North Korea

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progressive17 progressive17's picture

The $ does not need America or anyone else. Human greed is a bigger force than NATO.

NDPP

An Elite Coalition Emerges Against A Trump-Kim Agreement

https://t.co/KEQ5AZa302

"An implicit coalition of corporate media, Democrat partisans and others loyal to the national security state are actively hostile to any agreement that would endanger the continuation of the 70-year-old Cold War between the US and North Korea..."

WWWTT

Ok looks like this is going to be a slow weekend and I've got time on my hands so I figured I'd share some political humour with everyone. Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9df_y1X6sU

6079_Smith_W
voice of the damned

Despite their partisan rhetoric about "selling out to a dictator", I think the "elite coalition", were they in power, would be doing pretty much the same thing that Trump is doing on North Korea, which is more-or-less continuing a status quo that no one is really in any position to upend.

voice of the damned

Anyway, a few dozen dead American soldiers from the Korean War have now been returned, which gives Trump the pretext to brag about how great he is at getting concessions from the DPRK. (I believe Carter, acting on behalf of Clinton, also got some bodies back in the early 90s, but see my previous point about the status quo.)

WWWTT

All show and no go.

Let me explain, the biggest supporter of NK, China has veto power at the UN, second largest Russia also has veto at the UN. India, probably the third largest supporter of North Korea, if not the second? does not have veto (making the UN a racist peice of shit organization, but that's for another thread) So really, these countries only support the UN sanctions for show, in reality they give a ratts. As they should!

Here's a link about India/NK relations

https://www.dw.com/en/the-curious-case-of-india-north-korea-relations/a-...

6079_Smith_W

In case you were too busy to notice while fitting everyone for team jerseys, the point is that the "agreement" is worthless.

Mr. Magoo Mr. Magoo's picture

Quote:
India comes right after China as North Korea's second-biggest trade partner among all other countries who maintain trade relations with the communist state. India makes up about 3.5 percent ($97 million, €83 million) of North Korea's exports and 3.1 percent ($97 million) of its imports, according to the Massachusetts Institute of Technology's Observatory of Economic Complexity.

Wait, what?

Their SECOND LARGEST trade partner amounts to about 3.5%?

I can scarcely imagine how little their sixth largest trade partner accounts for.  Or their twelfth.

"We traded a case of AA batteries for some kimchi".

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

Activists Criticize US for Delaying Real Peace

South Korean peace and justice activists have been writing to us at Popular Resistance complaining that the United States is not responding to the positive steps being taken by North Korea before and after the meeting between President Trump and Chairman Kim. They have sent us information about protests they are organizing in South Korea aginst the United States as well as in Washington, DC.

Their views show a great divide between the United States and the calls for a permanent peace which includes removal of US troops as just last week the Congress passed a National Defense Authorization Act which forbids removal of US troops from Korea. The John S. McCain Act states the “significant removal” of US troops is “a non-negotiable item as it relates to the complete, verifiable, and irreversible denuclearization” of North Korea..

The activists argue that the temporary halt in war games which practice nuclear and other military attacks on North Korea are insufficient. They want to see movement toward a real peace treaty and removal of economic sanctions, especially allowing South Korea and North Korea to normalize relations. And, they want US military forces out of Korea, permanently.

On July 27, in a protest in front of the White House, South Korean activists claimed the June 12 agreement between North Korea and the United States called for normalizing relations between North Korea and the US and establishing a permanent and solid peace regime in Korea. They believe that to conclude North Korea-US peace treaty includes withdrawal of the US military from Korea as the core. They call on the Trump administration to fully implement the June 12 declaration and immediately withdraw US troops from South Korea. They pledge all-out national resistance against the United States, to advance the realization of the world where US troops are withdrawn, the Korean people are masters of their country, and the nation is reunified....

NDPP

Inside America's MeddlingMachine: The US Funded Group that Interferes in Elections Around the Globe  (and vid)

https://twitter.com/GrayzoneProject/status/1031706407761006592

"Watch America's Meddling Machine, a documentary investigation into the National Endowment for Democracy. Filmed on Capitol Hill, Max Blumenthal shows how this US-funded group has interfered in elections and driven regime change operations around the globe."

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

That's a very interesting little video, well worth watching. Here is a direct YouTube link.

WWWTT

Here's a recent event in North Korea very important to share. Worthy of other babblers to at least reflect upon for a moment

http://www.leadertelegram.com/News/Daily-Updates/2018/08/23/div-class-li...

After seeing this, I'm 100% convinced Korea will reunite! Question isn't if but when.

NDPP

Trump Cancels Secretary of State's Trip to North Korea One Day After its Announcement

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2018/08/25/kore-a25.html

"US President Donald Trump on Friday canceled Secretary of State Mike Pompeo's upcoming fourth visit to North Korea next week, citing a lack of progress on Pyongyang's denuclearization. The decision coming  only one day after Pompeo announced his trip, highlights the unpredictability of the Trump administration and the continual ramping up of tensions in Northeast Asia, aimed primarily at China.

In the same set of tweets canceling Pompeo's visit, Trump also denounced China, linking the growing trade war between Washington and Beijing with North Korea: 'Additionally, because of our much tougher Trading (sic) stance with China, I do not believe they are helping us with the process of denuclearization as they once were.'

Trump's agenda from the beginning was to issue Pyongyang an ultimatum: either join the US war drive against China, which would likely mean US troops on the Chinese border and even North Korea's own participation in such a war against its former ally, or the US would 'totally destroy' the poverty-stricken country as Trump had previously threatened. With the US-China trade war escalating and another Chinese delegation expected to arrive in Washington in the near future, Trump is leveraging North Korea against China to gain an upper hand in the talks..."

WWWTT

Thanks for the link NDPP. I'm going to use it for some speculation.

It's possible that Trump (or the US) wants to be central to the peace process. Trump may be worried that the US has lost control (or the perception of) of the peace process and that reunification of Korea will happen without the US. It actually makes sence because if  Korea is able to brush aside the US and acomplish without the US's help, then this may be viewed as US weakness.

I don't think it's any coincidence that after hundreds of families have briefly united (and more planned) and the Korean people all have seen these images, that Trump is now trying to put the US back into center stage of the peace process. Using a delaying tactic is fairly safe for the time being. Flip side is that it gets old and predictable.

voice of the damned

WWWTT wrote:

I don't think it's any coincidence that after hundreds of families have briefly united (and more planned) and the Korean people all have seen these images...

Just for the record, but these family reunions are not unprecedented. They've been taking place, albeit sporadically, since 2000. So the current images are not likely to be any sort of epiphany for most Koreans.

As for Trump, I've never quite bought the idea that he's a crazed warmonger, and I think that if he believes he can attain glory by seeming to preside over the end of the Korean War and the reunification of Korea, he'll happily grab the honour. I also think that, if Obama had made some sort of major advance in regards to peace on the peninsula, Trump would now be trying to wreck it.

https://tinyurl.com/yc7dug3q

WWWTT

I have seen footage of past reunions and I’m sure they have kept the peace process going all this time. Now to what extent it has helped can be debated. 

Keep in mind that the current peace negotiations are probably the most promising ever, and these family reunions will only guarantee that peace process will not stall. And or accelerate the process 

NDPP

US To Continue Army Drills with South Korea Despite Trump's Promise in Singapore

https://youtu.be/yLSInXf43Q4

NDPP

Kim Jong-un Welcomes South Korean Leader in Pyongyang for Historic Summit (and vid)

https://on.rt.com/9ehl

"South Korean President Moon Jae-in has landed in Pyongyang for the historic summit with Kim Jong-un as part of the ongoing reconciliation process and talks on denuclearization of the peninsula. The South Korean president brought a large entourage of 110 delegates, including top business leaders, that will discuss strengthening ties between the neighbors..."

As long as the psycho Americans can be kept at bay, things are likely to go well.

NDPP

US Bullying of the Two Koreas Endangers Its Alliance...And Peace

https://t.co/FGhnNqy0bf

"Everyone but the US believes that unilateral denuclearization is a fantasy and that only accepting peace can defuse the problem. If the haranguing by Washington continues, South Korea may well act on its own..."

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

Two Koreas Advance Peace Without Trump’s ‘Approval’

North and South Korea are moving ahead with plans to build road and rail links as part of their historic peace talks. But the U.S. is standing in the way, as Trump refuses to lift sanctions and claims that the South Koreans “do nothing without our approval.” We speak to Col. Lawrence Wilkerson

 

WWWTT

@ epaulo NDPP

Korea moving on with peace without the US is something I predicted and really it’s a no brainer screaming obvious. 

The only problem is the US troops and military hardware based in SK and Japan. 

The sanctions I believe is something Korea and regional countries will ignore in several years. 

Perhaps in say 10-16 months, the thumb screws are going to seriously tighten on the US if they keep playing their games!

WWWTT

I’m surprised NDPP didn’t jump on this so here it is. North Korea may very well start up their nuclear testing again

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2018/11/03/asia-pacific/north-korea-warns-restart-nuclear-weapons-development-sanctions-arent-lifted/#.W99ik6RybYU

side note- I’m going to try to stay away from western news links. 

WWWTT

Yep here we go! I kind of thought something like this was going to happen when Meng Wan Zhou was detained in Canada.

https://ca.yahoo.com/news/nkorea-says-wont-denuclearize-unless-us-remove...

I suspect that China is now using it's influence over it's allies to turn the thumb screws down on Trump/Canada.

NDPP

Trump Will Meet Kim Jong-un For 2nd Peace Summit in February (podcast)

https://sptnkne.ws/k5RV

"The White House announced today that the second summit between Donald Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong-un will take place in late February at a yet-to-be determined location. Brian Becker speaks with Simon Chun, a fellow of the Korean Policy Institute and a member of the Korean Peace Network."

WWWTT

I came across this article while searching for something else. Out of curiosity, I read it and found it very interesting. It fits into the theory or belief I have that many Koreans want to realize a single Korea. No North /South divide. 

https://m.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asia/article/2149654/koreans-living-japan-without-nationality-want-unification

WWWTT

Here’s a real interesting follow up on NDDP’s comment posted last month. But before I post the link, I had to search a bit to find something not from the icm!

http://m.koreatimes.co.kr/pages/article.asp?newsIdx=262312

Vietnam And Hanoi are in the lead for most likely host city for the next round of these historic peace talks. WOW! Who would of thought? Clearly Kim is is in control. We can have a huge debate about what the choice of host city could imply, I’m really surprised that it could be Hanoi!?!? 

I’d like to hear from other posters on this one. 

voice of the damned

WWWTT:

Vietnam And Hanoi are in the lead for most likely host city for the next round of these historic peace talks.

Vietnam and Hanoi are in the lead for hosting? You might want to update your sources. The summit is going on as I type this.

 

 

WWWTT

Ok thanks for that! I checked several links but found conflicting reports about the location. I briefly touched on this in my comment referring to sources. No biggie 

Anyways, cmon man, Hanoi????? You don’t find that this location, a communist country that dealt the US it’s most humiliating defeat, the country where the US committed its most evil war crimes to be very odd?

You and other babblers must have something to say about Hanoi being the host ! Must!

voice of the damned

I believe Vietnam these days has relatively cordial relations with the US, and at least two US presidents, Clinton and Obama, had previously visited the country for the specific purpose of meeting with Vietnamese leaders. So visiting to meet with other countries leaders wouldn't seem like too much of a tall order at all.

Likely, Vietnam was one of the countries most amenable to both parties in the summit.  

WWWTT

The link I posted suggested Thailand and Hawaii were at one time suggested. Now Hawaii is probably a long shot that’s more like a joke. 

I believe these host countries in the peace talks are suggestive how this will play out. So far all post colonial countries that have shared common interests in expelling western occupation. 

Trump must see this. He must know he’s at a disadvantage. He’s getting played and is being strong armed by Kim. 

I’m going to speculate that Trump is desperate for a Korea peace treaty and there is a greater than 50% chance we’ll see one leading up to the 2020 presidential campaigns. Trump needs a big win and I suspect Kim is going to make him pay a super hi premium for it!

voice of the damned

WWWTT wrote:

The link I posted suggested Thailand and Hawaii were at one time suggested. Now Hawaii is probably a long shot that’s more like a joke. 

I believe these host countries in the peace talks are suggestive how this will play out. So far all post colonial countries that have shared common interests in expelling western occupation. 

Trump must see this. He must know he’s at a disadvantage. He’s getting played and is being strong armed by Kim. 

This is kind of assuming that every time the US and Vietnam have some sort of involvement together, the Vietnam War is the big issue looming over everything. But if that were the case, I doubt you would have seen stuff like this happening...

The United States and Vietnam on Thursday signed a pact that would allow the transfer of nuclear technology to the Southeast Asian nation and open the way for U.S. investment in the burgeoning industry, in another sign that Washington is seeking stronger economic and strategic ties in the region.

Granted, this is just technology, not nuclear material per se, and presumably won't be used to develop weapons. But still, given the air of controversy that generally accompanies such deals undertaken with suspect states, I'd say Vietnam and the US are more-or-less back in each other's "We can do business together" column.

And I don't know if the average voter in the US is going to make connections like "Hmm, Singapore and Vietnam are both countries which kicked out colonial occupiers, what does this all mean?" And if the voters don't generally care, the politicians likely don't either.  

I agree Hawaii wasn't a likely winner for the summit-hosting lottery, for the same reasons that Pyeongyang wouldn't be. I also agree that Trump REALLY wants some sort of positive agreement to come out of this, though as I've said before, the status quo is always the best bet on the Korean peninsula.

https://tinyurl.com/y2qewxup

 

 

 

 

WWWTT

Voters in the US not caring is a plus for Trump. 

And let’s make something perfectly clear hear, millions of Vietnamese died. Agent orange/purple were used in arguably the most hideous war crimes in humanity! Children to this very day are still born suffering from the US criminal legacy.  

The proud brave people of Vietnam will never forget!

cco

Vietnam's been buying weapons from America for a few years now.

WWWTT

Here’s some follow up articles from the corrupt icm. Take it with a grain of salt please. 

https://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-vietnam-trump-north-korea-20190208-story.html

more to come 

WWWTT

Here’s a tweet of Trump ripping a fucking new asshole into another “ John McCainish” war pig!

I have now spent more time in Vietnam than Da Nang Dick Blumenthal, the third rate Senator from Connecticut (how is Connecticut doing?). His war stories of his heroism in Vietnam were a total fraud - he was never even there. We talked about it today with Vietnamese leaders!

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-27/trump-gets-set-for-one-on-one-kim-meeting-hanoi-summit-update

Again, this is from another servant of evils icm link. Reader beware. 

WWWTT

Here’s another link from a loyal icm servant hard at work living up to their reputation 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/trump-kim-jong-un-summit-live-updates-north-korea-us-meeting-vietnam-hanoi-a8798271.html

Apparently, some reporters were shouting out questions in Hanoi and were barred. Good on Trump! And then the icm tried to dictate the direction of the media coverage. 

If Trump is locking horns with the icm, I’ll take Trumps side!

voice of the damned

WWWTT wrote:
I have now spent more time in Vietnam than Da Nang Dick Blumenthal, the third rate Senator from Connecticut (how is Connecticut doing?). His war stories of his heroism in Vietnam were a total fraud - he was never even there. We talked about it today with Vietnamese leaders!

Wow, that guy really is in a category of his own. He insults one his nation's own senators while on an official visit to a foreign country, and then brags that he had also been insulting him in a meeting with the leaders of said country?  

Not that I'm complaining, in fact, as I've said before, his style is kind of refreshing. But definitely unique.

 

swallow swallow's picture

What is the icm? Not an abbreviation I've heard before. 

Although Vietnam and the US are indeed frirndly now, there is a nice irony to holding a meeting to resolve the Korean War (1950-53, and counting) in the capital of the country that hosted America's next big Asian war. 

Third summit could maybe be in the southern Philuippines, site of America's first big Asian war of extermination. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moro_Rebellion 

voice of the damned

Well, if there is a third summit. We'll see what happens now that the last one ended on a low note.

Though I did see a headline saying that Trump "taken Kim Jong Un at his word" on the death of Otto Warmbier. Which sort of goes with what I was saying about Trump's rather idisoyncratic approach to int'l relations. Most politicians, if not getting what they want from their opposite number, wouldn't publically testify to his personal honesty on an unrelated matter.

 

WWWTT

icm=imperialist corporate media 

here’s an example 

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/white-house-trump-kim-meetings-change-of-schedule.html

The writer in the above article tries to label Kim and North Korea as evil and demanding, where Trump is vocalizing good “as expected” friendly progress. Basically it was a successful meeting that he’s going to stretch out to the next presidential elections 

WWWTT

Here’s a piece written with a different perspective. It’s a little dated but I found it interesting 

https://original.antiwar.com/feffer/2019/01/23/the-next-us-north-korea-summit/

WWWTT

The possible locations of the third summit. So far it appears that Kim is the one making the list and or has the final say. Forget Europe North America China Russia Japan. It’s possible Kim wants it in a symbolic South East Asian/pacific country. But I suspect there’s flying through airspace of some nations not acceptable for either side so for example Laos Cambodia may not be considered?

Indonesia Philippine Papau New Guinea. Outside chance East Timor and Malaysia

For some reason I’m thinking Philippines or Bangkok are hi on the list. 

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

“The Korean People Want Peace”: Christine Ahn on Trump Walking Away from N. Korea Nuclear Talks

We speak with Christine Ahn, founder and executive director of Women Cross DMZ, a global movement of women mobilizing to end the Korean War.

quote:

CHRISTINE AHN: And so, I mean, I want to first start by saying we don’t know what the full picture is. And, in fact, there have been now some reports coming out, especially from South Korea, the former minister of unification is suggesting that Bolton—of course—I mean, once we saw the picture of the table and we saw Pompeo and we saw Bolton, I mean, we had to—that was a red flag that something was going to be derailed. And so, what we understand from the South Korean side is that Bolton was insisting that biological and chemical weapons were to be part of the package. And so North Korea obviously shifted their position and called for full lifting of sanctions.

quote:

CHRISTINE AHN: Well, I mean, there are two things that give me hope in this current moment. One is, I mean, actually, the rapport, if you actually see the rapport that Trump and Kim have established. I mean, you need the leaders of the two countries to have good rapport. And clearly there is something there.

And, you know, the fact that Trump said two things in his press conference really surprised me. One was, he put a dollar bill, the amount, a price tag, on the U.S. war drills. He said they cost $100 million. It’s a huge waste of money. The other thing he said was that the sanctions harm the people of North Korea and that he wouldn’t be adding more new sanctions. I think that’s a great outcome. It’s a great foundation. But we need to continue to build on it. We need to push for it.

The other thing that obviously gives me hope is that the peace—the historic peace that’s taking place between North and South Korea. The Korean people want an end to this Korean War. Nine out of 10 South Koreans want a declaration to the end of the war. They have made tremendous progress.

quote:

AMY GOODMAN: Christine Ahn, you were among hundreds of women who wrote a letter jointly to Donald Trump and to Kim Jong-un, calling for peace and saying peace women should be at the table. Can you explain?

CHRISTINE AHN: Absolutely. I mean, I think right now the fragility of the talks shows that we have to democratize this process. We can’t leave it just in the hands of Donald Trump and Kim Jong-un. It needs to have—it’s not just a war, a 70-year war, between the leaders of the two countries. We have had generations of propaganda. We’ve always seen North Korea through a prism of war. And we need to have people-to-people engagement. That is what’s going to bring genuine peace.

And we know that when women are included in the peace process, it leads to a peace agreement—and not just a peace agreement, but a really durable one. And when half the world’s population isn’t part of shaping a peace agreement that reflects the desire of half the world’s population, it’s not going to, obviously, be a just and sustainable one. So we’re demanding that there is a process that includes civil society and that includes women’s rights groups, because we have seen the record. In 40 conflicts around the world, in all but one case, when women’s groups were involved in the peace process, it led to a peace agreement. And we want to see denuclearization. We want to see peace. We want to see the improvement of human rights. We’ll never get there, until there is a true peace, until war is taken off the table.

WWWTT

Total bullshit headlines from democracy now and the rest of the icm!

The Kashmir conflict between Modi and Kahn dictated that Trump immediately redirect his focus to India and Pakistan. 

I seriously doubt that Amy Goodman would ever acknowledge this. 

NDPP

CrossTalk on Trump-Kim Summit: No Agreement

https://youtu.be/BHkdQGaRAKA

"Much was expected from the Hanoi summit..."

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

U.S. and South Korea Roll Back Joint Military Exercises

The U.S. and South Korea have canceled their upcoming annual joint military exercises in a move that’s likely to ease tensions with North Korea, which views the exercises as a provocation. The move comes days after the highly anticipated summit between President Trump and Kim Jong-un fell apart without a deal or any substantial progress made on dismantling North Korea’s nuclear arsenal. The U.S. and South Korea will instead engage in much smaller-scale and less publicized drills. Trump said canceling the massive military exercises will save the U.S. hundreds of millions of dollars.

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

North Korea Disputes Trump’s Account of Why Kim-Trump Summit Failed

North Korea has contradicted President Trump’s explanation of why talks in Hanoi between President Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong-un came to an abrupt end Thursday. Speaking to reporters, Foreign Minister Ri Yong-ho said North Korea had asked for only partial sanctions relief in exchange for dismantling its main nuclear complex in Yongbyon.

Ri Yong-ho: “Our proposal was that we will permanently dismantle all of our nuclear material production sites, including plutonium and uranium facilities, in the Yongbyon area, as a joint work by engineers from both countries and in the presence of experts from the United States, if the U.S. lifts the sanctions that affect our people’s livelihood.”

The statement contradicts President Trump’s claim that he walked away from the talks after North Korea demanded total relief from sanctions in exchange for disarming the Yongbyon facility.

WWWTT

Thanks for the updates epaulo!

This confirms my suspicions that Kim is in the drivers seat. And knows it!  He did get the US to tone down the war games, and that was always something way up there on North Korea’s demands. 

And since it came at/after the Hanoi summit, there was progress made there!

I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again, there has to be some kinds of concessions made to save face for the US and make Trump look like a hero in all of this. 

How that will exactly look like, I’m not sure? Ok actually I have no clue. 

NDPP

Mike Whitney: What Really Happened in North Korea

https://t.co/rBV7sG0xFF

"...What was particularly puzzling about the summit was the manner in which the negotiations were conducted, that is, there were no negotiations at all, not really. The Trump delegation simply listened politely to Kim's offers, scratched their chins and then rejected them without debate or counter-proposals. In other words, the whole summit was a fraud..."

 

North Korea's Game Plan and the Upcoming Satellite Launch

https://t.co/hIxtxBWhsP

John Bolton won. After a short period of calm and talks between the US and North Korea both sides are again walking towards a conflict. The US has not fulfilled its side of the bargain. The US continues to walk away from the Joint Statement Trump signed in Singapore and is back to making threats..."

 

Full Obedience or Tougher Sanctions: US Says North Korea's 'Step-by-Step' Denuclearization Unacceptable

https://on.rt.com/9prs

"After threatening to ramp up 'crushing economic sanctions', National Security Advisor John Bolton urged Kim Jong-un to ditch any idea of a step-by-step denuclearization of his country..."

Amerikka returns to its historical, traditional style of gun-to-the-head treaty making. Except not everybody folds so easily...

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