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Syndicate
Looking at the Wikipedia article on JDL, I read that it is in fact a "violent extremist organization", a characterization given by none other than the FBI. It is also mentioned that JDL members have been involved in terrorism and have fundraised for the terrorist organisation Kahane Chai.
In the light of the above, I must say that presenting the JDL demo as an "Israeli" demo is primarily an insult to honest Israelis. Also, that counting these thugs as the "pro-Israeli equivalent" of the demonstrators against the aggression in Gaza is an insult to any democratic citizen...
So, here we have a civilin population caged, starved, brutalized and now bombed by a state that promotes ethnic supremacy and this thread is about Hamas? Chalk another small one up to the bad guys.
-deleted by Merowe-
Careful Frustrated Mess, I got my pee pee slapped for referencing good guys and bad guys in one of my posts- careful my friend :)
I think when those battles were going on a few months (year?) ago Israel thought they would plow over Hamas or Palastine defenses (not sure the correct term). Israel and the rest of the world was surprised when Israel got a wake up call and their forces were slowed down or even stopped. BIG bloody nose.
No one expected that. I think it embarassed the hell out of them and now they aren't taking any chances and want some good ol'revenge to make uyp for the face they lost.
Hamas was democratically elected wasn't it? Like legitimately voted in? I think NATO should put a stop to Israel attacking a democracy, how come the states aren't condeming their actions?
Necessary to fight things out some times. No need to appologize to me. The situation is difficult and complex.
Didn't get anything in that link, and I would certainly like to take a look at that article. It sound interesting.
Sorry, cueball, here is the repaired link:
Engaging Hamas and Hizballah
Lagatta, type in a word you want to link. Then use your mouse to highlight it. When highlighted, the following image becomes visibile above the smiley face below the text entry window:
Click that and then paste your link into the dialog that pops up.
Luckily my brainfart only lasted a few hours. If you want to know when my awakening came, I suddenly imagined a demo calling for Canada to get out of Afghanistan, and someone saying, "but the Taliban are bad too".
Anyway, back to the thread.
The accurate term is "Zionist lobby." Many Jews are either anti-Zionist or opposed to the course Israel has taken, vis-a-vis the Palestinians, the last 40 years.
My point wasn't made clearly. I condemn the "Jewish lobby" terminology, and I agree with you on that.
I wanted to point to the danger of using "Israel lobby". From the Wikipedia entry about Walt and Mearsheimer's book:
It gives me the shivers.
I've been a way from a computer for the last few days and though I was following the Israeli massacre I didn't get to follow babble's coverage; I had looked forward to getting to read it today. I just wanted to thank everyone for this thread, its a great read and the back-and-forth between Unionist and Cueball was actually very good reading. I respect both of your posts a lot and I was a little surprised by Unionist's initial stance but it looks like its all resolved now. Unionist you summed it up so well with,
Which, after being so impressed with your posting history on Afghanistan over the years, is pretty much what I was thinking as I read along upthread.
Anyway thanks again, sorry I don't have anything really to add right now; frankly just getting caught up reading babble has me rather mentally warn out
As well, among the most influential elements of the Zionist lobby are evangelical Christians who are far more important and numerous in American politics (and elections) than the subsection of Jews who vote primarily based on what candidates say about Israel.
"The path to sovereignty and nationhood can be accomplished by walking in the steps of Mahatma Gandhi and Dr. King, not Syed Qutb and Osama Bin Laden."
What you mean, of course, is that Palestinians should learn to bleed and die quietly like good little victims.
How cheap is Palestinian blood? So cheap Zionist politicians readily spill it hoping for nothing more than a bump in the polls:
This is what Zionist supremacy looks like.
I'm a little confused... are you thinking of a different Dr. King?
"It is impossible for someone to lie unless he thinks he knows the truth. Producing bullshit requires no such conviction. The bullshitter is neither on the side of the true nor on the side of the false. He does not care whether the things he says describe reality correctly. He just picks them out, or makes them up, to suit his purpose."
Harry G. Frankfurt
What a load of bullshit ... Anyway ...
The planet's most impotent and useless body, the Arab League, will be meeting on Wednesday to eat little sandwiches and pretend to have relevance in the affairs of their own nations, according to a Reuters article that also says Ban Ki-moon, the so-called leader of the United Nations, the world's second most impotent and useless body, is ticked. Oh, dear! Has he gone over the top and composed a letter yet?
On our local news at eight am..Global didn't even mention it..they mentioned India, they mentioned a few other places ..no mention..very bizarre..the Globe allowed no comments either.
One wonders!
FM...couldn't agree more..this is about who has the most machismo..Livni or Netanyahu..as they impress the ultra right.
The Palestinians of Gaza are cannon fodder in a pen struggling to achieve the will of the majority who voted for them. We like democracy as long as the "right" side wins..and only then.
All animals are created equal but some animals are more equal than others.. (rough quote)
How stupid. The late Dr. Rantisi, one of the founder of Hamas, and Sheik Ahmed Yassin's second lieutenant, and immediate successor, started his political carreer organizing Palestinian tax strikes because he thought is was absurd that Palestinians should pay for their own occupation. It was not effective, and he joined Hamas. In fact, the great majority of Palestinian protest is non-violent, this is why you never hear about it.
If all Palestinians were violent in their opposition to the occupation, the streets of Israel would run with blood. There are after all more that 3 million of them.
But rather than convince you of that, I will pull out this excelent Israeli piece about the "Ghandi Riddle", and Israeli repression of peaceful Palestinian protest to the occupation.
Ran HaCohen -- Letter from Israel
If you like later, I will show you some film footage of Israel soldiers breaking up an peaceful protest with rubber bullets and tear gas, and shooting protestors in the head with rubber bullets at less than fifty yard range, causing permanent brain damage to (not to mention almost killing) an Israeli Jew who sympathizes with the Palestinian cause.
But then again, you actually argued tenaciously for 20 or so posts that Michelle Palmer was going to do hard time in Dubai for fucking on the beach, so probably no amount of discussion or evidence will undermine your prejudices.
Mon 29 Dec 2008
Canada's New Democrats condemn the unacceptable escalation of violence in the Middle East causing death and injury to so many civilians in the Gaza Strip and Israel.
It is a tragedy that hundreds of civilians have again become the victims of violence in this conflict. The continuing airstrikes by Israel on civilians in the Gaza strip and the ongoing rocket attacks on Israeli civilians are serving to compound the existing civilian disaster and further harm chances for a negotiated peace.
We call on the Government of Canada to immediately call for an end to the aerial bombing of Gaza, the blockade of aid to civilians and the indiscriminate rocket attacks on Israel. Indeed, the government must urge both sides to agree to end the current hostilities immediately, reinstate the ceasefire and return to the peace process.
The Government of Canada should also work to ensure that medical and food aid is provided to the civilians of Gaza through U.N. agencies.
New Democrats believe that Canada must pursue a balanced approach to the Middle East crisis, in keeping with Canadians' deep desire for peace in the Middle East and are ready to work with the new administration in the U.S. towards a lasting peace in the region. This goal cannot be achieved while citizens in such large numbers are being killed and endangered.
http://www.ndp.ca/press/new-democrat-statement-on-situation-in-middle-east
___________________________________________________________ "watching the tide roll away"