NDP MP Judy Wasylycia-Leis calls it quits

The House of Commons' gain will be Winnipeg City Hall's loss.

I wonder if Ralph Goodale will be happy to see her go? 

Soon to be Liberal?

She'll run for mayor. Hence my hilarious quip upthread.

One fewer member of the CPCCA.

I'm a Dipper, but I'm glad she's going.

What is the CPCCA?

Read this, Augustus.

I see.  It's an acronym for the Canadian Parliamentary Coalition to Combat Anti-Semitism.

Reading that other thread, I get the sense that Babblers are not a supporter of the organization, or of Judy's involvement in it?

I hope not. It is nothing more than a cover to criminalize, or at the very least, delegitimize criticism of the racist policies and official violence of Israel.

I read her justification for remaining on the committtee and I disagree with her strongly. But, in any event, now that her presence has helped to legitimze the committee, I suppose she will now never write the "minority report".

I think when they write her political biography that her most famous moment will still be when she rushed before the cameras during the middle of the 2005/2006 election and announced the RCMP investigation into income trusts.  She basically tarnished Ralph Goodale by doing that, although he was later cleared of any wrongdoing.

That's why I said above that I think he will be glad to see her go.

Yeah Augustus, I actually caught that reference. She did it jointly with that other working-class hero, Paul Summerville, if memory serves. Harper owes her big-time.

The CPCCA is HUAC north, McCarthyism come to Canada. Layton should never have allowed any member of the caucus to join that committee. I believe that Pat Martin is the only knee-deep left, and he's not going to leave voluntarily. Layton should take the same principled stand that the Bloc have, but I'm not holding my breath.

I've written to my NDP MP twice on the matter of the CPCCA, and he has never deigned to reply - mind you, I've always known that he was weak in the conscience department when it came to Israel's crimes.

I followed the CJPME's call to email Jack, Judy, Pat etc., and I got Judy's lame excuse in return (reprinted in the other thread).

Pat Martin, besides being a whitewasher of Israel, is the same anti-Québec pro-monarchy low-life who pushed for a loyalty oath for all MPs as a condition of sitting and of receiving any public funds.

Are there any minimum standards for being a sitting member of the NDP these days?

Judy W-L did the right thing by asking for an investigation into leaks in the Dept. of Finance around the income trust decision. Its a fact that just hours before the government announced its decision on income trusts there were millions of dollars worth of stocks that mysteriously changed hands and there were strong suspcions of leaks of government policy leading to insider trading. It would have been negligent of any of any opposition MP not to demand an investigation of the Department of Finance and Goodale was Minister of Finance at the time and had to be held accountable for his personnel leaking information. As it happened, someone in the dept. of Finance was charged and convicted.

Thanks for the negative reply, Stock.

Her behaviour was disgraceful in that incident - even I can recognize that.  

As was reported at the time, she was salivating so excitedly to rush out there and present her news that her throat got dry and one of the reporters had to give her a cough drop to moisten her mouth!

I fail to see what's wrong with demanding a police investigation of government corruption and possible insider trading. That's what opposition politicians are elected to do. You can attack the RCMP for publicly announcing that they were investigating during an election campaign - but that is their problem not hers. Judy asked the RCMP to investigate before the election had been called.

I wouldn't worry too much about Harper calling a quick by-election in this riding.

It wouldn't have to be called until November 1st, and more than likely won't happen until 2011.

Why didn't she wait until the next election to retire anyway?  Is it really right to leave your constituents with no MP half-way through your term?

That's what led to the Conservatives taking Paul Crete's seat in Quebec last year in the by-election.  He was opportunistic in trying to jump to another job only a short time after the last election.

Good riddance. I hope Pat Martin will be next to exit the NDP caucus. He would fit in with the Cons.

Augustus, you should really consider the long-term consequences of your silly talking points.  If a Conservative member were to step down before the next election, you'd be trumpetting it as an opportunity to bring in new blood.

As to Judy's newser during the campaign, I don't recall any salivation.  You should see your people when they're on panels and think they have someone else on the run.  She's about as dignified and serious an MP as you can find in the House of Commons, which is why she had so much credibility on that issue.

There's nothing silly about what I said.  Perhaps you should consider not criticising an argument before you understand what it means - that's what is silly.

I am in favour of MP's serving their full terms unless they have to retire because of illness or family emergency.  I would not support a Conservative MP playing musical chairs either.

Only New Democrats would cheer when they lose an MP.

People are persuading her to run for mayor of Winnipeg, and if she goes forward with this, she would need lead time to get ready for it. With the volatility around the minority Parliament, she can't plan a mayoral run around that.

Besides, people move on to different things in their life all the time. Why should politicians be any different?

Speaks well of how noble and principled we are, yes?  *big grin*

Good grief, Babble is swarming with Liberal and Conservative spinners these days!  The surest sign that their own polling is showing them we are on the move, if you ask me.

Augustus you are being absurd.

Judy is being principled by steping down, allowing Harper to call a by-election to replace her rather than run for mayor while remaining as an MP.

Everyone knew this was coming, so what is Harper waiting for to call a by-election? Every day that goes by now and no by-election is called, it will be the Conservatives that are depriving those voters of an MP.

Do you also think it's odd that on May 1st the caucus will be one member smaller and people (supposed members of the party) are celebrating?

Now that is spin!

Waiting? Didn't she just announce today?

Exactly.

She officially handed in her resignation today. She was rumoured to be interested in running for mayor of Winnipeg for a couple of months, so it certainly is no surprise in Winnipeg circles.

You and North Report seem to have missed the point.  Politicians should finish the term they are elected to.  They should not leave their seats until the next election.  (unless there is illness or emergency).  There's nothing wrong with moving on to different things, but it should be done after one's term is complete.

Leaving a seat to run for something else is opportunistic.  That's why the voters in Paul Crete's riding last year sent a message they were not happy with him jumping off to run for the PQ only 6 months after getting elected as a BQ MP.  That led to the Conservative victory in the by-election.

Sarah Palin is guilty of doing the same thing, and that is why she will not be President.  She is a quitter.  She left half-way through her term as Governor of Alaska so that she could write books and make a lot of money.

Well....So? Harper should have had his Winnipeg team gear up in advance? I don't get what the issue is. She resigned today. She seat isn't even cold yet.

So Augustus can we expect you to compile a list of Conservative candidates/municipal officials (Mayors, Councillors) to condemn publically.  I can think of at least 3 in southwestern Ontario just off the top of my head.  And none of them seem to plan to even step down from those postions while running for Parliament.

I'll hold my breath waiting 'kay

She announced today she's resigning on May 1, if you want to get picky.

Sorry, I was merely speaking to the fact that this is no surprise to people in Winnipeg, not as to when Harper should call a by-election.

Let the voters decide.  That's how it works - your puritanism aside.

John Baird and Jim Flaherty resigned their seats in the Ontario legislature to run federally in 2006 - i guess Augustus shoudl demand their immediate resignations as well...and btw: Dawn Black resigned to run provincially and the NDP held her seat in a landslide last November - i guess no one there minded at all!

BTW "Red Rover", who exactly is "rejoicing" that Judy W-L is resigning? I don't see anyone popping champagne corks here. People are however looking forward to her being the next mayor of Winnipeg and to the NDP getting a stellar new MP in this supersafe seat. I doubt if there will ever be a byelection in Winnipeg North - we wll have an election first.

Mahmoud: "Good riddance."

Unionist:  "The House of Commons gain will be Winnipeg City Council's loss"

skdadl:  "I'm a dipper, but I'm glad she's going."

At least two of those babblers are clearly not New Democrats so you are clearly just making things up, or woefully ignorant.

Descending like a dark cloud to "out" some babblers and insult others...

Either you are a toad or a bullfrog.

Unionist, you were called a loyal NDP partisan.  Bet you had a good chuckle over that one, eh!

What's your problem? Stalling for time while trying to figure out how to defend Judy? Haw haw haw haw. Chuckle chuckle.

I vote NDP, I worked for them in the last general and byelection in my riding, and I spent much of my youth in the NDY and trying to keep the NDP honest and principled. Now, I no longer drool and slaver when the word "NDP" is mentioned, and I maintain my independence, basing my vote and my words on positions rather than petty partisan considerations. Thus, when Jack Layton does praiseworthy things - as he has done time and time again - I praise him. When he whips his caucus to support Harper's omnibus crime bill and disciplines Siksay for breaking ranks - or when he unilaterally switches party policy to support the Clarity Act - or when he goes soft on Afghanistan, or supports a useless EI "reform" and then forgets about his own party's EI platform thereafter just to avoid an election - or when he sends champions of Israeli criminals to sit on an extreme right-wing antisemitic CPCCA - I have the freedom to criticize him publicly. Which you don't. You can't. Because ... ummm... because... you happen to agree with every single thing he says and does, even when he's inconsistent? I don't know.

When you ridicule people for not genuflecting before your party, you disclose a side of your nature which is not personal or individual. It is the mischief wrought by a party system where all that matters is winning power - not what you do once there. That's the damage that is done even to otherwise sensitive, intelligent, and progressive people. That's why the coalition of December 2008 was the best hope for Canada - it actually hit the PAUSE button on all this carping and adolescent partisan bullshit - for about 5 seconds - and inspired Canadians that they could achieve something beyond partisanship. Pity it was killed, to the relief of all reluctant participants.

A lot of people who vote for the NDP will be happy when Pat Martin follows Judy out of the House.  Winnipeg used to be a hub of leadership for the left in Canada.  We need it now more than ever.

Actually, I do have criticisms from time to time.  And I direct them where they might have some impact, as in to possibly change the said direction.  I don't share all the same criticisms that you do, though, although in my past I did share some of them.  My views have changed on a number of issues since then.

I'm certainly not asking anyone to genuflect before my party.  But I don't spend all my time over at the Blogging Tories poking sharp sticks in their eyes either.  That's just weird.  Do you drop by someone else's house uninvited and horn in on their conversations to tell them they're full of shit?  I didn't think so.  We recognize this is not an exclusively NDP forum, but it is well-known as a progressive one.  There's only one motivation I can think of for folks who don't share that persuasion to drop by and try to stir things up.

ETA: Again, I'm too slow on the posting. This was a reply to Unionist.

Sure Pat isn't going to run for leader after Jack gives it up?

I'll be happy when "the House" is given a good cleaning from stern to stem. After 140 years of the same-old same-old, there's bound to be a bit of mildew, some dust bunnies, and even slime mold growing in places where it should not.

WInnipeg has a lot of major issues to deal with. As mayor of Winnipeg, Wasylicia-Leis would have her hands full.

She's represented North Winnipeg, so she's well aware of the hurdles facing Winnipeg. If Winnipeg's going to have a bright future, Winnipeg's social problems like poverty, racism, education, housing, community deelopment, mass transit, etc... will have to be dealt with.

I can't think of a better person to be Winnipeg's mayor then JWL.

So, how has the north end fared under her stewardship over the last 13 years? Lots of new industry, jobs, community development, affordable public housing, justice and peace for FN residents and others, hope and future for the youth?

Good argument there, JKR.

Are you suggesting that an opposition individual MP is supposed to single-handedly end all unemployment, and all equity issue sinvolving first nations, make all housing affordable, give all youth a "future"?? That would be a lot to expect even of a mayor - but at least a mayor has some executive powers and spending authority. Individual MPs have none whatsoever.

LOL! I am absolutely NOT suggesting that an opposition MP (or even a government MP) could do any of that! I was merely ridiculing, mercilessly, JKR's "argument" that Judy's 13-year tenure as a north-end MP gave her the slightest qualification whatsoever to be able to tackle those same problems as mayor. That's why I said "good argument there, JKR". I would have far more confidence in a well-meaning stranger, quite frankly.

Are we going to get into this old "anyone who is critical of the NDP from the left is a Liberal secret agent" garbage again?

The people I think are Liberal "secret agents" are not the people who are critical of the NDP from the left - it's the "concern trolls" who express all these crocodile tears about how the NDP can never make progress as long as people like Libby Davies are allowed to have any public profile whatsoever or who do these Chicken Little "we're gonna die, we're all gonna die" routines over and over again.

I don't really concern myself with people who criticize the NDP from the far left. Why bother, we are talking about maybe 20 people in all of Canada - half of whom post regularly on babble - making it look to us like they actually represent anyone. Who cares if a few people still believe in Trostkyism or Stalinism or whatever other outmoded form of socialism there is that has been dead for the last 50 years. Instead of yammering on about the NDP not being "pure" enough - why don't you run in Winnipeg North for the Communist Party - let's see how many votes you get. That will show us what percentage of the people want something to the left pof the NDP.

Not "all youth". Just their own kin. Unless your memory is short or selective, Stockholm, you must have read at that time of the Rae administration when Ministers were swapping daughters and sons and hiring them as Ministerial aides.

Fellow Babbler Fidel is always -rightly- dismissive of the Cons and Fiberals as the "two old line indiscernable parties". As far as I am concerned there are three "old line indiscernable parties". You got my point!  

If any difference, Harper would have never sent New Democrat Gary Doer as our ambassador to... the USA.

Unionist @ 44, that was superb. Every word: word.

oo, this really shocked me. To read this on babble really shocked me.

I agree with you, to begin with, that people who waste time poking at the BTs are not only wasting time but are probably writing online out of some unfortunate addiction to conflict.

But how could you segue from that observation to imply that those of us who maintain some semblance of independent critical intelligence, even when we are members of the NDP or work for the party at election time, are just "visitors" on babble, "uninvited" ones at that, horning in on your conversations?

I've been a member of the NDP since either 1964 or 1965 (fuzzy memory of when that happened -- when were you born, btw?). I've been a babbler since a month after start-up in 2001. This board has never, I repeat never, been an NDP mouthpiece, and those of us who are party members have not usually been rude to other leftist activists who come to talk serious politics here. Well, Stockholm is sometimes rude, as he is above, implying that anyone who hasn't sold her mind and soul to the electoral politics of the day must be a Trot or a commie, but we're all used to that from Stockholm, aren't we, Stockholm.

Again, oo, I am really shocked by what you wrote there. I would remind you that, on the scale of serious politics, electoral politics of the day and this week's polls rank pretty low, attractive though I know that arguing about them is to certain kinds of wonks, most but not all of whom usually turn out to be youngish males. Lord save us all from model parliaments.

If members of my party turn out to be stupid about basic democratic principle, as some of them inevitably do and will, I will certainly criticize them in order to defend democracy. I haven't sworn any idiot loyalty oath, and I'm offended at the suggestion from another party member that I should have. We're supposed to be progressives, not robots. And the most important thing we can do, since we are unlikely to form a government any time soon, is to keep educating other citizens about what real democracy should mean. We can't do that by mindlessly defending MPs who are 'way out of line just because they're ours.

Not that I think it will ever happen, but if Pat Martin became leader, I'd quit the party.

At least two ARE NDP members. Though very critical of the NDP, I have been (still am) a member since 1987.

And apparently I am an uncritical cheerleader for the NDP. I might be a lot more critical of their record after they've governed federally for the first time.

Sorry to shock you skdadl. I was referring very specifically to RedRover and Augustus. I thought that was clear but apparently not.

I do recognize that electoral politics and polls are hardly the be-all-and-end-all of politics writ large. At my age (born before you joined the party it appears), I do recognize the importance of getting good people elected though. And I hate it when people push conflict for its own sake, especially on incendiary issues, as does happen here on the middle east question and a few other hot button issues which I therefore now avoid completely on Babble.

However there are clearly one or two agents-provocateur who show up here whenever the NDP shows well in the polls, to try and stir things up for the benefit of the national media, who also pop in here for a quick read at around the same times. I hope that doesn't come as a complete shock to you, skdadl.

Some people on both sides are being unreasonable-- nobody should be expected to either criticize or refrain from criticizing a party.

As long as they are honestly portraying their opinion and not being offensive there should be no problem.

I happen to think that loyalty to a party includes criticism when needed. Others may feel differently -- we all need to respect that.

The one thing I try never to do is attack someone for attacking the NDP (I may attack the merits of the argument) or attack someone for defending it (and again I may attack the merits of the argument).

I have heard arguments in favour of loyalty during an election campaign but even those are issues of personal conscience and priority between the importance of the issue and the party itself.

To clarify further, I mean that there are a couple white-cat/black-cat agents-provocateurs who show up ...

How anyone could jump from that to me being critical of folks on the left (and here I explicitly exclude Liberals) who have sharp things to say about the NDP, I don't know. Passionate critics are always worth engaging in debate and discussion. Not so the others.

OO- I have not heard you ever argue agains the principle of criticicm of the NDP. I certainly was not thinking of you when I wrote that.

Arguing against a specific criticism is a different matter and that should be reasonable as an argument made ought to be open for opposition.

Ok, oo. I understand and probably mostly agree. Shake hands? Group hug? (I've even been known to hug Stockholm on occasion. ;)  )

I hope teh kitteh is well, Fidel.

The Smokester is doing surprisingly well, Skdadl. I don't understand it. I'll enjoy his company in the mean time. His breath is terrible though, and the vet doesn't want to knock him out to clean his teeth because he's so fragile.

The vet is right, Fidel. Eschew anaesthetic for the oldsters.

Teeth don't matter. If they rot enough, they just fall out -- I've seen that happen, and it's not serious. Cats with no teeth can still eat happily -- in fact, they're happier. I would never put a cat under for dentistry again -- it's just too dangerous. Best wishes to you and Smokey (sp?).

Group grope/hug sounds good to me.

Just to prove it, I'm going to say one mildly critical thing about the NDP, which actually does hurt me to say, but it has to be done.

Why haven't they scouted a woman to run to replace Judy? Who was the original federal party women's organizer? I see that the preferred candidate is Kevin Chief, and he appears to have a wonderful record in that community, and of course I also want to see aboriginal candidates running, but why must those two kinds of imperatives always seem to clash?

(As you might guess, I supported Hillary too, and wasn't it wonderful hearing her give a no-pussy-footing full explanation of the importance of contraception and abortion here last month!)

Not that the Libs or Greens have put up a woman candidate there either, but seats with retiring women incumbents should get double-attention on that score from us, don't you think? They better be running and financing a lot of fantastic women in strong seats to make up for this !!!

(See, I can be critical.)

I agree that its a shame to have a second time where a woman would be substituted by a man - but having a high profile First nation candidate is also a very high priority and there are already quite a few woman in the NDP caucus - but zero First Nations.

OO, would you care to make a short list of ridings that are obvious NDP targets in the next election where we have women running?

I think we do need to focus on the big picture-- Women are not a minority group and it should not be that hard to balance but this remains a major problem for most parties. I agree First Nations candidates are very important. However, there ought to be a recognition that there needs to be a replacement who is a woman -- this means in a highly winnable riding not a throw away candidate to hold the banner.

Stockholm, it's not a pretty picture.

NL - only target seat so far I know of (the other St. John's seat) has its 2008 (male) candidate renominated
NS - 2008 male vismin candidate and former MP renominated in South Shore-St. Margs; new male candidate in Hfx West; likely male candidate in Dartmouth; I guess we could hope for Alexis MacDonald or Louise Lorefice again in Central Nova; who knows about Sydney-Vic

QC - Gatineau will renominate its 2008 female candidate; who knows about Westmount VM, but it would be great if Anne Lagace-Dowson would go again; most others I know about so far are men, but there is a great woman in I-forget-which north shore riding who is a local municipal councillor and disabled activist

ON - Peggy Nash in Parkdale HP; a man in Beaches EY (who beat a woman for the nomination), plus men in Davenport, York SW, and York West. No-one yet in Etobicoke North or Scarborough SW; men in Oshawa, Brant, Elgin-Middlesex, Essex, woman in Sarnia! (first nations woman, too!), another first nations woman -- the 2008 candidate -- again in Kenora

MB - Wpg North to have an aboriginal candidate; not sure where else is targetted
SK - Nettie Wiebe again in Sktoon RB + another woman in Sktoon-Humboldt; aboriginal candidate in DMCR; young male lawyer in Palliser

AB - 2008 (male) candidate again in Edmonton East, aboriginal male candidate in Edm Centre

BC - 2006/08 candidate renominated in Kamloops, declared woman nomination candidate for Kootenay-Columbia, vismin male candidate in Surrey North, apparently identified but unnamed candidate in Pitt Meadows, no-one I know of in Fleetwood-Port Kells (ETA: I missed our vismin male 2008 candidate was renominated), no-one named but available for 2008 male candidate in Van Cntr, no-one in Esquimalt, first nations woman in Saanich-Gulf Islands, 2008 female candidate in Nanaimo-Alberni, former female MP in Van Isle North

North - no names yet in Yukon or Nunavut

Like I said, not a great record to date in recruiting women.  Now the right candidates could make other seats targetable down east, for example, or in Ontario.  And when you look at the number of top quality aboriginal candidates the party has attracted (and the Liberals haven't), now that I count them up it's quite impressive.  There are also a number of very enthusiastic young candidates in the Toronto burbs from a variety of backgrounds, some of whom are women.

And overall, the calibre of those candidates is really top-notch.  It's just that there are only 9-10 women listed.  We really need to do a LOT better.

Whaddya mean, "young male lawyer in Palliser"? That's our Noah! Noah is one of the original babblers. Y'all go out and vote for him. He can win, and it would be wonderful to have him in Parliament. (And this is a feminist of the female persuasion writing this.)

OK, "bright, exciting young male lawyer in Palliser"!  Like I said, a lot of very strong candidates.  Just not enough women amongst them yet.

Describing people as "underprivileged" (see his site, linked above) doesn't sit well with me  It's hard to believe that anyone with a well thought out "left wing" political stance would use such a term.

What do you find untoward about that word, RosaL?  Would there be a better one you could suggest?

He's certainly mastered the art of political speech-making. Perhaps a speech isn't the place for substantive analysis or proposals.

Thank you for highlighting why running things out of Ottawa is so insidious.  The inner city riding Judy has represented needs an aboriginal MP and Kevin seems to a great choice.  There are serious problems in all our western cities with aboriginal youth and our racist society.  If you are saying they should have found an aboriginal woman to also run for the nomination then great but the last thing we need is a white woman social worker.  (I figure if people can complain about lawyers I can complain about social workers)

Here is a little bio of Kevin Chief taken from the Premiers Awards page.  Since I didn't know who he was I had to google him.

http://www.uwinnipeg.ca/index/uw-news-action/story.103/title.uwinnipeg-s... [78]

___________________________________________

Soothsayers had a better record of prediction than economists

Why would you assume I'd take that view, kropotkin?

I'll have you know that I've worked three campaigns in and around that area, and am as aware of the challenges as any outsider could be.  Is it so necessary to be insulting?

I didn't even say that the solution was to change course in that particular riding.  But it's not a pattern I want to see repeated, and certainly one that must be addressed lickety-split.

(see what I get for saying something thoughtfully critical, skdadl?)

Perhaps it sounded condescending?

Although I'm not involved in Etobicoke North any more, I would fall off my chair if anyone except Ali Naqvi got the nomination. We got our rebate back for the first time in a long time in 2008, and he is an established name in the area. Whereas with anyone else, there would have to be a HUGE effort to get anyone else known, never mind close to 15%. And given the paucity of funds and a fairly quiet riding association, I would need a lot of convincing that someone else could do better. Our target there is to get 20% or more next time around, and put it on the radar of the feds that this is somewhere that will reward hard work.

Mehdi Mollahasani was nominated in Willowdale, and Kurtis Baily was nominated in York Centre. That's two minority candidates for certain in Toronto proper, and another probable in Etobicoke North. And that's only off the top of my head. All of them passionate, intelligent and charismatic. Could and should be doing better, but we shouldn't be flagellating ourselves here.

OO, I quite agree. Not enough women. I would point out, however, there are many more women candidates in winnable ridings than LGBT candidates (I can't think of ANY LGBT candidates, come to that). And as Ontario rep to the federal LGBT caucus, I'm looking for LGBT candidates to be more than just progressive cannon fodder.

.

I've reread my post I don't believe I ascribed any view to you.  Whatever?

Well that's how I took this part ...

Judy was one of the first, if not THE first, women's organizer for the federal party.  I'm just saying that on two occasions now where women incumbents stepped down in VERY winnable seats, we're falling backwards on that particular measure.

Aside from Judy's sex, is anyone concerned about the fact that she is a champion of Israel, voluntarily sitting on the CPCCA, whose mission is to criminalize criticism of Israel?

Do you really think there are no capable women out there with some progressive conscience?

I guess after I saw the quality of the candidate I thought that your comment was inappropriate. What you are saying is that someone was asleep at the wheel to allow this man to claim a woman's seat.  No matter that the man looks like the type of aboriginal leader that out country badly needs. Young articulate and from the inner city.  He is my ideal candidate unless of course you could find a aboriginal woman with a community background in which case your comment would have some meaning.  The idea that an aboriginal community leader being the candidate to replace Judy is your only problem with the NDP did tend to strike me as very elitist. 

Well then, you're putting words into my mouth.  Because I'm delighted that the party is finding so many wonderful aboriginal candidates who would like to run for us, and not just in Winnipeg North.

But, for the love of mike, must women's representation always go to the back of the bus?  If you go one riding at a time, you can talk yourself into having no women candidates pretty soon.  My point is that the party (in Ottawa or Winnipeg, or preferably both) needs to have a better proactive overall plan to keep our numbers of women candidates up in winnable ridings.

In BC, they had a policy that they would ONLY run women in the seats of retiring incumbents.  I wouldn't go that far, but if we don't pull up our socks soon, we'll be running fewer women than the Liberals and Greens.  And this old feminist social democrat still cares about that.

While I'm at it, I've had it up to the teeth with all-male, all-white, all-english political panels on the major political shows, especially when only two parties are represented and it winds up being a you-know-what swinging contest.  No wonder women don't want to run.

If women are sent to the back of the bus, then LGBT candidates are hanging on from the rear licence plate.

Well, then, the party's LGBT committee better get recruiting too.

The Ontario rep to the federal LGBT caucus (i.e. me) is getting on that.

Well, not so much anymore.  She's toast after all.  My concern would be that the NDP will send in a replacement.

Good to hear.  We'll look forward to seeing the results.

As will I, OO, as will I.

By that criteria kropotkin, one could say your lack of sensitivity to a woman's comment about women being under-represented as a political force, is sexist.

Is that how you want to appear?

Welcome back, remind.

No kidding, women are over 50% of the population of Canada! People who are openly LGBT are at most 5%. Right now out of 37 NDP MPs we have two LGBT (Bill Siksay and Libby Davies) that's about what we should have in proportion to population - though more would be a nice bit of gravy.

 OO, thank you.

The majority of political analysts are male, yes.  That is because for many decades most of the people who work for politicians as staffers, advisors and pollsters, have been men.  As more women go into those fields, their numbers will increase.

But it's important not to forget that "Canada's most-watched political panel" on the CBC has Chantal Hebert.  She's not male or English.

I don't know what party is being talked about here, but the above statement is not true for the NDP, and it's largely no longer true for many other parties.  I suppose women don't enter into thing-waving contests, making them apparently less interesting on TV or something, but Don Newman was able to put together perfectly intelligent panels of senior women activists from all parties who had lots of interesting things to say, such as Nancy Branscombe from the Conservatives, Brooke Jeffreys from the Liberals, and ... well there are so many to choose from in the NDP, but to pull a name out of thin air, Joy MacPhail.

ETA:  The problem we're having is getting them from the backrooms to the nomination meetings.

This is like the second-time you've basically said that a woman's place is not in politics.  Which makes me wonder ... WTF are you doing on the Babble boards ????

OK, now I'm no longer responding to you anymore.  Good night.

Lemme see, 308 ridings, 5% of pop (while probably fair to say for out folks, there's plenty more who might be tempted to come out of the closet, but let's take that number for argument's sake), which equals (more or less) 16 out LGBT candidates across the company. With Bill and Libby crossed off the list, we need 14 more. I would want them in winnable ridings, but getting them on the radar would be an excellent first step.

There were several other out LGBT candidates in the last election.

Remind

Your right no need for FN's candidates we just need more women.  Like Helen G. for instance or Bev Oda. 

And by the way this is the political forum and I don't see arguing that this riding needs a FN's person is sexist merely truth.

Kropotkin, love you too, but please do not put words in my mouth, nor OO's.

Neither of us stated anything close to "no need for FN's candidates", and given my positioning in respect to First Nations, it is not possible for you to truthfully mischaracterize what I am about.

Interesting that you indicate examples of women in politics who are poor examples of progressiveness, as if they are somehow different than the many more men who are even worse examples.

What, should we women be shirt rendering because 2 women fail to understand they are not progressive in the human rights department in the least? Would you men be even stating such a thing about men running for office? No, of course you would not, even though there are more men in Ottawa who are not progressive than there are women, so why are you commenting upon 2 examples of women?

What could be sexist, never said it was though in the first place, or now even, was your indicating that a woman was being wrong by being concerned about the lack of women running, or being found to run, and perhaps by trying to state that OO was saying a woman should be running not a FN's person, when indeed she was not.

Just as your statement, about this in response, could be considered to be sexist as well, given you name 2 women, who are not good representatives for women or indeed any humans, and question do we need more of that type, this in the truthfull face of how many men are even worse examples of poor representation. As such, it perhaps seems you are giving men a pass and a continuing leg forward, before you would women, who fail to represent human rights. At the least you are wiilling to judge men less harshly, by not considering them in the same light as you do women elected officials

The fact is MORE women are needed in politics, period! And this truth has no bearing on whether identifiable minorities need more representation as well.

Her comment was about a specific riding where a very highly qualified FN's person is the front runner.  If you would read what I actually wrote I also said that if she was saying they should have looked harder for a FN's woman that would make sense.  But I still say the gender of a white social worker is irrelevant compared to a FN's activists credentials.  

OO highlighted this riding as her only problem with the NDP.  She explicitly said that she would have preferred that the party had done prep work so this FN's man would not be the front runner. And since they didn't do that then they must atone for the sin of having a FN's male run for office.  

No, she did not, and your quote of hers does not even suggest that even.

What she is indicating is that 2 seats of the NDP, that were held as women reps, have been lost, and that more effort now needs to go into other ridings to get more women represented then elected.

Am not going further with this.

I mean, I'm closing for length.