Green Party coup

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cco

I'll be amazed if it gets heard by election day. Unless Paul can twist people's arms into dropping the case – and if she had that kind of torque, I don't think the suit would've been filed in the first place – this will just hang over her during the whole campaign.

melovesproles

NDPP wrote:

GPC Votes - Green Left Canada

https://twitter.com/dimitrilascaris/status/1418637685783138309

"Green Party of Canada members are now voting on policy motions, constitutional amendments and Federal Council elections.

Green Left Canada has issued a list of the motions and candidates whom we support. You can see the list here..."

The recommendations looked pretty good to me but there were a couple policy prioritizations that I might have made or not made (I'm fairly agnostic on mandatory voting for example) if I had been voting blind. The devil is obviously in the details for a lot of these and I don't have the time to look too deeply into all of them. So I voted as advised since I mostly just want to show support for Lascaris. I know there are others eligible to vote on here and curious if others deviated at all from the list? I think we have until the 11th to vote. A lot of policies to click through but a fairly quick and painless process.

Debater

More key officials depart Green Party amid staffing upheaval as election looms

Aug. 9, 2021

https://beta.ctvnews.ca/national/politics/2021/8/9/1_5540549.html

nicky

So the party executive has now laid off Paul's chief of staff. Incredible.

Pondering

Well I got all my voting done. I am not surprised at more layoffs. From the last reports they are verging on bankrupcy.  Paul is following a scorched earth policy. It is very obvious she can't remain leader of the party. She has been using the excuse of a new Federal Council coming in but they will want her gone just as much as the current council. 

I still see it as good news. I don't want the Green Party to be successful under Paul anymore than I wanted to see the NDP successful under Mulcair. The weaker the Greens are, the more likely the ecosocialists will be able to take control. 

Pondering

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/ottawa-playbook/2021/08/18/wednesda...

CRI DE COEUR — The Greens pushed out ANNAMIE PAUL's elevator pitch to the nation: “The thing that I believe that the backroom operators who cooked up this election have gotten wrong, is that try as they might with their polling, try as they might with their calculations, they underestimate the desire of people for change … that this pandemic has provoked, and we are ready to strike out in a new direction.” Paul wants the governor general to “reinvoke” Parliament for an emergency debate on the crisis in Afghanistan — which is, at this point, constitutionally forbidden.

Again with wanting the monarchy to rule. "the Greens" didn't push this message out, Paul did. Paul has now called the elected National Council "backroom operators".  

Paul seems to be taking a leaf out of Trump's book. Just keep flat out lying over and over again. I cannot wait until she is gone and I bet just about everyone in the Green Party feels the same way. I doubt the incoming National Council members will be happy to be described as "backroom operators".  She may have hurt her future law cases against the Greens with that comment. 

nicky

Has the new executive been elected yet?
Is the new executive still critical of Paul?
Are theGreens going ahead with their convention?

Pondering

nicky wrote:

Has the new executive been elected yet?
Is the new executive still critical of Paul?
Are theGreens going ahead with their convention?

The new council will be announced tomorrow. I am waiting with bated breath to see if Greenleft picks were elected. 

  • Lorraine Rekmans:  FC President
  • Lisa Gunderson or Keith Wiley, ranked 1-2 or 2-1:  VP English
  • Samuel Moissan-Domm:  VP French
  • Colin Griffiths:  Fund Rep
  • Kim Bell:  Newfoundland and Labrador Rep
  • Nicholas Hendren:  Nova Scotia Rep
  • Jean-Charles Pelland:  Quebec Rep
robbie_dee

Did the Green Party end up funding Annamie Paul's campaign in Toronto Centre or is she on her own?

Ken Burch

Are we basically at the point of saying "Last one out of the GPC please turn off the energy-saving bulb" ?

Pondering

robbie_dee wrote:

Did the Green Party end up funding Annamie Paul's campaign in Toronto Centre or is she on her own?

She is on her own and the new National Council results are in! I had hoped for a bit better but not bad. 4/7 Both the President and one of the VPs is a GreenLeft choice as are the reps from Quebec and Newfoundland/Labrador. I don't think any council will accept Paul's leadership when she has referred to the outgoing council as "backroom operators" and accused the party of racism and sexism. She's made it clear she is a  dictator.  

These are the candidates GreenLeft supported. The ones elected are bolded. It is 4 out of 7 GL choices but includes the President, 1 VP and the Quebec rep.

  • President: Lorraine Rekmans
  • Vice President - English: Lisa Gunderson
  • Vice President - Francophone: Clément Badra
  • Fund Representative: Carrie McLaren
  • Alberta Representative: Natalie Odd
  • Saskatchewan Representative: Thomas Boysen
  • Manitoba Representative: Pearson Singbeil Montgomery
  • Quebec Representative: Jean-Charles Pelland
  • New Brunswick Representative: Louise Comeau
  • Nova Scotia Representative: Matthew Piggott
  • Prince Edward Island Representative: Darcie Lanthier
  • Newfoundland and Labrador Representative: Kim Bell
  • Youth Representative: Stuart Hunter

These are the results of the election:

  • 1 President: Lorraine Rekmans
  • 2 Vice President - English: Lisa Gunderson
  • Vice President - Francophone: Clément Badra
  • Fund Representative: Carrie McLaren
  • Alberta Representative: Natalie Odd
  • Saskatchewan Representative: Thomas Boysen
  • Manitoba Representative: Pearson Singbeil Montgomery
  • Quebec Representative: Jean-Charles Pelland
  • New Brunswick Representative: Louise Comeau
  • Nova Scotia Representative: Matthew Piggott
  • Prince Edward Island Representative: Darcie Lanthier
  • Newfoundland and Labrador Representative: Kim Bell
  • Youth Representative: Stuart Hunter
Pondering

Ken Burch wrote:

Are we basically at the point of saying "Last one out of the GPC please turn off the energy-saving bulb" ?

Not even close. May and Manley both seem to be in a good position to win their seats. Paul will be included in the debates and I think she will be excellent in that regard. She is chasing NDP seats, but she will go after Trudeau and O'Toole. Paul and Singh, both lawyers, are going to have them on the ropes. 

The party is financially broke but I don't think bankrupt because they have simply stopped spending money. I hope this will make it easier for the eco-socialists to take over. 

kropotkin1951

Why are there no BC or Ontario Representatives, without even talking about Nunavut or the Yukon or the NWT?

nicky
Pondering

No idea Krop, it is a massive hole in representation. I can only guess they didn't have anyone willing to run for National Council from those areas. It's a small party. If it were not, it would be much more difficult to take over. 

nicky

So Pondering, are you able to make an assessment whether Paul's position is better or not with the new executive?

Douglas Fir Premier

Pondering wrote:

No idea Krop, it is a massive hole in representation. I can only guess they didn't have anyone willing to run for National Council from those areas. It's a small party. If it were not, it would be much more difficult to take over. 

"Each Councillor is elected for two years. Half of the positions are elected in odd numbered years, while the other half are elected in even numbered years."

https://www.greenparty.ca/en/council/election-2021

You might fine it useful to bone up on the party's governance structure if you're serious about taking it over.

Pondering

Douglas Fir Premier wrote:

Pondering wrote:

No idea Krop, it is a massive hole in representation. I can only guess they didn't have anyone willing to run for National Council from those areas. It's a small party. If it were not, it would be much more difficult to take over. 

"Each Councillor is elected for two years. Half of the positions are elected in odd numbered years, while the other half are elected in even numbered years."

https://www.greenparty.ca/en/council/election-2021

You might fine it useful to bone up on the party's governance structure if you're serious about taking it over.

I will not be taking it over personally. Eco-socialists are trying to take it over and I support them. I followed GreenLeft suggestions for voting for National Council and they won important positions. Next opportunity I get to vote I will do the same. I am most likely voting NDP this time around but I will check out the local Green candidate to see if they are closer to eco-socialist. 

Badriya

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Why are there no BC or Ontario Representatives, without even talking about Nunavut or the Yukon or the NWT?

You piqued my curiosity, so I checked the Green Party website.  There are representatives for BC and ON, but there is as of now no representative for the Territories.  All the other representatives listed are the same as the ones above.

Territories                         Vacant

Ontario                               Adrian Currie

British Columbia               Bob MacKie

https://www.greenparty.ca/en/party/structure/council

kropotkin1951

I see now the list that was posted was an election result list and not the full council since like many boards they don't elect it all at once.

Pondering

nicky wrote:

So Pondering, are you able to make an assessment whether Paul's position is better or not with the new executive?

Not an educated one. The president is GreenLeft choice as is the Quebec rep and one of 2 VPs. I don't know the position of the ones who didn't face election. 

In general I think she is done. She accused the party of racism and sexism and took the party to court to prevent the previous council from acting. Court cases have not been dropped. I think some are supporting her because the election is coming but you can be sure May and Manley are not happy. It's too late to oust her before the election but after the election the knives will be out. Within 6 month of the election, I imagine sooner, the members get to vote on whether or not to have a new leadership contest. I'm fairly confident members will want her gone ASAP. Her membership may be revoked before then. 

melovesproles

If the Greens don't gain seats, she is finished. She needs an undeniably successful election to survive her handling of the Zatzman shitshow.

eastnoireast

paul's no good past unchallenged soundbites.  there's no depth.  i've seen may enrapture audiences for hours, off the cuff. 

robbie_dee

If Paul can win her seat (Toronto Centre) I think she will fend off her detractors in the party and stay on as leader. But that's a tall order. She needs a great performance in the debates and a bit of a Liberal meltdown to have a chance. I can imagine this but I think it's unlikely (and it would probably mean a Conservative government if it occurs). 

* As an aside, but worth noting: Paul did not actually take the Green Party to court. She took them to arbitration under her employment contract, which is inherently a private proceeding. The Green Party took her to court after they lost the arbitration. 

Pondering

There is no way on earth she will win her seat. If anyone gets it other than the Liberals it will be the NDP no matter how well she does in the debates. Everyone knows she doesn't have the backing of the party and May will not be helpimg her out this time. Paul might even step down the the day after the election. She's running to up her profile for her next job. She won't want "ousted" on her resume.

She will quit having left the party in tatters over her love affair with Zionism.

nicky

I feel a little cheap kicking the Greens while they're down but, hey, they deserve it.

Mainstreet has been running a series of riding polls. You have to pay about$15 to receive them. I don't feel free to disclose the actual numbers butI think I can reveal some general results.

So far Mainstreet has polled three of the Greens' top seats and they are doing badly in all three.

Paul  has lost half her percentage  vote since the by-election in Toronto Centre ( my home riding!) and is now a distant second.

In both Malpeque and Kitchener Centre the Greens ran respectable seconds last time. They have lost about half their vote in both those ridings as well and now run third and fourth respectively. Interestingly the NDP is a strong  second in Kitchener.

I wd like to see a poll in Nanaimo where hopefully Manley is going down.

Pondering

I don't know why you would want Manley to go down. Other than that is it all great news. 

laine lowe laine lowe's picture

I like Manley too. I have no idea why we would rejoice his going down.

nicky

Because the raisin  d'être of the Greens has always been to siphon off enough "progressive" votes to allow Conservatives to win. 
Let's hope hope the Greens get zero MPs although it may be too good to hope that May gets defeated as well as Manley.

NDPP

"On CBC radio, Annamie Paul was told by a Palestinian-Canadian that their community feels 'excluded' from the Green Party, and was aksed what she was doing to address this issue. Annamie Paul basically ignored the question..."

https://twitter.com/mbueckert/status/1430641301314224136

Pro-Zionism is a scourge that affects more than just the Green Party leadership, alas. As is ignoring the issue.

kropotkin1951

nicky wrote:

I feel a little cheap kicking the Greens while they're down but, hey, they deserve it.

Mainstreet has been running a series of riding polls. You have to pay about$15 to receive them. I don't feel free to disclose the actual numbers butI think I can reveal some general results.

So far Mainstreet has polled three of the Greens' top seats and they are doing badly in all three.

Paul  has lost half her percentage  vote since the by-election in Toronto Centre ( my home riding!) and is now a distant second.

In both Malpeque and Kitchener Centre the Greens ran respectable seconds last time. They have lost about half their vote in both those ridings as well and now run third and fourth respectively. Interestingly the NDP is a strong  second in Kitchener.

I wd like to see a poll in Nanaimo where hopefully Manley is going down.

The voters of Nanaimo like to send MP's to parliament who speak truth to the Central Canadian power, Manley fulfills that requirement of a typical Nanaimo MP. Its not like those voters ever elect a member from the governing party. His father held this riding for the NDP in 1980 and 1984. The main reason he is not running for the NDP is that when his father was arrested, illegally by the Israeli's, and Paul asked for the the party to condemn that breach of international law the party sided with the apartheid state.

robbie_dee

Ian Bailey, “ Racism, transphobia big problems in Green Party, internal report says,” Globe and Mail, August 31, 2021.

Quote:

“There is systemic racism at the governance level of the party, which needs to be, but is not being, addressed,” says the report from the party’s ombuds and appeals committee, which was released internally in mid-July but not made public.

The report, a copy of which was obtained by The Globe and Mail, says many complaints have been submitted through established party processes about prejudicial behaviour within “spaces” involving the Green Party. This includes in-person spaces like election campaigns and events, and unofficial, online spaces associated with the Green Party.

“Transphobic and racially prejudicial statements are regularly shared, and a culture which tolerates them is endemic within the party (and within society as a whole),” states the report from the committee, which reviews members’ concerns about the party.

robbie_dee

Anyone know how many candidates the Greens were able to run in 2019? Because they only have 252/338 this year.

jerrym

robbie_dee wrote:

Anyone know how many candidates the Greens were able to run in 2019? Because they only have 252/338 this year.

They ran 336 candidates in the 338 ridings in 2019 according to the url below. The also ran 336 in 338 ridings in 2015, 304 candidates in 308 ridings in 2011, 303 candidates in 308 ridings in 2008, 308 candidates in 308 ridings in 2006, and 308 candidates in 308 ridings in 2004. In other words, this is there weakest showing since at least 2000 (before that date data for the Green Party is not separated out from Other). 

https://www.sfu.ca/~aheard/elections/1867-present.html 

 

Ken Burch

It's looking more and more as though Paul is determined to take down the entire GPC with her- to leave nothing to resign FROM when she has to resign.

We may be seeing the most patholigically vindictive party leader in Canadian history here.

NorthReport

Let's not be too harsh at least with the general membership, if not the Green leadership, who have obviously smoked them. The general membership are well intentioned people who want action on reducing global warming, the issue that will fry all living things unless immediately addressed. That is why David Suziki has thrown his support behind candidates from other parties as well as Avi Lewis' run for the NDP.

cco

Ken Burch wrote:

We may be seeing the most patholigically vindictive party leader in Canadian history here.

I wouldn't go that far. She's hardly Maurice Duplessis. Although he had essentially unlimited power, and she can't even control her own tiny party.

Ken Burch

cco wrote:
Ken Burch wrote:

We may be seeing the most patholigically vindictive party leader in Canadian history here.

I wouldn't go that far. She's hardly Maurice Duplessis. Although he had essentially unlimited power, and she can't even control her own tiny party.

Duplessis didn't go out of his way to try and destroy the Union Nationale before he died.

nicky

I live in Toronto Centre where Pauli's running. 
In the by-election she polled about 32% and had a very visible sign campaign. I got at least two pieces of her literature even though I had an NDP sign on my fence.

In the by-election her strongest area was Cabbagetown . She lots lots of signs then, now very few.

Although there are 18 days To go, Paul's campaign is far less visible than it was in the by-election. She has far fewer signs than before, less than the Liberals or the NDP and perhaps no more than the Conservatives. No literature from her yet.

The Mainstreet poll had her at only 15%

I know we are only half way through the campaign and she may get mileage from the debates next week. But at the moment I would say she is floundering.

NDPP

 CPAC had her foreign policy statement in Toronto. My impression also is that she no longer draws much of a crowd.

R.E.Wood

nicky wrote:

I live in Toronto Centre where Pauli's running. 
In the by-election she polled about 32% and had a very visible sign campaign. I got at least two pieces of her literature even though I had an NDP sign on my fence.

In the by-election her strongest area was Cabbagetown . She lots lots of signs then, now very few.

Although there are 18 days To go, Paul's campaign is far less visible than it was in the by-election. She has far fewer signs than before, less than the Liberals or the NDP and perhaps no more than the Conservatives. No literature from her yet.

The Mainstreet poll had her at only 15%

I know we are only half way through the campaign and she may get mileage from the debates next week. But at the moment I would say she is floundering.

I expect her to do terribly in the debate because from what I've seen she's either inept and incoherent or evasive. 

NorthReport

The right-wing ploy to set up the Green party to try and halt the overall increasing support for the NDP has gone bust, at least for the present.

Where do you think Elizabeth May came from?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/green-party-candidate-1.6164558

Ken Burch

NorthReport wrote:
The right-wing ploy to set up the Green party to try and halt the overall increasing support for the NDP has gone bust, at least for the present. Where do you think Elizabeth May came from? https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/green-party-candidate-1.6164558[/quote]

I thought she came from Connecticutt

JKR

I thought she came from Nova Scotia and was the executive director at Sierra Club of Canada.

jerrym

Ken Burch wrote:

NorthReport wrote:
The right-wing ploy to set up the Green party to try and halt the overall increasing support for the NDP has gone bust, at least for the present. Where do you think Elizabeth May came from? https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/green-party-candidate-1.6164558

I thought she came from Connecticutt

[/quote]

JKR wrote

I thought she came from Nova Scotia and was the executive director at Sierra Club of Canada.

 

Both are true. 

May was born in Hartford, Connecticut,[5][6] the daughter of Stephanie (Middleton), a sculptor, pianist, and writer, and John Middleton May, an accountant.[7] Her father was born in New York and raised in England,[8] and her mother was also a native New Yorker. She has a younger brother named Geoffrey.[5][6] Her mother was a prominent anti-nuclear activist and her father was Assistant Vice President of Aetna Life and Casualty.[6][9] The family moved to Margaree Harbour, Nova Scotia in 1972 ...

In 1989, May became the founding Executive Director of the Sierra Club of Canada

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_May

nicky

O'Toole went to Nanaimo yesterday, a seat the Cons have not won in years.

I suspect Manley is running third. Any local intelligence to share? Prince?

kropotkin1951

nicky wrote:

O'Toole went to Nanaimo yesterday, a seat the Cons have not won in years.

I suspect Manley is running third. Any local intelligence to share? Prince?

I have no idea. The NDP vote in Nanaimo has always been an anti Central Canada vote and he does fit that profile. The worst case scenario is that the Conservatives win a three way dead heat. The BC NDP has hurt their environmental branding with Site C and LNG and the fascist police abusing protestors in Fairy Creek. If you voted for him last time the reasons for voting for him again are much the same. To a citizen of the riding it seems clear that either a Green or NDP MP will go to Ottawa with much the same message and neither will be in government.

melovesproles

kropotkin1951 wrote:

nicky wrote:

O'Toole went to Nanaimo yesterday, a seat the Cons have not won in years.

I suspect Manley is running third. Any local intelligence to share? Prince?

I have no idea. The NDP vote in Nanaimo has always been an anti Central Canada vote and he does fit that profile. The worst case scenario is that the Conservatives win a three way dead heat.

Agree. The only way the Conservatives have a hope of winning this riding is if the Green vote does not collapse and they can squeeze up the middle-otherwise enough Manley voters revert to the NDP and give them a safe win. I still think he has a shot though for the reasons you've stated.

However, to your first point, that's been my worry about the NDP's fortunes on Vancouver Island this election. I don't know if they've done enough to get that populist vote with a lot of their appeal based on working with the Liberals to get things done for Canadians. I think some more populist positions with real contrast from the Liberals would help a lot. I'm anxious that the Conservatives are better poised to increase their vote share in BC.

I travel up and down the island and just from an unscientific eye test, the Conservatives were way ahead in getting signs out and dominated early on but the NDP has closed the gap a bit and the Greens are third. Liberal signs are pretty rare which is not surprising since their idea of "democratic mandates" doesn't include voters or their representatives from Vancouver Island.

Ken Burch

nicky wrote:

O'Toole went to Nanaimo yesterday, a seat the Cons have not won in years.

I suspect Manley is running third. Any local intelligence to share? Prince?

There's really no reason to have it in for Manley- he never deserved to be blocked from the NDP nomination there by Mulcair, and it was inexcusable for Mulcair to refuse to protest it when the Israelis put Manley's dad in jail just for being on the Mavi Marmara, and once Mulcair unjustly blocked him, what right did anybody in the NDP have to be angry that he'd seek the Green nomination?  Mulcair should have stayed out of that nomination process and it is nothing but a tragedy for the NDP that Manley was barred from being one of its candidates.

If anything, in this one riding, the NDP should stand down just to avoid throwing the riding to the Con. 

And the lesson the party needs to learn from this is- it's not a crime to commit truth about the Israel/Palestine situation.

kropotkin1951

Ken Burch wrote:

nicky wrote:

O'Toole went to Nanaimo yesterday, a seat the Cons have not won in years.

I suspect Manley is running third. Any local intelligence to share? Prince?

There's really no reason to have it in for Manley- he never deserved to be blocked from the NDP nomination there by Mulcair, and it was inexcusable for Mulcair to refuse to protest it when the Israelis put Manley's dad in jail just for being on the Mavi Marmara, and once Mulcair unjustly blocked him, what right did anybody in the NDP have to be angry that he'd seek the Green nomination?  Mulcair should have stayed out of that nomination process and it is nothing but a tragedy for the NDP that Manley was barred from being one of its candidates.

He was a former NDP MP for the riding on a mission of peace to bring needed medical supplies to Palestine. Paul did not even ask that they support the mission but only that they rise in the House and demand his release. The major disrespect was to Paul's father and mother who are from the generation that made Nanaimo an NDP stronghold and the safest seat in the country when Tommy needed to parachute somewhere. Mulcair is and was an arrogant idiot who believes himself to be a political mastermind.

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