything those morons failed at.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:48
#104
Dix and his entire team need to be gone, yesterday. Pleasantries about positive campaigning may look good on TV, but this is politics. You play by Chicago rules or you might as well go home.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:49
#105
That isn't what it looks like to me right now at least.
Nobody votes for pipelines. That's idiotic.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:49
#106
It'd be ironic if Clark wins huge victory only to lose her own seat. Things concidered I doubt she'll resign when she won the big picture and is still effectively the Premier with a bigger majority.
Does anyone know if Kindler Morgan was popular, unpopular?
I still think it was more likely a combo of not fight back against negative ads and a bad debate preformance.
Justin Trudeau should watch Dix carefully this could be his future fate.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:50
#107
1969. 1983. 2013
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:53
#108
Ex-Vancouver Mayor Sam Sullivan elected
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:53
#109
Remember federal NDP's road to govt. goes thru BC
May be one positive... federal party won't have a mid term provincial NDP govt weigh them down.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:53
#110
Why should the NDP be eating crow right now? EVERYONE thought it would be an NDP win. There is nothing to apologize for.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:55
#111
Frankly, I would be glad if both Justin and Harper lose.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:57
#112
Catchfire
I don't think the problem is the "positive" campaign -- because the NDP didn't really run a "positive" campaign. They didn't run attack ads, but they didn't run a policy that would get out the vote with people disenchanted with the Liberals.
Wed, 2013-05-15 00:57
#113
I feel bad for Brian Topp, all the positive energy he built up for his career after 2011 election, all the energy he built up during the leadership race, and all the energy he built up in the early days, only for it to turn all to shit. Dix fucked up, but Topp will pay the price along side him.
And you can't just blame it on the Tory collaspe, the NDP was around 50 percent on thier own not that long ago, no the Dix has to take responsiblity and resign, he blew it.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:02
#114
Well, the NDP is currently on track to do *worse* than in 2009.
Somewhere in Victoria, Carole James must be feeling just the *teensiest* bit of vindication.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:03
#115
I don't think the problem is the "positive" campaign -- because the NDP didn't really run a "positive" campaign. They didn't run attack ads, but they didn't run a policy that would get out the vote with people disenchanted with the Liberals.
Your confusing Inspired with positive. It was positive in tone and not negative, but its sounds like it was lacking in inspiration.
Positive isn't bad, but it can't be all sunshine and lollypops, you need to be tough, although being inspiring and having a vision would help and is important.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:05
#116
I don't believe or accept these results.
BC wanted and desperately needs change, and all the polls indicated this.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:07
#117
Well, I'm no fan of the Liberals, and the NDP were undoubtedly the lesser evil. But I am looking forward to fewer "[insert NDP leader] WILL be the next Premier/Prime Minister" threads.
A fighting party that actually STOOD for something would have won in a landslide.
I'm not close enough to know if this is true, but I'd sure like to think so, and hope that's the takeaway here.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:07
#118
So the million dollar question is this: all the polls, as close as they were, showed the NDP in the lead, and given the history of BC polls, the NDP should have won. Instead, the Liberals finished significantly ahead of the NDP. Why were the polling predictions that far off?
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:07
#119
derrick
It's true that the NDP failed to enumerate the BC Liberals' record of cuts, lies and vicious rollbacks against the rights of working people. But I think that's a very partial explanation here.
It looks like another pitifully low voter turnout. I think the scale of atomization in our digital/neoliberal era needs to faced and considered.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:07
#120
For me, there are five lessons from the election:
(1) in the ever more media and leader oriented world a party needs a good smooth communicator as leader - Dix has his strengths but this is not one of them;
(2) a NDP leader cannot have any questionmarks about his ethics (it does not matter if they are true or false, it will be exploited, espeically when the MSM favours the free enterprise party);
(3) the NDP must attack the economic record of the government, especially the mammoth debt outside the budget;
(4) the party needs to face the reality that negative campaigns work but base them on government policies not personalities except for ethical issues;
(5) whoever the free enterprise government party is they will play the economic card and in this province that means natural resources where in the interior there are many concerned about this - on the other hand the Greens will attack the NDP on not being pure enough on "green" issues - eventually the effects of climate change will no longer be able to be denied as more and more climate-related disasters occur such as Hurricanes Katrina and Sandy and the pine beetle infestation occur. The NDP needs to develop a green energy policy that creates jobs, not simply a carbon tax or carbon offsets, which do nothing for jobs.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:09
#121
I feel bad for Brian Topp, all the positive energy he built up for his career after 2011 election, all the energy he built up during the leadership race, and all the energy he built up in the early days, only for it to turn all to shit. Dix fucked up, but Topp will pay the price along side him. And you can't just blame it on the Tory collaspe, the NDP was around 50 percent on thier own not that long ago, no the Dix has to take responsiblity and resign, he blew it.
As much as I can't stand the man or his politics, the NDP needs a Thomas Mulcair-type leader.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:09
#122
Well, I'm no fan of the Liberals, and the NDP were undoubtebly the lesser evil here. But I am looking forward to fewer "[insert NDP leader] WILL be the next Premier/Prime Minister" threads.
A fighting party that actually STOOD for something would have won in a landslide.I'm not close enough to know if this is true, but I'd sure like to think so, and hope that's the takeaway here.
No you'll be getting alot of BC NDP leadership race thread instead. Hopefully the NDP does some serious soul searching a learns from this.
Oh and I still believe Mulcair can win and no I don't plan to count my chickens before thier hatched, but I will not surrender before the battle of 2015 is through.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:09
#123
Catchfire
It looks like another pitifully low voter turnout.
A low voter turnout for the NDP, not for the Liberals, apparently. Again, not giving those who might have voted Orange reason to get out and do so. "One practical step at a time" didn't motivate anyone.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:10
#124
Christy ClarkBC Liberal Party 5,793 45.44%
David EbyBC NDP 5,707 44.76%
Christy 86 vote lead
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:11
#125
Vancouver-Point Grey: 45.4 LIB - 44.9 NDP
Saanich N & Islands: 33.1 LIB - 32.6 NDP - 32.4 GRN
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:12
#126
NDP incumbent Gwen O'Mahony defeated. Liberals take Maple Ridge-Pitt Meadows from the NDP. NDP incumbents Harry Lali, Jagrup Brar and Joe Trasolini trailing. Liberals leading in Delta North and Coquitlam-Maillardville - both held by the NDP going into tonight.
What a fucking disaster.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:13
#127
derrick
Catchfire, no doubt that slogan and approach did not cut it -- and even if it had led to victory it wouldn't have been excusable to campaign on such a limited program of reforms. I just don't think the failure of that slogan accounts for all or even most of this stunner...
Most interesting comment by a pundit tonight that I've heard: Geoff Meggs alluded to 'war in woods' style confrontations over megaprojects. By no means do I think Meggs himself was endorsing it, but what he said and what he implied is true: If people do not see their opposition to the tar sands pipelines manifest in the electoral system, resistance will take other forms.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:15
#128
Saanich North & the Islands: Lib, NDP, Green all within 200 votes of each other
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:18
#129
I feel bad for Brian Topp, all the positive energy he built up for his career after 2011 election, all the energy he built up during the leadership race, and all the energy he built up in the early days, only for it to turn all to shit. Dix fucked up, but Topp will pay the price along side him. And you can't just blame it on the Tory collaspe, the NDP was around 50 percent on thier own not that long ago, no the Dix has to take responsiblity and resign, he blew it.As much as I can't stand the man or his politics, the NDP needs a Thomas Mulcair-type leader.
I find him more likelable then you, but I otherwise agree. Trudeau thinks being the Grizzily aka Mulcair is bad and tries to be the pussy cat. Look what happens to pussy cats.
Mulcair also hits all the points Jerry's list.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:18
#130
To what extent does this reinforce the idea that "the only poll that counts is the election?" Dix had a strong lead and very high approval ratings going into this. One of the general rules of politics is that if you are the front-runner, you stay silent. But that only seems to work if a confident front-runner emerges in the late stages of the campagin, for example Stephen Harper in 2006 or Jack Layton in 2011. Is this also a message to never be complacent even if you are numerically ahead?
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:18
#131
I think it's premature, immature and kneejerk to be instantly calling for Dix's resignation. Where were all these reservations about Dix last week?
Find out what happened first.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:20
#132
Christy ClarkBC Liberal Party 6,321 45.05%
David EbyBC NDP 6,330 45.11%
70% of vote in
Eby 9 vote lead despite only 1.54% for Conservatives
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:20
#133
It looks like another pitifully low voter turnout.A low voter turnout for the NDP, not for the Liberals, apparently. Again, not giving those who might have voted Orange reason to get out and do so. "One practical step at a time" didn't motivate anyone.
You know what moves people to vote, a Polarized electorate, just like Mulcair likes doing.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:21
#134
Arthur Cramer
That isn't what it looks like to me right now at least.
Nobody votes for pipelines. That's idiotic.
Well, it sure looks like they did.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:22
#135
In my opinion, something deeper is going on.
The pipeline lobby is evidently quite influential. They simply could not have an NDP win.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:22
#136
Dix speaking
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:23
#137
Catchfire
Dix is conceding now.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:25
#138
I think it's premature, immature and kneejerk to be instantly calling for Dix's resignation. Where were all these reservations about Dix last week?
Find out what happened first.
Absolutely find out what happened, but its to late for Dix. Nothing they find will save him.
Just out of curiousity Jas, your coming off as if you think it may be electoral fraud, is that possible? I doubt it, but in the age of Harper anything is possible.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:25
#139
Well, if the Christy Clark led Liberal party is re-elected. They're so fond of bringing up the 90s, well the smell of their budget has a certain "fudget budget" quality to it and it's amazing that enough people don't seem to care.How about the talk of the Liberals promoting Jane Sterk? Is that along the lines of the vote-splitting scandal in Manitoba where the PC Party financed "independent" candidates to siphon votes from the NDP in the 1995 election?
I don't know enough about the details of either to say. But if they spent money to boost the Greens one would think so.
Then again, I would've thought that cost overruns on government projects, campaigning on becoming "debt free" when the Liberals have what? Trippled the debt?!? Constantly running defecits, lying about the HST, in fighting in the government, poor economic and job growth, not to mention all the problems in health care, education, transportation, inter-governmental relations and with the environment and this government's lack of administrative skill, Gordon Campbell's arrogance, Christy Clark's stupidity and the taint from all of that would've been enough to lead to a change in government.
If these results hold I think this will prove that overwraught positivity doesn't work. Now this may sound ''unholy'' but everyone always praises Jack Layton and his positivity. But let's not forget that even though the NDP had it's best result under his leaderhsip, it ultimatley still lost the election. Hence, it's pretty important to point out your what your opponents fuck ups are very forecefully. I'm not sure who is to blame at this point, although at this point I'm keen to blame the stupidity of the general public.... But obviously you can't do that when you want their votes. Obviously heads need to roll, but maybe as I haven't had time to get too involved with other projects and activism, I'm willing to give them a bit of time to think this through.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:26
#140
Is he resigning yet?
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:26
#141
In my opinion, something deeper is going on.
The pipeline lobby is evidently quite influential. They simply could not have an NDP win.
Lobbies are usually termed to be about influencing politicians not the electorate. If you are saying poeple headed the pipeline message for its economic concern you might be right. Environmental issues are important but they cant be front and center in an election plain and simple.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:27
#142
Find out what happened first.
He lost. Not that complicated. Unless the Liberals ran the biggest vote-rigging scandal in Western history, Dix needs to be gone.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:27
#143
Carole James took the NDP from 3 to 34 seats in one election, then did better than Dix did tonight in 2009, and got knifed in the back for her troubles. It doesn't really matter at this point why this happened - Dix has no credibility if he tries to stay on as leader.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:27
#144
Is he resigning yet?
Not yet, and he is hinting that he has no plans to reconsider his "sunshine and lollipops" approach to positive campaigning.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:30
#145
Then someone needs to get the butterfly net asap and aka the executive needs to show him the door.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:31
#146
Carole James took the NDP from 3 to 34 seats in one election, then did better than Dix did tonight in 2009, and got knifed in the back for her troubles. It doesn't really matter at this point why this happened - Dix has no credibility if he tries to stay on as leader.
Excellent point.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:31
#147
Catchfire
Dix looked devastated. And rightly so.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:32
#148
If these results hold I think this will prove that overwraught positivity doesn't work. Now this may sound ''unholy'' but everyone always praises Jack Layton and his positivity. But let's not forget that even though the NDP had it's best result under his leaderhsip, it ultimatley still lost the election. Hence, it's pretty important to point out your what your opponents fuck ups are very forecefully.
And again, I always remind people that as positive as Jack was, he was very forceful in pointing out the slip-ups of his opponents, as you said.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:32
#149
I dont think it matters much if Clark loses her seat. Its not uncommon for newly elected party leaders to not have seats for months even years after they gain the party leadership. She'll just run in another seat at some point, a safe liberal seat, and likely win.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:34
#150
Is he resigning yet?Not yet, and he is hinting that he has no plans to reconsider his "sunshine and lollipops" approach to positive campaigning.
Then he's doubly the fool.
And look its good to have a positive side, no successful leader runs on pure negative, but no leader runs on pure positive either you need the right recipe.
Wed, 2013-05-15 01:34
#151
If Christy loses, will we see a Senate or other cushy appointment by Harper for a Liberal MLA in a safe seat, and voila she has seat?