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The strange dance between China and Canada---Keep dancing and just hope there enough chairs once the must stops
Mon, 2018-06-04 00:40
#1
The strange dance between China and Canada---Keep dancing and just hope there enough chairs once the must stops
Mon, 2018-06-04 01:32
#2
I had really interesting coversation with a friend. He was not happy with China folk buying homes and businesses in Canada. Happy that Trudea blocking of major companies from falling into China ownership. Basic racism and basic ignorance but I some symthapty those making the limit the Chinesse investment in Canada. In a capitalist world the trade betweet and China and Mexico vs Canada is crisis waiting, best way to decribe as a uneasy codepedence. But the Western Allies after WW2 when they rebuilt the world economy forsaw this situation but they were split, English and Western Nations of Euopre wanted balanced trade because they saw unbalanced trade as cancer of the system. The Americans decided they would not support the idea for stupid selfish reasons. The europaeans wanted trade system the would try regulate world trade by forcing surplus nations with prolonged trade surplus pay a "duty" making their trade surplus less like to last. The duty would make surplus pay until balance is restored in the system. The Americans believed that the trade surplus they had at the time was not going away. How wrong they were from super surplus nation in 1945 to 1975 a nation that would never see a trade surplus again.
I will present the next the implcations and mechanics of trade between China and Canada in capitalist system.
Mon, 2018-06-04 05:23
#3
We hear of the public talking about how to enage China. Why is China buying companies and land in Canada --- Where are they getting the money. The money question is my favorite to explian to the average person must people have no concept how that your pucharsing choices effect world trade flows.
1. You buy a china product in Canada, retailing to warehousing to shipping takes a cut and rest is sent to China as payment for the product.
2. Step 1 happens millions of time a month. The good people of Stats Can collect the this data. On monthy basis, the last reported trade deficit was 2 billion in March. The people China solds 2 billions of goods more Canada people.
3. So the 2 Canada billion shows in China and companies sold their goods in CND curreny. The Chinese banks accept the 2 billion in Canada dollars. The China company get yuan to pay there staff or do research etc in China. Sometimes the China companies keep the money in bank in the form of the Canadian dollars.
4. The china banks hold 2 billion in CND. a) Some the china companies, they have own their CND to ease further trade in Canada. * 2) The china banks allow other entites borrow the Canada dollars for the purchase of buying Canadian assets-oil companies-fram land etc. 3 *)And of Canadian bonds from corperate to everylevel of government. Hell maybe your city floated a bond offer the some china company is fiancing your muinpicial debt.
5. When things were not so out of whack canadian bonds were safe to go. But a certain point the Chinese holders of Canadian bonders will tendency to transfer there paper wealth into real assets in Canada if the paper continues to grow. If I was in the Chinese shoes do I want a paper claim( of future production in Canada). Why not buy real assets rather than cliams on future productin.
6.Lets do a thought expirment. Lets say there little Canada CDN floating in the China banks. How do expect to gets CND dollars to buy canadian assets in Canada. You generally don't. But every month 1 to 2 billions canadian dollars flow into China. That has be used in some way because you get another 2 billion and more and more.
7.So the natural thing is to buy Canada. So if hear a conversation on why chineses are buying Canada. If do you spend on China goods they will buy assets in Canada.
Next I speak about the reactinary politcs happening Canada danger of uneasy Codependnce.
Mon, 2018-06-04 09:26
#4
Then there's this:
https://www.straight.com/news/1083641/guardian-column-suggests-trudeau-b...
And it was put in place by the government of Stephen Harper. It raises the question of whether his "stand up to China on human rights" act was just cover for this far more substantial move.
Mon, 2018-06-04 10:38
#5
Smith:
That Straight link comes up DOA. Here's the original Guardian piece...
As for your theory about Harper using human-rights complaints as a breastplate of righteousness(hat-tip Laud Humphreys) to cover up potentially unpopular deals with China, that's quite possible. Though I do wonder how much attention the media would have paid to the details of those agreements anyway, even if Harper hadn't been lodging complaints about Falun Gong and whatnot.
Mon, 2018-06-04 11:01
#6
Yes, I'm not sure either. But it is definitely a weird contrast that he used that rhetoric while at the same time negotiating a deal that is such a threat to Canadian sovereignty. I can only think that his interest was that it puts business before democracy.
Mon, 2018-06-04 11:12
#7
Yes, I'm not sure either. But it is definitely a weird contrast that he used that rhetoric while at the same time negotiating a deal that is such a threat to Canadian sovereignty. I can only think that his interest was that it puts business before democracy.
Admittedly, there is probably a fine line between saying "Bwahahhah, think I'll dupe everyone into believing I care about human-rights in China, while I sell Canadians out to Beijing", and saying "Well, if I can cut a deal with China, while simultaneously playing to the human-rights lobby and Cold War nostalgists by hollering about human-rights, well, that just shows what a brilliant operator I am".
Fri, 2018-06-08 16:58
#8
We hear of the public talking about how to enage China. Why is China buying companies and land in Canada --- Where are they getting the money. The money question is my favorite to explian to the average person must people have no concept how that your pucharsing choices effect world trade flows.
1. You buy a china product in Canada, retailing to warehousing to shipping takes a cut and rest is sent to China as payment for the product.
2. Step 1 happens millions of time a month. The good people of Stats Can collect the this data. On monthy basis, the last reported trade deficit was 2 billion in March. The people China solds 2 billions of goods more Canada people.
3. So the 2 Canada billion shows in China and companies sold their goods in CND curreny. The Chinese banks accept the 2 billion in Canada dollars. The China company get yuan to pay there staff or do research etc in China. Sometimes the China companies keep the money in bank in the form of the Canadian dollars.
4. The china banks hold 2 billion in CND. a) Some the china companies, they have own their CND to ease further trade in Canada. * 2) The china banks allow other entites borrow the Canada dollars for the purchase of buying Canadian assets-oil companies-fram land etc. 3 *)And of Canadian bonds from corperate to everylevel of government. Hell maybe your city floated a bond offer the some china company is fiancing your muinpicial debt.
5. When things were not so out of whack canadian bonds were safe to go. But a certain point the Chinese holders of Canadian bonders will tendency to transfer there paper wealth into real assets in Canada if the paper continues to grow. If I was in the Chinese shoes do I want a paper claim( of future production in Canada). Why not buy real assets rather than cliams on future productin.
6.Lets do a thought expirment. Lets say there little Canada CDN floating in the China banks. How do expect to gets CND dollars to buy canadian assets in Canada. You generally don't. But every month 1 to 2 billions canadian dollars flow into China. That has be used in some way because you get another 2 billion and more and more.
7.So the natural thing is to buy Canada. So if hear a conversation on why chineses are buying Canada. If do you spend on China goods they will buy assets in Canada.
Next I speak about the reactinary politcs happening Canada danger of uneasy Codependnce.
I agree with your point 7 -- the logic is very clear. It is probably less direct even -- money is convertable easily between US and Canada for example. Even if Canada bought nothing the Chinese could use US dollars to invest in Canada.
I think the connection to individuals buying real estate is a different issue. That raises several issues -- There is the concern with price inflation but there are very real concerns about non resident buyers. These are not misplaced. If you buy into a property and live there you spend money and contribute to the economy. If you lock the door and leave that is a different result. There are good reasons why housing ought not to become investments that are parked and unused.
I agree that there is racism and you can see this in the objection to people who come to Canada to fully participate here. But it is important that the parked real estate issue is not confused either with immigration where people come and become part of our society or invest in businesses that function in the economy.
Now here is another thought experiment: follow the logic you started where North American dollars buy from China (I say this is NA wide rather than just Canadian). Then if you restrict severely the ability of Chinese poeple to come here and for business investments here then you will find that these more productive investments will be reduced and less productive ones like parked real estate will increase. Now using this logic, if you tax the real estate nothing will improve over the longer term (may move to other cities in Canada) because that dynamic still exists. Rather you ahve to create an outlet you are okay with the money going towards -- more actual immigration from China or business investments that are a good deal that woul want China to invest int. In other words you cannot buy and restrict all forms of investment at the same time as that money, as you say, will go somewhere.
I am largely agreeing with you just making a point here about which is better or worse as investment.
In fairness, I am quite supportive of greater Chinese immigration to Canada as healthy while restricting non-resident buyers as a reasonable practice.