Media coverage of suspicious death of billionaires

I don't know a great deal about the Shermans. I do know, though, when you see the term "murder-suicide" you're generally also talking about domestic violence. Whether or not that's the case is still apparently under investigation.

Again thank you Timebandit. The first thing that came to my mind was domestic violence. And yes it may come to pass that domestic violence is not involved in this apparent murder-suicide,  but it is the first thing that came to my mind as well, and this thread seemed preoccupied with seemingly irrelevant tangents. It took Legatta and Timebandit to address the issue and to finally give this thread some relevant context, IMO.

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Murder/suicide. Called it right away when this hit the news. Question is,why would a billionaire commit suicide? You don't have a worry in the world which is something 99.9% of the rest of us don't have that luxury.

Or at any rate, you don't have a financial worry in the world.  And I guess if your biggest worries are financial worries then it might be tempting to imagine that if your bills are all paid for life, you have no worries now.

Doesn't that TOTALLY contradict the idea that money can't buy happiness? 

FWIW, I acknowledge that I have no specific information to add to this investigation.  On the one hand, it sounds like the Shermans had everything to live for, but  then when was the last time someone killed themself (or another, and themself) and everyone who knew them said "Oh, it's for the best.  S/he had nothing, really, and I'd have done the same"?  We seem to like to believe that everyone has something to live for.

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save other views opinions expressions experiences and writings for other forums that I participate on. I’ll expand on them there and not here.

Do post links, tho!  I'm sure we're all eager to hear how it was all about those Jews!

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Whats your problem Mr Magoo? What I touched on clearly is too sensitive a topic to be discussed at this forum. But regardless of your beliefs is very real. And not just from/for one group but many! It’s also very hard to prove! If it never existed there wouldn’t be the need for affirmative action and or employment equity.

That's super.  But all I asked for was a link to it.

WWWTT wrote:

Ken Burch wrote:

Thanks to whoever changed the thread title, btw.

Yes that was me that changed it. Too many posters complaining. So I figured I better comply with the vocal posters here and save other views opinions expressions experiences and writings for other forums that I participate on. I’ll expand on them there and not here. 

Some forums are more accepting of certain "opinions" than Babble?! Readers Digest? Better Homes & Gardens? Ebony?

https://www.thespec.com/news-story/8016688-billionaire-barry-sherman-was-trying-to-quash-probe-into-political-fundraiser-he-held-for-justin-trudeau/

Good point, Mobo2000. I've immortalized that victory here.

Barry Sherman Was Under Investigation For Breaking Lobbying Rules

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2017/12/19/barry-sherman-was-under-inve...

"Only days before he died, Toronto billionaire Barry Sherman was attempting to quash an investigation into a political fundraiser he held for Prime Minister Justin Trudeau that allegedly ran afoul of lobbying rules..."

What has this got to do with the topic at hand????

In no way do conspiracy theories about Jewish "oligarchs" help the Palestinian cause. I' ve been involved in Palestine solidarity for decades.

As you should know, there is just as much support for Zionism among evangelical Christians as there is in SOME Jewish circles. Harper is a Canadian example, as is the outrightly antisemitic Stockwell Day. Now this extends to a certain type of far-right Catholic, "more Catholic than the Pope" and hating the current Pope (Scheer and Kenney are examples of that). Sure, one can and should call out any individual or any organisation (not all of them Jewish by any means) that denies the Palestinian people's right to self-determination, but crap about (Jewish) oligarchs (of all things) poisons the Palestinian cause by associating it by antisemitism.

It also undoes the protracted efforts of progressive Jews, and allies, to convince Jewish people that pride in their identity and history and the struggle against antisemitism does not depend on uncritical support for Israel, or for any other State. There has been a spate of hateful messaging and threats against synagogues and against mosques, and we should take the opportunity to build solidarity among groups targeted by hate groups or unhinged individuals.

Should I even have to be repeating this at a progressive site?

lagatta4 wrote:

Should I even have to be repeating this at a progressive site?

Evidently yes, even if some seem to think this is a subject too sensitive to be challenged. Though clearly it isn't too sensitive for the smears to continue being repeated.

As for the connection, I guess for some tragic death is a perfect opportunity to bring up everything you don't like about the victim, and all your prejudices against them. No one has come right out and said they think it is a good thing they are gone, but why else bring it up?

Speaking of which, when are we going to get all those threads about the deaths of poor people that we are supposedly ignoring by focusing on the rich and famous?  That was the stated grievance here, right? Rich people dying and taking media space away from those who deserve it.

Instead, we are still talking about bad rich people.

Here is my plan. We avoid posting on this thread, it disappears into the archives and we never have to be reminded of how low we have sunk.

oldgoat wrote:

The point was raised about making light of domestic violence.  As I have not been following this I don't know if or where that comes into things, but I hope we all know we don't make light of domestic violence, despite wealth or social status.

Welcome as always, oldgoat!

No one in this thread has "made light of domestic violence". Nor have I seen one single hint of evidence, or even speculation, that these particular deaths had some connection with domestic violence. So your moderatorial reminder to not make light of domestic violence is appreciated, but misplaced and unnecessary.

This is simply a case where the media have gone splash-crazy because the story is still unknown, and the deceased are billionaires, Jews, pharma bigshots, etc. That's guaranteed clickbait for the MSM, and apparently now for babble as well.

My personal theory as to the inside story behind the deat

NDPP wrote:

My concern is with Zionist capture of Canadian foreign policy for Israel.  Zionist oligarchs such as Sherman and Bronfman have great power and influence over such matters, inside and outside government circles, as we see not only in Canada but in the penetration of the American political system as well. This is simply a fact, not a conspiracy theory, and the results are obvious and made manifest in the malevolent power that is the Jewish state of Israel, to stoke or foment regional wars, and viciously consume Palestine with impunity. It should be a developmental task of every Canadian progressive to arrest this process. Support for Israel, and from whatever quarter it comes, as was the case of Apartheid South Africa, must be stopped.

I think Canadian progressives see that antisemitism is unfortunately alive and well in Canada and throughout the world. I think many progressives also see that Israel has an essential role to play in safeguarding Jewish people throughout the world.

Thanks Old Goat.

I don't know if it is a case of not knowing what it is about so much as throwing whatever is at hand against the wall to see what will stick.

Personally, my gut reaction to this is not defending the privileged, but rather considering how any family would feel dealing with a tragedy like this and not knowing, and having that made worse by uproven speculation by police and media who should know better.

As for the rest of it, the old maxim about not wishing this on my worst enemy springs to mind. But for those not so inclined I still have to question the logic of complaining about a media frenzy serving the rich, and yet continuing to feed that frenzy.

If that is your stated goal, are there not suffering people more worthy of our attention? Or is that just an excuse to carry on the snipe hunt of proving how bad these rich people were?

(edit)

And yes Unionist. I was wondering about that too. I know a lot of people use that trope, but the fact is whatever frictions existed between these communities only got a lot worse after the imperialists got involved.

Unionist wrote:

JKR wrote:

I think Canadian progressives see that antisemitism is unfortunately alive and well in Canada and throughout the world.

Definitely, but one must add the caveat that there are extreme reactionary forces that try to vilify criticism of Israeli policy by calling it "anti-semitism".

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I think many progressives also see that Israel has an essential role to play in safeguarding Jewish people throughout the world.

You know, JKR, I know many people whom I'd call "progressive" who are supporters of Israel and its right to exist with the same recognition and legitimacy as any other state - although being progressive, they are of course also strongly opposed to Israel's occupation, acts of aggression and discrimination, etc.

But you raise an interesting point.

I cannot in all honesty think of a single progressive person, no matter how personally pro-Zionist they may be, who advocates that "Israel has an essential role to play in safeguarding Jewish people throughout the world". And trust me, I know lots of Jews, progressive and otherwise, and lots of progressives, Jewish or not.

So without diverting too widely from the theme of this salacious thread, perhaps you could grace me with just a few names of the "many progressives" that you allege hold this non-intuitive belief. Public figures, of course - unless you were just referring to personal acquaintances.

I think Israel safeguards Jews throughout the world by allowing Jewish people who are persecuted in other countries to emigrate to Israel. I thought many other progressives would think likewise but I may be wrong about that. I'm not sure if a survey has ever been done asking people, progressive or otherwise, if they think Israel provides a refuge to Jews who want to leave their country. It seems to me that Israel was created as a consequence of the Holocaust so Israel's role as a safe haven for Jewish people is commonly accepted but I may be wrong about that.

Firstly, I agree with kropotkin about the Roma, who not only suffered persecution and pogroms just as the Jewish people did, but were also targeted for utter destruction by the Nazi regime, and many scholars now contend that their losses were proportional to those of the Jews. And the terrible thing is that discrimination and outright persecution of the Roma people is continuing nowadays in some Central European countries. (see Karl Nerenberg's documentary Never Come Back).

This is a coincidence, as just before I checked in to rabble, I got seasonal greetings from an old friend in Buenos Aires, who had managed to survive persecution by the dictatorship. He was a young radical leftist (not a Montanero), moreover he is of Polish-Jewish origin, and there have been even more revelations about the extent to which the junta were obsessed with a Jewish plot against the Argentine homeland ... and the complicity of a certain Henry Kissinger. My friend's family were from Warsaw, and every member of his extended family was murdered except for his mother and father.  Another friend did flee to Israel (he was of German-Jewish origin) but nowadays he is a firm supporter of the Palestinian cause. No, he doesn't want the Israelis "cast into the sea" and thinks there is practically no risk of that happening. My friends were certainly in a position to be terrified of persecution not only for political beliefs but because of the rabid antisemitism of the regime, but certainly have at least an ambiguous position about Israel as a place of refuge and certainly identify with the plight of the Palestinians, who were not responsible for the persecution or genocide of Jewish Europeans.

My friend had to go underground several times during the Dirty War... I couldn't help imagining how his parents felt back then.

Fromm WWWTT:

Hi Rev Pesky. Unless you can provide a link to support your beliefs here, I don’t really buy it.

​I'm not sure what 'beliefs' I expressed. Perhaps you could be a bit more specific. That would at least allow me to respond.

I know everyone loves a good conspiracy theory. Thing is, accusations like that - specifically about charities and universities - made without the relevant information aren't as simple as "your opinion".

They could be taken by some to be libellous, which affects not only you, but this site. Sherman may no longer be here, but his company sure is.

From WWWTT:

You downplayed Amir Attaran’s comments about Apotex. And oddly cross reference a TS article that supports Attarans opinion?

Now we all have opinions but why did you use an article that went against your view?

​Pardon me, I didn't downplay Attaran's comments. I merely pointed out that he declared Sherman to be deplorable because he 'manipulated' drug pricing in this country, while at the same time declaring that it was the provinces that were the problem. I mean, you gotta make up your mind.

In fact it was the provinces that used a policy of across the board pricing (18% of brand name pricing) rather than tendering or negotiating with the manufacture.

Oh yes, and the article also pointed out that Canadidan consumers saved roughly $100 million by using those genereic drugs instead of brand name. 

I pointed out that at least some of the lawsuits Sherman engaged in were suits to allow him to manufacture generic equivalents of drugs, which ended up saving Canadians a lot of money. As I said, I believe he did that for his own purposes, but Canadians benefitted, nevertheless.

In any case, everything I said was fully supported by both articles in the Toronto Star. As opposed, say, to someone speculating, with no basis, that the provinces were steered in that direction by political donations.