Women as an identifiable group under attack: Part 2

Last night on the CBC news from Vancouver, the coverage of the story, in Calgary, where the husband/father murdered the children, and was trying to murder the wife when the police got there,  had the police noting that domestic violence against both women and children is increasing, and it is the most actioned crime by police across Canada.

It was a relatively quiet day in Tegucigalpa. Terror will do that.

bolding mine

and where is the denunciation by those human rights groups against what is being done to women?

War teaching our Canadian military persons that women and girls are just sex objects.....

The man had a stellar reputation with the forces, working his way up to become an officer and serving “numerous” tours of duty in war zones.

This thread over here indicates another way, or several, that women and our  allies/supporters, are under attack...

The arrest follows a three-month investigation into online offers for young Asian prostitutes

You don't think that it is a little bit over the top to blame the military mentality for this, do you?   What happens when this is a teacher or a nurse or a doctor doing the same thing?

If you did not need to  put in this your story as though it is true:  War teaching our Canadian military persons that women and girls are just sex objects.....    I find it an insult to anyone in the military, past present and future ESPECIALLY the women who serve. 

Some of your posts show a huge lack of empathy, and I do not know if that is passively aggressively intentional or just not communicating clearly.

Blame the military mentality?

I blamed war....

How about you stop putting words in my mouth to attack me?

oh.... and how about researching whom war impacts the greatest.....and just what it does to all involved

Blogger who targets feminists faces charges

I think there is a disconnect between what you think you are saying and what you post.   You cannot defend that statement by attacking me.   I would suggest take a little more care with how you say things rather than find yourself offending everyone just in order to be "right".

Other than that, I shall leave you to your thread.   Just remind you that treating everyone as though they are your personal enemy will not win you any support;  there is a way to compromise, conciliate and communicate that will have the effects you seek.

This rather unfortunate article seems to be confused and missed the point http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/montreal-massacre-death-cult/article1392013/

Rather good counter points to some of what was raised here http://www.progressive-economics.ca/2009/12/08/the-supposed-plight-of-university-men/ [16]

Thanks PSto, Wente is her usual misogynist self.

Copenhagen's social-democrat mayor

ETA: the further tail of this story was that the woman supposedly speaking up for the Danish 10,000+ prostitutes in outrage, actually was entitled to speak for 79.

Wonder how it is nowadays for Canadian women in the military?

Military Abortion Ban: Female Soldiers Not Protected by Constitution They Defend

Quite the enlightening and sickening read, for women in this day and age to have to go through this shit....

h/t BnR

From a now closed thread comes this woman hating link...

http://www.singularity2050.com/2010/01/the-misandry-bubble.html [23]

In fact, it almost, if not actually, reads as a threat against western women...

here is another thread at babble which indicates clearly that women as identifable humans are underattack...both the thread and the news item are great examples.

I'm normally not a fan of incarceration but remind makes a great point about women being under attack.  We treat crimes against women less seriously than property crimes.  Shame on me and all of us.

Well if men cannot refrain from being physically violent, from rape and from sexual assault - incarceration is necessary. The rich and well-connected asshat referenced in the thread remind linked to should have gotten a jail term. Perhaps he would think twice next time he feels he has ownership of other girls' and women's bodies.

Now we have a highly-publicized story where men receive the lessen that just saying your sorry is enough (fat chance he is actually sorry as well - I bet his real thoughts are appreciation for his lawyer and judge).

Not only that, the young girl is now burdened for the rest of her life with the societal belief, for sure in Saskatchewan, at the very least,  that this "poor crying"  man was publically harmed by her reporting of him....

If he keeps his job, the Saskatchewan Rough Riders deserve to lose every fricking game they play until the end of time, or their bankruptcy which ever comes first.

So I say; Pox on their team if they do keep him around.

People should be calling the Rough Rider headquarters demanding that Tillman not be re-enstated. If the courts can't do the correct thing people can.

here is their web site for the contact Info...

http://www.riderville.com/

and/or direct contact page

http://www.riderville.com/page/contact [28]

One thing to be encouraged by, the normally rah-rah sports type were outraged wiith phone calls and e-mails to the FAN590 yesterday. 

Discouraged, the same radio station is avoiding the topic.

Good point as well. This type of thing definitely has an effect on the willingness of girls and women to come forward. As if there are not enough barriers and issues in this regard already!

That is why the barriers and issues are thrown up, so women and girls won't come forward.

Complicity in marginalizing women and girls coming forward also comes in the form of the media showing a crying sobbing man, followed by a lawyer who states that judges give lighter sentences to public figures, because of the public humiliation they have to go through.

With that course of thinking then they should give lighter sentences to all criminals who appear in a take down on TV, or the most wanted lists, as they too suffer public humiliation.

Frankly  can hardly accept that it occured, it is such an attack upon women....and overt classism...

 encourage all to contact the Riders and demand that he remain out of a job with their organization. It will be another attack against women, if he is allowed to keep his position.

More on Tillman and his audacious sense of white male privilege right to sexuallly assault young girls....from when he was first charged.

"Happy to be green,"

His arrogance in not resigning, can only be outpaced if the Rough Riders re-enstate him to his job position...

Also, we see more rammifications occuring with the sexualization of young girls in society, and the ages of abusers getting younger with the latest incident here in BC.

The allowing of sexual assaulters to get off with a mere whinning apology in public, does not send a good message to young boys, say nothing of men.

Should we as a society really be  socially sexualizing young boys into rapists, as well?

Can we look forward to seeing a rash of sexual assaults, particularily in SK, because boys and men have been told quite clearly they can get away with it, by just whinning about how hard done by they are, that they took too many drugs and did not know what they were doing, and that they are sorry?

Anyone with information is asked to contact the Vancouver police.

It is time to stop pretending that all these sexual assault actions against women and girls happen in isolated splendor, and that sexual assault is no different than any other type of assault!

Wow - Tillman's comments are unbelievable remind. I don't even know what to say, it just has me so angry. I have contacted the Riders as well and hope others do.

Just so people can see how outrageous letting Tillman of is I think people should look at the various parts of the Criminal Code that he might have been subject too but for his privilege. Only charged with assault apparently although arguably he was in a position of trust over this young person in his home and under his charge.  He didn't need any medical evidence to show he was not criminally responsible he merely had to state it and he was believed.  This is an outrageous outcome.

I am sorry about the formatting above.  When I hit the preview comment button before posting all the Code Sections and headings show up but when I hit post comment they disappeared.

Thanks kropotkin, perhaps letters should also be written to the Saskatchewan government,  as this is just unacceptable on so many levels...as your criminal code information clearly indicates.

Oh too funny,and not in a good way, I just went to the SK government site to get contact info and look what I found:

So the Attorney General  wants mandatory minimums and yet he allows Tillman to get away with not even basic criminal code activities occuring.

all the info to contact the SK attorney general is at the link in the quotes, and indeed perhaps letters to the opposition critic would be good too...which is:

Constituency Office:
610 Duchess Street
SASKATOON, SK S7K 0R1
Phone: 651-3581 Fax: 651-4670
fquennellmla@sasktel.net [38]

http://www.frankquennell.ca [39]

and the complete MLA list is below

http://www.legassembly.sk.ca/members/mla_list.htm [40]

If people want to contact the SK Chief Justice here is the info....

The Hon. J. Klebuc · CRT · Chief Justice of Saskatchewan · (306) 787-5382 ·

Sexist attacks against women,  come in all places, shapes and sizes it seems these days...

And it seems Dockers, is quite  content to try and sell their products at the expense of women, mainly by telling men the world's ills are all the fault of women.

http://www.us.dockers.com/season/landing.aspx

And the site that everyone on the left loves to get their yucks from, are not content to be left out of the ugly and extremely harmful sexism against women, and they too deserve to be boycotted.

Wonder where are the commedy pieces about the "sluts" in our society, whom countries are targeting for their tourism dollars?

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/vh1_reality_show_bus_crashes_in?ut...

The phone number to contact Dockers from BC is 1 800 362 5377.

I just talked to a nice young woman who I think will pass on the fact that I have bought many pairs of Dockers but I never will again because of this blatantly misogynist ad.  I hope other men on this board will follow suit.

Thanks for the number kropotkin, and for your calling them out on it.

Just going to add the thread on Dimanno's attack against women, just to show how many women are co-opted by patriarchy.

http://rabble.ca/babble/feminism/dimanno-tillman-case-patronizes-women

This is perhaps a reminder of the archaic laws against women:

MP : 'Gold-digger' veteran clause 'unfair'

Really unbelievable, the government  wanting to save itself a bundle, saw nothing wrong with ascribing the term gold digger to women....to cover their money grubbing ways.

Thanks RP

Stoffer is correct this law needs to be gone.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/jan/15/why-men-use-prostitutes

I found this story on the most read of the Guardian website. It is a really disturbing article and the researcher who does it supports tightening laws around johns to decrease the consistent culture of permissivity that surround the enforcement of laws around the users of 'commercial sex' and the use of women as sex objects.

I wasn't 100% sure where to post this. So I chose this thread because Remind and other members have often many of the things shown in this article.

I agree that the term is horrible but don't necessarily agree with changing the law. The existing law that designates division of military pensions upon marital dissolution treats the wife at the time the pension was accrued in an appalling way. The military pensioner collects his (I'm using "his" but recognize that occassionally it could be "her", as well) pension beginning at any time from 19 years + 1 day of service onward. So, let's say he starts collecting at age 45 and, after division, he gets $550/month. At the same time, his previous wife will have received a lump sum that she has to invest (it's locked-in and, by law, cannot be used with one exception that's worse) in an RRSP, or other equivalent financial mechanism. The idea being that she will need to invest in some plan that, by age 65, she will receive $550/month. So, he will have drawn income for 20 years meaning that he receives $132,000 more from a marital asset that supposedly has been divided equally.

It's more complicated than that, even, but that's the briefer version. The wife who sacrificed a normal life by moving around, often living on low-ish income, living away from extended family, having their partner be away and possibly in danger, gets screwed by this division and that situation should be rectified before any consideration is given to subsequent spouses.

Thanks for that heads up Loretta....perhaps Stoffer should address this too? Have you written him about it?

Papal Bull, you are correct thte article was disturbing so, was the whole pdf report. And thank you for posting this.

Also...so much for claims that decriminalization would help those trafficked...

Going to link the Dockers thread to this one, as there is more going on with the Dockers ad.

The evidence is becoming pretty overwhelming these days, what the push for legalized prostitution has  done to the plight of women around the world, report after report, from country after country, indicates just what the actual truth is.

Slavery and exploitation, beyond that of which was present before  so called legalization. That is beyond the increased violence against all women.

And seeing as how men apparently do not care whether women are being trafficked, nor the ages, legalized prostitution is no solution to anything.

Criminals infiltrating legal brothel industry

And then of course there is this truth too, that so many have tried to minimalize, and the same holds true in Canada:

One American Indian woman's long fight to escape prostitution [53]

re- john's research

The article was presented as a major new piece of research when it is nothing of the kind; a casual glance shows it is not peer reviewed or presented to an acceptable academic independent standard. The Guardian and the editor responsible should be thoroughly embarrassed by its misrepresentation.

One of the co-authors of the report is Melissa Farley, when this "study" was run in Edinburgh n response a paper authored by some 15 academics and sexual health experts was submitted to the Scottish Parliament, strongly rebuking the methods and conclusions of the study. Amongst other things, the report states - "This research violates fundamental principles of human research ethics in that there is no evidence of any benefit to the population studied. Rather the purpose of the research appears to have been to vilify the population of men who were chosen to be interviewed. " In addition they criticize the work as biased, ill informed and unhelpful.

- A Commentary on 'Challenging Men's Demand for Prostitution in Scotland': A Research Report Based on Interviews with 110 Men who Bought Women in Prostitution, (Jan Macleod, Melissa Farley, Lynn Anderson, Jacqueline Golding, 2008)" by Teela Sanders, Jane Scoular, Michael Goodyear, and others, April 29, 2008. "The researchers were defined as people wanting to end violence against women - but presumably this may introduce bias into how the research was run. If you are asking someone to disclose buying sex but you openly disagree with this how can you hear what they say?"

This is not research it is a campaign.

i am refering to the hoisting of the research in the guardian news paper above and i would ask remind, how does the quote you chose debunk decrim as making women safer? education of consumers and clear safe methods for them to report dangerous conditions. by ending the shame and educating consumers we could actually be more effective in combating human trafficking.

http://www.timescolonist.com/news/Jody+Paterson+Good+news+Johns+just+normal+guys/2471932/story.html

A new study out of Simon Fraser University concludes that people who buy sex are no more prone to violence than anyone else.

Fewer than two per cent of the 1,000 respondents who took part in SFU sociologist Chris Atchison's study reported ever having hit, hurt, raped or robbed the person they bought sex from.

Granted, that's just them saying so. But Atchison noted in a Vancouver Sun story this week about his research that there was little reason for the respondents to lie, given that the survey was anonymous.

That his findings are provocative is an understatement.

"It's an outrageous study and it really works towards normalizing sexual assault," said Aurea Flynn of the Vancouver Rape Relief and Women's Shelter, which is the go-to organization in B.C. when media are looking for a quote from someone vehemently opposed to prostitution.

"I'm really angry about the emphasis on the compassion for johns that the study provides," added Flynn, "and I'm very concerned about its impact on the continued normalization of prostitution in Canada because I believe prostitution is violence against women."

It's odd, really. Atchison's findings ought to be considered good news in a society that puts so much emphasis on reducing violence. Shouldn't we be happy that most of the thousands of British Columbians who buy sex on a regular basis aren't violent toward sex workers?

Ah, but this is about the sex industry. We don't want to hear anything "nice" about it. We don't want anybody telling us that most of the customers of the sex industry are largely average, non-violent guys -- the kind of men we work with, live with and even love. We don't want to hear that most adult sex workers in Canada might actually be choosing to work in the business.

When it comes to prostitution, we only like it violent, coercive and miserable. I guess we pretty much have to cling to that belief, because otherwise we just might question the ineffective, discriminatory and ultimately harmful laws that govern how the sex industry operates in our country.

We prefer a single story line when it comes to public conversations about the sex trade -- one in which all the people who buy sex are exploitive predators and all the people who sell it are victims needing to be saved (or at the very least prosecuted in the event they refuse "rescue").

But what if we've got that wrong?

man kills girlfriend over contraceptives

The plight is world wide, and never ending it seems......

'I believed sexism in our culture would wither away. I was entirely wrong'

That looks like an excellent book, remind. I am terrified of raising a daughter in the the present culture. How do you prepare them and arm them with enough self-esteem?  

yes,  I think so too Ghislaine, can't hardly wait to read it.

 sorry  do not know how you prepare them and arm them with actual self esteem, as oppopsed to their wrongly believing that the more they look like a living doll or centerfold the better their self esteem would be. Other than encouraging education education education.

For awhile the granddaughter was upset, if you can imagine, because she was being labelled "smart" as  she is fluently bilingual, and has always gone to an ecole. This apparently sets them apart from their peers in straight english schools and sets them up as targets for mocking.

But nowadays she gets it, or at least some of it and she has two stark realities in her  extended family to compare to. Her fathers side are surface people who live a patriarchial norm, that is full of violence, mainly verbal and emotional, though it is hidden beneath the surface of supposedly upper middle class posturing, and her feminist matriarchial family where that type of VAW stuff does not exist. And where there is no societal posturing occuring.

So she "sees" for herself and them comes to me to speak of social feminism, much more so than her mother did actually. Her mother, my daughter, did not start accepting feminist thought until a few years ago, as she wrongly believed broad sociatal sexism did not exist any longer, because it did not exist in her family and amongst the larger social network we exist in.

Unfortunately that false belief of hers lead her to  world of hurt that she is just beginning to recover from.

Having said that though, she also owns her own home, and business, and she just turned 30. Which indicates that some things have progressed for women  of the next generation in some ways.

Just not in the sexual objectification and VAW ways.

Newly released info from medical news...

"The findings suggest that pregnancy coercion and birth control sabotage may be an aspect of partner violence that, given its relevance to reproductive health, should be identified by providers in clinical settings

Interesting blog writings on this study's findings

Sabotaging birth control - sinister new face of sexual violence

and then this one really lays it out

Rates of unintended pregnancy might decline if more young women learned to recognize, avoid or leave abusive relationships or were given the skills and support to do so. [63]

And there i believe ghislaine lays part of your answer in red....

Definitely, remind. It just seems so overwhelming what girls and young women are up against.

I am not surprised by these new findings - as it would seem an abusive male can cause a partner to become even more dependant and unwilling to leave if he gets her pregnant.

I don't know what it is like in other provinces, but I know that here on the Island and there is not nearly close to enough time spent in sex-ed on abusive relationships, what constitutes abuse, how to recognize, how to leave, what your rights are, etc. ,etc. There needs to be a lot more down in all grades to educate both boys and girls.

And then in the USA women are getting hit with a double whammy after experiencing forced pregnancy....and other acts of violence.

Over here we see how trivial women lives are nowadays...

Today started out a good day, I was happy and in a good mood, until I was made aware of this on Facebook:

http://tiny.cc/AXSNn

Report this group if you are on Facebook. Please, all help is needed.

Dear God, don't they have automatic filters for certain words like killing or hookers.

Reported to senior management of facebook that I know

This thread contains comments that are another good example of attacks that come disguised as info and fact but are not.

No, actually, the thread doesn't contain anything nefarious against women. We know you have an axe to grind with Susan, and you want to see prostitution gone but that is no reason to stir up shit with her - yet again.

besides that this thread was important and about women under attack. Last time I checked, sex workers were also women.

Stargazer, am not going to get into this with you, so I will only say this:

Susan has made that spurious and false accusation here before, and it is not abolitionists who are harming women,  and killing them, it is MEN, aka Johns, and no one else, other than perhaps pimps and procurers.

As such, making such false claims is an attack upon women who view things differently than she does. And frankly I am not going to put up with it and let it go unchallenged.

I totally agree with Susan in that thread.  You're not the only feminist game in town, remind.  I think it's ironic that you're attacking feminist sex workers on babble in a thread about identifiable groups of women being attacked.

I disagree, and sorry remind, it is you who have the problem. If you truly care about women and violence then you would support ALL women who suffer or potentially suffer from it. Not just women who are not sex workers.

She made zero attacks. You used her post to marginalize her. I am shocked actually, especially after the facebook group that was about killing hookers (and that you paid absolutely no attention to nor even show disgust over). That is far more telling to me.

And yes, remind, your postion on sex workers harms women. We've been over this time and time again. We will have to agree to disagree, just as we had already done but when you personally attack another women whose views you don't hold, you become part of the problem, not the solution.

Michelle seems we cross posted!

No....frankly, she attacked feminists and women, and indeed I  find her words slanderous, as well as giving those men who hurt women an excuse or reason to say it is not their fault. Or actually by saying such a false thing, she gives them, the abusers, license to  keep on doing it.

Men who hurt woman, no matter what the woman does for a living, are to blame for hurting said woman, not someone else. Full stop.

It is not abolitionists who are to blame for women in sex work who get hurt and killed, and saying so is an attack and slander.

Michelle... great example on differing types of feminism, as the street goes 2 ways on that comment of yours, as feminists by that very same token, who support the legalization of pimps and procurers are not the only feminist game in town. And when such a feminist states that other feminists, who are abolitionists, are to blame for the violence against sex workers and prostitutes, then they better expect to be called on it.

Do you see me running around blamming feminists, such as yourselves, for prostitutes and sex workers getting harmed?

NO, even though I believe differently, than you on this, I know who to blame.

It is the persons doing the harm, who are the ones who do the harm, scapgoating those who do the harm, is unacceptable. And to blame it on abolitionist feminists is even more unacceptable,  as such it was/is an attack upon both types IMV, as a comment it was geared to set up controversy, just as it did before.

Feminists do not blame other women, and/or feminists in my feminist world at least, especially when men are the perps of violence against us, just as we do not blame victims of any type.

Women shouldn't attack other women we see enough of that from men.

Great comment Stargazer.

You should take your own advice. Apparently you took the time to blame susan for women's downfall.

Oh and it sure as hell is not "slander" to say that abolishment is and has done harm to women. Shall we play a game of stats?

Prostitution is not going away just because you wish to wage war on it. How is the War on Drugs coming along? Did prohibition help anything? BTW, these are rhetorical questions.

Do you have anything to say about groups that call for the death of sex workers? This made news around the globe.

That's my say and my take and I approve of this post. (where is the Like button?)

Stop putting words in my mouth, and that is me putting it nicely, as you well know you were.

She did not say that, she said abolisionists were to blame, so how about you reread what she said, as opposed to spinning what you think she said.

It is slander to  state that I, for example, or indeed any other babbler, am to blame for the harm johns and pimps/procurers have done, and do, to prostitues and  sex workers.  As that is exactly what she did,  call all those who are against the legalizing of johns, pimps and procurers  murderers and assaulters.

And I will not take false attacks like that and let them go....not by a long freaking shot.

Again, not only is it slander, it scapegoats those who are you know, actually commiting the  acts of violence.

Okay..whatever. Not worth it.

And the following is what happens, or could happen, in other countries, who put male penises before the rights of women. And we already know the increased violence against ALL women, legalized non-regulated prostitution, has brought to the Netherlands.

The young woman witnessed some of the man's other nurses offering him sexual gratification, the union said. When she refused to do the same, he tried to dismiss her on the grounds that she was unfit to provide care.

Cheated by Justice

ya bacchus thanks for the info, as there is nothing like the guilt one experiences, after listening to your raped daughter scream in pain when a male RCMP officer is collecting "the rape evidence" after you have insisted she report it.

Saying it should be reported is something I would never ever do again to any girl or woman, in fact I would tell them to stay the hell away from the police.

And that is even though I know it is made rough for women and girls in order to keep male privilege alive and well.

"the following" seems to be a "news of the wierd"-type story of a lone individual who feels he should be offered sexual services as part of his care.

Oh no.

Snert you are not actually in this thread and forum are you, making grossly uninformed comments like that and indicating you read the article without comprehension?

Heads up, first of all the union would not be making a move without significant evidence it is a broadly occurring activity amongst their membership. And the article itself indicates a common place activity.

Secondly, I was a home care nurse for a very long time, and I lost count of the Canadian male patients, who thought they should get some sort of sexual jollies  from an attending nurse or caregiver.

That is not even mentioning the husbands of women patients who also sought the same thing.

Being met at the door with an open housecoat sporting a hard on, or a flaccid penis hoping for one, was not an unusual circumstance. Many nurses walked away and refused to go back, and I do not blame them for doing so. But personally, I usually just laughed and walked on by, or told them to put it away before it got hurt and it never usually happened again, as I did not believe their wives should be deprived of needed care because of their husband's idiocy.

If it was a male patient, I, like the other nurses would walk away, and  they were told by supervisors that if they kept it up, they would not be getting care. Some nurses and caregivers that I knew over the years even quit their jobs over the trauma of it. And one just quietly realized why.

Thirdly, even working in a hospital setting nurses are solicated sexually, I could not imagine how bad it would be if primary focus on the male penis was even greater than it is.

Okay fuck it. I am dead tired of playing "nice" to you. Somewhere along the lines you seem to have acquired a hate on for sex workers. Don't tell me to shut up, or that I put words in your mouth. YOU stated you were a supporter of abolishment.  You stated that. Study after fucking study has shown that THIS WON'T and DOESN'T WORK. Not unlike Prohibition.It does put women in danger, even the police know this.

Your stand on transwomen is less than progressive judging by your posts. I consider them women and allies. Not people who need anyones "guidance" about how they should live their lives.

I am not a part of your team of purist feminists. I am pro-sex, pro-sex workers and pro complete control over our bodies.

Just like E. Tamaran was accused of constantly yelling racism you seem fit to constantly yell "male privilege" every freaking time, no matter what the issue. This is NOT going to win us allies. There is a way to discuss topics without shouting "male penis" and "male privilege". That shuts out debate completely. I just want people to know that this is NOT the brand of feminism I signed up for. You do not represent me.

You have been flying off the handle for awhile now with this divisive and unnecessary layering of who is deserving and who is not and I am not playing that freaking horrible game.

Lastly, it is not slander. Don't make me pull up all the horrible things you've said to sex workers who dared come here and tell us their stories.

Mods, if you want to give me a "time out" go ahead. I understand.

'male' penis?

As opposed to what?

Pull them up Stargazer, however I am not waiting for it, as you can't....and it is not been me who has been flying off the handle, as you call it.

And just a heads up to you, if the majority of men, on the so called left,  were actual allies and interested in women's equity, we would have achieved it by now.

As such, I am not looking for allies, where there quite clearly aren't many, when all pretense has been put aside.

etd to put the missing m in

The sexual harassment of health care workers is ongoing and an enormous topic that's not adequately addressed - it tends to get shrugged off as coming from drugs or dementia, though many of the nurses I work with insist that the patients know exactly what they're doing.

Oh yes they do know Sineed, as evidenced by their halting of said behaviours, when told care will be suspended if such behaviour continues.

Not that I even looked at 1 of the links, but if such is the case, then it is spreading of hate against an identifiable group.

And I like the "fakebook"  slang name, it seems appropriate.

York University Rapist -Victims read impact Statements

The night of the incident, Katsnelson and his friend, Justin Connort, went from floor to floor at Vanier College residence looking for unlocked doors.

"I can assure you I'll never do anything like this again. I hope everyone, especially the victims, will get some closure. I'm so sorry. Please forgive me," he said.

But previously in court, when asked what his victims could take away from the incident, he responded they would now know to lock their doors. One of the victims immediately broke down and had to leave the courtroom.

This wakeup call didn't get enough MSM play when it broke 4 days ago:

Criminal code does not prohibit incitement of hatred against women, because women are not a minority! - Montréal judge

Yet more of us die from hatred inciting than any other identifiable group....

I clikced on the first link.

4 out of the 6 members previewed were young women.

Second link about hiding dead hookers bodies.

6 our of 49 members.  First 5 were women.

These facebook groups are stupid but the disturbing thing is that a lot of people seem to think it's a joke but you can't blame facebook when we see the same thing acted out in video games.

Women shouldn't be considered a minority because we're not.

Instead of playing the who is a minority game why don't we consider ALL crimes of this nature as the same?

Hatred directly against me isn't more henious than a non-minority.

And thos facebook groups are stupid but the disturbing thing is that a lot of people seem to think it's a joke but you can't blame facebook when we see the same thing acted out in video games.

We are actually an identifable group which is targeted, not a minority.....

Here's the problem - the definition of "identifiable group" in Sections 318 and 319 of the Criminal Code:

Someone should research why the entire gang of buffoons known as Parliament decided to exclude advocating murder of women, the disabled, etc. from this provision.

Can't you make the argument that any group could be an identifiable group?

Progressives could be an identifiable group. As could liberals couldn't they?

Yes am aware of that, and the reasons why the exclusion, status quo is always so acceptable....especially forpatriarchy and privilege

Sure, and CEOs are identifiable, as are police officers and dentists.

But none of these groups are targetted, by individuals, the state, institutions and structures, for significant mistreatment and inequity in relation to others. Okay, maybe dentists are. (I am NOT an anti-dentite!)

Sparky One. We've had one full thread on this topic, and we're now coming up to a second full thread. If you have nothing to add to the discussion, and if in fact you disagree with the premise, as you appear to be doing, the thing to do is to stay out of the thread. This is not a suggestion, by the way. Thank you.

My feeling was when does it stop? I'm not comfortable with a someone getting a harsher sentence for committing assault against me because I'm black over a woman who is white. Or a woman as an identifiable group over a man.

Why does someone have to be an identifible group to fall under this specific rule?

I'm not questioning the premise but still I guess I apologize for disagreeing?? and I will stay out of the thread as ordered.

I still believe women are playing a huge part in letting this shit happen. Just look at those facebook groups and watch the comments by "fellow women".

Have a good day (and you're welcome)

Preston manning and Allen Gregg are doing a bang up job of attacking women's rights, Murray Dobbin  indicates such

Then we have the case that is currently before the Supremes, asking whether the right to rape a unconscious victim, is okay or not....

But I do blame Fakebook !

The first link is in the Category: Common Interest - Sexuality [106] , not games or humor.

http://www.facebook.com/terms.php?ref=pf [107]

[107]

"You will not post content that: is hateful, threatening, or pornographic; incites violence; or contains nudity or graphic or gratuitous violence."   (except references to hookers or comments veiled in humor)

I quess Fakebook is too big and too busy counting cash to search their own site for keywords like "Kill".  Appears it takes the police or media to make them act on their own policies.

Thinking of joining up and starting a group.
Maybe "Kill the cop so you don't have to pay the traffic ticket"
Or "Kill your children so you don't have to pay for their college"
Category: Common Interest - Humor
Would I get any flak for doing that ?
Wonder how many will think it"s funny.

Just found this, "four days after the complaints began - Facebook was adopting the social media strategy of sticking its fingers in its ears and singing la la la."

http://blogs.dailyrecord.co.uk/webeditor/2010/02/facebook-hitting-women-row.html [108]

"However, the judge said Parliament specifically intended the charge of incitement of hatred to protect minorities, which does not include women."

Wow, I sort of assumed incitement of hatred was wrong, period.

Why intelligent people don't read the Winnipeg Sun:

Several female politicians and women's rights activists have denounced anti-abortion remarks made by the Catholic Church's top Canadian official over the weekend.

Cardinal Marc Ouellet, attending the Campagne Pro-Vie conference in Quebec City on Saturday, suggested that abortion can never be justified, even in cases where a woman has been raped.

He called abortion a "moral crime" as serious as murder.

Ouellet said he understands how a sexually assaulted woman has been traumatized and must be helped and that her attacker must be held accountable.

"But there is already a victim," he said. "Must there be another one?"

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/montreal/story/2010/05/17/ouellet-marois-abortion-rape.html#ixzz0oCJXtEbP

Guess there is not enough children for the Catholic clergy to rape and brutalize.....and it so wonderful that men feel they can make comments on women's human rights.

Good greif

Apparently cutting your little girls throat, wide open is deserved punishment for bad behaviour.

As that is what the step father did after having an argument with "his wife" about discipline. And indeed he was "stoic" after he did so. wtf?????

Afghan women jailed for 'bad character'

Surprisingly uplifting to read tho

If he had been high on any drugs other than pharmaceuticals that would be the story.  

Fear of rape traps women in kenya

Fear of sexual violence is keeping poor Kenyan women away from communal toilets, and increasing the risk of disease, Amnesty International says.

A family from the Elsipogtog First Nation in New Brunswick is hoping someone will come forward to help them figure out how their daughter died this week.

Sabrina Polchies, 22, was found dead in an apartment building in Salisbury Monday evening. She had been reported missing July 4.

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/new-brunswick/story/2010/07/07/nb-elsipogtog-family-grieving.html#ixzz0t5jlw49f

continued  here