MP Dawn Black Ready to Jump To BC Provincial Politics?

106 posts / 0 new
Last post
Centrist
MP Dawn Black Ready to Jump To BC Provincial Politics?

Just came to my attention that NDP MP Dawn Black might jump into the provincial arena to represent the vacant provincial seat of New Westminster.

Quote:
New Westminster-Coquitlam MP Dawn Black is seriously contemplating a move into provincial politics. "I am giving it serious consideration," Black told The Record by telephone from Ottawa Thursday. "There is a vacancy." Black said she has to make a decision soon. She's expected to meet with local NDP officials this weekend, after returning from Ottawa.

http://www2.canada.com/newwestrecord/news/story.html?id=6e1e4741-5ce7-428f-bca8-c467a636adf9 

Frankly, I hope she doesn't jump as the provincial riding of New Westminster is a safe NDP seat.

More importantly, when a by-election occurs, it might be tough to hold Dawn's seat considering her relatively narrow 3%/1,500 vote winning margin last year.

 http://www.cbc.ca/news/canadavotes/map/2008/#286

skarredmunkey

Centrist wrote:

Frankly, I hope she doesn't jump as the provincial riding of New Westminster is a safe NDP seat... More importantly, when a by-election occurs, it might be tough to hold Dawn's seat considering her relatively narrow 3%/1,500 vote winning margin last year.

Good point. If the shift towards the Conservatives in BC in the last federal election is proof on any long-term momentum, this is likely a pickup for the Tories unless Black sticks around.

I guess Black is weighing the possibility of being a potential cabinet minister in Victoria against being a third party critic for a ministry she once admitted she knows nothing about.

V. Jara

I'd be happy to see Black go. Her lame line on Afghanistan and shouting approach to media interviews has left me disappointed. I also think the Federal NDP will hold the seat. They almost won it with Steve McClurg in 2004 (losing by 113 votes). It would also give the NDP a chance to run a proper high profile campaign with a strong visible minority candidate- something that is sorely lacking in the NDP's Lower Mainland caucus.

Unionist

Good riddance!

JUMP!!!

Lord Palmerston

I agree 100%.

NorthReport

"I guess Black is weighing the possibility of being a potential cabinet minister in Victoria against being a third party critic for a ministry she once admitted she knows nothing about."

Why did she accept it then?

But more to the point, this appears to be a very good omen for the BC NDP's chances in the upcoming May election, otherwise why bother. 

Webgear

I hope she does not jump into provincial politics. She is needed as the NDP defence critic.

______________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

NorthReport

Why, is she doing a great job in that portfolio?

Unionist

She's doing a great job supporting our troops in their sacred mission.

Webgear

Unionist, I honestly think she is towing the party's senior leadership's direction and talking points.

If Dawn Black does move into provincial politics, who do you believe will replace her as the party's defence critic?

 

______________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

NorthReport

How much work is provided to organized labour from the defence department? A lot? A little? Nothing? 

Unionist

Pardon?

 

Fidel

Unionist wrote:
She's doing a great job supporting our troops in their sacred mission.

You must mean that mission which Crazy Jean and Liberian Paul said to Loco Jorge, Here, use our troops for your imperialist occupation. I remember now. It's hard to keep up with which colonial administrator in Ottawa did the initial kow-towing to Uncle Sam on these colonial outpost matters.

Webgear

NorthReport wrote:
How much work is provided to organized labour from the defence department? A lot? A little? Nothing? 

I think it would take a lot of work. 

______________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

Stockholm

I can understand why Dawn Black might consider this. She would be a shoe-in to win the provincial seat of New Westminster, there is at least a 50% chance that the NDP wins the provincial election and that means she would be almost sure to become a cabinet minister. Being an MP from BC is very tough. Imagine having to constantly fly 5 hours back and forth from home to work? She's has roots and family in Vancouver and so why not?

That being said, I hope she doesn't. It could be a tough byelection for the NDP and I don't know if there is anyone waiting in the wings who would be as strong  local candidate as she is etc...

melovesproles

Now if Pat Martin would get into Provincial politics the Federal NDP would really be getting somewhere.

Unionist

Great idea! I think Pat should jump to Québec provincial politics. He can try to revive his brilliant 2006 motion, which unaccountably failed to garner any support:

Quote:
Mr. Martin (Winnipeg Centre) - That, in the opinion of the House, no member of the House of Commons shall sit therein and that no funds shall be made available to the member for the carrying out of parliamentary functions unless he or she takes an oath or makes a solemn affirmation of loyalty to Canada in addition to the oath of allegiance to Her Majesty provided for in the Constitution Act, 1867.

KenS

Webgear wrote:

Unionist, I honestly think she is towing the party's senior leadership's direction and talking points.

I doubt it.

More likely is that she has a certain amount of rope to diverge from official position and what Jack and others say. The reasons for that being that the sop keeps the loose cannons in the Caucus from popping, and because  the Caucus/leadership is happy enough to have the wiggle room that follows from what Dawn Black says.

What Dawn Black says has never stopped Layton, Mulcair, and others from making the clearer statements of position.

Stoffer knows far more about Defense issues. But I'm guessing he would not get the crtitc role he wants back because I'm guessing he has either not tried to, or not succeeded at, convincing Layton he would stay on as short a leash as Black.

ottawaobserver

I can't really engage you guys in foreign policy debates, but I love Dawn Black and I have done so since she was first elected back in 1988.

She belongs in cabinet and if she wants to run provincially, I wish her every bit of luck.

The Conservatives did make some gains in that seat in the last election, but they'd be starting off with a new candidate themselves, since Harper appointed their last candidate, Yonah Martin, to the Senate recently.

Personally I would love to see Corky Evans in the House of Commons, but he's from the Nelson-Creston area.  A strong Tri-City area candidate would be best to recruit.

V. Jara

I think Stoffer supports a continuation of the commitment. He needs to be convinced, if it is even possible, that the Afghan government is just a totally worthless ally. They are not worth the blood. Why put Canadian soldiers and their families in the terrible position of having to prop up a government that has already failed?

Canadian troops have been at war in Afghanistan longer than in any war since 1763. All the studies indicate that even those Afghans that fully support the government think coalition troops have been there too long- they want their own army to stand up.

V. Jara

Corky would be great but he comes with his own caveats. He's one of those guys that gets so carried away with his own idealistic musings that he sometimes unintentionally embarasses himself. I like him though. His home riding is currently represented by NDP MP Alex Atamanenko I believe.

jas

skarredmunkey wrote:

I guess Black is weighing the possibility of being a potential cabinet minister in Victoria

Or perhaps just a comfortable opposition member whose travel time will be cut down to almost nothing due to the fact that the BC Legislature hardly ever sits? It would be a cut in pay, I guess, but perhaps worth it for the increased leisure time and quality of life. Kind of like retirement?

jas

and that's not a comment on Dawn Black, as I know nothing of her record, but more on the unlikelihood that the BC NDP are poised to take government this May.

genstrike

Stoffer?  Appoint the pro-war guy as the defence critic?  Are you people serious? While you're at it, why don't you just make Pat Martin your spokesperson for issues with Israel and put Jim Maloway in charge of women's and LGBT issues.

Get someone who is committed to peace and immediate withdrawal.  And if you can't find someone like that, then you have a big problem.

 

And I think Pat Martin would be right at home in the Blairite Manitoba NDP.

Stockholm

What's the problem with Maloway and women's or LGBT issues? I've heard that the guy is a dumb as a post and kind of a jerk - but never that his views on the actual issues were out of the NDP mainstream.

genstrike

Stockholm wrote:
What's the problem with Maloway and women's or LGBT issues? I've heard that the guy is a dumb as a post and kind of a jerk - but never that his views on the actual issues were out of the NDP mainstream.

Because one of those fascist Christian groups endorsed his as "pro-life and pro-family" while he was an MLA.  So I would hope his views are out of the NDP mainstream.

http://www.lifesitenews.com/elections/provincial/Manitoba/2003/results.html

http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2003/jun/03060403.html

Lord Palmerston

So according to them, three NDP MLAs are "pro-life."

genstrike

Lord Palmerston wrote:
So according to them, three NDP MLAs are "pro-life."

Actually, Oscar Lathlin died recently, and Maloway moved up to being an MP.

And Chomiak admitted it publically a few years ago.

Stockholm

I'd like to hear that from a believable source.

genstrike

Stockholm wrote:
I'd like to hear that from a believable source.

What, you think they would endorse pro-choice MLAs?  Why would they do that?

And Chomiak is for sure pro-life.  He got into a little fight with Morgentaler a few years ago over funding at a clinic (I don't remember the specifics) in Winnipeg and admitted to being pro-life.

And while we're at it, Doer opposed Morgentaler getting the order of Canada.

Face it, the NDP isn't a purely pro-choice party.  Where do you think Joe Borowski came from?

Stockholm

Joe Borowski was an NDP MLA 40 years ago! and he quickly quit the party ran as a perenial anti-abortion Independent candidate, so you're really grasping at straws with that.

Chomiak was Health Minister of Manitoba for many years - I don't recall any attempts to ban abortions during that time. Some people are against Morgentaler opeing a clinic because his clinics are private clinics where people have to pay to get treated and that is something that the NDP disapproves of.

If you have actual quotes from Maloway that he wants to try to ban abortions in Canada and that he will try to reverse SSM - please send us the relevant evidence.

"What, you think they would endorse pro-choice MLAs?  Why would they do that" 

More recently, Lifesite has condemned the NDP and all its candidates as groups for being pro-choice and making it clear that all members must vote accordingly.

 

Lord Palmerston

According to the Pro-Choice Action Network:

Quote:

Manitoba provides zero funding to the Winnipeg Morgentaler Clinic, putting them in contravention of the Canada Health Act and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. (Most of the same arguments that apply to New Brunswick as described previously also apply to Manitoba.)

Last fall, Manitoba's Health Minister Dave Chomiak put forward three possible scenarios to solve the abortion clinic funding crisis in the province: buying the Winnipeg Morgentaler clinic, expanding existing hospital services, or opening a new public clinic that also provides other women's health services.

But negotiations appear to have stalled and no solution lies in the immediate future, according to a clinic spokesperson, as well as Dr. Henry Morgentaler. Part of the problem is that Dave Chomiak likes to say he is personally anti-choice but that he "belongs to a pro-choice government." The latter credential has proven to be of no help to the clinic. In fact, Morgentaler suspects that Premier Gary Doer may have caved into anti-choice pressure, resulting in negotiations being suspended between Morgentaler and Chomiak last year.

Manitoba has arbitrarily singled out a particular private clinic—the Winnipeg Morgentaler Clinic—and refused to grant it approval as a public facility performing medically necessary services. Meanwhile, the province has given public funding to Pan Am, a sports medicine clinic. Chomiak's proposal to open a new publicly funded women’s clinic also ignores the fact that the Morgentaler Clinic already has full resources and staffing to deliver the required services.

The only logical explanation for these actions is an anti-abortion bias by the Manitoba government. When provincial politicians abuse their elected office by imposing their personal religious or philosophical beliefs onto citizens, they are guilty of violating the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

For now, the Manitoba pro-choice community is pinning their hopes on a lawsuit filed last July by two anonymous Manitoba women, challenging the province's illegal refusal to fund abortions outside public hospitals. They are suing the provincial government for the costs of their abortions at the Winnipeg Morgentaler clinic in years past, during two different governments. The lawsuit is progressing slowly, with a court date now set for the end of May.

http://www.prochoiceactionnetwork-canada.org/print-friendly/02spring.sht...

Stockholm

One thing I've never understood is why all the same people who tend to oppose any private clinics that charge for medical services - also support abortion clinics - that are private clinics that make you pay for their services. Shouldn't abortion be like any other medical procedure and be 100% free and offered at hospitals. I don't think people should have to pay $500 for a tonsillectomy in a private clinic and I don't see why anyone should have to pay a private clinic for an abortion either.

Unionist

Stockholm, read a history book before you make such comments. Honestly.

Fidel

Stockholm wrote:
Shouldn't abortion be like any other medical procedure and be 100% free and offered at hospitals.

Yes it should be. It's a basic service covered by National Health in England. Meanwhile this government in Toronto has people paying cash for every little medical test and procedure theyve delisted since elected to phony majority power

ottawaobserver

Yowsa, did this thread ever meander after I last read it!

Say what you want about Jim Maloway, the guy is an organizational machine!  (He and his staff both, actually).

Say what you want about Henry Morgentaler (and I was thrilled that he got the Order of Canada), but he had a libertarian streak that did not want to see his clinics brought under the rubric of the publicly funded and administered health system.  I understand why, I think, but I think he was wrong, and I'm glad the Manitoba and Ontario NDP governments pressed that point.

Stoffer would be a great defence critic.  He is the best constituency politician since George Baker, and one of the most natural politicians I've even seen in action.

OK, I guess with those 3 comments I've just put myself well outside the rabble mainstream.  Oh well.

Webgear

KenS wrote:

More likely is that she has a certain amount of rope to diverge from official position and what Jack and others say. The reasons for that being that the sop keeps the loose cannons in the Caucus from popping, and because the Caucus/leadership is happy enough to have the wiggle room that follows from what Dawn Black says.

What Dawn Black says has never stopped Layton, Mulcair, and others from making the clearer statements of position.

Stoffer knows far more about Defense issues. But I'm guessing he would not get the crtitc role he wants back because I'm guessing he has either not tried to, or not succeeded at, convincing Layton he would stay on as short a leash as Black.

Why was Stoffer removed from the critic role? Why would Dawn Black be given a critic role if she had a lack of knowledge on the topic?

V. Jara wrote:

I think Stoffer supports a continuation of the commitment. He needs to be convinced, if it is even possible, that the Afghan government is just a totally worthless ally. They are not worth the blood. Why put Canadian soldiers and their families in the terrible position of having to prop up a government that has already failed?

When is a Canadian soldier's blood worthy of being spilled?

 

______________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

genstrike

V. Jara wrote:

I think Stoffer supports a continuation of the commitment. He needs to be convinced, if it is even possible, that the Afghan government is just a totally worthless ally. They are not worth the blood. Why put Canadian soldiers and their families in the terrible position of having to prop up a government that has already failed?

So, imperialism if feasible, but if too many Canadians die then it's just not worth it?

ottawaobserver wrote:
Stoffer would be a great defence critic.  He is the best constituency politician since George Baker, and one of the most natural politicians I've even seen in action.

Somehow I think seeking out the one pro-war guy in caucus and making him defence critic doesn't exactly show off the NDP's commitment to peace, regardless of how good of a constituency politician he is.  What are anti-war activists to think if a party that claims to be anti-war puts a pro-war guy in charge of war?

...and, you know, he's an open Blairite who supports war and voted for C-484 and such...

ottawaobserver

I've never seen any convincing evidence that Peter Stoffer is "pro-war", as you put it.  He votes for every private member's bill on 2nd reading on the principle that backbenchers efforts should be supported, and said that he would vote against C-484 on 3rd reading.

He is supportive of the folks in his riding who are in the forces and the reserves, and in particular of veterans' rights.  I believe this was also a big issue for historic figures in our party, like Stanley Knowles to name just one.  I'd stack Stoffer's voting record on the issue (or any issue really) up against Ignatieff's any time.

Kristoff

V. Jara. - "His home riding is currently represented by NDP MP Alex Atamanenko I believe."

 

Isn't the Creston side of Corky Evan's provincial riding in Jim Abbot's riding and the Neslon side in Alex Atamenko's?

Unionist

ottawaobserver wrote:

I've never seen any convincing evidence that Peter Stoffer is "pro-war", as you put it.

Well, he and Pat Martin sure have the knuckle-draggers fooled, at least:

[url=">http://ottawavalleyvoice.blogspot.com/2006/09/shout-out-to-mr-stoffer-an...
A Shout out to Mr. Stoffer and Mr. Martin (the NDP one)

[/url]

Quote:
Petet Stoffer and Pat Martin, both members of the NDP caucus have come out in defiance of their own party to stand behind our troops and support their hard work in Afghanistan. It takes a lot of guts to come out on the other side of the fence as your own political party. I am so proud to see that these two MPs, when push comes to shove with stick with their values before the flippy and political swinging of their leader and party.

Last week at the NDP's Anti-Harper, Anti-Bush, Anti-America, Anti-Common Sense convention Jack Layton's resolution to demand the withdrawal of Canadian Forces from Afghanistan passed with over 90% support. I believe this is nothing but political short sightedness and hand wringing. Its time to clear up some of the arguments used by Mr. Layton and Co.

Blah blah blah.

 

genstrike

ottawaobserver wrote:

I've never seen any convincing evidence that Peter Stoffer is "pro-war", as you put it.  He votes for every private member's bill on 2nd reading on the principle that backbenchers efforts should be supported, and said that he would vote against C-484 on 3rd reading.

He is supportive of the folks in his riding who are in the forces and the reserves, and in particular of veterans' rights.  I believe this was also a big issue for historic figures in our party, like Stanley Knowles to name just one.  I'd stack Stoffer's voting record on the issue (or any issue really) up against Ignatieff's any time.

Just google "Peter Stoffer Afghanistan".  Here's one link of many, discussing a convention resolution to withdraw troops which Stoffer opposed.

Quote:
Nova Scotia MP Peter Stoffer, whose riding holds a large military constituency, also spoke out against the proposal. He called it "premature."

"What (the troops) are doing is right," he said. "We need to send the message that we love them, we care about them, and that we hope for their speedy return.

Hell, he's wearing a yellow ribbon in his picture on wikipedia.  That shows that he is either pro-war, or just incapable of seeing through this whole "support the troops" bullshit.  I wouldn't be caught dead wearing one of those things.

Basement Dweller

Dawn Black is my MP. If she didn't want to go to Ottawa, why did she just run only a few months ago? This looks bad. She isn't a very good MP anyhow.

I hear Forseth is running again, so I really hope the NDP runs someone I can vote for.

 

Webgear

Genstrike

What is your view on the press statements released by Mr. Layton when a Canadian soldier dies?

 

______________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

genstrike

I don't see what this has to do with anything, but...

I think maybe Jack Layton should issue a press statement every time someone is killed at work instead.

And I don't see why whenever someone dies in Afghanistan we need to all pretend that they did it "in service of the country"

If I had to write a statement, it would would go something like

"I wish to extend my condolences to the family of ______ who died in Afghanistan yesterday.

Our thoughts are with the friends and family of ______

______ is not the first to die in this imperialist war, and sadly he will likely not be the last.  We need to end this war immediately, as the working class should not have to bear the burdens of war for their capitalist oppressors."

 

And this is me being nice, and not criticizing people who sign up to go kill Afghans

Unionist

Bravo, genstrike.

Webgear

Genstrike

 

Read the press statements, Mr. Layton is playing support the troops game also.

 

"I wish to extend my condolences to the loved ones of Sapper Sean David Greenfield, who was killed today when the armoured vehicle he was riding in struck an improvised explosive device, in the Zhari district, west of Kandahar city.

Sapper Greenfield, a 25 year-old engineer, was based out of Petawawa, Ont., and served with the 3rd Battalion of the Royal Canadian Regiment Battle Group.

"Our thoughts and prayers are with the family, friends, colleagues and communities who mourn the loss of this brave soldier."

"On behalf of all New Democrats, I wish you all the strength and support needed during this time and remind you that Sapper Greenfield's sacrifice, dedication and commitment to his country will never be forgotten."

 

Statement by Jack Layton on the death of a Canadian soldier in Afghanistan

 

______________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

genstrike

Webgear wrote:

Genstrike

 

Read the press statements, Mr. Layton is playing support the troops game also.

 

"I wish to extend my condolences to the loved ones of Sapper Sean David Greenfield, who was killed today when the armoured vehicle he was riding in struck an improvised explosive device, in the Zhari district, west of Kandahar city.

Sapper Greenfield, a 25 year-old engineer, was based out of Petawawa, Ont., and served with the 3rd Battalion of the Royal Canadian Regiment Battle Group.

"Our thoughts and prayers are with the family, friends, colleagues and communities who mourn the loss of this brave soldier."

"On behalf of all New Democrats, I wish you all the strength and support needed during this time and remind you that Sapper Greenfield's sacrifice, dedication and commitment to his country will never be forgotten."

 

Statement by Jack Layton on the death of a Canadian soldier in Afghanistan

 

I did read some statements, and wrote what Layton should have wrote but doesn't have either the moral convictions or political courage to write.  The bit about pretending everyone died for the good of their country was a response to what he writes.

Yes, Layton is playing the support the troops game too and I think he should be heavily criticized for that.  It shows either a lack of anti-militarist convictions or a lack of political courage.  But Layton is also far from the worst offender in the NDP.  People like Peter Stoffer, Pat Martin, and Gary Doer are (but of course, these three jokers being worse doesn't make Jack Layton good).  And if the NDP is serious about peace (which I often have my doubts about), they wouldn't let any of these clowns anywhere near the position of defense critic.  Having a pro-war Blairite in caucus is bad enough, but making him defense critic would be a clear endorsement of his views on the war.

Fidel

Which party volunteered us to Crazy George's phony war in the stan? What's that? Oh yeah, that was the little guy from Shawinigan's LIBERAL GOVERNMENT, the same ones who handed a 15 year-old Canadian citizen to a gulag for torture at Gitmo!

melovesproles

If the NDP had a clue then they would realize the Defense Critic portfolio presents them with one of their best opportunities to cut the Ignatieff Liberals down a size or two.  They should put someone with real principle in the position like Siskay or a star performer that can respect and support the position of the party's membership.

Webgear

Genstrike

I agree with you view on Layton. I believe the NDP has plans for the military to deploy into Africa or perhaps Sri Lanka if they come into power.

 

_____________________________________________________________________________________________ We are like cloaks, one thinks of us only when it rains.

Pages

Topic locked