North Korea has repeatedly offered to suspend its nuclear weapons development in exchange for a freeze in US-South Korean joint war exercises.
Would DPRK also suspend its own so-called "war games"?
If so, I would heartily endorse this.
North Korea
Sat, 2017-08-05 17:36
#202
Tue, 2017-08-08 17:01
#203
As I understand it the US has some confusion about war making powers.
The President can send forces for up to 90 days.... But the President cannot declare a war.... There have been undeclared wars....
To make this muddier -- not only are wars often undeclared, Korea is not at peace but technically already in a state of war although with an armistice. Are the President's powers different in this case than where there was no war to begin with?
Tue, 2017-08-08 17:22
#204
U.S. involvement in the Korean War was based on a UN resolution, not a declaration of war or a Gulf of Tonkin like resolution. But as a practical matter, a president can pretty much do whatever he wants militarily.
Tue, 2017-08-08 22:08
#205
U.S. involvement in the Korean War was based on a UN resolution, not a declaration of war or a Gulf of Tonkin like resolution. But as a practical matter, a president can pretty much do whatever he wants militarily.
I think that is close to true but not quite. As a practical matter Congress can limit a President in many ways and while the President can take action Congress has not spoken on it can prohibit or require the President to do things by vote.
Wed, 2017-08-09 02:34
#206
Trump Warns North Korea New Threats Will Be Met With 'Fire and Fury'
" North Korea best not make any more threats to the US. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen,' Trump said on Tuesday afternoon..."
TRNN: Has Trump Threatened Nuclear War on North Korea?
"The need for diplomacy is as urgent as ever, says veteran journalist Tim Shorrock...These sanctions will hurt the North Korean people."
Wed, 2017-08-09 10:54
#207
Trump Warns North Korea New Threats Will Be Met With 'Fire and Fury'
" North Korea best not make any more threats to the US. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen,' Trump said on Tuesday afternoon..."
TRNN: Has Trump Threatened Nuclear War on North Korea?
"The need for diplomacy is as urgent as ever, says veteran journalist Tim Shorrock...These sanctions will hurt the North Korean people."
The Sec. of State today is dialing back the irresponsible utterances of the President. This is, as everything else about this administration, quite pathetic.
Wed, 2017-08-09 11:07
#208
From josh:
U.S. involvement in the Korean War was based on a UN resolution, not a declaration of war or a Gulf of Tonkin like resolution.
This may be, strictly speaking, true, but it's not really true. Post WW2 the USA and the Soviet Union split the Korean peninsula between them, which set the stage for the Korean War. There were USA trooops in Korea from the end of WW2.
The United Nations resolution was a formality which provided legal cover for the USA. Another one of those 'coalition of the willing' things.
Wed, 2017-08-09 12:01
#209
More 'Fire and Fury'
"North Korea threatens to strike US territory in Guam. 'The fear is that if somebody flinches, if somebody screws up, there could be hundreds of thousands of dead people here...."
The Intercept: Trump Intel Chief: North Korea Learned From Libya War
"Dan Coats did something truly shocking at the Aspen Security Forum: He told the truth about the effects of US foreign policy..."
Wed, 2017-08-09 18:14
#210
North Korea best not make any more threats to the US. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen
I wonder if Trump is aware of just how much that sounds like a DPRK spokesman speaking. Swap "North Korea" and "the US" in that sentence and see if you don't agree.
I wonder if Trump is itching for the chance? When you play some video games, half of the excitement and anticipation comes not from the objectives or questlines, but the opportunity to unlock the BFG and use it.
Wed, 2017-08-09 18:35
#211
North Korea just reponded to the Trump statement. I don't remember the whole thing but they stated that speaking with Trump is useless and they will use force as it is the language to communicate with Trump. Something like that. It should all over the web by now.
Wed, 2017-08-09 18:45
#212
I look forward to the day the USA takes the same stand against Israel's nuclear weapons as they do against North Korea's. After all, Israel has invaded a lot more countries than North Korea has.
Wed, 2017-08-09 20:00
#213
I believe Israel's policy is to neither confirm or deny that they have nuclear weapons. Of course it's assumed they probably do.
DPRK's policy has always been to boast to the world that they have nuclear weapons, even when it was assumed they didn't.
But I'm not entirely disagreeing. I, too, look forward to the day that everyone drops their biases and team allegiances and treats (let's say) DPRK forced labour camps with the same disgust and contempt as (let's say) Guantanamo Bay.
Can you even IMAGINE what babble could be like if all that mattered was what a state did or didn't do, and not "whose side they're on", or whether the U.S. was for 'em or ag'inst 'em?
Thu, 2017-08-10 04:40
#214
Stop The Bluster - N Korea Is A Nuclear Weapon State
"North Korea has good reasons to want nukes and the US missed all chances to remove those reasons. It is way too late to lament that..."
The Jimmy Dore Show
'Trump threatens N Korea with 'Fire and Fury'
Fri, 2017-08-11 04:56
#215
Are N Korea's ICBM's Justified? - Hyun Lee
Why There's No Reason To Worry About War with North Korea
https://www.counterpunch.org/2017/08/10/why-theres-no-reason-to-worry-ab...
"It will be handled. So relax..."
Pyongyang May Hit US Targets in South Korea if Provoked By Americans - Russian General to RT
" North Korea may well fulfill its threat to hit US targets on South Korean territory if continued pressure by Washington puts Pyongyang at an impasse, Pavel Zolotarev, a retired Russian Major General, told RT.
'A US strike against N Korea may go against common logic, buty when a country is governed by propaganda - and the US are going through such a period - political decisions go beyond rational logic, and there we can have consequences that are hard to foresee,' Zolotarev warned.
'The Americans should have enough brains not to do it. As long as they don't hurt N Korea, it will not take any action in return..."
Fri, 2017-08-11 11:23
#216
Andrew Bacevich: Trump's Handling of N. Korea, His First National Security Crisis, is Very Troubling
quote:
ANDREW BACEVICH:
But that said, you know, one of the things that strikes me about this president is his inability to use the English language with any sort of precision or finesse. And I think this was evident in spades in the "fire and fury" statement. And we should emphasize that it was a threat of "fire and fury," meaning—necessarily meaning the use of nuclear weapons, in response to further threats. And I think it’s that, the notion that threats voiced by another country could lead to preemptive nuclear attack by the United States of America—I think it’s that—that notion, which is embedded in that statement, is what causes great concern and, again, is what is so indicative, and indicative in such a troubling way, about the inability of this individual to speak with some understanding of the implications of what he says.
I mean, many people have commented—and I think accurately commented—on the narcissism, which seems to be such a prominent characteristic of Trump’s personality. And you—when you watch the video of him making that "fire and fury" comment, it’s difficult to avoid thinking that the motivation of the moment is to make himself feel good, to somehow demonstrate that he’s a tough guy, that he’s standing up to what he perceives as a threat, and to, somehow or other, derive some sense of personal satisfaction from that—from issuing that threat, utterly oblivious as to the larger implications and how that statement will play to other audiences. And that’s—that’s got to be very troubling.
And again, to emphasize the fact that he still does these things, despite the fact that he’s now surrounded by, ostensibly, more mature figures, does not bode well for how well this crisis is going to play out. But it doesn’t bode well for how other crises, which he will inevitably encounter—how other crises are going to play out.
Fri, 2017-08-11 18:21
#217
A US strike against N Korea may go against common logic, buty when a country is governed by propaganda - and the US are going through such a period - political decisions go beyond rational logic, and there we can have consequences that are hard to foresee,' Zolotarev warned.
Ah, yes. THE U.S. is "going through such a period".
DPRK has been "going through such a period" for the last couple of decades. I mean, please.
Fri, 2017-08-11 18:32
#218
Fri, 2017-08-11 19:52
#219
Newsweek Exclusive: North Korea Missile Claims Are 'A Hoax'
http://www.newsweek.com/trump-north-korea-missiles-nuclear-scientists-64...
Hurtling Toward 'Fire and Fury'
https://consortiumnews.com/2017/08/10/hurtling-toward-fire-and-fury/
US Imperialism and the Threat of Nuclear War Against North Korea
Fri, 2017-08-11 22:57
#220
I think that the more ridiculous the comments, the more this sounds like WWE wrestling hype. I wouldn't doubt it if this was all fixed and scripted. The biggest disagreements the US and NK probably have is how long they're going to continue this fake tough guy display going.
Wake me up when something actually happens. Because I'm not going to rush to this thread when Trump says something just to try to top the last thing he said he was going to do. Maybe next time Trump makes another threat, he should smash a fake bear bottle over his head so he looks real crazy! Anything less than that then this has pretty much lost all entertainment value
Sat, 2017-08-12 09:48
#221
On Guam, Resistance Grows to US Military Presence as N. Korea Threatens Missiles Off Island's Coast
quote:
LISALINDA NATIVIDAD:
So, I’ll give you an example. In 2009, the Department of Defense released what was called a draft environmental impact statement of this planned military buildup for the island, and really, you know, it’s an expansion of their existing footprint. And in response to that, as part of the—not just the scoping process, but their collections of testimonies and what have you from our community, we responded with 10,000 testimonies in a population base of 160,000 people. That was unprecedented in U.S. DOD history. And they actually reported that number, and they also reported that that was unprecedented in their history for that kind of a community response. What’s very disheartening, however, is that regardless of this kind of mobilization, which ultimately resulted in our suing the Department of Defense on their plan to take a ancient, sacred village of ours called Pagat—and so, as a result of that, it delayed the buildup, because we were able to win that lawsuit. Unfortunately, since then, they have released new plans, and they, just in the last few weeks, have gotten the green light to go ahead and clear an additional 1,000 acres of land for purposes of this military expansion in the ancient village of Litekyan. So there’s this whole—I mean, these atrocities, it’s like one assault after the other.
You know, in terms of our ocean space, let me give you an example. In 2014, the Marianas Island training and testing range was also established. We outpoured. We resisted. It did make a difference. And ultimately, what has been the consequence of that is the establishment of a training range in the ocean and the sea and the skies of nearly a million square nautical miles. That’s larger than the states of Washington, Oregon, California, Idaho, Nevada, Arizona, Montana and New Mexico, all combined, for this purpose. And just in the last month, they’ve announced an expansion even more so of this range. So, you know, the just insane, magnanimous nature of this expansionism has really just evoked a lot of heavy response in terms of anger, in terms of resurgence of the knowledge of our colonization and how this really has been what we’re—the price we’re paying because of our colonization by the U.S. government.
Sat, 2017-08-12 22:41
#222
'You're Going To Become Extremely Famous': Trump Gives Guam Governor Pep-Talk Phone Call (and vid)
https://www.rt.com/viral/399404-trump-calls-guam-governor/
An Open Letter From Guam To America
http://bostonreview.net/war-security/victoria-lola-m-leon-guerrero-open-...
"Dear America, I am glad that you are finally paying attention to what is happening in Guam...So please stop all this bomb talk. And instead ask yourself why Guam is still your colony in 2017?"
North Korea Says 3.5 Million Volunteers 'Ready To Retaliate Against US ' (and vid)
"In the meantime, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said on Friday that there is a strong risk that Washington and Pyongyang could engage in military conflict. 'There are direct threats of deploying [military] power,' he said, adding that the side that is stronger and smarter should take the first step to defuse tensions..."
'Death To US Imperialism!'
"
Sat, 2017-08-12 23:33
#223
The Jimmy Dore Show
"Defense Department Brags About Killing One Million Koreans."
The Jimmy Dore Show
"Chomsky Bombshell: US Rejected N Korean Peace Offer."
Sun, 2017-08-13 11:09
#224
I think that the more ridiculous the comments, the more this sounds like WWE wrestling hype. I wouldn't doubt it if this was all fixed and scripted. The biggest disagreements the US and NK probably have is how long they're going to continue this fake tough guy display going.
I hope to God that you are right.
Mon, 2017-08-14 00:59
#225
The Jimmy Dore Show
North Korea sitting on stockpile of minerals worth trillions.
Canada Had 2 Meetings With N Korean Officials This Week
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/north-korea-canada-1.4244177
"Chrystia Freeland said Friday that she met with Ri Yong-ho, her counterpart from Pyongyang, during a meeting of Asian-Pacific foreign ministers last weekend in Manila. Freeland made it clear Canada is standing firmly beside the United States and the threats were totally unacceptable. 'When they are threatened, we are there,' Freeland said.'
Mon, 2017-08-14 01:29
#226
North Korea (English site)
Wed, 2017-08-16 12:28
#227
China Says It Will Defend North Korea in Event Of US Invasion
"Editorial in Chinese official newspaper Global Times sets out China's red lines: China will intervene in event of US invasion of North Korea to prevent regime change..."
Thu, 2017-08-17 12:06
#228
Hyping North Korea To Relaunch Reagan's Star Wars?
"To set the Trump crew straight, China reissued its guarantee for NK's security..."
Thu, 2017-08-17 12:21
#229
China Says It Will Defend North Korea in Event Of US Invasion
"Editorial in Chinese official newspaper Global Times sets out China's red lines: China will intervene in event of US invasion of North Korea to prevent regime change..."
This is no surprise. China has long considered NK as a buffer state and for good reason.
Thu, 2017-08-17 16:21
#230
Jon Schwarz has an article up on The Intercept about the analogy between the Cuban Missile Crisis of 1962 and today's North Korean Crisis. After an interesting review of the facts from 1962, he has this to say about North Korea.
And that brings us to our conflict today with North Korea. The U.S. of course has possessed the ability to instantly destroy North Korea with nuclear weapons for 60 years. Moreover, we already leveled the country once with conventional weapons during the 1950s, killing perhaps one-fifth of its population. The equivalent number of deaths for the U.S. today would be over 60 million people.
That, however, has never been a “crisis,” just as it was not a crisis when the Kennedy administration put nuclear missiles in Italy and Turkey. It has become a crisis because it appears North Korea may be close to being able to put nuclear weapons on ICBMs that can reach the continental U.S.
Now, in an echo of Kennedy’s September 1962 remarks, Trump has declared that that “won’t happen!” Just as during the Cuban missile crisis, we start from the position that we must have the power to kill others, but it is illegitimate for them to have the power to kill us.
Fri, 2017-08-18 20:31
#231
If DPRK really does have the nukes they boast about then they have the only nukes on the Korean peninsula.
I wonder if they understand that that makes them the aggressor, not the poor wee victim?
Sat, 2017-08-19 15:59
#232
If DPRK really does have the nukes they boast about then they have the only nukes on the Korean peninsula.
I wonder if they understand that that makes them the aggressor, not the poor wee victim?
Wow, what a contradiction of the real power balance there.
Other countries have the ability to deliver nukes to North Korea at distance or from nuclear submarines that lie offshore. The US, which offers threats, has the ability to nuke N. Korea until it no longer exists as a place humans could live.
I am not defending NK but to suggest that they, in any way, out number their opposition when it comes to nuclear weapons is dangerous fantasy.
Sun, 2017-08-20 13:22
#233
US-South Korean Drills Could Lead To 'Uncontrollable Phase of Nuclear War', North Warns
"The Trump group's declaration of the reckless nuclear war exercises against the DPRK...is a reckless behavior driving the situation into the uncontrollable phase of a nuclear war.'
Tensions in the region show no signs of abating."
Sun, 2017-08-20 17:15
#234
I am not defending NK but to suggest that they, in any way, out number their opposition when it comes to nuclear weapons is dangerous fantasy.
I'm not suggesting they outnumber the nukes stationed on the continental USA, nor even at sea. I'm just pointing out that they've got the only nukes on the Korean peninsula, and they're running around testing them and boasting about them and threatening to use them. But NDPP just gave us a perfect example of why I point this out.
The Trump group's declaration of the reckless nuclear war exercises against the DPRK...is a reckless behavior driving the situation into the uncontrollable phase of a nuclear war.
It really has little to do with Trump -- the same folk have been saying the same thing for at least the last several Presidencies. But never, ever do DPRK's own "war games" or their own nuclear stockpile or their own threats of "fire and fury" seem to be a factor in anything. Somehow it's always 100% the fault of the U.S. Somehow the DPRK, through three different dictators, is still viewed as the myopic nerd who's being bullied so bad he brings a steak knife to school in his backpack in the desperate hope of defending himself. That narrative wore thin a long time ago.
Fri, 2017-08-25 21:45
#235
North Korea fires three short-range missiles; U.S. says tests fail
Three North Korea short-range ballistic missiles failed on Saturday, U.S. military officials said, which, if true, would be a temporary setback to Pyongyang’s rapid nuclear and missile expansion.The U.S. Pacific Command said in a statement that two of the North’s missiles failed in flight after an unspecified distance, and another appeared to have blown up immediately.
That can happen. Sometimes missiles get overly excited and they detonate prematurely.
It's nothing to be ashamed of. It's important that the missiles just relax, and enjoy the moment. Maybe cuddle for a bit.
Tue, 2017-08-29 14:44
#236
Trump Says 'All Options Are On The Table For North Korea' - White House Statement
"Meanwhile, Russia and China have proposed a 'double freeze' initiative to resolve the Korean crisis. The plan, which is supported by Germany, involves freezing missile launches in exchange for a halt in US-South Korean military exercises."
Tue, 2017-08-29 19:49
#237
The plan, which is supported by Germany, involves freezing missile launches in exchange for a halt in US-South Korean military exercises.
I literally asked the same exact thing three weeks ago... but would DPRK continue to hold "war games", or would they also impose a similar moratorium on theirs?
Wed, 2017-08-30 12:23
#238
There is a difference between South Korea and the USA engaging in joint military exercises, and North Korea having military exericises with themselves.
Thu, 2017-08-31 12:09
#239
China Says It Will Never Allow War On Its Doorstep As Tensions Escalate On Korean Peninsula
"Beijing has said it will not allow war or chaos on the Korean Peninsula, as two US B-1B bombers conducted a new flight in the area, joined by South Korean and Japanese fighter jets in a show of force amid mounting tensions..."
Sun, 2017-09-03 01:42
#240
'Artificial Earthquake' Strikes North Korea Near Known Nuclear Test Site
"The Pentagon and the JCS have urgently called for a crisis countermeasure. Seoul has placed its military on highest alert and is closely cooperating with the US. Earlier in the day, North Korea's official news agency (KCNA) reported that the Nuclear Weapons Institute has created a 'more developed nuke', that can be fitted on an intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM)."
Sun, 2017-09-03 04:14
#241
No Peanut - North Korea Tests A Thermonuclear Device - Continues To Press For Negotiations
"One must now assess that North Korea has the capability to make, launch and deliver staged thermonuclear weapons up to megaton size at ICBM ranges. Most of China, Japan and at least the US west coast are in reach of such a weapon. With this war head size the somewhat dubious accuracy of the North Korean missiles is of little relevance.
One can understand today's nuclear test as a response to these continuing US provocations. The US will as usual claim that only North Korea is 'provoking' and it itself is only 'responding'. But such a hen-egg discussion and juvenile tit for tat is not only useless but dangerous.
North Korea has offered several times to negotiate with the US towards a peace agreement. Not doing so has only created the current situation and today's events. It must NOW stop further provocations and immediately agree to open-ended talks with North Korea."
Sun, 2017-09-03 16:26
#242
The US will as usual claim that only North Korea is 'provoking' and it itself is only 'responding'. But such a hen-egg discussion and juvenile tit for tat is not only useless but dangerous.
The author seems to be trying to say:
1. It doesn't matter "who started it" -- it's silly and juvenile to consider that.
2. The U.S. started it.
It's also interesting that SK and the U.S. are conducting drills, while DPRK is both conducting drills and testing nukes and missiles. But somehow it's all about SK and the U.S.
Sun, 2017-09-03 17:03
#243
It's also interesting that SK and the U.S. are conducting drills, while DPRK is both conducting drills and testing nukes and missiles. But somehow it's all about SK and the U.S.
It's true. The United States has only conducted a measly 1,054 nuclear weapons tests, nothing like the DPRK's monumental total of six. It's only used two nukes in combat, to North Korea's zero. And American missiles are only a threat to North Korea if Donald Trump orders them to be fired at North Korea, something a sane, rational man like himself would never consider.
It's much like the repeated offers to achieve a "denuclearized Korean peninsula". The U.S. can keep its submarines, missile silos, and bombers anywhere it wants, and attack North Korea with 20 minutes of warning. North Korea, meanwhile, only has the option of keeping its nuclear weapons on the Korean peninsula. Perhaps it's somewhat understandable that taking the Kaddafi route of unilateral disarmament doesn't appeal to Kim.
Sun, 2017-09-03 17:35
#244
It's true. The United States has only conducted a measly 1,054 nuclear weapons tests, nothing like the DPRK's monumental total of six.
It's my understanding that those ceased in 1992 -- 25 years ago.
It's 2017 now, cco. What the U.S. did in 1945 isn't really all that salient right now, any more than suggesting that if the U.S. allowed slaves in the 19th century then they'll surely allow them again in the 21st.
I'm not supporting Trump, and I'm certainly not hoping for a U.S. military "answer" to the DPRK escalation. But could we at least quit pretending that DPRK is somehow the poor wee victim of something here? They're no Latvia -- they would appear to have the fourth largest army in the world, and they don't seem shy about exercising them.
Sun, 2017-09-03 17:36
#245
The US will as usual claim that only North Korea is 'provoking' and it itself is only 'responding'. But such a hen-egg discussion and juvenile tit for tat is not only useless but dangerous.The author seems to be trying to say:
1. It doesn't matter "who started it" -- it's silly and juvenile to consider that.
2. The U.S. started it.
It's also interesting that SK and the U.S. are conducting drills, while DPRK is both conducting drills and testing nukes and missiles. But somehow it's all about SK and the U.S.
Well if you don't test nukes how can you be certain they will work if you need them?
Oh and which countries in the world have a G_d given right to possess nukes?
Sun, 2017-09-03 17:52
#246
There must be negotiations on all outstanding issues. There are no good alternatives.
Sun, 2017-09-03 18:16
#247
Well if you don't test nukes how can you be certain they will work if you need them?
I'm struggling to think of any time that we've agreed that some or other country "needed" nukes.
Oh and which countries in the world have a G_d given right to possess nukes?
You just spelled God as Jews do.
Was that intentional??
Sun, 2017-09-03 18:43
#248
What the U.S. did in 1945 isn't really all that salient right now, any more than suggesting that if the U.S. allowed slaves in the 19th century then they'll surely allow them again in the 21st.
But what North Korea did in 1950 is very salient? Or perhaps the suggestion is that despite the war having ended 64 years ago, North Korea's continued to pose a threat via their ongoing military posture -- much as the U.S. didn't denuclearize after 1945, but has instead continued 72 years of buildup and deployment that enable Donald Trump to annihilate any country on Earth with a single order. Could Kim's posturing perhaps take that into account?
I'm not supporting Trump, and I'm certainly not hoping for a U.S. military "answer" to the DPRK escalation. But could we at least quit pretending that DPRK is somehow the poor wee victim of something here? They're no Latvia -- they would appear to have the fourth largest army in the world, and they don't seem shy about exercising them.
Reducing all of international relations into a dichotomy of victim nations and aggressor nations is a bit simplistic for my taste (it's what led Charlie Wilson to arm the Taliban, memorably). I'm just saying that from the North Korean perspective, they've been threatened with nuclear weapons since Douglas MacArthur, and after having seen the U.S. invade dozens of nations without nukes and zero that have them, they've come to the arguably rational conclusion that counter-strike capability is the only thing saving them from Trump pushing the button when his ratings are down. Saying this isn't apologism for DPRK concentration camps any more than opposing the Iraq invasion was an endorsement of Saddam gassing the Kurds. It's just the same balance-of-power international relations theory that applied throughout the Cold War. Trump doesn't want NK to be able to balance American power. He'd like to "have all the death over there". It's reasonable from his point of view (though I wonder how Moon Jae-in feels about it), but I don't think we can expect Kim to play along.
Sun, 2017-09-03 18:47
#249
Justin Trudeau Condemns North Korean Missile Testing
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-condemns-north-korea-test-1.4274...
"US warns of 'massive military response'...
Nasrallah : With North Korea, Trump Heads for Nuclear World War
"Today the fate of the world is suspended between two people, regardless of what one thinks of the one and the other: Trump and Kim Jong-Un. God knows what they will do..."
Sun, 2017-09-03 19:09
#250
Reducing all of international relations into a dichotomy of victim nations and aggressor nations is a bit simplistic for my taste
Then why is it apparently imperative that SK and the U.S. cease holding military exercises, but all DPRK has to do in exchange is stop trying to ramp up its thermonuclear arsenal?
I am literally proposing that there is no "bully" and no "victim" in this. Are you saying you agree?
Sun, 2017-09-03 20:46
#251
Most Babblers won't be old enough to remember the "Ban the Bomb" movement of the 50s and 60s. Its actually happening in 2017 but Canada and the USA will refuse to sign (after Sept 20) but the large majority of the UN has voted Yes. Our stand on North Korea will be even more hypocritical. With the Bomb, NK is invulnerable as Iraq, Syria and Libya, weren't. Having been so destroyed by US bombs in 52/53 and with their penisula occupied by nuclear-armed USmilitary since, they could be somewhat proud.