Coalition Deal Reached: CBC

I.O., you do know she's one of the Deputy Speakers, already, right?

Also, on the prorogation business, the Conservatives spent a good part of last Friday spinning that the Opposition couldn't vote down the Ways & Means motion, because it would hurt seniors, since the W&M contains the provision which allows them to delay RRIF withdrawals during the crisis.

That the Conservatives would now consider prorogation before that came to a vote, indicates just how desperate they are, and how little they meant what they said as late as last Friday.

The Tories are stalling for time hoping that a fracture forms in the coalition ranks or that public opinion shifts against the option.  All the leaks about Iggy, just like the NDP demand for finance, should be viewed with a lot of caution - Harper and company are trying to push every pressure point they can find to expose a weakness and see if they can break the coalition.

But if it is Iggy, so be it.  Why should I care if the Liberals want to pick their most right-wing option for leader - I welcome it.  The contrast would be good for the NDP and for Jack.  There will be an election after this and we can say that if you like the progressive policies of the coalition then you have to vote for the progressive element of the coalition, the NDP.  Its much harder to do that if the media paints the Libs and the NDP as essentially interchangable.

As for the merits of a coalition in the first-place I don't understand the opposition to it from some quarters here.  If politics is the art of the possible then I like the possibility of a 25% NDP government as opposed to a 100% Conservative one.  Nice work Jack - oh and when we next go to the polls there should be a binding referendum on implimenting a form of proportional rep so we never need risk another false majority governement.

The NDP propped up the Martin Liberal government in spring 2005, in exchange for the "NDP budget", Kelowna, child care, the workers' "bankruptcy" bill, etc. Did that reduce their credibility? Was their "credibility" only restored when they joined with Harper and Duceppe to defeat the government in November?

I see the risks, but your analysis is entirely one-sided. What makes you think the NDP and Bloc are incapable of hammering out a decent government platform? And if the Liberals renege, what stops the others from pulling the plug - and how will that hurt them? And since when does "cabinet solidarity" mean that the party loses its freedom of speech on issues?

The grassroots have exactly as much input into the coalition agreement as they do into the party platform. In both cases, it's the leader and his coterie who decide. And if the grassroots have not already influenced the party as to what it can and can't agree to in a coalition agreement, then the grassroots are so impotent and the party is so corrupt that why would you even waste your breath talking about it?

This is about dealing the extreme right a humiliating defeat. It's a statement that Canadians will no longer put up with a minority regime that seeks to demolish our acquired gains, our social solidarity, and the sliver of independence which we had hung on to on the foreign stage. It will not produce a workers' government - but it is potentially dramatically better than the alternative of doing nothing and waiting for the NDP to become consistent and principled and popular.

Why not be more constructive in your critique? Or, if you really think this is wholly negative, suggest what the NDP should be doing instead? and the Bloc?

No shit. But possibly very high reward, if the coalition lasts long enough to do some good things, and leads to a disunited right.

 

Just seeing Harper finally tripped up by his hubris and attacked by the mainstream press that was fawning on him up to now is pure, unadulterated joy!

Try to stick to the topic.

We're talking about a multi-year coalition government here, not a temporary accord designed to wring concessions out of a capitalist government while still retaining independence from it. Learn the difference.

What, the Liberals, with their 77 seats, don't get a say?

Since cabinet solidarity was invented. Cabinet ministers are not permitted to dissent in public from government policy. Nor are they permitted to disclose the debates that go on in the cabinet room.

The NDP can't be government and opposition at the same time. If they choose to be government, they lose the right to criticize. That privilege will fall only to the Conservatives. And the Bloc. 

I was wasting my breath by replying to the babbler who talked about how the grassroots would have to keep the coalition "honest". Otherwise I would not have dreamed of raising such a ludicrous concept.

I don't agree. It lets Harper off the hook for doing anything to solve the unsolvable (within capitalism) world financial crisis, and puts the burden of making capitalism work squarely on the shoulders of the NDP and the Liberals. When they fail, Harper will be the beneficiary.

It's also about dealing a humiliating defeat to independent working class politics. It's about the final step in the transformation of the NDP from alabour party into a bourgeois party with no real reason for existence separate and apart from the Liberal Party.

Now instead we'll have a coalition to do that for us.

I have already suggested more than once that the NDP should make tactical accords in order to get specific concessions from the capitalist government, as it has been doing from time to time, federally and in Ontario.

As for the Bloc I don't give them advice because they are a capitalist party. But I note that they will not be part of the NDP-Liberal coalition, retaining their independence and freedom of speech and action.

I don't know that labour is on board with it.

Their treacherous leadership seems to be, however. 

"This is a high-risk business in lots of ways. "

 

I don't see much discussion here about the highest risk of all: the possibility that the NDP and Liberals will alienate numerous supporters, and rally somnolent Tory supporters, by allying themselves with a separatist party.

Some people will surely have a visceral and longlasting  reaction to this alliance.  Both parties will claim the influence of the BLoc will be benign, and deny their influence, but the reality is that they will be invited to hold the balance of power in our country.  Their support will not be free of charge, and that fact will be well marked by many more than Tories.

I love all the hysterics about dealing with the BQ. They are the duly elected representatives for Quebec ridings, not a bunch of terrorists. They have the same desire to deal with this economic crisis that affects Quebec like anywhere else.

There was little choice but to try a coalition. The Conservatives stupidly alienated all other parties so they can't govern now.

I just want the coalition to get down to work quickly. First they should fix the EI system. It will soon be needed like never before. pain is on the way.

What I'm anxious to hear is which ministries are going to New Democrats. Since PM, Deputy PM, Finance and Treasury Board were taken off the table, I hope they are meaty and a mix of economic and social portfolios, and that the NDP didn't settle for seats at the kiddies' table.

Justice, Health, Labour, Industry, Environment, Heritage - that's my wish list. 

 

There is one straightforward way this coalition might not happen, that has little to do with Liberal leadership rivalries or such considerations.

If Harper wants to hold on enough and really eat crow- he can announce at the end of the week the stimulus package they were going to make everyone wait for while they played "we'll show who is boss" [and how much of our ideological agenda we're still going to force in].

We don't know how much they were going to do later before they got the fear. Thats moot now. The bottom line is that the unannounced stimulus package is going to have at leat enough in it to satisfy all the media commentators and economists who dumped on last weeks surprise package.

So if Harper wants to outline it late this week, then what?

Because most Canadians do not when it comes down to it really care that Haper has been an ass and someone they now like even less. They want results. And if Harper promises what they were looking for....

Why should they prefer it coming instead from this uncertain coalition animal?

Right now only the usual suspects are saying that the coalition should not be the ones getting us out of this mess. But what happens in the Liberal party if and when that is no longer the case?

Hard to say. They now have their own internal dynamics of people with a vested interest in this. IE, both Dion and Rae. Its not by any means just a simple matter of the Iggy camp outnumbering, even if by a lot.

My guess is that IF Harper wants to go all the way in eating humble pie Dion and Rae will want to tough it out despite the obvious problems. And that they and non-aligned allied heavies will prevail.

And as to public opinion- the way that a great many people will want to see Harper stay if he eats humble pie, cuts the same for a coalition if it goes ahead in spite of that public sentiment: when the dust settles people will judge the government on what they see come from it, whatever they thought about the process of getting there.

"Wasylicia-Leis probably gets the last spot because of seniority and the fact that she is the only member of caucus with ministerial experience (Manitoba 1986-88). Plus, as an added bonus, she would ensure gender parity."

 David Christopherson had several portfoloios in the Rae government in the 90s and of course Mulcair was Environment Minister in Quebec.

Well I got email from the labour council and a letter from Ken G (CLC). And yes, they are on board. CAW too, along with CUPE. I don't know what big labour who are thinking about who aren't. 

______________________________________________________________________________________ Our kids live together and play together in their communities, let's have them learn together too!

If public opinion polls show that the coalition is massively unpopular or if enough right wing Liberal MPs balk then it's not quite a done deal.

There is a disturbing report that the coalition government will be advised on the economy by a council of Frank privatize it McKenna. Paul slash it Martin, John free trade it Manley, and Roy public health care Romanow. The government needs to be run by elected members of parliament, not Liberal retreads, and an NDP slatwart who can be out-voted. This is an attempt to diminish the NDP contribution to the government on the economy and pump up the big bank end. Will McKenna step down from the TD bank job? Will Manley leave the CIBC board?