NDP candidate quits: Endorses Liberal candidate in bid to unseat the Tories

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robbie_dee
NDP candidate quits: Endorses Liberal candidate in bid to unseat the Tories

[url=http://ca.news.yahoo.com/ndp-candidate-withdraws-race-back-liberal-bid-u... NDP candidate withdraws[/url]

 

Quote:
LONDON, Ont. - The NDP candidate for the Ontario riding of Elgin-Middlesex-London has pulled out of the race for the May 2 federal election.

 

Ryan Dolby says he will support Liberal candidate Graham Warwick, in his effort to unseat Conservative Joe Preston.

Dolby told radio station AM980 he didn't want to split the vote.

He also ran for the NDP in 2008, finishing third with 9,135 votes. Preston was re-elected with 22,970 votes, while Liberal Suzanne Van Bommel was second with 11,169.

Warwick said he was surprised by the news and declined immediate comment.

Dolby says he did not discuss his decision with federal New Democrat officials.

"I think it's the best decision on behalf of my family, my community, and my country to do whatever I can to make sure there isn't a Conservative victory, especially in this riding," he said.

"I want to make sure we get a progressive MP - one that cares about improvements to Canada Pension Plan, improvements to employment insurance, believes in democracy instead of contempt, and believes in sustainable job creation instead of building more prisons."

"I know Graham Warwick has the same values that I do."

Caissa

Is Kimble Sutherland still around to take his place?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kimble_Sutherland

Was Dolby blinded with science?

I assume he will be expelled from the party forthwith.

Anonymouse

Conservative MP Preston called Dolby's move "dishonourable" (towards NDP supporters). I'm inclined to agree.

6079_Smith_W

Perhaps.

On the other hand, it's not like he's not acting on what a lot of people are thinking, and falling on his sword for it kind of underscores it. 

As well, if it is seen as some sort of affront to people's ability to vote for the part they want, I think I read in the paper last night that even the party with the highest number of nominees (the tories) only have candidates in 75 percent of the ridings in Canada. 

Life, the unive...

Is he going to personally repay all the donations people made to buy signs and leaflets?   If not there is nothing but disrespect for voters in this action.

gyor

Anonymouse wrote:

Conservative MP Preston called Dolby's move "dishonourable" (towards NDP supporters). I'm inclined to agree.

I agree with preston.This will not get the libs more votes as people will be disgusted about it. What a low life. I hope the NDP sues him for campaign costs that they payed out on his behalf. I wonder what his price was.

ghoris

I'm not sure what this guy is thinking. First, if you add the Liberal and NDP numbers from last election, the Tories still win, so I'm not sure I buy the vote-splitting argument. Second, he had to know the NDP would find a replacement candidate so it's not like his move will automatically result in all NDP supporters voting Liberal. Third, it looks like the only time the Liberals have held this riding (or its predecessor Elgin-Norfolk) in recent history was in the 1990s during the split on the right, so I can't imagine this is a top-tier target for them. Strange move indeed.

Aristotleded24

Why don't we ever hear of any Liberals doing likewise in Western Canada?

Snert Snert's picture

I hope the NDP does all they can to make his life miserable.  What a fool.

Caissa

Some info on Mr. Dolby

Ryan Dolby is ready to run -- if necessary.

The St. Thomas union benefits rep has been acclaimed the NDP candidate for Elgin-Middlesex-London in the coming federal election.

It's the second time Dolby will have represented the party. He stood for the NDP in 2008.

But while the Liberals have threatened a non-confidence vote this fall which could topple PM Stephen Harper's minority Conservative government, Dolby says he'd prefer to see the Tories work with the NDP for the betterment of ordinary Canadians

http://www.stthomastimesjournal.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?archive=true&e=1...

leftgreen

I know Mr. Dolby and he is anything but a low-life and dishonourable.

 

Caissa

Okay, he's a Quisling, then.

Snert Snert's picture

Quote:

I know Mr. Dolby and he is anything but a low-life and dishonourable.

 

What's he going to do now that his political career just got shat out? Jobs can't be easy to find for a quitter with a two digit IQ.

 

Anyway, if you see him, thank him on behalf of the Liberals, assuming they haven't thanked him already.

ghoris

Hey guys, making personal attacks like calling someone a "lowlife" and saying things like "I hope the NDP does all they can to make his life miserable" neither reflects well on us as an online community, nor on the NDP or its supporters. Let's not forget this is a public discussion forum.  It's fair game to question the wisdom of Mr. Dolby's decision and feel betrayed by it, but it would be nice if people could refrain from the personal attacks. Just my $0.02, FWIW.

Stockholm

Of course if the guy REALLY wanted to unite the anti-Conservative vote etc...he should have waited until half an hour before nominations closed, then withdrawn his candidacy when there would have been no time at all for the NDP to replace him - or announced he was suspending his campaign after the close of nominations. The timing would also have been better suited to the typical Liberal "closing argument" about strategic voting etc...Instead, the NDP will get a new candidate within the next two days and that person will probably get at leats as many votes as Dolby would have received.

pcml

BRAVO !!

We need more like this man!!

How many of you would say the same things if it was a Green candidate in a certain riding clearing the way for an NDP?

 

Snert Snert's picture

Quote:
Hey guys, making personal attacks like calling someone a "lowlife" and saying things like "I hope the NDP does all they can to make his life miserable" neither reflects well on us as an online community, nor on the NDP or its supporters.

 

Gah. And here I just questioned his intelligence, and if you read between the lines, might even be wondering out loud whether the Liberals were behind this sudden epiphany. I'll remember this for next time though.

Unionist

Good lord, what an elevated level of discussion in this thread. I wonder how much they paid Amir Khadir to bolt from the Bloc and go to Québec solidaire?

Or Thomas Mulcair. Jack Layton must have filled his Swiss bank account to get him to leave the Liberals in the lurch, eh?

What happened to all the BS about how it's ok to cross the floor as long as you don't get elected first and betray your constituents?

Here in Québec, people switch parties all the time, and "strategic" voting is in the genes.

 

NorthReport

Unfortunately for the Liberals it is already starting to backfire on them

 

Preston: NDP dropout sign of coalition Laughing

 

 

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/2011/03/30/17806461.html

6079_Smith_W

@ Unionist 

Indeed. I suppose for many casting a vote in the Canadian parliament is itself a strategic compromise.

Caissa

It is certainly not in good taste to do it after securing the nomination and after a writ has been dropped, Unionist.

Centrist

pcml wrote:
How many of you would say the same things if it was a Green candidate in a certain riding clearing the way for an NDP?

Well, the Green candidate in Kamloops-North Thompson just did exactly that. Unfortunately, the Greens have found a replacement.

http://www.bclocalnews.com/features/118605144.html

 

 

Snert Snert's picture

Quote:
How many of you would say the same things if it was a Green candidate in a certain riding clearing the way for an NDP?

 

When E.May was basically campaigning for the Liberals, and when she cut a backroom deal with Dion to not run competitive candidates, and when she blatantly endorsed a Liberal candidate, I was all over that like a cheap suit. It doesn't make me angry in the same way, since I don't support the Greens, but I do think it's disgraceful and I do think it should signal the end of a political career. I don't quarrel so much with floor-crossing, as I see that as a change of personal ideology. This guy doesn't even have the stones to go join the Liberals... he just wants to accept the NDP nomination and then endorse the Liberals. That makes changing parties seem positively noble.

 

If this guy didn't want to run, he didn't have to.

Stockholm

as i said above - it could have been worse - he could have pulled out AFTER the close of nominations!

Jacob Two-Two

What I don't like about it is the typical politician's arrogance it displays. "I've decided that all my votes should go to the Liberal condidate so all you voters who hang on my every word just play along with my little plan, all right?"

The NDP don't own those votes, and Dolby certainly doesn't. They can't trade them like baseball cards. He's representing a certain political perspective that is opposed to the Liberal agenda, which is why those votes aren't Liberal to begin with. Even if the NDP didn't replace him, I doubt more than a handful would actually migrate to the Liberal candidate. More likely they'd go Green or disappear. His motives may be good but his presumption is very disrespectful.

janfromthebruce

I found what he did was absolutely ignorant and so disrespectful to Jack Layton and NDP. Step down, go away and shut your mouth is all I have to say to this person.

Doug

pcml wrote:

BRAVO !!

We need more like this man!!

How many of you would say the same things if it was a Green candidate in a certain riding clearing the way for an NDP?

 

I might be pleased but I could certainly understand how Green members, donors and volunteers would be very, very angry.

Unionist

Caissa wrote:

It is certainly not in good taste to do it after securing the nomination and after a writ has been dropped, Unionist.

Sorry Caissa, the NDP's BS "floor-crossing legislation" doesn't cover this situation. Plus, he got the nomination a year ago, and had no idea when the writ would be dropped, nor what the political scenery would look like at that time. He's a union brother, and I will defend him against hysterical charges (see above) that he must have been paid off to do this. While I utterly disagree with his choice, it is in extremely bad taste to pretend that one would be hurling the same abuse had it been a Liberal candidate in a Saskatchewan riding bowing out to help the NDP win.

The partisan hypocrisy and aggressiveness in this thread is disturbing.

Oh well, the ONDP must now convene and throw this man's ass out of the Party, relying on the Hargrove precedent. In fact, I just noticed that he's a CAW union rep also, so the ONDP can go to town with some bizarro conspiracy theory if they like. I hope it makes them feel oh-so-holier-than-thou.

6079_Smith_W

You have to admit, it is a step above the stunt David Emerson pulled.

Unionist

It could have been worse. Here's another former CAW fellow (actually FFAW, but they're a wing or branch of the CAW in NL) - [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Taylor_%28politician%29]Trevor Taylor[/url] - who ran second for the NDP in Humber-St. Barbe-Baie Verte in 2000, then moved over to provincial politics where he won in 2003 and 2007 in The Straits - White Bay North - for the Progressive Conservatives! He ended up as Minister of Transportation before leaving politics in 2009.

Mind you, that was Danny Williams' party, who was several light years to the left of Baron Michael Ignatieff.

Politics in Canada is complex. Life is admittedly easier when one adopts a Papal infallibility attitude to one's own (useless) party, and heaps scorn and abuse on all the other (useless) parties and anyone who dares find anything good in them.

 

Overtaxed Overtaxed's picture

No coalition, eh? 

morningstar

Hooray Ryan! He actually cares about getting rid of Harper instead of simplistic partisan politics. My kind of man, for sure.

Catch 22 has a great site for those of us who want to ensure that Harper loses this election.If you are in or near one of the close target ridings I urge you all to go and do everything that you humanly can to get the Conservative candidate defeated.

After harper is gone, all of us who are progressive and concerned about democracy, must work outside of party politics to get the parliamentary reform that we need for better voting system,more transparency and consensus building in parliament.

We have organized a Stratford Democracy Watch group here.Grass roots, extraparty groups may be the way to get more people interested in their role as citizens without being seduced by issues of power. Our group's web page is   stratforddemocracywatch.blogspot.com.

Work for Canada---get rid of harper in any way you can.

Sean in Ottawa

I disagree with what he did. I agree that it was unethical. I agree he should be thrown out of the party. I agree the NDP should consider legal action.

I don't agree with calling him names or think he was bought. But it still is a very serious thing and cannot fail to have consequence.

Here are my reasons:

I can accept that he came to this conclusion but it is the way he carried it out and the order of events that is so disturbing.

If he had come to the conclusion before the nomination then I think he could have made his reasons public but he did not.

After the nomination he made a commitment to represent the NDP and speak on behalf of the party. His opinion is not just his own.

It would have been wrong to have made such a public statement before the writ but after causes even more damage.

I accept that the writ could have caught him off-guard and that with this feeling he needed to resign. He ought to have resigned citing personal reasons because his withdrawal is personal not related to the party. It is not his resignation that is a problem -- it is his use of the NDP platform to effectively campaign against the party that is so disturbing and ought to have consequences.

We ought to assume his motives are good but we also need to be aware that if there are no consequences this will encourage others to do the same thing-- perhaps with other motives from the start having seen this. He is breaking a commitment, one that has a financial investment and causing damage of a financial nature. This is due to the decision to announce a rationale damaging to the party at a time when he has committed to represent the party. That is unforgivable-- union brother or no. You make a decision to make a commitment you live up to it or not you don't campaign against the people committed to you. If you have a change of heart you close your mouth and resign for personal reasons. You do not use the NDP's commitment to you as a stage to support another party. Sorry that is disgusting.

Here is the basic fact. We would not be hearing about a New Democrat deciding to strategically vote Liberal if it were not for the commitment he made as candidate. It is a double cross.

There needs to be a deterrent because regardless of his motives, if he gets away with it others will seek nominations as plants and this can happen to any party. You simply cannot advocate for a party while holding the nomination for a different party without being liable for damages. the NDP ought to replace him and wait till after the election and then sue.

morningstar

hey---don't you all remember the liberals in Calgary who didn't even run a candidate and instead threw their support behind the NDP candidate there---isn't she the only NDP in Alberta? Wasn't it Liberals for Linda??

comeon folks, we're all in this together and a joint strategy is clearly needed.  

Sean in Ottawa

I'll add-- as a union brother he should know you act together by consensus. The organization he is a part of he could have argued to step aside in that riding but he is not following the democratic will of his party association or his party. To me I find it difficult to see the difference between this and a person who crosses a picket line to go to work because he or she disagrees with a strike. I find it disturbing that a union member would not get the need for collective action and the individual responsibility to respect a collective democratic process. The more I think about this the worse it is. I am disturbed by those applauding it.

Please do not consider the benefit. Consider the morality of the decision based on the committments made and the democratic process behind them. To me this is as much a principle as E. May in the debate which I support even if it means difficulty for the NDP. This is also a position I am holding based on an important principle-- even if it happens to also coincide with a party interest. You ought to be able to separate these things and see the moral problems with this. I would feel no different if he were a Conservative, Liberal or Green.

leftgreen

The only way progressives are going to defeat Harper and his government in this or any FPTP election, will be for cross-party cooperation.  Watch and see.

Sean in Ottawa

morningstar wrote:

hey---don't you all remember the liberals in Calgary who didn't even run a candidate and instead threw their support behind the NDP candidate there---isn't she the only NDP in Alberta? Wasn't it Liberals for Linda??

comeon folks, we're all in this together and a joint strategy is clearly needed.  

If that was a decision democratically taken by a riding association fine otherwise I would not support a Liberal backstabbing their association to help the NDP.

Regardless of what your position is on restricting electoral choice to help a candidate beat another, that is a decision that can and ought to be arrived at through a democratic process through the organization the candidate represents or the candidate should resign for personal reasons. Using a platform to campaign against the party financing your bid to get elected is a huge betrayal.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

leftgreen wrote:

The only way progressives are going to defeat Harper and his government in this or any FPTP election, will be for cross-party cooperation.  Watch and see.

I do not believe that the Liberal Party is "progressive" at all. As I have said before, it is only the left wing of the corporatist party. Both they and the Cons work for the same boss, and towards the same ends. Thinking that there is a significant difference between them is, in my opinion, an obvious error. Judge them by their deeds, not their words, and you will see that this is the case.

I saw this young man interviewed on P&P a while ago. He sounds sincere. He is probably making the same error as you are, because his thinking has been clouded by the same propaganda that has convinced you. A Liberal government will do the same, nasty things as a Conservative government, minus the religious extremism.

I agree with Sean that this is a serious problem, but judging from his demeanour, this fellow would not have been deterred. He seems to believe deeply in his erroneous course.

Unionist

Sean in Ottawa wrote:
After the nomination he made a commitment to represent the NDP and speak on behalf of the party. His opinion is not just his own.

I can't even begin to fathom your distaste for what this person did. My ONLY objection is the choice that he made.

Remind me, Sean. When Jack Layton "ran for Prime Minister" in September 2008, did he, and all his elected caucus, mention beforehand that they would be installing Stéphane Dion as Prime Minister in December?

No?

Throw them all out??

Find subtle distinctions?

I find party partisanship revolting and sickening. It always condemns in others what it tolerates in oneself.

 

gyor

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

morningstar wrote:

hey---don't you all remember the liberals in Calgary who didn't even run a candidate and instead threw their support behind the NDP candidate there---isn't she the only NDP in Alberta? Wasn't it Liberals for Linda??

comeon folks, we're all in this together and a joint strategy is clearly needed.  

If that was a decision democratically taken by a riding association fine otherwise I would not support a Liberal backstabbing their association to help the NDP.

Regardless of what your position is on restricting electoral choice to help a candidate beat another, that is a decision that can and ought to be arrived at through a democratic process through the organization the candidate represents or the candidate should resign for personal reasons. Using a platform to campaign against the party financing your bid to get elected is a huge betrayal.

It is also fruad and charges should be laid. People donated money to this man, money that went to signs with his name on it, buttons with his name on it, ect..., money they will not get back, nor will the party. This might even count towards the ndp spending limit. He she be sued by the party and fruad charges laid on behalf of those who donated to his campaign.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

@unionist:

I will accept the point you make.

Notwithstanding, I find it very hard to take the idea that someone would withdraw as a New Dem and endorse a Lib. Sorry, I just can't help but feel negatively about this. And also, what is up with the CAW? Have they forgotten how Trudeau stuck it to workers and unions in the early 80s with wage controls.

Absolutely mind boggling!

Arthur Cramer, Winnipeg

Summer

does the money go to him personally or to the NDP?  Won't the party still keep the campaign contributions?

Life, the unive...

Many of thos contributions will have been already spent - on his behalf - by the local riding association.   Signs, leaflets, buttons and a bunch of other stuff will now be worthless- but costs a lot.   Office space and a few other things will still be able to be used by another candidate.

remind remind's picture

morningstar wrote:
...comeon folks, we're all in this together and a joint strategy is clearly needed.  

Ummmm....no...the Liberals have been in this with the Conservatives for the last 3 years since we saw you here saying the same damn thing.

They have allowed Harper to do everything he has done...the Liberal Party are NOT in this with us "ordinary Canadians" they are in this with the corporations which control them as well as the CONs.

You are merely asking us here/Canadians to support a bait and switch between the 2 parties who have driven this country into the ground, and who have attempted to absolutely destroy the People's whose country it is.

remind remind's picture

Agree with Life's post completely at 41.

 

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

@morningstar:

@remind said it for me. We AREN'T in this together. I am not a Liberal; I am a New Dem. There is a difference. Sorry, you vote Lib, I'll vote NDP.

Knock off the fearmongering.

Arthur Cramer, Winnipeg

Life, the unive...

Seriously Unionist how could the writ drop caught him off guard?

Every political party in Canada has been on high alert for at least a couple months.   Campaign teams from across the country would have been preparing for a spring election for some time.   If this person would have stepped down in the last month or two, disappointing I am sure for local riding people, but no big deal.  If he had come forward after the writ drop as a private citizen to support another party, disappointing I am sure for local people, but again not a big deal.   Instead he acted in a manner that shows a profound disrespect for his brothers and sisters in the local NDP.   They will have spent money printing signs with his name on them.  (You would always have to replace a bunch of signs from a previous election).  They will have spent money on flyers and candidate cards already with his name on it.   This is potentially 5000 or more of locally raised money from volunteers and supporters.  You don't order that stuff, in most ridings, after the writ is dropped, but rather in the lead up to the writ drop.  That's how signs go up as soon as the election gets called.

That is where he crossed the line.  Not in changing parties, but in how he went about it.   It was a slap in the face to a large number of grassroots volunteers.   It showed a complete lack of class to not have told those people himself.   They will have been working on his behalf for some time.   They would have taken family and spare time to look for an office, to bundle signs and stakes, to fundraise and all the other things local riding associations and volunteers do to prepare for an election - and trust me it is a lot of work.  At the very least he owes a lot of people some money.  He made a committment to those people, not the NDP, but those individual grassroots volunteers who give of themselves, their time and their financial resources because they care about a different Canada.   This guy didn't deserve them and deserves no one's sympathy or support.  It isn't about what party he went to, or what party he came from.  Irrespective of party I would feel the same way.  It is morally wrong and profoundly arrogant.

N.Beltov N.Beltov's picture

SIDEBAR: Arthur, there is no need to sign every one of your posts. You can put identifying information on your profile and the absence of the signature makes for a smoother conversational flow.

You should have seen the smooth flow on the old babble software. Sadly, it is no more.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

@N.Beltov

Hi, ok, I can fix that. I just always sign my comments because I hate this anonymous ID stuff. I don't feel this way on here for the most part, I think because we are all in many ways like minded, lol.

But for example, on the Winnipeg Free Press site, people hide behing anonymous monikers, say the most absurd things, and refuse to take responsibility for anything. It drives me crazy.

Thanks very much, I will try to see if I can fix things up in my account.

All the best. Cheers!

Unionist

Life... I get your point... and I am not in the slightest defending his choice... I have never supported the Liberals and never will.

But someone explain to me Jack Layton's choice after the 2008 election - when he said "I'm running to be Prime Minister" (which I thought was a bit dumb, because it wasn't actually true) - and then he signed a legal agreement which would have made Stéphane Dion prime minister - without consulting with his constituents, or all the others who voted NDP.

What he did was right, by the way. But what exactly makes one decision right and the other abominable?

I'm asking.

ETA: Ok, yeah, I agree with what was said about individual decisions vs. collective decisions. He should act as a trade unionist, after all. That part I understand.

 

Life, the unive...

Well the fundamental difference is that Layton did not become PM.  So in differing situations he made a choice to forward the agenda he and his caucus was elected on.  I really don't see the situations as analogous even a little bit. If he had been elected PM and then crossed the floor to sit as a member of another party than you might have a point.

This guy on the other hand made committments to become the candidate and accepted the committments, financial resourses, energy and time of volunteers and then once the writ was dropped turned around and treated the local volunteers like dirt under his feet.

It is the treatment of those volunteers that I find contemptable.  Doesn't have a thing to do with what party he came from or went to.   It is the way he acted towards his committments to those who were so willing to give of themselves on his behalf. I've never been a candidate, but I have seen plenty of campaigns (in two parties) and I have never seen a candidate treat their volunteers so dismissively and with so much contempt for their committment and caring.

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