Cost of Rabble.ca Upgrade

I was reading some of the background information on the site and I came across the link to the rabble.ca "annual reports".  Page 39 of the 2008 annual report indicates that $49,000 was expended on the upgrade of the wesite.  So, I finally got the answer I had been unsuccessfully seeking here!!

Could you have done it for cheaper Sven?  How long do you think it takes to do a site migration like that?  Have you ever costed out a large software project?

Recently I had to estimate for a software project, a site migration, to Drupal, for a university program.  They needed all their data migrated over from several custom and third party solutions, and they needed everything to be very flexible with lots of different access for different types of users.  They even wanted their payroll system integrated into their website.  And they wanted training for all their staff to use the system.

I estimated the project to come out at $90,000.  The project would've taken 3 months to build with a 3 month support period beyond that.  There would've been 2 people working on it full time for most of the project, another 3 people working part time for most of the duration, and several other people getting involved for a week or two here and there.  And of course, without being able to see their data before making the bid, we had to be prepared for any number of potential obstacles.

Their budget, unfortunately, was $18,000, maybe $20,000 tops.  So we did not get the project. :(  We TOTALLY did not get the project.

They're dreaming of course.  They're going to go with the cheapest solution, and they're not going to get the training they need, and I suspect the project won't launch when (according to them) they absolutely need everything to be ready.  The project deadlines were pretty unrealistic to start with--which is why our bid was high.  It would've been a crunch already with a handful of people workng overtime during the busiest periods.

I say all this because I doubt you (or some others here) have any idea at the amount of work involved in building and migrating data for a site like rabble.  While it may seem like it's all clickety-click to you, this is actually an extremely complex site, where all kinds of things can go wrong.  If that migration had happened 3 years earlier it would've been 3 times as much.  If Rabble had another 30 grand the migration probably would've been a lot smoother, and the moderators as well as the developers would've had a lot less stress since indignant users like you would've had fewer minor details about which to complain incessantly.

But unfortunately, they didn't.  Being a free service, Rabble didn't have the cash to throw around, and as such users had to make adjustments.  Boo fucking hoo.  The Rabble upgrade costed $49,000?  That's a bargain.  SERIOUSLY.  How many millions of dollars do you think Facebook has spent on their user interface?

Building these sites take TIME.  Any idea how many people were working on the Rabble upgrade for how many months?  Any idea at all?

But there's your individualist mentality at play.  Use a service that's provided to you for free and then complain about the business decisions made by the provider of said service.  Sure Sven, Rabble decision makers are bumbling fools!  Why did these doofuses spend $49,000 on a website upgrade?  Duh!  If only Sven were in charge!

I haven't given rabble a cent.  I intend to rectify that soon.

Your link to the old discussion doesn't work Sven.

Could you, or someone, please tell us how to get to that annual report where you got the $49,000 figure?

And suggest a donation for a low income person such as myself, while you're at it.

Thanks for the interest G. Muffin. You can become a paying subscriber for $5 a month, and get some gifts as well. Go to the About section which is accessed from the front page, and click on membership. http://www.rabble.ca/about/membership

KenS you can find the annual reports on the About section as well. Click through to: http://www.rabble.ca/about/annualreport [7]

wage zombie gave a good picture of the expense involved in upgrading a website. When you start wanting video and audio quality that matches the editorial work involved in produced the RPN or rabble tv it becomes important to have a site that welcomes podcasts and videos. When rabble was launched streaming audio and video were not what they are today. Now, rabble radio and the rabble podcast network are top of the class.

We are proud as we can be of the level of debate on this site and want to keep it together for posterity. That too costs as wage zombie points out when you migrate and store data. 

Figuring out how to get people to pay for something they get for free is not easy. But it is part of what needs to happen in moving ourselves from an I world to a We world, which is what rabble is about as well.

Hold on there, Tex.  Slip yer six-shooters back in yer holsters.

I was engaging in hyperbole in that earlier thread when I made a reference to the 10 cents figure.  But, I really did want to know how much money was shelled out for the system upgrade -- cuz it seemed like a ton of effort (and time) went into the project (which usually translates into a ton of money -- because I do, indeed, have a pretty good sense of what projects like this cost).

But, now we know what the dollar amount actually was (a paltry $49,0000).  So, clearly, rabble.ca must have received tons of free (or substantially discounted) services to do that project.

Yes, rabble.ca must have received tons of free or substantially discounted services to do the project.  Several people must've taken a big paycut (ie volunteered much of their time) because they believe that the project is worthwhile.  It's the only way Rabble could've paid that little.

These generous developers could've made 2 or 3 times as much building sites for coca cola and rogers, as you would no doubt encourage them to do instead.  But they'd rather use their valuable skills to build sites that will help people.  So i hate to see them disparaged here.

I have done site migrations that went really smoothly as well as other ones that were pretty turbulent for one reason or another.  It's always a crapshoot what reaction the users will have.  After one recent migration that i did an ornery user emailed a site moderator who was 8 months pregnant and cussed her up and down, telling her that they hoped she'd be fired.  All because a free forum service was changed around a bit and some links were in different places.  Another project where it took months to work out multiple issues with the interface, users were quite understanding.  You just never know.

From what i can tell of the relative smoothness of the transition here, I'd say babblers were pretty rude.  A supposedly progressive board shits all over developers putting a bunch of their time in for free to help build up a free service.  Makes me wonder.

Here was your opening post in the thread you linked to:

The thread was closed within ten hours.  So hold on there yourself.  If you think that is respectful of people who donated their time to enhance a service that you use for free, well, i guess i shouldn't be surprised given your posting history.

Nice flash-up Wage Zombie. My only regret is that I'll be reading all of Sven's...  But it did do some good; I guess I'll have to start coughing up some of the bucks. Signing on soon.

Thanks for your support E.P. Houle. It is most appreciated.

Homeopathy.

I can do $5.00 a month.  

Which magazine(s) do you recommend?

I would think magazines are off topic.

And you'd be wrong.

I have been a reader of Canadian Dimension since it appeared in the 1960s. This Magazine is well know to me. Lots of people say good things about Briar Patch which has a good track record, and is getting better all the time apparently.