Clayoquot to be logged?!

Yep. [img]mad.gif" border="0[/img] [img]mad.gif" border="0[/img]

G&M: Envrionmental groups furious, threaten new war in the woods

quote: "This is unbelievable," Adriane Carr, leader of the B.C. Green Party, said yesterday. "To me it's tantamount to a declaration of war. . . . People all over the world believe that the forests in Clayoquot Sound are protected. They will not stand quietly by as chainsaws rip through the heart of Clayoquot Sound."

quote: Tzeporah Berman, program director of enivronmental group ForestEthics, said key wilderness areas in the middle of Clayoquot Sound will be lost.

"I never thought I'd say these words: Clayoquot Sound is going to be logged. The pristine valleys are now open to having roads blasted into them," she said, choking back tears.

She said the decision could trigger blockades. "I hope it's not going to come to that. But this is our worst nightmare."

Thanks for that WCG, if we don't hear from the BC NDP on this in the next forty eight hours our socialist paper will be running with the Green Party statement.

(With apologies to Carole James)

[ 02 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

The campbell government is planning on allowing luxury hotels to build in and then dominate all parks in B.C..

And i am sure that the harpies are already on side with the idea.

Well I am certainly conflicted now. I believe in saving our old growth forests but I also believe in First Nations self government. quote: It is expected that logging in the area would largely be done by Iisaak Forest Resources.

Francis Frank, President of the Nuu-chah-nulth Tribal Council -- which represents 14 tribes on Vancouver Island, including five that are members of the Clayoquot board -- said all logging would have to meet scientific guidelines.

But Mr. Frank agreed the issue could lead to blockades and to divisions within the native community.

"You face the possibility of road action again. . . . That's coming across loud and clear that if Iisaak was to proceed and get into some of these pristine areas that they shouldn't be surprised that the environmentalists are out on the logging roads."

Mr. Frank said that in 1993, aboriginals largely supported the blockades. Would that happen again, even if the loggers were natives this time?

"I'm sure [environmental protesters] would have a level of support within first-nation communities. Now what degree or level, I don't know, but I'm certain there will be some." So does this come under Babble's guidelines against white people telling natives how they should conduct themselves or is the environment an exception to the "rule." Is only Eric the Half Red allowed to comment or can others?

quote:

FNFP @ WFC

From September 21-28, 2003, the international forestry community met in Quйbec City for the XII World Forestry Congress. Over seven days, the Congress unfolded as an open forum in which a variety of discussions focused on individuals, communities and forests under the theme "Forests, Source of Life".

During the Congress, the evening of Wednesday, September 24, 2003, the First Nations Forestry Program and the National Aboriginal Forestry Association (NAFA) hosted Aboriginal Forestry in Canada - Best Practices for an over-capacity crowd of 400 participants. This WFC side event gave congress delegates the opportunity to learn more about Aboriginal forestry practices and experience cultural tradition. A photo album of the Side Event will give you a quick visual tour!

Six speakers offered a variety of perspectives on Aboriginal forestry. Here are brief abstracts of each discussion:

Integrated Resource Management: A Sustainable Managed Forest

Growing Capacity and Value-Added Diversification: An Interim Forestry Operation Plan

A First Nations Strategy for Greater Involvement in the Forest Sector by the Year 2010

Pictou Landing Certified Forest: A Community's Point of Pride

Iisaak Forest Resources Ltd.

Copies of Aboriginal Forestry in Canada - Best Practices Proceedings are available on CD. Send your e-mail requests through the website to info@fnfp.gc.ca.

Presentation Abstracts
Integrated Resource Management: A Sustainable Managed Forest
Steven Ginnish, Forestry Development Officer, Eel Ground First Nation

Eel Ground Forestry located within the Eel Ground First Nation Community has become a model leader of forestry management, which has been accredited for their achievement and excellence through organizations such as FNFP, CIF, NB Conservation council and the Environmental Network of Canada. Eel Ground Forestry Group is responsible for the active management of 6,500 acres of productive forest land, ecological knowledge, medicinal plant protection research, digitization of land mapping and portable sawmill production. Eel Ground Forestry recognizes the importance of continual improvement accredited environmental standards as they move toward a more productive and self-sustaining practice of forest management in the future.

Growing Capacity and Value Added Diversification: An Interim Forestry Operation Plan
George Kemp, President, First Nations Limited Partnership (FNLP)

An interim report outlining the story of First Nation and forestry industry cooperation that has led to the creation of the First Nations Limited Partnership (FNLP). The presentation outlines the vision in the development of territorial lands within the area of the FNLP and the history of the FNLP from 1998 to the present including economic development, capacity building and stewardship initiatives that have been undertaken. The rationale for an interim development project is laid out including a proposed operating plan, corporate governance model and potential next steps and anticipated future benefits.

A First Nations Strategy for Greater Involvement in the Forest Sector by the Year 2010
Gordon Prest, First Nations Coordinator, Faculty of Forestry, University of British Columbia

Until very recent times, BC First Nations have been mainly excluded from meaningful participation within the provincial forest sector. However, with resolution of the aboriginal land question through modern treaties and other forms of agreements, First Nations will be assuming greater ownership over portions of their traditional territories and become much more involved in the forest sector at all levels. Currently, with only 12 RPFs and an estimated 300 forest technologists of aboriginal ancestry, there is an obvious need to increase these numbers to meet the challenges to be faced as we move towards the post-treaty era of the 21st century. It is timely to start developing strategies to form collaborative agreements with various partners to increase First Nations participation in the forest sector. Prest's presentation outlines a collective vision to train, educate and employ the target numbers of First Nations in the forest sector.

Pictou Landing Certified Forest: A Community's Point of Pride
Dan MacDonald, Settlement Administrator, Pictou Landing First Nation

The community of Pictou Landing is a Mi'kmaq First Nations community is located in northeastern Nova Scotia near the towns of New Glasgow and Pictou. In the 1980s members of the Band began to take more interest in their woodlands, making a commitment to manage them a sustainable way, using traditional values when making decisions regarding their woodlands. At the same time, interest in certification through the Forest Stewardship Council (FSC) was growing. After an initial assessment the gap between how the Band was managing the forest resource and FSC criteria was not that great. After modifications and a final assessment, certification was granted in March 2000. At the time it was the only native reserve land in Canada to hold certification. Through settlement of disputes with government and industry, the Band's forested lands continued to expand. A new management plan was completed based on past practices and certification was gained for these new lands as well. MacDonald will summarize the lessons learned from the Pictou Landing experience.

Iisaak Forest Resources Ltd.
Cindy Hazenboom, Communications and Special Projects Forester and Matthew Lucas, Director, Iisaak Forest Resources Ltd.

Iisaak, a joint-venture company led by five First Nations communities (51%) and Weyerhaeuser Company (49%), is charting a new course in the development and application of conservation-based forestry. Iisaak defines conservation-based forestry as practices and operations designed to achieve conservation as a primary management objective. In the language of the Nuu-chah-nulth First Nations, iisaak (pronounced "E-sock") means respect. The company operates on the principle of Hishuk-ish ts'awalk, the Nuu-chah-nulth belief of respecting the limits of what is extracted and the interconnectedness of all things. The guiding principles of respect and interconnectedness provide the foundation for socially equitable, economically viable, ecologically sensitive and culturally relevant resource management on Iisaak's forest lands. The company's innovative approach to resource management has been recognized internationally. Iisaak's market focus is to maximize the value of timber harvested rather than the volume. The company anticipates earning a greater return for its forest products in recognition of their high standards and increased resource protection. In addition, Iisaak expects that minimizing the impact of harvesting timber will provide additional economic opportunities for new markets in botanical forest products, under-valued species, eco-tourism, recreation, carbon and biodiversity.

web page [6]

There are many logging options other than clearcutting.

Single tree select cutting is accomplished by various logging methods and targets high value trees.The problem is that it is expensive to accomplish but if the value is high enough,it is profitable.

Just because Iisaak is the prime logging contractor does not mean that natives will be doing any or all the work.

Geez, I'm hurt, I didn't realise I was soo scarey... I really only tried to help these discussions back onto the issues I thought leftwingers would be most concerned, which is the many many problems that aboriginal people the world over have to deal with now, but maybe I was being a bit naive or worse. If it helps these discussions along I can tell you that Erik the Half Red won't be here much longer and yeah, I'm a little conflicted about this myself.

IMO (which others are perfectly free to disagree with here) some activists take too much of a puritan "noble savage" view of FNs and seem to expect them to suffer quietly in hopeless poverty. OTOH (and according to some FN contributers I've seen) some native leaders mostly just seem interested in economic development now, regardless of potential future costs to their own autonomy, culture, environment or health. Where the balance between two valid interests are is a question I guess everyone involved will have to consider carefully, hopefully within the context of each situation, but IMO Again the final decision should remain up to the FN involved themselves. Perhaps we should learn to trust their collective judgement a bit more -if indeed that is what this decision actually represents.

(On our little island the local band faced some resistence when they announced their intention to do some selective logging here to generate some needed income. Turned out they did such a good job of it that it was almost invisible from the outside and they won a conservaTION award for it. Ironically a white neighbour who raised some of the most noise over it promptly began a near clearcut on his large property and then left the island. Didn't receive as much local comment but wasn't able to sell any of the land for further home development either. Maybe there's a lesson here somewhere)

Re Clayoquot Sound I guess I'll have to see what this particular deal involves first, before casting any stones. The previous compromise by the BC NDP allowed for some limited mostly selective logging as well as preservation areas so I'm curious now to see what or who exactly is motivating this latest turn of events. If anyone else has anymore information or angles on it then I'd be interested in seeing it. That's all from Erik the Terrible here.

[ 03 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

quote:Originally posted by EriKtheHalfaRed:
...

IMO (which others are perfectly free to disagree with here) some activists take too much of a puritan "noble savage" view of FNs and seem to expect them to suffer quietly in hopeless poverty. OTOH (and according to some FN contributers I've seen) some native leaders mostly just seem interested in economic development now, regardless of potential future costs to their own autonomy, culture, environment or health. Where the balance between two valid interests are is a question I guess everyone involved will have to consider carefully, hopefully within the context of each situation, but IMO Again the final decision should remain up to the FN involved themselves. Perhaps we should learn to trust their collective judgement a bit more -if indeed that is what this decision actually represents.

...

Re Clayoquot Sound I guess I'll have to see what this particular deal involves first, before casting any stones. The previous compromise by the BC NDP allowed for some limited mostly selective logging as well as preservation areas so I'm curious now to see what or who exactly is motivating this latest turn of events. If anyone else has anymore information or angles on it then I'd be interested in seeing it. That's all from Erik the Terrible here.

[ 03 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]I am sorry if something I posted offended you. I did not understand your previous post and it seemed to me to be demanding a condemnation of the logging by the NDP.

I share your view that we need to wait and see what the actual plans eventually look like. It is a dilema for many of us. I understand the need for economic development and I sincerely hope that the First Nations involved come up with a plan that is sustainable and uses the best logging practices. I can't imagine them just clear cutting their ancestral homeland so I am hopeful. I was also concerned about some environmentalists who have a knee jerk reaction to any logging and a belief that their views should supercede the views of others.

No biggie Kropotkin, I'm not easily offended and I know you're a genuine leftist. I just didn't understand why my name came up as trying to block others from taking part. I usually only get irritated at those who are just trying to undermine a topic, pretending to be something they're not, or generally acting like an arrogant rightwing mudslinger. Standard Babble trolls IOW. [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img] I should have been more balanced in my intial reaction though.

[ 04 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

Let's not forget that the arrival of man into North America was followed by a massive extinction of animals hunted to extinction and that many first nations cultures like the Mayans were wiped out after they ruined their environment.

Like That for example. [img]rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] Little known fact about many Native cultures, is that they have ancient myths and stories about their once misusing mother nature for selfish arrogant ends and suffering as a result of it. One of the more common themes, if memory serves, is about the animal spirits turning against them and plant spirits in the form of medicine coming to their rescue, young hero figures coming back with the necessary prescriptions to regain the balance after the old magician's tricks failed. That's why they consciously taught their young hunters to respect their prey and young farmers to respect the soil, thereafter.

The Mayans and Toltecs were exceptions to the rule, being highly stratified (eventually) warrior societies with high populations, and even They never went Near as far as we have abusing the Earth. Serious droughts due to major volcanic activity thousands of miles away also undermined them. Reliable birth control also hadn't been discovered Anywhere yet, with the possible exception of a couple Amazonian herbs still being studied (quietly) and the myth of self imposed abstinence OC...

ETA: And I find it interesting that there's rarely mention anymore that the end of the Ice-age coincided with the end of mega fauna Everywhere in the world, some of it coming from diminishing habitats and invading species other than man. Native Americans are now more commonly recognised as having entered the New World well Before these catastrophic events. (well before 'Kennewick man' too...) That doesn't mean that every 'Indian' can just be assumed to be a natural environmentalist either, certainly not anymore, that too would be kinda presumptious. Just means that we're not in a strong position to lecture Them about preserving nature.

[ 04 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

Such myths are present in just about every culture (the biblical flood for example).

According to Jared Diamond in Guns Germs and Steel, it was the arrival of homo sapiens that caused the extinction of the most large land mammals in North America. You could say climate change at the End of the Ice Age caused it however you can look on the arrival of homo sapiens as part of climate change.

David Thompson in his journals commented on local game and fish shortages due to overhunting necessitating migration of tribes.

quote:Originally posted by EriKtheHalfaRed:
Like That for example. [img]rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] Little known fact about many Native cultures, is that they have ancient myths and stories about their once misusing mother nature for selfish arrogant ends and suffering as a result of it. One of the more common themes, if memory serves, is about the animal spirits turning against them and plant spirits in the form of medicine coming to their rescue, young hero figures coming back with the necessary prescriptions to regain the balance after the old magician's tricks failed. That's why they consciously taught their young hunters to respect their prey and young farmers to respect the soil, thereafter.

The Mayans and Toltecs were exceptions to the rule, being highly stratified (eventually) warrior societies with high populations, and even They never went Near as far as we have abusing the Earth. Serious droughts due to major volcanic activity thousands of miles away also undermined them. Reliable birth control also hadn't been discovered Anywhere yet, with the possible exception of a couple Amazonian herbs still being studied (quietly) and the myth of self imposed abstinence OC...

ETA: And I find it interesting that there's rarely mention anymore that the end of the Ice-age coincided with the end of mega fauna Everywhere in the world, some of it coming from diminishing habitats and invading species other than man. Native Americans are now more commonly recognised as having entered the New World well Before these catastrophic events. (well before 'Kennewick man' too...) That doesn't mean that every 'Indian' can just be assumed to be a natural environmentalist either, certainly not anymore, that too would be kinda presumptious. Just means that we're not in a strong position to lecture Them about preserving nature.

[ 04 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

The 'Beaver wars' were also caused in part by the search for new hunting grounds to supply a new foreign market in furs. The Algonkian Cree are now seen as having the most sustainable fur trade in the world. They quickly adapted and learned IOW. Most of the recorded population movement during historical times was due to pressure from White settlement (increased warfare) and the accompaning clearance of forests and game. Unlike New World myths the Bible also says 'be fruitful and mutiply' and 'hold dominion over the Earth' which is still interpretted by many true believers as a licence to take what they will. 'God will provide' others are smugly told. When Aboriginal people today see the changes in climate most seem to worry about it and argue that we can still alter course; when fundamentalist Christians see it they celebrate the coming demise of homosexuals, socialists and Muslims. My point is theres no real comparison in either sense, the New World still had a far more diverse and healthy environment after 11 to 25,000 years of Amerindian habitation than it does after a mere 150 to 500 years of Ours. Blame it on high tech if you prefer but the pro-development creed still revolves around Judeo-Christian, Greco-Roman ideals of industry, individual wealth and infinite growth and power. Those are not traditional Native values.

[ 04 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

The decision to open up pristine areas of Clayoquot Sound to logging is outrageous and must be resisted by all who care about the environment.

Clayoquot Sound contains the largest intact forest remaining on Vancouver Island and the Lower Mainland of British Columbia. quote:The heart of Clayoquot's intact forest is composed of a series of undisturbed, or "pristine", valleys. Many of these valleys are unprotected. Large valleys like the Sydney, Pretty Girl, Ursus and the Upper Bulson stand majestically as they have for thousands of years, and are cradled by smaller but equally important stretches of wilderness like Satchie and Hesquiat Lake Creeks. In the ocean channels lie impressive islands carpeted in old-growth forest, like Flores and Meares Islands. Fishermen regularly report seeing cougars, bears, and deer swimming from shore to shore in search of nourishment. Together, these islands and valleys offer native wildlife on Vancouver Island their best chance to survive and thrive for countless generations to come. Yet logging continually diminishes Clayoquot's intact forest, threatening its capacity to sustain wildlife.... Friends of Clayoquot SoundOne of the eight major watersheds that the Clayoquot Sound Central Region Board agreed last week to open up to logging is the Ursus River Valley, one of the largest unprotected watersheds in the Clayoquot Sound Biosphere Reserve. Spanning 7380 hectares, this lush valley was awarded "eehmiis" status by Iisaak Forest Resources and the Central Region First Nations in 1999. An eehmiis area is considered to be "very, very precious" to the native people of Clayoquot Sound and is supposedly off-limits to logging.

Contemporary reports of environmentalists from 1999 confirm that it was the clear intent of the Memorandum of Understanding that no pristine areas, such as the Ursus Valley, would be opened up to logging: quote:Our Iisaak-enviro MOU [Memorandum of Understanding] was supported by the Nuu-chah-nulth Central Region Chiefs in January 1999 and finally signed at a public ceremony in Tofino on June 16, 1999. It was a very happy day! The MOU confirms Iisaak's commitment to reserve eehmiis (undeveloped) areas for non-timber uses and to log according to the highest eco-forestry standards only in the parts of Clayoquot Sound that had already been partially logged. [my emphasis] Western Canada Wilderness Committee [15] quote:"The problem is that the forest lobby is stronger and more well-established than the tourism lobby and the government has not put in place laws halting the logging of old growth in BC," said [B.C. Green Party leader Adriane] Carr. "I cannot imagine that the BC government wants Clayoquot to revert back to conflict. Nor can I imagine who would want to see precious places like the Sydney, Ursus or Clayoquot logged. It makes absolutely no long term business sense."

"Preserving old growth as an economic growth strategy is even more intelligent today given the steady increase in high-value ecotourism and the flood of cheap lumber which is making traditional forestry risky. With over 75 percent of the old growth forests on Vancouver Island now logged, Clayoquot's eehmiis areas are even more precious than they were in the 1990s," explains Carr.

"These new plans break the promise that brought an end to the conflict in Clayoquot and they allow logging in the unspoiled valleys that the world was told were safe from destruction," says Carr. BC Green Party [16] quote:"Clayoquot Sound's pristine valleys should be saved forever, but these new plans undermine years of protests, good faith negotiations and the will of the international community," said Stephanie Goodwin, Greenpeace forest campaigner. "Any long-term solution for Clayoquot Sound must incorporate the protection of these valleys."

World-renowned scientists including Dr. Jane Goodall and Dr. E.O. Wilson as well as several members of the blue ribbon Clayoquot Sound Science Panel, from which the Plans originated, have said the pristine valleys should not be logged. The International Union for the Conservation of Nature also recommended that the pristine valleys be protected.

"Recent satellite photo analysis shows that 89% of the productive, valley-bottom ancient forests on Vancouver Island have already been logged. This Island-wide context must factor into any scientific assessment on whether it is acceptable to allow logging in the pristine valleys of Clayoquot Sound. Clearly, this wasn't done in devising the new watershed plans," states Ken Wu of the Western Canada Wilderness Committee. ForestEthics [17]

[ 04 August 2006: Message edited by: M. Spector ]

quote:Iisaak, a joint-venture company led by five First Nations communities (51%) and Weyerhaeuser Company (49%) Any company that has the U.S. corporation Weyerhaeuser as its controlling shareholder is unlikely to respect native values. No company with non-native shareholders should be allowed to touch these sacred lands after all the decades of dispute.

This is a farce.

I don't think a company with 100% native shareholders should be allowed to log in the pristine valleys of Clayoquot Sound. This is not a race issue.

I agree, this is not a race issue. The issue is that a rapacious multinational is gaining access to lands that it has coveted for decades by co-opting native rights and government land settlements. And it is a farce.

Lol, why I Love Babble, no matter How carefully I put things someone will always come up behind me and disagree again. I will longer feel guilty about my long winded pedantic writing style. Yes, I'm inclined to agree as well, I'm just saying now that these 'race' issues are going to come up, whether the left wants them to or not, as the previous posters put so well. It's also a 'sovereignty' issue, but most won't be so careful about their approach, some will happily turn this into another wedge issue.

The next thing to look at, for me, is whether the actual tracts being slated for logging is recognised Nuchalnuth land now or just a generic 'claim', if still a generic claim under the prior agreement then that Might be used as counter leverage. Then, how these 'sacred' vallies are going to be logged, selectively with real care or clearcut with cosmetic touches. Maybe some caring soul could also investigate if this is really a good deal for the local bands, and/or whether the chiefs really know what they *may* be getting into, and/or whether the decision really reflects the majority of members wishes. Either way it looks like the Greens have finally found an enviro issue they can really attack under this government.

Found some factoids online that help outline the complexity of it a bit, I boldfaced some interesting bits that could be useful leads for anyone wanting to look into this further. Maybe a couple more interesting links later.

http://staging3.onenw.org/DogwoodInitiative/bulletins/clayoquot_-_one_step_forward _two_steps [23]

1. On the one hand, International Forest Products (Interfor) announced that it will not log in two pristine watersheds for the next five years;

2. On the other hand, the Ministry of Forests reduced the annual logging quota (AAC) of Iisaak, the Nuu-chah-nulth joint venture with Weyerhaeuser that is implementing sustainable logging practices certified by the internationally recognized Forest Stewardship Council (FSC); and *** (!!!)

3. The provincial Crown's just approved the privatization of 173,641 acres of forestland previously included in Weyerhaeuser's tree farm licence 44. This was done without any consultation with the Nuu-cha-nulth. This privatization will impact on the region's forests as provincial forest laws will cease to apply, raw logs from these lands will ultimately be available for export, and lands may be subdivided and converted to other recreational or residential uses.

http://staging3.onenw.org/DogwoodInitiative/newsstories/clayoquotopenedtologging [24]

Mr. Lornie said the board is seeking a balance between economic activity and environmental protection. "You really have to factor in the interests of first nations here. . . . At some point down the road they are going to want to put treaties in place and they are going to want to have some form of an economy, whatever the scale of it is, to support their people," said.
It is expected that logging in the area would largely be done by Iisaak Forest Resources.
Francis Frank, President of the Nuu-chah-nulth Tribal Council -- which represents 14 tribes on Vancouver Island, including five that are members of the Clayoquot board -- said all logging would have to meet scientific guidelines. {1}*
But Mr. Frank agreed the issue could lead to blockades and to divisions within the native community.
"You face the possibility of road action again. . . . That's coming across loud and clear that if Iisaak was to proceed and get into some of these pristine areas that they shouldn't be surprised that the environmentalists are out on the logging roads."
Mr. Frank said that in 1993, aboriginals largely supported the blockades. Would that happen again, even if the loggers were natives this time?
"I'm sure [environmental protesters] would have a level of support within first-nation communities. Now what degree or level, I don't know, but I'm certain there will be some."

http://www.forestethics.org/article.php?id=1539 [25]

The new plan will permit anywhere from 20 per cent to 60 per cent of each {2}* of the eight planning units to be logged under eco-standards established by a scientific panel on sustainable forest practices.
……………………………….......

The watersheds have been under a voluntary moratorium since the mid-1990s so land-use planning in Clayoquot Sound on a watershed-by-watershed basis could be completed. Environmental groups, who fought a bitter war with logging companies in the 1990s to save the sound from logging, say they expected the moratorium would be maintained in regions they describe as pristine but outside existing parks.
……………………………….......

But Agriculture and Lands Minister Pat Bell said he believes very little logging will take place because of the high standards set by the regional board. He described the plans as the framework that establishes conditions under which logging can take place.
"The standards are certainly the highest in British Columbia."
He said so far, no logging has taken place in the other three watersheds in the region where planning has been completed since 2003.
"We believe it is appropriate to respect the decisions of the Nuu-cha-nulth," {3}* he said, referring to the first nations on Vancouver Island's west coast. The five Clayoquot Sound tribes are members of the Nuu-cha-nulth Tribal Council.
He said so far, no logging has taken place in the other three watersheds in the region where planning has been completed since 2003.
Francis Frank, president of the Nuu-cha-nulth Tribal Council, said he is concerned about the decision to allow logging {1}* and is attempting to set up a meeting between Clayoquot first nations and environmental groups to determine what exactly has been decided.
"That's one of the underlying concerns," he said. "How much logging will take place and what methods of logging will be used."
………………………………......

The plans will protect 40 per cent of the old-growth forests in each planning unit {2}* and once existing parks are taken into account, ensure that 61 per cent of the sound is protected.

http://www.iisaak.com/historicagreements.html [26]

Agreement With Environmental Groups
On June 16, 1999, a Memorandum of Understanding was signed between Iisaak Forest Resources Limited and the following environmental groups:
Greenpeace Canada
Greenpeace International
Natural Resources Defense Council
Sierra Club of BC
Western Canada Wilderness Committee
Environment Groups committed to:
Supporting Iisaak’s operations.
Actively engaging in promoting markets for products produced by Iisaak.
Developing ongoing mechanisms for sustaining cooperation.
Iisaak committed to:
Respecting the role of First Nations in resource management activities.
Achieving certification under the Forest Stewardship Council.
Managing eehmiis, Nuu-chah-nulth for "precious", areas emphasizing non-timber values.
Developing ongoing mechanisms for sustaining cooperation.

Agreement With Displaced Forest Workers
In September 1999, a Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) was signed by Iisaak and displaced forest workers of the Clayoquot South Community (or ‘the South End’). This agreement led to the establishment of an employment protocol wherein Iisaak agreed to provide opportunities to local contractors and individuals as much as possible, taking into consideration performance standards and cost.
Based on the company’s operating requirements Iisaak will hire: First Nations contractors who are owned by the Central Region First Nations or partnered with a local contractor, qualified South End residents with special consideration for displaced Kennedy Lake employees, and qualified persons within the local area. Over time, Iisaak will expand its business to create additional local employment opportunities.

http://www.gov.bc.ca/bcgov/content/docs/@2SOJ7_0YQtuW/clayoquot_sound.pdf [27]

Clayoquot Sound Interim Measures Extension Agreement (PDF)

http://www.physorg.com/news73995887.html [28]

The dispute pits aboriginal people against environmentalists, warned Paul Watson of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society in a statement Thursday.

"The Nuu-chah-nulth are demonstrating that they are no different than the white loggers. {3}* A chainsaw is a chainsaw no matter whose hand is on the throttle," said Watson, a controversial international activist.

[ 07 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

Logging FN AAC is frequently subbed out to large logging contractors for a set price per cubic meter.

Logging on the West Coast is accomplished with very large,specialised,expensive equipment.It is not a business one just jumps into.

Strategic partnerships with forest multinationals and partnerships with large logging contractors speaks of using Iisaak as a front to deflect criticism whereas a non-intrusive select logging plan could be accomplished by Iisaak in a sustainable method.

As a person who helped build the Carmanah Trail way back in the old days of protests and arrests, this news is particularily galling. I guess the old adage of 'if you can't beat em, join em' is now being employed by the oppressors to wipe out one of the few remaining old growth areas left in the world.

sad and incredibly short sighted...but I am half way through reading The Golden Spruce and the words about the otters are still fresh in my mind.

quote:Originally posted by jester:
Logging FN AAC is frequently subbed out to large logging contractors for a set price per cubic meter.

Logging on the West Coast is accomplished with very large,specialised,expensive equipment.It is not a business one just jumps into.

Strategic partnerships with forest multinationals and partnerships with large logging contractors speaks of using Iisaak as a front to deflect criticism whereas a non-intrusive select logging plan could be accomplished by Iisaak in a sustainable method.

That's an another angle to look into, which other companies may be behind it (one good possibility is Interfor) but from what I've seen online most of the cutting Is going to be done by Iisaak using selective means.

Since the prior agreement looks to me more open than either side seems to be admitting so far, another question I'd like to see answered is what the status of the central blocks slated to be logged are, as well as how important they are to the viability of the forests on either side -bears and other large species need it as a corridor, salmon need it to protect nearby spawning grounds?

Those are the kind of things I'd like to see looked at again, as not sure if the board members overseeing it would still be as ecologically oriented under this government.

Cynic that I am,the whole select logging scheme will not support the intentions attributed to Iisaak above.

I'm a former stump to dump contractor and a former Interfor contractor.I worked for MB in Kennedy Lake back when spars were wooden and men were steel.

There is no way single tree select can generate the employment indicated above or generate the volume required to attract the interest of a Weyerhauser or Interfor.

quote: August 9, 2006 (Forestweb) — Logging in Vancouver Island's Clayoquot Sound is on the verge of a unique restructuring that would help reassure environmentalists concerned that pristine valleys are being opened up to cutting, The Vancouver Sun reported

The fix is in

quote: Iisaak has seldom been profitable since it was founded in 1999 and has been harvesting higher timber volumes each year in a bid to make money.

No surprise here

quote:Triumph Timber, one of the province's top eco-system-based loggers, is to take over the operational side of Clayoquot logging under the plan.

Triumph Timber is one of the biggest clearcutters on the west coast.

quote: The deal, worked out over the last six months, would mark the first time one of B.C.'s struggling forest companies had been restructured not only for the bottom line but to make it ecologically sustainable as well.

Iisaak can be restructured to be either economically sustainable or ecologically sustainable but not both.

The provincial ministry of forests is geared to reaping revenues through industrial logging.

There is no way that Ecotrust or especially Triumph Timber is investing in Iisaak to improve the biodiversity of the area. They smell profit.

As I speculated above, the bands are walking away from both management and logging and handing everything over to industrial loggers for a set price per meter.

quote: The issue of logging the watersheds is intertwined with Iisaak's profitability. If it cannot make money by logging lower volumes of higher valued timber, then the watersheds offer a ready solution.

Making money by cutting less won't be a problem, said the man who will be charged with doing the actual logging.

"It can be done," said Thomas Olsen, of Triumph Timber, one of the province's top eco-system-based loggers.

Triumph is to take over the operational side of Clayoquot logging under the plan. Triumph pioneered new logging methods on the north coast, where it has developed relationships with first nations based on balancing ecological integrity, social well-being and the economic realities of the business, said Olsen.

He said it would be premature for him to comment on the watersheds until Triumph has a chance to develop short-term and long-term plans.

Thats Olson's story but others have a different perspective on Triumph Timber's committment to ecological integrity or social well being.Triumph's committment to"economic realities of the business" is not in doubt.

forgot link...Forestweb

[ 13 August 2006: Message edited by: jester ]

[ 13 August 2006: Message edited by: jester ]

How about a logging scenario where there are no roads to build(signifigantly cuts down on costs of the roads bridges, enviromental reviews of building those bridges, and setbacks from salmon spawning streams(very sensitve stuff in BC these day). Of course with no roads it makes it difficult for protesters to get in to block fallers from entering the bush as the nearest road maybe 20 km away thru some of the ruggest BC coastal terrain. Most importantly, the media is going to be dragging their feet slugging through the bush to find the logged areas to get out the all important media attention required to garner large support amoung the population. The logging company simply has 5 sites on the g at any given time, and should there be a problem in one site, will abandon that site for a season and chopter in the crew to another site. Welcome to the world fo heli-logging. It is a very profitable form of looging for premium timber(not the crap for the pulp mills. First growth timber fits the bill perfectly. This combined with a program blessing the harvasting practises of this selective logging from FN makes the challenges of enviromental orginizations just that, a major challenge. This warin the woods is going to be a very different affair as the last one in this area and a very expensive one if it is to be won.

Is there to be NO reserves left of the giants that used to dominate this land?

quote:Originally posted by otter:
Is there to be NO reserves left of the giants that used to dominate this land?

Maybe, but we can never give up defending them, because as long as there is profit in cutting them, someone will want to cut them. Designating a Park or protected area only slows them down. Witness the current push the beetle log the parks or the plans to build new lodges. [img]mad.gif" border="0[/img]

quote: Either way it looks like the Greens have finally found an enviro issue they can really attack under this government

Actually, HalfRed, there are and have been legions of enviro issues that this Liberal regime has given opportunity to be attacked on--ones that mainly the NDP has taken on with, as expected, no coverage in the corporate dominated media.

Just a few of these are park privatization, park services and maintenance cuts, pulp mill effluent increase permits, gutting the Forest Practices Code, cancelling and divesting the clean energy and motors project started by the NDP government, expanding coal bed methane extraction without any ecological safeguards, promoting offshore oil drilling, completely butchering long-term sustainable development and transportation plans for the Lower Mainland and pushing for knee-jerk freeways expansion projects with little regard for their effectiveness or their impact on communities. The list goes on.

The ecological atrocities of the BC Liar regime are multitudes. It's the NDP, which has a lot of in-depth policy on these matters, that has addressed them--again with little or no attention.

As for Clayoquot Sound and what's happening there now, it's quite clear the major forest firms and their Liberal puppets have found a new way sell plain old fashioned rape-and-run practices to the public: shadow them behind First Nations development.

I don't totally fault the Nuu-cha-nulth Tribal Council for caving into some of this stuff. That nation is desperate for work opportunities for its members, and this is about all that's likely to come up in the next few years, or at least as long as the Liberals are in power.

None-the-less, from what I can gather about this plan is that it's not really a First Nations development plan since it's clear the Nuu-cha-nulth aren't anywhere near the drivers seat.

It may be true that they have little choice but to partner with forest companies to get the labour, skill and equipment needed, but they clearly would need to be the ones calling the shots--and it's clear they're not.

In addition, when the final decision on Clayoquot Sound was made by the NDP government in 1995, it dictated that the maximum area designated as commercial logging forest was to be 38 per cent, and that it needed to be logged under severely reduced cut block size and minimum road building.

It was determined by scientists at the time that any further expansion of the harvest area would great increase the risk of permanent damage to the temperate eco-system.

If this new plan expands that harvest area, then that's trouble. Add to this, that the BC Liberals changed the FPC to allow for expanded cut block size and further road building. That adds more trouble to the mix.

Also the whole AAC and tenure system has been messed around with to give forest company bosses more exclusive decision-making power over how much to cut and at what pace (market "rationalization" I think they call it).

SO Minister Bell can bloat about the “highest standards in BC” all he wants. The fact is his government has lowered those standards significantly. If scientific research shows that expanding the harvest area in the sound, and lowering the FPC standards, greatly risks damaging the sound permanently, then it shouldn’t happen, period.

quote: Achieving certification under the Forest Stewardship Council.

This is all great in principle. The FSC has very good ethical standards.

[URL=http://www.fsc.org/en/about/policy_standards/princ_criteria/[/URL]

The problem is in the detail and its legal interpretation. It's also a matter of monitoring to see if that's what's actually happening in practice.

The Liberals wiped out the Ministry of Forests field staff in their first term. So who's to know what is or isn't going on out there.

quote: There is no way single tree select can generate the employment indicated above or generate the volume required to attract the interest of a Weyerhauser or Interfor.

I agree with the second thought here, but not the first.

I have read about logging operations in Europe, specifically Scandinavia, that are primarily based on selective harvest and sustained yield methods. Can't remember the link now, but I will try dig it up.

I do remember the stats quoted as getting about 5 full-time equivalent jobs per board foot. That's about 2.5 times better than we get in BC.

And all of these jobs are union, with employee ownership and worker co-ops and other democratic or community based business playing a huge role.

add to this, that the selective harvest methods are complimented by huge value-added provisions and massive investment into reforestation and maintenance.

Obviously, you can't just blindly compare what goes on in Scandinavia to BC, since there are huge biological, climate, market conditions, political status, terrain and other differences to consider.

But there are clearly some similarities where, if we had the democratic forum in which to discuss these, we could look at.

It's true, though--and this related to the above--that there's no way a major multi-national corporation, unless it is under the control of labour or progressive governments (and those are few and far between), would be interested in such practices, especially when compared to what they get away with in other parts of the globe.

Selective harvest and similar sustainable practices are labour intensive and require the re-investment of capital wealth generated back into the industry. That means lower returns for major shareholder cliques and snior executives that control these firms.

quote:Also the whole AAC and tenure system has been messed around with to give forest company bosses more exclusive decision-making power over how much to cut and at what pace (market "rationalization" I think they call it).

A TFL or Forest License holder must have a 5 year cutting plan approved by MOF.

The license holder must be within +/- 5% of their AAC at the end of the 5 year plan.

Great in principle,but the reality is that license holders immediately high grade their cutblocks and then when faced with harvesting the lower grade timber,whine about market conditions in order to squeeze concessions from MOF.

In many instances,unions are handmaidens for industry because the threat of job losses lead the charge for concessions.

quote:I have read about logging operations in Europe, specifically Scandinavia, that are primarily based on selective harvest and sustained yield methods. Can't remember the link now, but I will try dig it up.

quote:Obviously, you can't just blindly compare what goes on in Scandinavia to BC, since there are huge biological, climate, market conditions, political status, terrain and other differences to consider

It is a difficult comparison because the Scandinavians only build infrastructure once and it is depreciated over many harvest rotations.

On BC's west coast,roadbuilding costs can be 1 million per Kilometer and the roads must be deactivated between cuts.

The largest reason for a lack of select cut on the coast is that the mayor corporations control access to timber and they prefer to cut very high value butt logs into dimension lumber rather than maximising value for clear millwork stock or value added products.

BC's timber marketing system must be opened up to reflect the value of these logs rather than allowing industry to waste them.

All the changes into a market based timber pricing system that BC is implementing is merely rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic because the same players control BS's timber supply that controlled it before the reforms.

Hi SA:
Thanks for writing. I agree that selective logging can be profitable IF the focus isn't on shareholders but maintaining local employment over time. Our local band made a cool two million in one season contracting out, without making a mess of it, while the Menominee of Wisconson were considered to be using the most sustainable methods in North America till the government illegally forced them to pay taxes on it -still better than most others.

Jester has raised somemore interesting questions however, I'll defer to his experience in the industry, but it's not clear from that article whether these companies will be as bad as feared. I think the important thing to remember here is that the Liberal government pressured them to increase their annual cuts or face losing their licence. Taking advantage of the band's tax free status maybe part of what these companies are looking at(?)

Another angle I'm concerned about is the prospect of housing being built on the edge of the actual protected areas, the damn Liberals are using the line that 'parks are for people' and the damn media is swallowing it whole. Found a realty section online with Carmaneh holdings on it but no units listed -yet. Hmm.

[ 20 August 2006: Message edited by: EriKtheHalfaRed ]

quote:... but it's not clear from that article whether these companies will be as bad as feared.

I am quite familiar with the modus operandi of the culprits involved.They are there for profit and if sustainability and forest stewardship is a goal,the goal will only be as a smokescreen for the real goal,cut everything they can get their hands on.

quote:

I think the important thing to remember here is that the Liberal government pressured them to increase their annual cuts or face losing their licence. Taking advantage of the band's tax free status maybe part of what that these companies are looking at(?)

Ah yes,the use it or lose it provisions play into industry's hands.The impetus for this provision is to enhance government's revenue flow and has nothing to do with forest stewardship.

Basically, nothing will happen with ANY cutting application unless FN are actively onside.Great idea but it leaves the bands open to being exploited by sophisticated corporations and also the miriad "consultants" who pocket everything that isn't bolted down.

Local Native leaders and their communities have to be on guard not to be used by multinational industries who *may* try to pit them against others, or more accurately, minimum environmental and labour standards, but I'd like to see some actual evidence for this in *this* particular case first. More research needs to be done here IMo, as I'd imagine all established forest companies have been responsible for shoddy practices if they're allowed to get away with it, question here is do the previous agreements still hold legal weight.

quote:Originally posted by EriKtheHalfaRed:
Local Native leaders and their communities have to be on guard not to be used by multinational industries who *may* try to pit them against others, or more accurately, minimum environmental and labour standards, but I'd like to see some actual evidence for this in *this* particular case first. More research needs to be done here IMo, as I'd imagine all established forest companies have been responsible for shoddy practices if they're allowed to get away with it, question here is do the previous agreements still hold legal weight.

Don't expect a government that puts priority on maximising timber revenues to challenge the practices of the industry that provides those revenues.

Also,don't expect the professionals who manage our forests to upset the applecart.

The only method available to protect Clayoquot is for activists to keep the spotlight on the area permanently.

Vigilance is always necessary, but I think we found a few potentially useful leads already.

And they'll ship it back across the border to us as toilet paper and Hallmark greeting cards with the most heartfelt sentiments for our loved ones, too. Canada's one big kleenex for MacBlo, Weyerhauser and friends

Source

See! Elizabeth May is right. Canadians are stupid.