Al Franken needs to resign sooner rather than later

I don't completely agree. His accuser (unlike other accusers coming forward in the Moore and celebrity cases) is a talk radio host. I think it's very possible that she has a political axe to grind.

It very well may be a deliberate distraction from the right to discredit Democrats to shield their own molesters from the news lines.  

We'll see as all this unfolds in the near and far future.

Geez, what about whichever one was in the photograph where he's grabbing her breasts??

Mr. Magoo wrote:

Geez, what about whichever one was in the photograph where he's grabbing her breasts??

He wasn't grabbing her breasts. The picture shows him  mockingly grabbing her breasts. No contact in the picture. Stupid move but not blatant sexual assault. Unlike Roy Moore wjho stalked teens in malls. And when confronted,he made no denial. Even going as far as saying he always asked their mothers for permission.

Apples and oranges. I haven't heard about a second accuser for Franken so I can't comment about that. But the first accvuser is a talk radio host. Talk radio,especially in the US, is rabidly right wing. This is the only reason why I have my doubts about her accusation and her motivations.

If Franken really is guilty he should resign. Having said that,so should Moore who definitely won't resign or step down and will probably be elected regardless of being a teenage stalker and ,in the real world,a molester. 

By the way,people have short memories. Donald Trump is a serial sexual assaulting pig. Why hasn't he been forced to step down?

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He wasn't grabbing her breasts. The picture shows him  mockingly grabbing her breasts. No contact in the picture. Stupid move but not blatant sexual assault.

Well, I guess maybe they're 1/16 of an inch above them.  How many angels could dance in that space?

NorthReport wrote:

https://www.snopes.com/photographer-said-franken-image-was-staged/

This is another factor of my skepticism. I read it was staged. Franken is a comedian. Was the picture funny? No. But if it was staged,it backs up my skepticism about this woman's motives.

Moore and Trump are ADMITTED sexual predators. They are not comedians.

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This is another factor of my skepticism. I read it was staged. Franken is a comedian. Was the picture funny? No. But if it was staged,it backs up my skepticism about this woman's motives.

Well, I'll admit that when I saw the Snopes link you posted, I thought "ruh roh, I guess I got the wrong end of this".   They're good at debunking nonsense.

Except, did you READ the link you posted?  Snopes isn't saying the photo was staged.

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The person who took the picture of Al Franken and Leeann Tweeden has not been identified, nor have they issued a statement regarding the incident. Which means there is no credible claim the image was staged, that Tweeden was “playing dead,” or that “she wanted him to ‘revive’ her” in the picture.

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He's looking right into the camera. If he was being serious in grabbing her I can't think he'd be that stupid to do it in front of a camera,looking right into the lens.

Because he didn't understand.  When people think what they're doing is OK they don't put a bag over their head.

Important to note:  I don't think he's doing it for some free breast feelies, or for personal gratification.  I think he's doing it because he thought it was OK, and funny.  And for whatever it's worth, I liked Franken back when he was half of "Franken and Davis" on SNL, so I'm just kind of sad that he had to turn out to be "that guy".

Rev Pesky wrote:

From Mr. Magoo:

Well, I guess maybe they're 1/16 of an inch above them.  How many angels could dance in that space?

​Actually she's wearing a flak vest. If Franken wanted to touch her breasts his hands would have had to be under that vest. 

=O

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The picture you posted was blatant abuse and interestingly enough,no punishment was doled out,no one resigned and no one lost their job.

Really?

I'm pretty sure that the soldier having a laugh there lost her job.  And was court-martialed and served time.

Anyway, my point wasn't that Al Franken is exactly the same as Lynndie England.  My point was that just because someone mugs for the camera doesn't mean they're not doing something wrong.  Whether or not they think it's funny is kind of immaterial.

Cody87 wrote:

Rev Pesky wrote:

From Mr. Magoo:

Well, I guess maybe they're 1/16 of an inch above them.  How many angels could dance in that space?

​Actually she's wearing a flak vest. If Franken wanted to touch her breasts his hands would have had to be under that vest. 

=O

Well. let's put it this way. If I saw a woman wearing one of those vests, and I wanted to continue maintaining my reputation for being at least a halfway decent human being, I wouldn't do what Franken did in that picture.

As for the woman just being part of some talk radio conspiracy to get Franken, is the allegation that the photo is a hoax? I don't think it is, because Franken himself admits that it is real.  

Pondering wrote:

alan smithee wrote:

 He wasn't grabbing her breasts. The picture shows him  mockingly grabbing her breasts. No contact in the picture. Stupid move but not blatant sexual assault.

He also kissed her and she didn't see the photograph until she got home. It was on a CD the photographer gave her. Think of the context. This wasn't a frat party. Can you honestly say this is something that would occur to you to do as a joke? To a co-worker? There is a mentality of entitlement.

alan smithee wrote:

Apples and oranges. I haven't heard about a second accuser for Franken so I can't comment about that. But the first accvuser is a talk radio host. Talk radio,especially in the US, is rabidly right wing. This is the only reason why I have my doubts about her accusation and her motivations. 

To my ears that is just another excuse like "the way she was dressed" or "flirting" or drunk or wants revenge or attention. It is not fun for women to accuse a man of inappropriate behavior. It's intimidating, embarassing, humiliating. You know people will look for mitigating factors to diminish what happened. The evidence has to be overwhelming.

There is a second accuser now.

 

The woman was a regular on the Hannity show and Greg Gutfeld's show. Extremely right wing assholes the two of them. And that's the only reason I cast doubt on her and rightfully question her motive.

Not once did I make a comment about her appearance or if she was 'asking for it'. I don't trust the far right and I don't care who is representing extremists like Gutfeld and Hannity. They are suspect to me full stop.

I'm not trying to defend Franken. Clearly,and in a picture explicitly showing what he did,he was in the wrong. He did something stupid. But he probably thought he was being funny at the time.

And now that there is a second accuser (whom I don't have an idea if they are part of a  profession I don't trust) things don't look good for Franken. Unless it turns out the second accuser was an employee of Sinclair broadcast group.. Then I'd cast the same doubt.

If guilty,Franken should resign. However,serial sexual assaulters like Trump and Moore go unchallenged. Definitely less challenged than Franken. I find that odd.

The only positive from all these cases is it casts a spotlight on male entitement , assault,molestation and the humiliation that comes with it.

My guess is we haven't heard the end of all these politicians and celebrities being outed.

In the case of Franken,he should step down the moment Moore and Trump do. If not, the outrage is monopolized by Democrats and Liberals when the reality is that their counterparts are very much worse. The difference is that the majority of Evangelical far right Conservatives assault boys and men instead of women.

FWIW,if the shoe was on the other foot and the accuser was a Democrat staffer or outspoken progressive or liberal,I'd doubt their claims too.

Jane Curtin, Laraine Newman and other 'SNL' women stick up for Al Franken

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Saying they "feel compelled to stand up for Al Franken," 36 women affiliated with "Saturday Night Live" during the now-senator's 20 years on the show have signed a letter countering sexual harassment allegations recently leveled against the Minnesota Democrat.

Signatories included original "SNL" cast members Laraine Newman and Jane Curtin, along with 34 women who worked on the show behind the scenes between 1975 and the present. Franken was a writer and performer on the NBC sketch comedy show primarily from 1975 to 1995.

NorthReport wrote:

What’s not to understand guys. When a woman accuses a man of sexual abuse you can assume there are many more women waiting in the wings to get up the courage to say the same thing When are we guys going to start believing women when the first woman goes public with a complaint against a man 

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/11/16/16665830/al-franken-sexual-assault-allegations

I don't think anyone here doesn't believe the women who have come forward and pointed out people who are perverts,child molesters and sexual predators.

Personally,I don't quite believe Leeann Tweeden about virtually anything. But there are more accusers. I don't know if they are talk radio hosts or regulars on Faux News  so I can't doubt them.

No one here condones Franken's actions. And if he is guilty of assaulting other women,he should resign. But so should Moore and Trump.

BTW,there is a slush fund for congressmen and senators who are guilty of sexual assault. Victims are paid off with tax money so you don't hear anything about it. In DC and Hollywood we've only seen the tip of the iceberg. And that's not including the rest of that country,our country,other countries.

I'm on the side that all this will cripple unconsensual,lewd conduct against women...and men. Terry Crews has stepped forward. Someone grabbed his junk. Whoever it was,they had a lot of balls (pardon the pun). Mr. Crews is a big guy,I wouldn't dare grab him even by the arm.   

Pondering wrote:

alan smithee wrote:

I don't think anyone here doesn't believe the women who have come forward and pointed out people who are perverts,child molesters and sexual predators. Personally,I don't quite believe Leeann Tweeden about virtually anything. But there are more accusers. I don't know if they are talk radio hosts or regulars on Faux News  so I can't doubt them.

If right wing women were out to get politicians they would choose someone more significant than Al Franken and a more damaging accusation than unwanted kissing. All news now is faux news unless it's about a disaster or mass shooting. It is prejudice to disbelieve her just because she is on the political right along with about 50% of women in the US. They are just as likely to be molested as the rest of us. The other accusations are about inappropriate butt grabbing. Same thing Rob Ford was accused of. A lot of men see no harm in grabbing a butt. I could see a 13 year old boy thinking it's funny to grab a woman's butt or take tasteless photographs but not a grown man. Grown men know they are copping a feel. They know women don 't like it. It's aggression. They are asserting their power. 

alan smithee wrote:

 No one here condones Franken's actions. And if he is guilty of assaulting other women,he should resign. But so should Moore and Trump. 

Yes but that is up to their supporters to decide and to push for. The right is not an excuse for the left to use or emulate.

alan smithee wrote:

 I'm on the side that all this will cripple unconsensual,lewd conduct against women...and men. Terry Crews has stepped forward. Someone grabbed his junk. Whoever it was,they had a lot of balls (pardon the pun). Mr. Crews is a big guy,I wouldn't dare grab him even by the arm.  

Molesters know their victims don't want to make a scene in public and are shocked in the moment so they let it pass because it's just a butt grab. There are a lot of people out there thinking "what's the big deal".

This will not even put a dent in nonconsentual touching for normal women as opposed to famous ones.

Well,in the case of Terry Crews,he was grabbed by the balls,not the butt. And I'm not sure where the ' butt grabbing'  is coming from.

I'm a male,I never nonconsensually touched another human being. Most males haven't. Those that do are assaulting said person.

As for Ms. Tweeden,you're right,she could have gone after a bigger fish. But Conservatives seem to detest Franken and the photo he posed for didn't help his case.

I just read a half dozen times that the picture was staged. The sketch they did at the USO gig probably was too. Maybe Franken took it to far. But I can't defend him. It was the epitome of stupid.

I don't doubt a woman for simply being right wing. I doubt a woman wsho is a hate radio host and regular on far right TV shows like Hannity and Red Eye with Greg Gutfeld. It's suspicious. She's suspicious. I'm talking about a particular individual,not women in general -- far from it.

But I do think that all these cases coming forward will inevitably change behavior. There's no man out there who wants to be known as a molester or sexual predator. Any man who does has a serious problem.

I believe this will empower girls and women to come forward and call out sexual assault. I also think it will scare off would be predators because that kind of behavior is frowned upon more than any other crime. Especially those who prey on children which both Trump and Roy Moore have been accused of doing. Franken should step down as soon as they do.